In Vital's eyes, is the KTM a bad bike now?

DrinkMoreWater wrote:

On the topic of Chase he chose to leave Honda and go to KTM, A rider of his caliber 100% would have had offers from pretty...

On the topic of Chase he chose to leave Honda and go to KTM, A rider of his caliber 100% would have had offers from pretty much every manufacture so at the end of the day it was his choice, was that choice money related or bike related? I like to think the latter. 

KTM in my eyes for the past 8 years has been a Outdoors bike rather than a SX bike, you can see this in the whoops the most every single rider who has great whoop speed on a Japanese Bike (Mookie/Craig/Sexton) has visibly looked worse through the whoops, where the KTM shines is through the corners and overall it seems to be a safer bike to ride in SX, you never really see a KTM rider get pitched off like you do with the Japanese bikes like Kenny did and Sexton.

Back on Sexton and the KTM I don't know if it's the bike or a new focus or both but he has not washed the front end nearly as much as he did previously, I don't know if that's because he cannot go as fast as he did on the Honda or the bike or a new style he's trying to adopt, but certainly the man is making far less mistakes and is fast doing so, I'd say he's 5% slower than he was last year but barely crashes.

I think Chase needs to stop blaming the bike and start changing his craft, he loads the bike at the front way too much, he is very heavy on the pegs and stiff basically demanding the shit out of the bike, I don't believe any manufacture will allow that style because it is brutal and extremely harsh, that's why everything looks really good and all of the sudden it's bad on the Honda.

That being said I expect a faster Chase Outdoors on the KTM.

Some riders just like different bikes Cooper Webb on his debut 450 Yamaha looked like a passenger, on the KTM well he was good obviously he won titles but he never looked like he did when he was on a 250, however on the new Yamaha 450 he's looked the best he's ever looked in complete control throwing whips, skimming whoops smoothly which he never done on a 450 prior.

 

Thisusernameisavailable wrote:

Are you sure he would’ve had offers from every manufacturer?    Honda- neither party were keen to continue. Kawasaki- Full with AC & Ando. Yamaha- chasing...

Are you sure he would’ve had offers from every manufacturer? 
 

Honda- neither party were keen to continue.

Kawasaki- Full with AC & Ando.

Yamaha- chasing their prodigal son Webb as well as Keeping Eli.

suzuki- could have made Chase an offer.. 
 

GG/Hqv/KTM- one and the same and thats where he landed. 
 

I can’t see that Chase had many offers at all tbf.. only the Austrians or Suzuki were likely. 

DrinkMoreWater wrote:

Only one I'm aware of is Star factory, which apparently he loved.

Donkey Kong wrote:

What gets lost in new bike talk is when a next gen bike is released the previous gen bike was as good as it could be...

What gets lost in new bike talk is when a next gen bike is released the previous gen bike was as good as it could be. Every time a next gen bike is released the teams have to search for new settings and while the new gen bike may be "improved" over the previous gen the search for settings can go unfound. It seems to me that if a next gen bike is going to be better it will be clear from the beginning. With the Yamaha generations for example every 450 has been a clear improvement over the previous gen. Same with Honda, Kawi and even Suzuki. With this current gen KTM it's probably not an improvement over the previous gen because if it was it would be apparent by now IMO. A problem that KTM has is the bike was already so good it's hard to improve at all making it easier to go backwards.

sandman768 wrote:

Those bikes have little in common with a stock bike, if they cannot get the bike working for them…. It’s on them or their testing methods…all...

Those bikes have little in common with a stock bike, if they cannot get the bike working for them…. It’s on them or their testing methods…all of the stock bikes are plenty good enough for the average racer. Perception plays a big role on how bikes are viewed. Be cool to see the 250 class be a minimal mod, stock class for Sx. 

183Matt wrote:

I agree 100% that the 250 class should be a limited class.  No engine mods, locked ECU’s, pipes, revalved/sprung OEM suspension, any handlebar, grips, tires and...

I agree 100% that the 250 class should be a limited class.  No engine mods, locked ECU’s, pipes, revalved/sprung OEM suspension, any handlebar, grips, tires and seat.  It keeps the cost down and we as consumers win because it forces the manufactures to keep up their game, or get left behind.

TeamGreen wrote:

I still get a kick outta the premise of this thread.  As someone that gets to ride A LOT of these bikes and I don’t have...

I still get a kick outta the premise of this thread. 

As someone that gets to ride A LOT of these bikes and I don’t have any prejudices or hidden loyalties…but, remember…my name IS TeamGreen & I sure do have a lot of good things to say about that darn Suzuki! So, I guess that should all be taken into consideration…right? 

Well, as “that guy”…I think the hardest bike for most riders to get to “feel right” is the Honda. A lot of people talk about getting it to feel stable and turn confidently…”front end bite”…etc. I always work on the rear/front “height” on the Honda, get it to turn in nice (I run the bike a bit firm but not too high in the rear/actually a little lower than some of the cool kids) and call it a day. Also, I’m short so I HAVE TO move around on the bike a lot. 

Anyways, on the new Austro-Katoom…between backing some torque out of the motor mounts and making sure the swing-arm bolt is torqued correctly…ALWAYS checking front air pressure and getting the rear ride height correct…I don’t have most of the complaints that others do on these scooters. Upfront, I stay away from running “not enough air” and usually run them a bit firm and might even pull the forks up in the clamps 3-5mm (3-5mm of fork tube showing above the clamp). And…I love their new rear shock. 

For my money, the insane deal to be had on 23.5 GG FE’s…? That’s the way to go. Besides, that’s the frame that the team runs! 

In the pits just before the night program started…Denver 2024. That’s the “old” new frame. 

TeamGreen wrote:

I still get a kick outta the premise of this thread.  As someone that gets to ride A LOT of these bikes and I don’t have...

I still get a kick outta the premise of this thread. 

As someone that gets to ride A LOT of these bikes and I don’t have any prejudices or hidden loyalties…but, remember…my name IS TeamGreen & I sure do have a lot of good things to say about that darn Suzuki! So, I guess that should all be taken into consideration…right? 

Well, as “that guy”…I think the hardest bike for most riders to get to “feel right” is the Honda. A lot of people talk about getting it to feel stable and turn confidently…”front end bite”…etc. I always work on the rear/front “height” on the Honda, get it to turn in nice (I run the bike a bit firm but not too high in the rear/actually a little lower than some of the cool kids) and call it a day. Also, I’m short so I HAVE TO move around on the bike a lot. 

Anyways, on the new Austro-Katoom…between backing some torque out of the motor mounts and making sure the swing-arm bolt is torqued correctly…ALWAYS checking front air pressure and getting the rear ride height correct…I don’t have most of the complaints that others do on these scooters. Upfront, I stay away from running “not enough air” and usually run them a bit firm and might even pull the forks up in the clamps 3-5mm (3-5mm of fork tube showing above the clamp). And…I love their new rear shock. 

For my money, the insane deal to be had on 23.5 GG FE’s…? That’s the way to go. Besides, that’s the frame that the team runs! 

In the pits just before the night program started…Denver 2024. That’s the “old” new frame. 

bvm111 wrote:

Manny … have you had the chance to test the pro parts engine mounts with the cut outs? 

TeamGreen wrote:

I still get a kick outta the premise of this thread.  As someone that gets to ride A LOT of these bikes and I don’t have...

I still get a kick outta the premise of this thread. 

As someone that gets to ride A LOT of these bikes and I don’t have any prejudices or hidden loyalties…but, remember…my name IS TeamGreen & I sure do have a lot of good things to say about that darn Suzuki! So, I guess that should all be taken into consideration…right? 

Well, as “that guy”…I think the hardest bike for most riders to get to “feel right” is the Honda. A lot of people talk about getting it to feel stable and turn confidently…”front end bite”…etc. I always work on the rear/front “height” on the Honda, get it to turn in nice (I run the bike a bit firm but not too high in the rear/actually a little lower than some of the cool kids) and call it a day. Also, I’m short so I HAVE TO move around on the bike a lot. 

Anyways, on the new Austro-Katoom…between backing some torque out of the motor mounts and making sure the swing-arm bolt is torqued correctly…ALWAYS checking front air pressure and getting the rear ride height correct…I don’t have most of the complaints that others do on these scooters. Upfront, I stay away from running “not enough air” and usually run them a bit firm and might even pull the forks up in the clamps 3-5mm (3-5mm of fork tube showing above the clamp). And…I love their new rear shock. 

For my money, the insane deal to be had on 23.5 GG FE’s…? That’s the way to go. Besides, that’s the frame that the team runs! 

In the pits just before the night program started…Denver 2024. That’s the “old” new frame. 

TeamGreen wrote:

I still get a kick outta the premise of this thread.  As someone that gets to ride A LOT of these bikes and I don’t have...

I still get a kick outta the premise of this thread. 

As someone that gets to ride A LOT of these bikes and I don’t have any prejudices or hidden loyalties…but, remember…my name IS TeamGreen & I sure do have a lot of good things to say about that darn Suzuki! So, I guess that should all be taken into consideration…right? 

Well, as “that guy”…I think the hardest bike for most riders to get to “feel right” is the Honda. A lot of people talk about getting it to feel stable and turn confidently…”front end bite”…etc. I always work on the rear/front “height” on the Honda, get it to turn in nice (I run the bike a bit firm but not too high in the rear/actually a little lower than some of the cool kids) and call it a day. Also, I’m short so I HAVE TO move around on the bike a lot. 

Anyways, on the new Austro-Katoom…between backing some torque out of the motor mounts and making sure the swing-arm bolt is torqued correctly…ALWAYS checking front air pressure and getting the rear ride height correct…I don’t have most of the complaints that others do on these scooters. Upfront, I stay away from running “not enough air” and usually run them a bit firm and might even pull the forks up in the clamps 3-5mm (3-5mm of fork tube showing above the clamp). And…I love their new rear shock. 

For my money, the insane deal to be had on 23.5 GG FE’s…? That’s the way to go. Besides, that’s the frame that the team runs! 

In the pits just before the night program started…Denver 2024. That’s the “old” new frame. 

lappedrider wrote:

Is the team not running the FE edition with the new frame? That would be suprising.  

TeamGreen wrote:

I still get a kick outta the premise of this thread.  As someone that gets to ride A LOT of these bikes and I don’t have...

I still get a kick outta the premise of this thread. 

As someone that gets to ride A LOT of these bikes and I don’t have any prejudices or hidden loyalties…but, remember…my name IS TeamGreen & I sure do have a lot of good things to say about that darn Suzuki! So, I guess that should all be taken into consideration…right? 

Well, as “that guy”…I think the hardest bike for most riders to get to “feel right” is the Honda. A lot of people talk about getting it to feel stable and turn confidently…”front end bite”…etc. I always work on the rear/front “height” on the Honda, get it to turn in nice (I run the bike a bit firm but not too high in the rear/actually a little lower than some of the cool kids) and call it a day. Also, I’m short so I HAVE TO move around on the bike a lot. 

Anyways, on the new Austro-Katoom…between backing some torque out of the motor mounts and making sure the swing-arm bolt is torqued correctly…ALWAYS checking front air pressure and getting the rear ride height correct…I don’t have most of the complaints that others do on these scooters. Upfront, I stay away from running “not enough air” and usually run them a bit firm and might even pull the forks up in the clamps 3-5mm (3-5mm of fork tube showing above the clamp). And…I love their new rear shock. 

For my money, the insane deal to be had on 23.5 GG FE’s…? That’s the way to go. Besides, that’s the frame that the team runs! 

In the pits just before the night program started…Denver 2024. That’s the “old” new frame. 

bvm111 wrote:

Manny … have you had the chance to test the pro parts engine mounts with the cut outs? 

TeamGreen wrote:

No. Not yet. Been a bit focused on my knees and CRFs as of late. 

Do you have the new chassis? 

bvm111 wrote:

Manny … have you had the chance to test the pro parts engine mounts with the cut outs? 

TeamGreen wrote:

No. Not yet. Been a bit focused on my knees and CRFs as of late. 

Do you have the new chassis? 

bvm111 wrote:

not yet manny, i was just released by my ortho last week following my left scaphoid fracture and surgery. I am going to be getting the...

not yet manny, i was just released by my ortho last week following my left scaphoid fracture and surgery. I am going to be getting the 25 350 SXF when they make it to the dealers. I was bored and looking at the power parts catalog and noticed them at a reasonable price so just curious how they affect the chassis other than the bling factor 😂

Electromoran wrote:

I want to know the secret to making a KTMish bike turn good. I was a Suzuki guy for over 20 years. On my 2nd GasGas...

I want to know the secret to making a KTMish bike turn good. I was a Suzuki guy for over 20 years. On my 2nd GasGas. My Stark turns and handles way better than my 23 mc350 with kyb spring forks. Wondering if I would have been better off spending almost half as much on the Suzuki 450, and I'm not concerned about the money part of being better off.

Electromoran wrote:

I want to know the secret to making a KTMish bike turn good. I was a Suzuki guy for over 20 years. On my 2nd GasGas...

I want to know the secret to making a KTMish bike turn good. I was a Suzuki guy for over 20 years. On my 2nd GasGas. My Stark turns and handles way better than my 23 mc350 with kyb spring forks. Wondering if I would have been better off spending almost half as much on the Suzuki 450, and I'm not concerned about the money part of being better off.

TeamGreen wrote:

I still get a kick outta the premise of this thread.  As someone that gets to ride A LOT of these bikes and I don’t have...

I still get a kick outta the premise of this thread. 

As someone that gets to ride A LOT of these bikes and I don’t have any prejudices or hidden loyalties…but, remember…my name IS TeamGreen & I sure do have a lot of good things to say about that darn Suzuki! So, I guess that should all be taken into consideration…right? 

Well, as “that guy”…I think the hardest bike for most riders to get to “feel right” is the Honda. A lot of people talk about getting it to feel stable and turn confidently…”front end bite”…etc. I always work on the rear/front “height” on the Honda, get it to turn in nice (I run the bike a bit firm but not too high in the rear/actually a little lower than some of the cool kids) and call it a day. Also, I’m short so I HAVE TO move around on the bike a lot. 

Anyways, on the new Austro-Katoom…between backing some torque out of the motor mounts and making sure the swing-arm bolt is torqued correctly…ALWAYS checking front air pressure and getting the rear ride height correct…I don’t have most of the complaints that others do on these scooters. Upfront, I stay away from running “not enough air” and usually run them a bit firm and might even pull the forks up in the clamps 3-5mm (3-5mm of fork tube showing above the clamp). And…I love their new rear shock. 

For my money, the insane deal to be had on 23.5 GG FE’s…? That’s the way to go. Besides, that’s the frame that the team runs! 

In the pits just before the night program started…Denver 2024. That’s the “old” new frame. 

lappedrider wrote:

Is the team not running the FE edition with the new frame? That would be suprising.  

TeamGreen wrote:

Last year’s  frame no cut-outs. 

lappedrider wrote:

Is the team not running the FE edition with the new frame? That would be suprising.  

TeamGreen wrote:

Last year’s  frame no cut-outs. 

lappedrider wrote:

Feel like I should know this, but what cut outs?