Carmichaels style

6/26/2025 7:34am
Partly retired and still able to run down and pass a prime James Stewart at the narliest track in America. Jett is great and all but...

Partly retired and still able to run down and pass a prime James Stewart at the narliest track in America. Jett is great and all but RC is the GOAT and always will be

It seems crazy to think the speed of the top guys hasnt gone up in 18yrs. But I cant argue. RC and Bubba seem faster than anyone ever. Deegz technique is far superior to RC's, by the way. I dont see that they are similar at all

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Johnny Ringo
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6/26/2025 7:51am

This video is further proof that wide open style does NOT translate well to a 450

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Johnny Ringo
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6/26/2025 7:52am

RC and style are two words that would never be used in the same sentence lol.

“His style is…riding a bull with no arms”

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Falcon
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6/26/2025 8:07am

Races, outdoors, are won in the turns. NOBODY ever got on the gas sooner or as hard as RC. And still haven't. The end.

Pop Shmoke wrote:

Nobody ever mentions this but you’re 100% right Carmichael was a savage in corner speed.

Absolutely correct. I recall him at Glen Helen, second year on the Pro Circuit Kawi 125, sporting the big number 1 plate. He came down the...

Absolutely correct. I recall him at Glen Helen, second year on the Pro Circuit Kawi 125, sporting the big number 1 plate. He came down the rutted, muddy straight into the 90 degree right turn (same turn that, years later, Mike Alessi would clobber Ivan Tedesco), and just SLAMMED into the berm WFO. I mean, the engine note never changed. And he was gone! There was no finesse, just a pure power move. Awe-inspiring.

I was at that race - the first National I ever attended. I hiked all the way to the top of Mt. St. Helen to watch from the peak. If you aren't familiar with that hill in person, let me tell you it's steep. I had to use my fingers in the chain link fence on the side of the track to help me climb up the trail - you literally can't walk up that hill! 
Anyway, the difference in abilities was unreal. Riders came up the side from what was called Shoei hill, made a 90-degree right, then down the big downhill. Most guys opted for the inside line, dropped off, made a shift or two and coasted down the hill about half-throttle. (That's still crazy fast, mind you.) Carmichael railed the outside line and JUMPED off the top, clicking up into 3rd while in the air, then pinned the throttle on that PC125 and upshifted all the way down the hill. Unreal!

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The Shop

6/26/2025 9:29am

Races, outdoors, are won in the turns. NOBODY ever got on the gas sooner or as hard as RC. And still haven't. The end.

Pop Shmoke wrote:

Nobody ever mentions this but you’re 100% right Carmichael was a savage in corner speed.

I was watching how both RC and JS "buried" their bikes in the corner and thought about the contrast to Jett these days.  Eli seems to "bury" his in the corners in a similar fashion to RC and JS in this clip.  

Such a contrast and so interesting to watch



 

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6/26/2025 9:35am

RC and style are two words that would never be used in the same sentence lol.

RC styled all the way to the bank

 

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Trickamoto
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6/26/2025 11:35am

it's so funny. threads like this re: RC make me happy thinking about him on the bike.....but i fucking hate the guy in the booth. wierd!

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Ramrod
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6/26/2025 11:52am
Trickamoto wrote:

it's so funny. threads like this re: RC make me happy thinking about him on the bike.....but i fucking hate the guy in the booth. wierd!

Good to remember he WAS an animal on the bike and won all those races and championships for a reason.

 

I wonder if he was more hard edged like his ultra competitive side would endear more viewers?  Hard to bring that persona and not say something edgy and get cancelled nowadays.

Tumic
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6/26/2025 12:03pm
It seems crazy to think the speed of the top guys hasnt gone up in 18yrs. But I cant argue. RC and Bubba seem faster than...

It seems crazy to think the speed of the top guys hasnt gone up in 18yrs. But I cant argue. RC and Bubba seem faster than anyone ever. Deegz technique is far superior to RC's, by the way. I dont see that they are similar at all

It’s the classic fool the eye with overly aggressive riding. 
I am by no means saying that RC and JS was not fast, but just like Eli they can look faster than what they are.


I stood in the corner at Matterley and saw it live when Everts passed JS standing on the pegs looking like he was on a Sunday cruise and JS looked fast as hell.

In 2025 we should know better than using looks as a gauge for speed.

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Johnny Ringo
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6/26/2025 12:43pm Edited Date/Time 6/26/2025 12:43pm
It seems crazy to think the speed of the top guys hasnt gone up in 18yrs. But I cant argue. RC and Bubba seem faster than...

It seems crazy to think the speed of the top guys hasnt gone up in 18yrs. But I cant argue. RC and Bubba seem faster than anyone ever. Deegz technique is far superior to RC's, by the way. I dont see that they are similar at all

Tumic wrote:
It’s the classic fool the eye with overly aggressive riding. I am by no means saying that RC and JS was not fast, but just like Eli...

It’s the classic fool the eye with overly aggressive riding. 
I am by no means saying that RC and JS was not fast, but just like Eli they can look faster than what they are.


I stood in the corner at Matterley and saw it live when Everts passed JS standing on the pegs looking like he was on a Sunday cruise and JS looked fast as hell.

In 2025 we should know better than using looks as a gauge for speed.

Can you then explain all those times Windham looked smooth and effortless….and was 30 seconds behind RC?

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Tumic
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6/26/2025 12:47pm

Can you then explain all those times Windham looked smooth and effortless….and was 30 seconds behind RC?

Sure thing, if you explain Everts passing JS. 

Windham was never on the same level physically as the other two, but that won’t change the fact that a overly aggressive rider can fool the eye as you should see every time Jett races Eli or AP.

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Johnny Ringo
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6/26/2025 12:59pm

Can you then explain all those times Windham looked smooth and effortless….and was 30 seconds behind RC?

Tumic wrote:
Sure thing, if you explain Everts passing JS. Windham was never on the same level physically as the other two, but that won’t change the fact that...

Sure thing, if you explain Everts passing JS. 

Windham was never on the same level physically as the other two, but that won’t change the fact that a overly aggressive rider can fool the eye as you should see every time Jett races Eli or AP.

What about RC vs Everts in Zolder? Who looked fast there? I can straw man this all day. 

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FreshTopEnd
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6/26/2025 1:05pm

One of my favorites from the early TGOs to warm up for Southwick.

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FreshTopEnd
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6/26/2025 1:18pm

This Steve Bruhn/TFS shot pretty well captures the RC experience.

TFS.jpg?VersionId=AjR AvzzPh21ztIUJSiZppeLg5zCej
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Tumic
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6/26/2025 1:25pm

What about RC vs Everts in Zolder? Who looked fast there? I can straw man this all day. 

You sure seem to put in a lot of effort to misunderstand this…

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72bu
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6/26/2025 1:31pm

Ricky’s style is take no prisoners. Full bore, always on the gas and looking for a new line. Who cares about looking smooth when you’re kicking everyone’s ass on the track. 

He’s a legend and definitely The GOAT

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NateDawg241
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6/26/2025 1:41pm Edited Date/Time 6/26/2025 1:43pm

Can you then explain all those times Windham looked smooth and effortless….and was 30 seconds behind RC?

Tumic wrote:
Sure thing, if you explain Everts passing JS. Windham was never on the same level physically as the other two, but that won’t change the fact that...

Sure thing, if you explain Everts passing JS. 

Windham was never on the same level physically as the other two, but that won’t change the fact that a overly aggressive rider can fool the eye as you should see every time Jett races Eli or AP.

If that's the rabbit hole you wanna go down why don't you explain RC stomping Everts in his own backyard riding a 250 2-stroke like a bucking bronco while Everts was smooth as glass on the 500c 4-stroke?

 

There's multiple ways to go fast and just because some styles look prettier than others doesn't mean they're any better

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FreshTopEnd
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6/26/2025 1:43pm

Frank Hoppen shots.

Hoppen001Hoppen002Hoppen003.jpg?VersionId=vyw3fvH8Uc7BRqOgXuLYO.
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Tumic
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6/26/2025 1:51pm
If that's the rabbit hole you wanna go down why don't you explain RC stomping Everts in his own backyard riding a 250 2-stroke like a...

If that's the rabbit hole you wanna go down why don't you explain RC stomping Everts in his own backyard riding a 250 2-stroke like a bucking bronco while Everts was smooth as glass on the 500c 4-stroke?

 

There's multiple ways to go fast and just because some styles look prettier than others doesn't mean they're any better

One more that put in the same effort… 

I said that overly aggressive riders can look faster than what they are and looks should not be used as a measurement and you guys can not comprehend what i mean with that?.

If looks were the things we based speed on Carson Brown and Barcia would be the fastest riders on the planet but they are not.

And the same goes for RC and JS from almost 20 years back. They are not faster than today’s riders just because they looked fast on the video that were shown. 

Simple as that. But I guess you guys choose to ignore the part where I clearly said that both RC and JS were fast but there are examples that prove that you can not base speed on looks. Jeez…

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FreshTopEnd
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6/26/2025 1:55pm Edited Date/Time 6/26/2025 1:57pm
It seems crazy to think the speed of the top guys hasnt gone up in 18yrs. But I cant argue. RC and Bubba seem faster than...

It seems crazy to think the speed of the top guys hasnt gone up in 18yrs. But I cant argue. RC and Bubba seem faster than anyone ever. Deegz technique is far superior to RC's, by the way. I dont see that they are similar at all

Tumic wrote:
It’s the classic fool the eye with overly aggressive riding. I am by no means saying that RC and JS was not fast, but just like Eli...

It’s the classic fool the eye with overly aggressive riding. 
I am by no means saying that RC and JS was not fast, but just like Eli they can look faster than what they are.


I stood in the corner at Matterley and saw it live when Everts passed JS standing on the pegs looking like he was on a Sunday cruise and JS looked fast as hell.

In 2025 we should know better than using looks as a gauge for speed.

I'm not sure this is a distinction with a difference.  No one contests there are different ways to go fast.  Marty Tripes was the slowest looking rider I've ever seen, and he walked past some of the best.

Regardless of style you can only tell so much by comparing 20 year old video to current.  Bikes, training, skill development change.  RC, Stew, Everts were a cut above in their time.   If their prime was now they almost certainly would still be a cut above, probably with some company.  Ultimately the results tell the tale who's fast, not the rider's style.  

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NateDawg241
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6/26/2025 1:59pm Edited Date/Time 6/26/2025 2:01pm
If that's the rabbit hole you wanna go down why don't you explain RC stomping Everts in his own backyard riding a 250 2-stroke like a...

If that's the rabbit hole you wanna go down why don't you explain RC stomping Everts in his own backyard riding a 250 2-stroke like a bucking bronco while Everts was smooth as glass on the 500c 4-stroke?

 

There's multiple ways to go fast and just because some styles look prettier than others doesn't mean they're any better

Tumic wrote:
One more that put in the same effort… I said that overly aggressive riders can look faster than what they are and looks should not be used...

One more that put in the same effort… 

I said that overly aggressive riders can look faster than what they are and looks should not be used as a measurement and you guys can not comprehend what i mean with that?.

If looks were the things we based speed on Carson Brown and Barcia would be the fastest riders on the planet but they are not.

And the same goes for RC and JS from almost 20 years back. They are not faster than today’s riders just because they looked fast on the video that were shown. 

Simple as that. But I guess you guys choose to ignore the part where I clearly said that both RC and JS were fast but there are examples that prove that you can not base speed on looks. Jeez…

Buddy if you put the riders of today against a prime RC on the same equipment they're gonna get smashed outdoors just like everyone else who ever raced RC. In motocross I would put Jett around the same level as Stewart and Carmichael smoked James outdoors

And idk why you keep acting like JS had some crazy out of control style. He had big crashes but dude was smooth as glass while on 2 wheels. Watching him go around a supercross track was poetry in motion

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Tumic
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Buddy if you put the riders of today against a prime RC on the same equipment they're gonna get smashed outdoors just like everyone else who...

Buddy if you put the riders of today against a prime RC on the same equipment they're gonna get smashed outdoors just like everyone else who ever raced RC. In motocross I would put Jett around the same level as Stewart and Carmichael smoked James outdoors

And idk why you keep acting like JS had some crazy out of control style. He had big crashes but dude was smooth as glass while on 2 wheels. Watching him go around a supercross track was poetry in motion

There is nothing smooth about JS riding at southwick in the video we are discussing.


I replied to Chris regarding that he thought they seems faster than anyone ever, and on that I strongly disagree just because you can’t base speed on looks for obvious reasons.


if you think that riders from 20 years ago went faster than what today’s riders do, you are not giving the current guys enough credit for the work and evolution. 

One could argue that none of today’s riders have the same mindset as RC did, but speed has evolved since then.

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Flatliner
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6/26/2025 2:19pm
TogaSet wrote:
Lining up on the gate against RC outdoors the best you could hope for was second place.  You weren’t going to win.  This went on for...

Lining up on the gate against RC outdoors the best you could hope for was second place.  You weren’t going to win.  This went on for years and years until he retired.  Just ask K-Dub. 

A few guys could sneak in a win here and there, KW and tortelli come to mind.  

Tortelli would have won red bud two years in a row if he didn't run ou of gas.

Dave v3.0
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6/26/2025 5:14pm

RC had no style.  But he had speed, determination, and an unbeatable mental attitude.  I wonder just how many practice bikes he wore out during his career in search of just one more tenth of a second.

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6/26/2025 6:33pm
Buddy if you put the riders of today against a prime RC on the same equipment they're gonna get smashed outdoors just like everyone else who...

Buddy if you put the riders of today against a prime RC on the same equipment they're gonna get smashed outdoors just like everyone else who ever raced RC. In motocross I would put Jett around the same level as Stewart and Carmichael smoked James outdoors

And idk why you keep acting like JS had some crazy out of control style. He had big crashes but dude was smooth as glass while on 2 wheels. Watching him go around a supercross track was poetry in motion

Tumic wrote:
There is nothing smooth about JS riding at southwick in the video we are discussing.I replied to Chris regarding that he thought they seems faster than...

There is nothing smooth about JS riding at southwick in the video we are discussing.


I replied to Chris regarding that he thought they seems faster than anyone ever, and on that I strongly disagree just because you can’t base speed on looks for obvious reasons.


if you think that riders from 20 years ago went faster than what today’s riders do, you are not giving the current guys enough credit for the work and evolution. 

One could argue that none of today’s riders have the same mindset as RC did, but speed has evolved since then.

To be clear, i think the current top riders are going faster than any generation ever. To deny that is saying the top level hasn't progressed in almost 20yrs. Its letting nostalgia override your brain 

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Scott14
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6/26/2025 8:00pm

I wish I looked like Jett when riding(I don't) but Ricky is way more fun to watch.  

DonM
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Fantasy
6/27/2025 5:53am
Buddy if you put the riders of today against a prime RC on the same equipment they're gonna get smashed outdoors just like everyone else who...

Buddy if you put the riders of today against a prime RC on the same equipment they're gonna get smashed outdoors just like everyone else who ever raced RC. In motocross I would put Jett around the same level as Stewart and Carmichael smoked James outdoors

And idk why you keep acting like JS had some crazy out of control style. He had big crashes but dude was smooth as glass while on 2 wheels. Watching him go around a supercross track was poetry in motion

Tumic wrote:
There is nothing smooth about JS riding at southwick in the video we are discussing.I replied to Chris regarding that he thought they seems faster than...

There is nothing smooth about JS riding at southwick in the video we are discussing.


I replied to Chris regarding that he thought they seems faster than anyone ever, and on that I strongly disagree just because you can’t base speed on looks for obvious reasons.


if you think that riders from 20 years ago went faster than what today’s riders do, you are not giving the current guys enough credit for the work and evolution. 

One could argue that none of today’s riders have the same mindset as RC did, but speed has evolved since then.

To be clear, i think the current top riders are going faster than any generation ever. To deny that is saying the top level hasn't progressed...

To be clear, i think the current top riders are going faster than any generation ever. To deny that is saying the top level hasn't progressed in almost 20yrs. Its letting nostalgia override your brain 

You are probably right, but I don't think there has been any great revelation on rider technique over the years but there has been great strides in the development of the bikes that I feel allows todays riders ride with the technique, speed and style they have. If you put RC on todays bikes in his prime he would still be the Goat and would still dominate like he did. 

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motomike137
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6/27/2025 11:47am
I'm not sure this is a distinction with a difference.  No one contests there are different ways to go fast.  Marty Tripes was the slowest looking...

I'm not sure this is a distinction with a difference.  No one contests there are different ways to go fast.  Marty Tripes was the slowest looking rider I've ever seen, and he walked past some of the best.

Regardless of style you can only tell so much by comparing 20 year old video to current.  Bikes, training, skill development change.  RC, Stew, Everts were a cut above in their time.   If their prime was now they almost certainly would still be a cut above, probably with some company.  Ultimately the results tell the tale who's fast, not the rider's style.  

There are guys with a certain mentality that would kick ass and take names in any era. RC is at the top of that list imho. 

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motomike137
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6/27/2025 11:50am
Buddy if you put the riders of today against a prime RC on the same equipment they're gonna get smashed outdoors just like everyone else who...

Buddy if you put the riders of today against a prime RC on the same equipment they're gonna get smashed outdoors just like everyone else who ever raced RC. In motocross I would put Jett around the same level as Stewart and Carmichael smoked James outdoors

And idk why you keep acting like JS had some crazy out of control style. He had big crashes but dude was smooth as glass while on 2 wheels. Watching him go around a supercross track was poetry in motion

Tumic wrote:
There is nothing smooth about JS riding at southwick in the video we are discussing.I replied to Chris regarding that he thought they seems faster than...

There is nothing smooth about JS riding at southwick in the video we are discussing.


I replied to Chris regarding that he thought they seems faster than anyone ever, and on that I strongly disagree just because you can’t base speed on looks for obvious reasons.


if you think that riders from 20 years ago went faster than what today’s riders do, you are not giving the current guys enough credit for the work and evolution. 

One could argue that none of today’s riders have the same mindset as RC did, but speed has evolved since then.

To be clear, i think the current top riders are going faster than any generation ever. To deny that is saying the top level hasn't progressed...

To be clear, i think the current top riders are going faster than any generation ever. To deny that is saying the top level hasn't progressed in almost 20yrs. Its letting nostalgia override your brain 

If RC or Hannah or James or Jeremy or RJ were around now instead of in the past they all would still be winners. It's all relative except for the mentality.

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Moto Nomad
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6/27/2025 3:56pm
It seems crazy to think the speed of the top guys hasnt gone up in 18yrs. But I cant argue. RC and Bubba seem faster than...

It seems crazy to think the speed of the top guys hasnt gone up in 18yrs. But I cant argue. RC and Bubba seem faster than anyone ever. Deegz technique is far superior to RC's, by the way. I dont see that they are similar at all

Tumic wrote:
It’s the classic fool the eye with overly aggressive riding. I am by no means saying that RC and JS was not fast, but just like Eli...

It’s the classic fool the eye with overly aggressive riding. 
I am by no means saying that RC and JS was not fast, but just like Eli they can look faster than what they are.


I stood in the corner at Matterley and saw it live when Everts passed JS standing on the pegs looking like he was on a Sunday cruise and JS looked fast as hell.

In 2025 we should know better than using looks as a gauge for speed.

Can you then explain all those times Windham looked smooth and effortless….and was 30 seconds behind RC?

Windham wasn't willing to hang it out and ride on the edge of disaster to win. RC was.

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