Hip position

sandtrack315
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Philadelphia, PA, USA

I’ve seen too many trainers, most prominently AJ, preach what amounts to an anterior pelvic tilt. This does not increase mobility and actually decreases the power you have in your posterior chain. If you watch how Jett, Sexton, Eli, et cetera, ride, none of them do this. They have their hips properly stacked backwards with a neutral position anterior-posterior. You move at the hips like a deadlift, you don’t tilt them anteriorly, which actually just puts all the weight on your lower back and doesn’t allow your abs, glutes, and quads to work. Ryno has shown this correctly, and AJ basically butchered it. Lots of folks out there preaching with a ton of confidence, even when it goes against basic biomechanics.

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SmokinJoe439
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11/15/2024 3:39pm

Remember what chubbs said

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bvm111
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11/15/2024 3:45pm

It’s all a bunch of nonsense hocus pocus to sell something

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PRM31
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Fantasy
11/15/2024 3:46pm Edited Date/Time 11/15/2024 3:50pm

Pictures would be useful here. 

As for technique, there are riders with very different techniques that all go very fast. I do think correcting major issues can enable a rider to go faster safely. Going faster is a choice. What your brain and eyes are doing is more important than minor elbow or butt positions. 

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The Shop

sandtrack315
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11/15/2024 4:21pm
PRM31 wrote:
Pictures would be useful here. As for technique, there are riders with very different techniques that all go very fast. I do think correcting major issues can...

Pictures would be useful here. 

As for technique, there are riders with very different techniques that all go very fast. I do think correcting major issues can enable a rider to go faster safely. Going faster is a choice. What your brain and eyes are doing is more important than minor elbow or butt positions. 

IMG 0811 2
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Shakybonez15
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11/15/2024 4:25pm Edited Date/Time 11/16/2024 9:28am

I've given up on all these position guys... Ride your style and go as fast as you can with your style.. trying to emulate the perfect this or that.. is not what makes champions.

Champions take the lessons and then modify it to fit them and keep doing what worked for them.

Myself who is not a champion tried to focus on all of this positioning stuff and all it made me do was think to much while i was riding and slowed me down. Once i just went back to how i know how to ride.. i was faster and i ended up on the podium at my last race.  however take my anecdotal experience with all the salt the titanic has accumulated over the years.

========

Side note, I really like the anterior pelvic tilt when my wife does it.. but this is the wrong forum for such a discussion

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crowe660
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11/15/2024 4:25pm

Is that the position AJ recommends his business partners get used to?

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sandtrack315
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11/15/2024 4:29pm
I've given up on all these position guys... Ride your style and go as fast as you can with your style.. trying to emulate the perfect...

I've given up on all these position guys... Ride your style and go as fast as you can with your style.. trying to emulate the perfect this or that.. is not what makes champions.

Champions take the lessons and then modify it to fit them and keep doing what worked for them.

Myself who is not a champion tried to focus on all of this positioning stuff and all it made me do was think to much while i was riding and slowed me down. Once i just went back to how i know how to ride.. i was faster and i ended up on the podium at my last race.  however take my anecdotal experience with all the salt the titanic has accumulated over the years.

========

Side note, I really like the anterior pelvic tilt when my wife does it.. but this is the wrong forum for such a discussion

Time and a place for everything, even incorrect biomechanics 

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11/15/2024 5:55pm

I'm on board with most of the usual MX basics of elbows up/out (good strong position), flat back (same as a Linebacker in football) and riding on the balls of the feet with using your legs and core (which is pretty much the same as in any atheltic sport).  That's pretty basic stuff that has been around forever and there is cross over between various sports.  But I'm not on board with the whole "drop your heels" fad.  I get that you need to have your foot positioned on the back of the peg to properly blitz whoops in SX, but outside of that there's no need to drop the heels. I get squeezing the bike with your knees and being properly balanced on the bike.  Fine. But there's no need to drop the heals.  That's just akin for a bad ankle/foot injury - ask me how I know.....And if you study Tomac closely, he's not dropping his heals anymore (or nothing like he was before the accident) since his Achilles tear.  Aside from the injury potential, it's about as an unathletic position one could possibly be in.  It's worse than being flat footed and if you have ever played any stick and ball sport, you know you don't want to be flat footed.  On the balls of the feet, knees slightly bent, flat back, good strong position is all great posture for any athlete to be in.  I predict that 5 years from now after a crapload of people have had torn up ankles, feet, and achilles injuries, the drop the heals stuff goes away (outside of the pros doing it for blitzing SX whoops).  

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11/15/2024 7:20pm
PRM31 wrote:
Pictures would be useful here. As for technique, there are riders with very different techniques that all go very fast. I do think correcting major issues can...

Pictures would be useful here. 

As for technique, there are riders with very different techniques that all go very fast. I do think correcting major issues can enable a rider to go faster safely. Going faster is a choice. What your brain and eyes are doing is more important than minor elbow or butt positions. 

IMG 0811 2

Position is exactly the same as every Pro on the start going for it.  Or for a sucker that dropped 400 for a riding lesson. It’s all soo confusing which 1 is it. Lol.  Toes in is just as bad or worse.  The big pass for your biggest win. Probably won’t hv I changed my toe position & bam I got em in the 100th time you told your story. Haha 

1
Johnny Ringo
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Tombstone, AZ, USA
11/15/2024 7:42pm
crowe660 wrote:

Is that the position AJ recommends his business partners get used to?

Lmaoo

1
11/15/2024 7:43pm
TbonesPop wrote:
I'm on board with most of the usual MX basics of elbows up/out (good strong position), flat back (same as a Linebacker in football) and riding...

I'm on board with most of the usual MX basics of elbows up/out (good strong position), flat back (same as a Linebacker in football) and riding on the balls of the feet with using your legs and core (which is pretty much the same as in any atheltic sport).  That's pretty basic stuff that has been around forever and there is cross over between various sports.  But I'm not on board with the whole "drop your heels" fad.  I get that you need to have your foot positioned on the back of the peg to properly blitz whoops in SX, but outside of that there's no need to drop the heels. I get squeezing the bike with your knees and being properly balanced on the bike.  Fine. But there's no need to drop the heals.  That's just akin for a bad ankle/foot injury - ask me how I know.....And if you study Tomac closely, he's not dropping his heals anymore (or nothing like he was before the accident) since his Achilles tear.  Aside from the injury potential, it's about as an unathletic position one could possibly be in.  It's worse than being flat footed and if you have ever played any stick and ball sport, you know you don't want to be flat footed.  On the balls of the feet, knees slightly bent, flat back, good strong position is all great posture for any athlete to be in.  I predict that 5 years from now after a crapload of people have had torn up ankles, feet, and achilles injuries, the drop the heals stuff goes away (outside of the pros doing it for blitzing SX whoops).  

I broke my foot when my heel hit the ground. Landing off a triple.  Big landings now I tell myself get pegs on my arches.  I saw a AJ vid that said he can’t shift standing up . He only shifts sitting. If you raise the shifter 1 notch you can. I do most shifts standing . What do u do if your in top gear wo & your left hand flew off the bars. You need to clutch in quick . Raise the shifter . It just screams like in neutral. Then let loose of the shifter . But keep it wo.  I learned that my 1st ride flying threw a 1/3 mi whoop section threw big trees.  I went for 7th gear the bike just screamed then I let it go. Little whoop riding trick . The bike rockets like a nos system. Lol.  If your a Super Grest shift control guy do it in 4th.  The rider u pass will b like what The Fuck was that. Haha . It’s diff than using the clutch no slip on the gears. Take 6 seconds off a lap 

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Soul Indigo
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Phuket, TH
11/15/2024 7:57pm

A majority of the western world, humans who grew up sitting in chairs all day, have a posterior tilt, or tucked butt.

The intention for the unlocking the hips coaching advice is to shift anteriorly, with a target of getting back to balance.

Some have interpreted this to mean continue to an anterior tilt.

This advice seems to have drifted over to the fitness influencer community. 

That’s my take anyways.

At the end of the day, motocross is about energy efficient, biomechanically sound movements by a well balanced human with extreme center of mass control working in sync with a balanced bike. 

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AssangeMX
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Belmarsh, CA, USA
11/15/2024 8:10pm

Everts was dropping the heels in his technique videos 20 years ago.!!!

My biggest problem is not body position,  it's throttle position. 

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11/15/2024 8:15pm
A majority of the western world, humans who grew up sitting in chairs all day, have a posterior tilt, or tucked butt.The intention for the unlocking...

A majority of the western world, humans who grew up sitting in chairs all day, have a posterior tilt, or tucked butt.

The intention for the unlocking the hips coaching advice is to shift anteriorly, with a target of getting back to balance.

Some have interpreted this to mean continue to an anterior tilt.

This advice seems to have drifted over to the fitness influencer community. 

That’s my take anyways.

At the end of the day, motocross is about energy efficient, biomechanically sound movements by a well balanced human with extreme center of mass control working in sync with a balanced bike. 

And moving on the bike loose & fluid. Landing on a backside of a hill off a step up jump . Has  different body positions in a sec but all flow smoothly together.  Going up to the ramp same thing. Corners and whoops are about Talent. 

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JM485
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Davis, CA, USA
11/15/2024 8:17pm

I ride with my elbows down because it’s more aerodynamic.  Remember kids, elbows down for speed. . .

5
Sandusky26
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Eastern, NC, USA
11/16/2024 1:47am
TbonesPop wrote:
I'm on board with most of the usual MX basics of elbows up/out (good strong position), flat back (same as a Linebacker in football) and riding...

I'm on board with most of the usual MX basics of elbows up/out (good strong position), flat back (same as a Linebacker in football) and riding on the balls of the feet with using your legs and core (which is pretty much the same as in any atheltic sport).  That's pretty basic stuff that has been around forever and there is cross over between various sports.  But I'm not on board with the whole "drop your heels" fad.  I get that you need to have your foot positioned on the back of the peg to properly blitz whoops in SX, but outside of that there's no need to drop the heels. I get squeezing the bike with your knees and being properly balanced on the bike.  Fine. But there's no need to drop the heals.  That's just akin for a bad ankle/foot injury - ask me how I know.....And if you study Tomac closely, he's not dropping his heals anymore (or nothing like he was before the accident) since his Achilles tear.  Aside from the injury potential, it's about as an unathletic position one could possibly be in.  It's worse than being flat footed and if you have ever played any stick and ball sport, you know you don't want to be flat footed.  On the balls of the feet, knees slightly bent, flat back, good strong position is all great posture for any athlete to be in.  I predict that 5 years from now after a crapload of people have had torn up ankles, feet, and achilles injuries, the drop the heals stuff goes away (outside of the pros doing it for blitzing SX whoops).  

Dropping the heals is a game changer. I'll take all the leverage I can get when holding on to a 450.

5
timeoutoff155
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11/16/2024 2:07am

I just always thought of pointing where you wanna go with your belly button and you naturally figure it out if you have your toes pointed in forcing your knees to grip.

I've seen C Level riders be able to communicate with new beginners better than pros, and Pro's connect with B riders looking to make the next step, and a slower Vet give advice to a current A rider just with extra eyes. It's all about the delivery and how whoever is listening absorbs it.

1
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cwel11
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Orangeville, PA, USA
11/16/2024 4:24am
I just always thought of pointing where you wanna go with your belly button and you naturally figure it out if you have your toes pointed...

I just always thought of pointing where you wanna go with your belly button and you naturally figure it out if you have your toes pointed in forcing your knees to grip.

I've seen C Level riders be able to communicate with new beginners better than pros, and Pro's connect with B riders looking to make the next step, and a slower Vet give advice to a current A rider just with extra eyes. It's all about the delivery and how whoever is listening absorbs it.

Exactly correct. You could have the skills of Jett but if you relay it to a young rider like Bobby Boucher it doesn’t matter. 

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colonel
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La Massana, AD
11/16/2024 4:39am
I’ve seen too many trainers, most prominently AJ, preach what amounts to an anterior pelvic tilt. This does not increase mobility and actually decreases the power...

I’ve seen too many trainers, most prominently AJ, preach what amounts to an anterior pelvic tilt. This does not increase mobility and actually decreases the power you have in your posterior chain. If you watch how Jett, Sexton, Eli, et cetera, ride, none of them do this. They have their hips properly stacked backwards with a neutral position anterior-posterior. You move at the hips like a deadlift, you don’t tilt them anteriorly, which actually just puts all the weight on your lower back and doesn’t allow your abs, glutes, and quads to work. Ryno has shown this correctly, and AJ basically butchered it. Lots of folks out there preaching with a ton of confidence, even when it goes against basic biomechanics.

Its either anterior or posterior not Anterior-posterior. One position recruits hamstring and glutes, the other doesnt. If you posteriorly rotated you have lower back weight and and does not allow glute or hamstring recruitment for starters. 

sandtrack315
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11/16/2024 5:33am
I’ve seen too many trainers, most prominently AJ, preach what amounts to an anterior pelvic tilt. This does not increase mobility and actually decreases the power...

I’ve seen too many trainers, most prominently AJ, preach what amounts to an anterior pelvic tilt. This does not increase mobility and actually decreases the power you have in your posterior chain. If you watch how Jett, Sexton, Eli, et cetera, ride, none of them do this. They have their hips properly stacked backwards with a neutral position anterior-posterior. You move at the hips like a deadlift, you don’t tilt them anteriorly, which actually just puts all the weight on your lower back and doesn’t allow your abs, glutes, and quads to work. Ryno has shown this correctly, and AJ basically butchered it. Lots of folks out there preaching with a ton of confidence, even when it goes against basic biomechanics.

colonel wrote:
Its either anterior or posterior not Anterior-posterior. One position recruits hamstring and glutes, the other doesnt. If you posteriorly rotated you have lower back weight and...

Its either anterior or posterior not Anterior-posterior. One position recruits hamstring and glutes, the other doesnt. If you posteriorly rotated you have lower back weight and and does not allow glute or hamstring recruitment for starters. 

I meant the anterior-posterior axis, just a fancy way of saying your hips move forward and backwards when you ride. No tilt, neutral spine. 

3
onefiveight
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11/16/2024 8:27am
AssangeMX wrote:
Everts was dropping the heels in his technique videos 20 years ago.!!!My biggest problem is not body position,  it's throttle position. 

Everts was dropping the heels in his technique videos 20 years ago.!!!

My biggest problem is not body position,  it's throttle position. 

lol that’s funny and so true!

colonel
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La Massana, AD
11/16/2024 9:56am
I’ve seen too many trainers, most prominently AJ, preach what amounts to an anterior pelvic tilt. This does not increase mobility and actually decreases the power...

I’ve seen too many trainers, most prominently AJ, preach what amounts to an anterior pelvic tilt. This does not increase mobility and actually decreases the power you have in your posterior chain. If you watch how Jett, Sexton, Eli, et cetera, ride, none of them do this. They have their hips properly stacked backwards with a neutral position anterior-posterior. You move at the hips like a deadlift, you don’t tilt them anteriorly, which actually just puts all the weight on your lower back and doesn’t allow your abs, glutes, and quads to work. Ryno has shown this correctly, and AJ basically butchered it. Lots of folks out there preaching with a ton of confidence, even when it goes against basic biomechanics.

colonel wrote:
Its either anterior or posterior not Anterior-posterior. One position recruits hamstring and glutes, the other doesnt. If you posteriorly rotated you have lower back weight and...

Its either anterior or posterior not Anterior-posterior. One position recruits hamstring and glutes, the other doesnt. If you posteriorly rotated you have lower back weight and and does not allow glute or hamstring recruitment for starters. 

I meant the anterior-posterior axis, just a fancy way of saying your hips move forward and backwards when you ride. No tilt, neutral spine. 

Axis is also a fancy saying but try not be fancy and know what you talking about when you dont by using big words. 

11/16/2024 11:33am

Remember what chubbs said

Reply of the year!

sandtrack315
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11/16/2024 11:42am
colonel wrote:

Axis is also a fancy saying but try not be fancy and know what you talking about when you dont by using big words. 

It’s not. I’m also just here to bash AJ for being so confident while telling people to do something silly. 

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Tumic
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Sundsvall, SE
11/16/2024 11:55am
I've given up on all these position guys... Ride your style and go as fast as you can with your style.. trying to emulate the perfect...

I've given up on all these position guys... Ride your style and go as fast as you can with your style.. trying to emulate the perfect this or that.. is not what makes champions.

Champions take the lessons and then modify it to fit them and keep doing what worked for them.

Myself who is not a champion tried to focus on all of this positioning stuff and all it made me do was think to much while i was riding and slowed me down. Once i just went back to how i know how to ride.. i was faster and i ended up on the podium at my last race.  however take my anecdotal experience with all the salt the titanic has accumulated over the years.

========

Side note, I really like the anterior pelvic tilt when my wife does it.. but this is the wrong forum for such a discussion

The main problem here is that if you have to think about it, you have not done it enough.

When a good technique/position/style becomes your natural default it will work fine, but that’s the hard part of learning things as a grown up compared to learning it as a kid.

 

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11/16/2024 1:15pm
I’ve seen too many trainers, most prominently AJ, preach what amounts to an anterior pelvic tilt. This does not increase mobility and actually decreases the power...

I’ve seen too many trainers, most prominently AJ, preach what amounts to an anterior pelvic tilt. This does not increase mobility and actually decreases the power you have in your posterior chain. If you watch how Jett, Sexton, Eli, et cetera, ride, none of them do this. They have their hips properly stacked backwards with a neutral position anterior-posterior. You move at the hips like a deadlift, you don’t tilt them anteriorly, which actually just puts all the weight on your lower back and doesn’t allow your abs, glutes, and quads to work. Ryno has shown this correctly, and AJ basically butchered it. Lots of folks out there preaching with a ton of confidence, even when it goes against basic biomechanics.

So what makes your opinion any more valid than any of the other "trainers/coaches"?  Not saying anyone is wrong but what are your qualifications and what is on your resume? Untitled 32

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sandtrack315
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11/16/2024 3:19pm
lostboy819 wrote:
So what makes your opinion any more valid than any of the other "trainers/coaches"?  Not saying anyone is wrong but what are your qualifications and what...

So what makes your opinion any more valid than any of the other "trainers/coaches"?  Not saying anyone is wrong but what are your qualifications and what is on your resume? Untitled 32

Nothing in particular. I have a PhD in neuroscience and work in medicine/bioengineering, so I’m above average at learning about things. You can do what I did and look up how your hips are supposed to be positioned for power while lifting, and how the pros also maintain that position. You’ll never see Jett with his hips tilted like AJ demonstrates. The only anterior pelvic tilt that makes sense is when your lady does it. 

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4
zehn
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Anchorage, AK, USA
11/16/2024 3:27pm
lostboy819 wrote:
So what makes your opinion any more valid than any of the other "trainers/coaches"?  Not saying anyone is wrong but what are your qualifications and what...

So what makes your opinion any more valid than any of the other "trainers/coaches"?  Not saying anyone is wrong but what are your qualifications and what is on your resume? Untitled 32

Nothing in particular. I have a PhD in neuroscience and work in medicine/bioengineering, so I’m above average at learning about things. You can do what I...

Nothing in particular. I have a PhD in neuroscience and work in medicine/bioengineering, so I’m above average at learning about things. You can do what I did and look up how your hips are supposed to be positioned for power while lifting, and how the pros also maintain that position. You’ll never see Jett with his hips tilted like AJ demonstrates. The only anterior pelvic tilt that makes sense is when your lady does it. 

Does that make you an esquire

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