450 gate twitch? JETT DOCKED 1 LAP

SteveUrchin
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8/9/2025 7:28pm
ando wrote:
Just playing this scenario through..Rider A jumps and hits the gate but it catches his front wheel; he pulls back, clears the gate and goes.  No...

Just playing this scenario through..

Rider A jumps and hits the gate but it catches his front wheel; he pulls back, clears the gate and goes.  No penalty as it’s assumed they have been penalised by effectively having to restart.

Rider B in the next gate also jumps and hits the gate but his gate falls forward.  What does he do?  Roll back to some undetermined position and go again?  Wait until everyone else is ahead and then go?  Or is the fact that the gate fell forward the determining factor and from that moment on you are doomed regardless of what else you do?

Don’t get me wrong - Jett jumped early and caused his own demise but I’m genuinely curious.

Don’t hit the gate. He’s Jett Lawerence went undefeated in his rookie season he shouldn’t hit the gate right? Hes a generational talent some may say? 

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Radical
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The reason the penalty applied is because when the gate actually dropped, Jett's bike was in front of the gate, in front of the other riders.  From memory, after Jett's bike bounced back from hitting the gate, but before the gate actually dropped, he started to go, then stopped and waited for the gate to drop.

If the gate didn't break, then rotate forward, it wouldn't have been possible for his bike to be in front of the other riders when the gate went down.

So, unless the gate is designed to fall forward when under a certain amount of pressure, I'm in favor of him getting at least some of his points back.  He did move his bike forward slightly before the gate dropped, but the gate also broke.

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Motodude
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Meanwhile a blind eye is turned for all the course cutting Deegs does. 

Oh yeah and the RC/CR fuel fiasco bs from 2005? 🤣 pretty much killed CR's title run momentum. 

Backward falling gates are meant to be unjumpable, not flop over if you bump them. They are self penalizing gates. Why use them now days if that not the case? Jett was serverly disadvantaged being nearly dead last in turn 1. 

Better idea. We have so much reliable tech now. Why not have a forward falling gate with sensors. If a rider hits the gate before the gate is triggered he gets a 10sec penalty, or something like that. 

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SteveUrchin
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8/9/2025 7:32pm
Motodude wrote:
Meanwhile a blind eye is turned for all the course cutting Deegs does. Oh yeah and the RC/CR fuel fiasco bs from 2005? 🤣 pretty much killed...

Meanwhile a blind eye is turned for all the course cutting Deegs does. 

Oh yeah and the RC/CR fuel fiasco bs from 2005? 🤣 pretty much killed CR's title run momentum. 

Backward falling gates are meant to be unjumpable, not flop over if you bump them. They are self penalizing gates. Why use them now days if that not the case? Jett was serverly disadvantaged being nearly dead last in turn 1. 

Better idea. We have so much reliable tech now. Why not have a forward falling gate with sensors. If a rider hits the gate before the gate is triggered he gets a 10sec penalty, or something like that. 

Hold up did anyone else hit there gate and make it fall forward in that moto?

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The Shop

Press516
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Mike Pelletier’s explanation was quite clear.  And the video repeatedly showed Jett crossing the gate, after he knocked it down, ahead of everyone else.  Case closed.  Yes, I also think the penalty exceeds the crime, but that’s a completely different discussion.


The screenshot above half way down the start straight is completely irrelevant.  The rule violation had already taken place.

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Motodude
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8/9/2025 7:37pm
ando wrote:
Just playing this scenario through..Rider A jumps and hits the gate but it catches his front wheel; he pulls back, clears the gate and goes.  No...

Just playing this scenario through..

Rider A jumps and hits the gate but it catches his front wheel; he pulls back, clears the gate and goes.  No penalty as it’s assumed they have been penalised by effectively having to restart.

Rider B in the next gate also jumps and hits the gate but his gate falls forward.  What does he do?  Roll back to some undetermined position and go again?  Wait until everyone else is ahead and then go?  Or is the fact that the gate fell forward the determining factor and from that moment on you are doomed regardless of what else you do?

Don’t get me wrong - Jett jumped early and caused his own demise but I’m genuinely curious.

Don’t hit the gate. He’s Jett Lawerence went undefeated in his rookie season he shouldn’t hit the gate right? Hes a generational talent some may say? 

Dont worry Steve, when your pinup boi Deegs gets on a 4fiddy you can open up the excuse book like a pro. 

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8/9/2025 7:38pm

The “4H Fair” gate “fell forward” when hit by “a Jett” which resulted in him “at one point” being in front of the “lineup”. 
That warranted the automatic one lap penalty. 

*no way I get a downvote. 

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Motodude
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8/9/2025 7:39pm
Motodude wrote:
Meanwhile a blind eye is turned for all the course cutting Deegs does. Oh yeah and the RC/CR fuel fiasco bs from 2005? 🤣 pretty much killed...

Meanwhile a blind eye is turned for all the course cutting Deegs does. 

Oh yeah and the RC/CR fuel fiasco bs from 2005? 🤣 pretty much killed CR's title run momentum. 

Backward falling gates are meant to be unjumpable, not flop over if you bump them. They are self penalizing gates. Why use them now days if that not the case? Jett was serverly disadvantaged being nearly dead last in turn 1. 

Better idea. We have so much reliable tech now. Why not have a forward falling gate with sensors. If a rider hits the gate before the gate is triggered he gets a 10sec penalty, or something like that. 

Hold up did anyone else hit there gate and make it fall forward in that moto?

He didnt hit it like how that pussie Barcia tapped it.

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dingaling
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8/9/2025 7:41pm

It might be a rule but from my memory I've never seen it enacted. But we've seen plenty of guys hit the gate, get a bad start and work their way into a good result. 

Like why did they choose to enforce it today?? Governing body clown show continues

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8/9/2025 7:41pm
Motodude wrote:
The entire concept of backward falling gates is to prevent jump starts and malfunctions. I was around when these gates were invented. They are NOT supposed to...

The entire concept of backward falling gates is to prevent jump starts and malfunctions. 

I was around when these gates were invented. They are NOT supposed to flop over forward on their own. Yeah, ok it might break when hit, but theyre individual gates, can be replaced easy if the track is prefessional and this is supposed to be an elite facility. 

Jump starts in F1 is a 10 sec penalty. 1 lap in Coombs Nationals is dodgy af. 

Cant wait for the bs to go down for the MXoN. Hopefully no issues to make the sport more of a farce that it already is, or attempt to make the FIM look bad. Imo

 

Anyway, can some post the actual rule he broke?

We installed several of the backward falling gates in the 70s and 80s and they all would fold forward so not sure what home built stuff you used there in kangaroo land. This one "didnt flop foward on its own" as you are saying, Jett ran into it  

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Crush
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8/9/2025 7:44pm

Lol... this sport.

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Motodude
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8/9/2025 7:46pm
TheMilkman wrote:
I believe the rule says “rider MAY be penalized by 1 lap”. That word MAY being in there leads me to believe it has some room...

I believe the rule says “rider MAY be penalized by 1 lap”. That word MAY being in there leads me to believe it has some room for review to determine if the rider got an advantage. I guess the officials determined that Jett had some sort of advantage there.

I think it’s a really harsh penalty for a guy who got a 23rd place start after getting hung up. I think a guy who jumps the gate and runs away (like the JLaw gate jump from back in the day) should get docked. I don’t think it should come into play on a mistake like this. 

'May' allows the promotor to interfere with a competitors performance over another prefered competitor to get an infair advantage by adversly handicapping the dominant competitor...for the show. 

Its pro sports, you should know how it works by now.

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Motodude
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8/9/2025 7:50pm
Motodude wrote:
The entire concept of backward falling gates is to prevent jump starts and malfunctions. I was around when these gates were invented. They are NOT supposed to...

The entire concept of backward falling gates is to prevent jump starts and malfunctions. 

I was around when these gates were invented. They are NOT supposed to flop over forward on their own. Yeah, ok it might break when hit, but theyre individual gates, can be replaced easy if the track is prefessional and this is supposed to be an elite facility. 

Jump starts in F1 is a 10 sec penalty. 1 lap in Coombs Nationals is dodgy af. 

Cant wait for the bs to go down for the MXoN. Hopefully no issues to make the sport more of a farce that it already is, or attempt to make the FIM look bad. Imo

 

Anyway, can some post the actual rule he broke?

lostboy819 wrote:
We installed several of the backward falling gates in the 70s and 80s and they all would fold forward so not sure what home built stuff...

We installed several of the backward falling gates in the 70s and 80s and they all would fold forward so not sure what home built stuff you used there in kangaroo land. This one "didnt flop foward on its own" as you are saying, Jett ran into it  

Jett hit it and it bounced off his tire..flopping forward.

Our Aussie gates never flopped forward and I hit lots of them in the 70's/80's too. Touching the gate was known lousy start. Maybe your yank gates were designed to allow selective cheating.

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SteveUrchin
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8/9/2025 7:57pm
ando wrote:
Just playing this scenario through..Rider A jumps and hits the gate but it catches his front wheel; he pulls back, clears the gate and goes.  No...

Just playing this scenario through..

Rider A jumps and hits the gate but it catches his front wheel; he pulls back, clears the gate and goes.  No penalty as it’s assumed they have been penalised by effectively having to restart.

Rider B in the next gate also jumps and hits the gate but his gate falls forward.  What does he do?  Roll back to some undetermined position and go again?  Wait until everyone else is ahead and then go?  Or is the fact that the gate fell forward the determining factor and from that moment on you are doomed regardless of what else you do?

Don’t get me wrong - Jett jumped early and caused his own demise but I’m genuinely curious.

Don’t hit the gate. He’s Jett Lawerence went undefeated in his rookie season he shouldn’t hit the gate right? Hes a generational talent some may say? 

Motodude wrote:

Dont worry Steve, when your pinup boi Deegs gets on a 4fiddy you can open up the excuse book like a pro. 

Deegs and sexton will be smokin jet in 2026 no worries brotha 

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SteveUrchin
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Jett is generational talent how does one hit the gate? 

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markus8v_s3
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8/9/2025 7:59pm
ando wrote:
Just playing this scenario through..Rider A jumps and hits the gate but it catches his front wheel; he pulls back, clears the gate and goes.  No...

Just playing this scenario through..

Rider A jumps and hits the gate but it catches his front wheel; he pulls back, clears the gate and goes.  No penalty as it’s assumed they have been penalised by effectively having to restart.

Rider B in the next gate also jumps and hits the gate but his gate falls forward.  What does he do?  Roll back to some undetermined position and go again?  Wait until everyone else is ahead and then go?  Or is the fact that the gate fell forward the determining factor and from that moment on you are doomed regardless of what else you do?

Don’t get me wrong - Jett jumped early and caused his own demise but I’m genuinely curious.

Don’t hit the gate. He’s Jett Lawerence went undefeated in his rookie season he shouldn’t hit the gate right? Hes a generational talent some may say? 

Just tied JS7 on moto wins, I’d say that’s pretty generational. 

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Motodude
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Ridiculous to dock him when he obviously got no advantage.

Press516 wrote:
Not true…. Had he backed out from the gate and then went, he would have been much farther back than 23rd.  By going after he knocked...

Not true…. Had he backed out from the gate and then went, he would have been much farther back than 23rd.  By going after he knocked it forward, he likely gained 10+ positions over where he would have been.  Plus, per the rule, he “fouled” the gate.  Penalty is 1 lap or DQ.

🐂💩

Whats he supposed to do when the gate flopped forward on its own, just sit there until the whole field goes?? Pretty sure he was surprised it went foward, he already was behind eevryone by turn 1..are we penalizing his quick reflexes overcoming his mistake? It wasnt intentional, it was missed anticipation.

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Motodude
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Deegs and sexton will be smokin jet in 2026 no worries brotha 

Take it easy SteveScreenshot 20250810-100313 Chrome.jpg?VersionId=01biO7Ephhj22dWjA1hjgP

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Press516
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Ridiculous to dock him when he obviously got no advantage.

Press516 wrote:
Not true…. Had he backed out from the gate and then went, he would have been much farther back than 23rd.  By going after he knocked...

Not true…. Had he backed out from the gate and then went, he would have been much farther back than 23rd.  By going after he knocked it forward, he likely gained 10+ positions over where he would have been.  Plus, per the rule, he “fouled” the gate.  Penalty is 1 lap or DQ.

Motodude wrote:
🐂💩Whats he supposed to do when the gate flopped forward on its own, just sit there until the whole field goes?? Pretty sure he was surprised...

🐂💩

Whats he supposed to do when the gate flopped forward on its own, just sit there until the whole field goes?? Pretty sure he was surprised it went foward, he already was behind eevryone by turn 1..are we penalizing his quick reflexes overcoming his mistake? It wasnt intentional, it was missed anticipation.

You don’t understand the rule, it’s ok..,

No BS, just facts.

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Motodude
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8/9/2025 8:12pm Edited Date/Time 8/9/2025 8:17pm
Press516 wrote:
Not true…. Had he backed out from the gate and then went, he would have been much farther back than 23rd.  By going after he knocked...

Not true…. Had he backed out from the gate and then went, he would have been much farther back than 23rd.  By going after he knocked it forward, he likely gained 10+ positions over where he would have been.  Plus, per the rule, he “fouled” the gate.  Penalty is 1 lap or DQ.

Motodude wrote:
🐂💩Whats he supposed to do when the gate flopped forward on its own, just sit there until the whole field goes?? Pretty sure he was surprised...

🐂💩

Whats he supposed to do when the gate flopped forward on its own, just sit there until the whole field goes?? Pretty sure he was surprised it went foward, he already was behind eevryone by turn 1..are we penalizing his quick reflexes overcoming his mistake? It wasnt intentional, it was missed anticipation.

Press516 wrote:

You don’t understand the rule, it’s ok..,

No BS, just facts.

Would you post the rule please? So we can all see it and what the actual beef is. 

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8/9/2025 8:20pm
Motodude wrote:
🐂💩Whats he supposed to do when the gate flopped forward on its own, just sit there until the whole field goes?? Pretty sure he was surprised...

🐂💩

Whats he supposed to do when the gate flopped forward on its own, just sit there until the whole field goes?? Pretty sure he was surprised it went foward, he already was behind eevryone by turn 1..are we penalizing his quick reflexes overcoming his mistake? It wasnt intentional, it was missed anticipation.

Press516 wrote:

You don’t understand the rule, it’s ok..,

No BS, just facts.

Motodude wrote:

Would you post the rule please? So we can all see it and what the actual beef is. 

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Shred
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8/9/2025 8:22pm Edited Date/Time 8/9/2025 8:23pm

Like the rule or not…it is the rule.  I have given the AMA so much sh*t in the past for enforcing a rule differently on a privateer than they did a factory guy.  It was BS… so….if the rule book says it then DO IT.  Even if it’s Jett.

…now if you want to get the rule changed then fine…argue that….not that they shouldn’t apply the rule that is in the book.

He smacked the gate, and unlike what some said …he did not back up.  He hammered on his front brake and you saw his forks rebound and then he went.

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MX558
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8/9/2025 8:26pm

Maybe Jett should threaten to go car racing. Then the AMA would reverse the penalty. I get the penalty if you gain an advantage but that clearly not the case 

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Press516
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Motodude wrote:
🐂💩Whats he supposed to do when the gate flopped forward on its own, just sit there until the whole field goes?? Pretty sure he was surprised...

🐂💩

Whats he supposed to do when the gate flopped forward on its own, just sit there until the whole field goes?? Pretty sure he was surprised it went foward, he already was behind eevryone by turn 1..are we penalizing his quick reflexes overcoming his mistake? It wasnt intentional, it was missed anticipation.

Press516 wrote:

You don’t understand the rule, it’s ok..,

No BS, just facts.

Motodude wrote:

Would you post the rule please? So we can all see it and what the actual beef is. 

1.8.10 - c. 1.

fouled gate.jpg?VersionId=xq7Z

 

He fouled the gate by hitting it hard enough to flip it forward.  Then he dropped the clutch again while he was ahead of the other riders...  That is the explanation given by Mike Pelletier and was confirmed by the replays showed over and over again.  If he had let them go, like if he had gotten stuck in the gate, probably no penalty.  

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mbw479
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8/9/2025 8:29pm

Has this happened before with this penalty?

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Motodude
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8/9/2025 8:42pm
mbw479 wrote:

Has this happened before with this penalty?

Not in pro moto that Im aware of.

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8/9/2025 8:42pm

He clearly checked up realizing what had happened. I don’t see the advantage gained to warrant a 1 lap penalty. Also you had RJ accelerated off the side of the track, that’s in the rule book and no penalty.  

It also reminded me of this. https://www.vitalmx.com/forums/Moto-Related,20/Gate-malfunction,1360317?page=0


 

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Motodude
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8/9/2025 8:44pm Edited Date/Time 8/9/2025 8:48pm
Press516 wrote:

You don’t understand the rule, it’s ok..,

No BS, just facts.

Motodude wrote:

Would you post the rule please? So we can all see it and what the actual beef is. 

Press516 wrote:
1.8.10 - c. 1. He fouled the gate by hitting it hard enough to flip it forward.  Then he dropped the clutch again while he was ahead...

1.8.10 - c. 1.

fouled gate.jpg?VersionId=xq7Z

 

He fouled the gate by hitting it hard enough to flip it forward.  Then he dropped the clutch again while he was ahead of the other riders...  That is the explanation given by Mike Pelletier and was confirmed by the replays showed over and over again.  If he had let them go, like if he had gotten stuck in the gate, probably no penalty.  

More 🐂💩. He got no advantage at all from hitting the gate. He clearly lost all momentum watching the gate flop forward resulting in being near the rear of the field into turn 1.

Busted his nut getting through the entire pack, risking life and injury to be told, 'nope you got an advantage off the start' by a hillbilly yank official.

Welp, you woke up the giant. Jet will give the entire field a whoooping now. MXoN too.

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Motodude
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Press516
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Motodude wrote:

Would you post the rule please? So we can all see it and what the actual beef is. 

Press516 wrote:
1.8.10 - c. 1. He fouled the gate by hitting it hard enough to flip it forward.  Then he dropped the clutch again while he was ahead...

1.8.10 - c. 1.

fouled gate.jpg?VersionId=xq7Z

 

He fouled the gate by hitting it hard enough to flip it forward.  Then he dropped the clutch again while he was ahead of the other riders...  That is the explanation given by Mike Pelletier and was confirmed by the replays showed over and over again.  If he had let them go, like if he had gotten stuck in the gate, probably no penalty.  

Motodude wrote:
More 🐂💩. He got no advantage at all from hitting the gate. He clearly lost all momentum watching the gate flop forward resulting in being near...

More 🐂💩. He got no advantage at all from hitting the gate. He clearly lost all momentum watching the gate flop forward resulting in being near the rear of the field into turn 1.

Busted his nut getting through the entire pack, risking life and injury to be told, 'nope you got an advantage off the start' by a hillbilly yank official.

Welp, you woke up the giant. Jet will give the entire field a whoooping now. MXoN too.

You don't get it...  He hit the gate so hard that it went forward.  If his foul was less egregious, he would have got caught in the gate and would have been MUCH FARTHER BACK THAN HE WAS.  His foul was much worse than most fouls on the start gate.  

No, I don't agree that the 1 lap penalty is fair.  But it is what's in the rule book.  What other penalties do you want the AMA to overlook?  Illegal fuel?  Bike under weight?  Really, tell us what other rules you want to ignore.

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