'Liberation Day' tariff announcements

burn1986 wrote:

Omg. Are you serious?! You know the lawyers are getting paid to blow this out of proportion and make this person look like a saint. Lowlife...

Omg. Are you serious?! You know the lawyers are getting paid to blow this out of proportion and make this person look like a saint. Lowlife immigration lawyers will punk this guy and his family for everything they have, especially if they know he’ll get deported.

Do you know anything about his case- records indices checks through NCIC, Eagle, Social Security Administration, Asylum, CIS, Interpol notices (green, red, etc.)? Any prior deports? How did he enter? Does he have any relatives here? What country is he from? All these checks have to be done before they can issue a warrant of arrest. They usually don’t suspect gang affiliation unless the alien says they are part of one or discover something that causes them to look at Facebook and stuff, and then do further checks. Since you’re versed on Immigration, what countries do MS13 gang members or associates not come from? Do you know anything about Expedited Removal Orders? What about a Section 238 Removal Order? What is the due process for these types of removal? If he’s from somewhere other than Mexico, then he had to be verified by that country’s consolate or equivalent to have a travel document issued.

Last2Stroke wrote:

No due process being deported to El Salvador, when a judge order he could not be deported to El Salvador!

JimSharp wrote:

Are non-citizens entitled to due process? Where in the Constitution and/or the Bill of Rights does it say that?

soggy wrote:

Why don’t y’all stop calling out tariffs and start calling it a new sales tax?  Cause that’s what it is. 

ns503 wrote:

Not exactly. Sales tax applies no matter where the product was made. Tariffs target countries. And create animosity and loss of trust. Especially when randomly applied...

Not exactly. Sales tax applies no matter where the product was made. Tariffs target countries. And create animosity and loss of trust. Especially when randomly applied to long time friends and allies. The effects of which will be long lasting and even more harmful that a simple tax. 

soggy wrote:

Why don’t y’all stop calling out tariffs and start calling it a new sales tax?  Cause that’s what it is. 

ns503 wrote:

Not exactly. Sales tax applies no matter where the product was made. Tariffs target countries. And create animosity and loss of trust. Especially when randomly applied...

Not exactly. Sales tax applies no matter where the product was made. Tariffs target countries. And create animosity and loss of trust. Especially when randomly applied to long time friends and allies. The effects of which will be long lasting and even more harmful that a simple tax. 

JimSharp wrote:

But what about the tariffs imposed by those other nations? Guess that’s just good business?

lumpy790 wrote:

What another country import taxes their citizens is non of our business.

lumpy790 wrote:

What another country import taxes their citizens is non of our business.

JimSharp wrote:

Ah yes, they should protect their industry and ours should go to shit. 

The U.S. sure does love their cheap, plastic crap.

flow wrote:

Kilmar's situation is a bit different from the usual deportation playbook you're talking about. Even the Trump administration itself admitted they messed up and deported him...

Kilmar's situation is a bit different from the usual deportation playbook you're talking about. Even the Trump administration itself admitted they messed up and deported him by mistake. 

All those checks (NCIC, warrants, etc.) are for the regular process. The whole point here is they didn't use the regular process like Expedited Removal or Section 283. They dug up that super old Alien Enemies Act from 1798 specifically to bypass the normal immigration courts and rules.

Kilmar wasn't some random guy they yoinked. He'd already been in front of a US immigration judge who granted him withholding of removal because he proved he'd likely be persecuted by gangs if sent back to El Salvador. In that court case there were questions raised as to his affiliation with MS-13, but the presiding judge reviewed it and rejected it. He got a court order saying "don't do the thing" specifically because there was determined to be significant possibility of harm if he was deported. Using the 1798 Act let them ignore that judge's ruling and "do the thing", which is why the other judge got so mad. Reg travel docs, normally you need consulate verification and all that but it doesn't really matter how they got his travel papers if the entire legal basis for sending him in the first place was ruled illegal.

It's less about whether the usual boxes were ticked and more about the administration using a really old, controversial law to skip the system, ignore a judge's previous order, and ending up deporting someone they later admitted they shouldn't have. I agree with your observation that the media will sensationalize individuals to push a narrative but this falls under "government doing sketchy shit" and at least for me, is a situation where I heavily scrutinize the gov and judge them more harshly in the court of my personal opinion. Same with Biden's continuing to use Title 42 which deported tons of people near the border during COVID while skipping important legal steps. 

TAUTOG wrote:

ns503 wrote:

Not exactly. Sales tax applies no matter where the product was made. Tariffs target countries. And create animosity and loss of trust. Especially when randomly applied...

Not exactly. Sales tax applies no matter where the product was made. Tariffs target countries. And create animosity and loss of trust. Especially when randomly applied to long time friends and allies. The effects of which will be long lasting and even more harmful that a simple tax. 

JimSharp wrote:

But what about the tariffs imposed by those other nations? Guess that’s just good business?

lumpy790 wrote:

What another country import taxes their citizens is non of our business.

Last2Stroke wrote:

No due process being deported to El Salvador, when a judge order he could not be deported to El Salvador!

JimSharp wrote:

Are non-citizens entitled to due process? Where in the Constitution and/or the Bill of Rights does it say that?

early wrote:

Amendments 1,4,5,6,8 of the Bill of Rights do not bestow those rights to US citizens exclusively, those rights are given to "the people" "persons" and "the...

Amendments 1,4,5,6,8 of the Bill of Rights do not bestow those rights to US citizens exclusively, those rights are given to "the people" "persons" and "the accused"

https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/bill-of-rights-transcript

The deportation is not as much of an issue as sending people to a 3rd party country to serve a sentence for something the were never proven guilty of.

If you read the Declaration of Independence disappearing people without due process was in their grievances with the king.

https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/declaration-transcript

soggy wrote:

Why don’t y’all stop calling out tariffs and start calling it a new sales tax?  Cause that’s what it is. 

ns503 wrote:

Not exactly. Sales tax applies no matter where the product was made. Tariffs target countries. And create animosity and loss of trust. Especially when randomly applied...

Not exactly. Sales tax applies no matter where the product was made. Tariffs target countries. And create animosity and loss of trust. Especially when randomly applied to long time friends and allies. The effects of which will be long lasting and even more harmful that a simple tax. 

burn1986 wrote:

Good points. I guess this is all online. What was his next court date? Pretty sure there was a time period for the Withholding of Rml...

Good points. I guess this is all online. What was his next court date? Pretty sure there was a time period for the Withholding of Rml (but, maybe not). 

Tithe 42, wasn’t necessarily a removal, but a VR right? Lots of Haitians removed under it. 

Oh well. All the aliens stage throughout the southern countries waiting for a political change and they all head up. Biden opened it up, so looks like one of the aliens got swept up. It happens. 

flow wrote:

I don't know about subsequent court dates actually. I did a couple of searches but didn't see anything. As for the time period, I believe it's...

I don't know about subsequent court dates actually. I did a couple of searches but didn't see anything. As for the time period, I believe it's permanent? I hesitate to say for sure because there's always that one damn exception lol. 

Reg 42, thanks, I'd forgotten that it was technically voluntary removal because of it's... assertiveness. Always thought it was pretty expulsive. And yeah tons of Haitians! Right around the time their Pres. got assassinated. that earthquake smacked them, and the crazy ass gang war was going on. I remember going down that series of unfortunate events rabbit hole. 

I see where you're coming from - very if you do x, y may happen. I feel that and share that sentiment with a lot of things that people get appalled at throughout the news cycle. I just personally feel that this specific case isn't just collateral but represents a specific failure/overreach. 

jjavaman wrote:

https://www.facebook.com/reel/9698536033502179?fs=e&s=TIeQ9V&fs=e&fs=e
 Nothing to see here….

Last2Stroke wrote:

No due process being deported to El Salvador, when a judge order he could not be deported to El Salvador!

JimSharp wrote:

Are non-citizens entitled to due process? Where in the Constitution and/or the Bill of Rights does it say that?

early wrote:

Amendments 1,4,5,6,8 of the Bill of Rights do not bestow those rights to US citizens exclusively, those rights are given to "the people" "persons" and "the...

Amendments 1,4,5,6,8 of the Bill of Rights do not bestow those rights to US citizens exclusively, those rights are given to "the people" "persons" and "the accused"

https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/bill-of-rights-transcript

The deportation is not as much of an issue as sending people to a 3rd party country to serve a sentence for something the were never proven guilty of.

If you read the Declaration of Independence disappearing people without due process was in their grievances with the king.

https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/declaration-transcript

JimSharp wrote:

Are non-citizens entitled to due process? Where in the Constitution and/or the Bill of Rights does it say that?

early wrote:

Amendments 1,4,5,6,8 of the Bill of Rights do not bestow those rights to US citizens exclusively, those rights are given to "the people" "persons" and "the...

Amendments 1,4,5,6,8 of the Bill of Rights do not bestow those rights to US citizens exclusively, those rights are given to "the people" "persons" and "the accused"

https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/bill-of-rights-transcript

The deportation is not as much of an issue as sending people to a 3rd party country to serve a sentence for something the were never proven guilty of.

If you read the Declaration of Independence disappearing people without due process was in their grievances with the king.

https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/declaration-transcript

APLMAN99 wrote:

The one correction that I would make to your post is that the Bill of Rights don’t give anyone rights, they are an acknowledgement that these...

The one correction that I would make to your post is that the Bill of Rights don’t give anyone rights, they are an acknowledgement that these are innate and inalienable rights. 

For everyone. 

aeffertz wrote:

Chance1216 wrote:

aeffertz wrote:

Predicting tomorrow’s headline:ELEVENTY BILLION PERCENT TARRIFS

Predicting tomorrow’s headline:

ELEVENTY BILLION PERCENT TARRIFS

Titan1 wrote:

It is when it affects American companies ability to sell their products in those countries.  If a country-ESPECIALLY if that country is one of our allies-is...

It is when it affects American companies ability to sell their products in those countries.  

If a country-ESPECIALLY if that country is one of our allies-is taxing American products at a higher rate than other countries, it puts American companies at a disadvantage because it makes American imports more expensive than imports from another country, and that is very much our business, and something the Federal Government can/should work to remedy.  

early wrote:

Amendments 1,4,5,6,8 of the Bill of Rights do not bestow those rights to US citizens exclusively, those rights are given to "the people" "persons" and "the...

Amendments 1,4,5,6,8 of the Bill of Rights do not bestow those rights to US citizens exclusively, those rights are given to "the people" "persons" and "the accused"

https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/bill-of-rights-transcript

The deportation is not as much of an issue as sending people to a 3rd party country to serve a sentence for something the were never proven guilty of.

If you read the Declaration of Independence disappearing people without due process was in their grievances with the king.

https://www.archives.gov/founding-docs/declaration-transcript

APLMAN99 wrote:

The one correction that I would make to your post is that the Bill of Rights don’t give anyone rights, they are an acknowledgement that these...

The one correction that I would make to your post is that the Bill of Rights don’t give anyone rights, they are an acknowledgement that these are innate and inalienable rights. 

For everyone. 

SEEMEFIRST wrote:

No, not everyone. 

Think about that one for a moment.