Leaded fuel at indoor MX tracks

studworx
Posts
835
Joined
1/24/2022
Location
Canada, QC CA

Is this a good idea?

Just came back from a weekend of indoor MX riding with a slight case of lead poisoning from the little bikes running leaded fuel. I’m not one to complain and always want to support these facilities because up here we need them!

But being sick as a dog all weekend and week after due to the lead burning in an enclosed building seems preventable. Is this something these tracks should consider? It’s extremely hard for venting to keep up with the sheer numbers of minis running the stuff 

8
17
|
1/29/2024 8:23am

It’s a valid concern but I don’t know what the solution would be. 
 

in a typical Mx track setting I wouldn’t sweat it too much but indoors is different, lead poisoning is nothing to mess with 

12
1
1/29/2024 8:29am

I think you just explained Vitards...

7
1
studworx
Posts
835
Joined
1/24/2022
Location
Canada, QC CA
1/29/2024 8:32am
It’s a valid concern but I don’t know what the solution would be.    in a typical Mx track setting I wouldn’t sweat it too much...

It’s a valid concern but I don’t know what the solution would be. 
 

in a typical Mx track setting I wouldn’t sweat it too much but indoors is different, lead poisoning is nothing to mess with 

Just a no-lead rule at indoor tracks no? They did it in pro racing with no ill effects. Bike don’t require lead to run

6
4
Meister
Posts
3209
Joined
3/21/2013
Location
Canton, OH US
1/29/2024 8:42am

I rode an indoor yesterday and can say i felt the same. My ashtma was extremely exasperated too. Id get 6 laps into a session and itd start up. The pits at this place are good and out of the fumes but riding in and going in to watch my daughter, i could really feel it. 

4

The Shop

studworx
Posts
835
Joined
1/24/2022
Location
Canada, QC CA
1/29/2024 8:57am
Meister wrote:
I rode an indoor yesterday and can say i felt the same. My ashtma was extremely exasperated too. Id get 6 laps into a session and...

I rode an indoor yesterday and can say i felt the same. My ashtma was extremely exasperated too. Id get 6 laps into a session and itd start up. The pits at this place are good and out of the fumes but riding in and going in to watch my daughter, i could really feel it. 

Yea man we were at the same track. I had to pack up after 2 sessions just was way too harsh after 2 days of it already

1
3
dkurtd
Posts
1111
Joined
4/15/2018
Location
TN US
1/29/2024 10:10am

How do you know lead caused your problems? Could have been carbon monoxide.

15
500 Mike
Posts
1112
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Kingwood, TX US
1/29/2024 10:15am
dkurtd wrote:

How do you know lead caused your problems? Could have been carbon monoxide.

I was wondering the same thing re: lead.   Could be VOC’s from bikes running rich?   No matter what it is, sounds like these venues need better ventilation. 

4
1
studworx
Posts
835
Joined
1/24/2022
Location
Canada, QC CA
1/29/2024 11:19am
dkurtd wrote:

How do you know lead caused your problems? Could have been carbon monoxide.

Had a blood test for lead levels

7
2
1/29/2024 11:31am

It's the exhaust not the lead. They just need better ventilation. BUT as an industrial hygienist even if they had better ventilation if you have been there for more then a day it will have a cumulative effect on you. Meanin each day you will get a headache sooner or hard to breath sooner then the day before.

4
dkurtd
Posts
1111
Joined
4/15/2018
Location
TN US
1/29/2024 12:55pm Edited Date/Time 1/29/2024 1:07pm
dkurtd wrote:

How do you know lead caused your problems? Could have been carbon monoxide.

studworx wrote:

Had a blood test for lead levels

Then you should take your test results and show them to the track owner and discuss it.

 

OBTW: What was the level of micrograms per deciliter?

3
1
Meister
Posts
3209
Joined
3/21/2013
Location
Canton, OH US
1/29/2024 12:58pm

You didnt have a Denali and big 5er there did ya? 

studworx
Posts
835
Joined
1/24/2022
Location
Canada, QC CA
1/29/2024 1:07pm
dkurtd wrote:

How do you know lead caused your problems? Could have been carbon monoxide.

studworx wrote:

Had a blood test for lead levels

dkurtd wrote:
Then you should take your test results and show them to the track owner and discuss it.   OBTW: What was the level of micrograms per...

Then you should take your test results and show them to the track owner and discuss it.

 

OBTW: What was the level of micrograms per deciliter?

I was at 4.7 µg/dL. The last time I had done a panel that also measured lead I was at 1.1µg/dL August 2023. 

 

It’s a relatively low level, but highly elevated from any of my prior tests. 

1
studworx
Posts
835
Joined
1/24/2022
Location
Canada, QC CA
1/29/2024 1:07pm
Meister wrote:

You didnt have a Denali and big 5er there did ya? 

No but I was parked near those guys

Meister
Posts
3209
Joined
3/21/2013
Location
Canton, OH US
1/29/2024 1:11pm

I came late and ended up parking in front of them on the hill. 

Do they do anything for lead poisoning? 

I have felt like shit all day and my wife tells me my kid has seemed down today too which isnt normal for her. 

2
studworx
Posts
835
Joined
1/24/2022
Location
Canada, QC CA
1/29/2024 1:18pm
Meister wrote:
I came late and ended up parking in front of them on the hill.  Do they do anything for lead poisoning?  I have felt like shit...

I came late and ended up parking in front of them on the hill. 

Do they do anything for lead poisoning? 

I have felt like shit all day and my wife tells me my kid has seemed down today too which isnt normal for her. 

I don‘t think so. They just said stay away from it as much as you can and basically the symptoms will ease faster the longer you stay away. Bummer way to end a really fun weekend. 
 

Ya we pulled in late as well so we’re all the way up there as well. Such a busy weekend 

1
gscx
Posts
186
Joined
4/27/2018
Location
Schenectady, NY US
1/29/2024 1:29pm

I feel like this discussion is pretty laid back considering lead poisoning could be involved. Not trying to be a Karen but someone should probably say something to the people running these tracks. It's no joke, especially for young kids.

14
1
1/29/2024 1:55pm

I spent a lot of time at indoor practice tracks as a kid for years. Some of them had adequate ventilation and others were essentially not ventilated at all and basically just a barn. This was back in the two stroke days as well.  At around age 17 I was told I had some scarring on my lungs at which point they asked if I smoke etc (no), really no cause for it. Flash forward a decade and I still have it. still not a smoker, no asthma, etc. I really think back to some of those times when we were literally just sitting in a cloud of exhaust for hours on end for months out of the year and really think it has something to do with it. 

Its a shitty part of the sport that really doesn't get brought up alot. 

5
1
Meister
Posts
3209
Joined
3/21/2013
Location
Canton, OH US
1/29/2024 2:09pm

I too grew up in lots of indoors. Always felt a little fumey but it was pretty heavy yesterday. 

Talked to another buddy who was there with his fam and they feel shitty today too.. coincidence? 

2
1
Snail
Posts
142
Joined
1/6/2024
Location
Ottawa, ON CA
1/29/2024 2:36pm

Talk to the track owner as an advocate for the sport. 
 

if he has a head on his shoulders he will hear you out and make some tweaks. 

3
1
Meister
Posts
3209
Joined
3/21/2013
Location
Canton, OH US
1/29/2024 3:22pm

He does and i believe him to be a solid dude for sure. Seems to really care about his patrons and what they think. 

2
truck
Posts
3565
Joined
6/10/2015
Location
Louisville, KY US
Fantasy
1/29/2024 3:49pm

It's not the lead making you sick. That level is less than what anyone would have had at any given time when leaded gas was the norm and isn't going to give you symptoms. However, If the ventilation is poor enough that you're bumping your lead level, you're sucking in all kinds of exhaust fumes and that's what is giving you symptoms. Most likely CO. And why are you routinely getting lead levels checked? 

General rule of thumb with these places is if they're heated, they aren't ventilated well enough. 

7
studworx
Posts
835
Joined
1/24/2022
Location
Canada, QC CA
1/29/2024 3:58pm
truck wrote:
It's not the lead making you sick. That level is less than what anyone would have had at any given time when leaded gas was the...

It's not the lead making you sick. That level is less than what anyone would have had at any given time when leaded gas was the norm and isn't going to give you symptoms. However, If the ventilation is poor enough that you're bumping your lead level, you're sucking in all kinds of exhaust fumes and that's what is giving you symptoms. Most likely CO. And why are you routinely getting lead levels checked? 

General rule of thumb with these places is if they're heated, they aren't ventilated well enough. 

Had lead poisoning 3 years ago when we were doing a major reno and didn't think of getting anything checked for lead prior. Had progressively gotten worse before I tested at 14 µg/dL. Now I'm pretty sensitive to it so I get semi annual full panel blood + lead tests.

Like I said, you are right that the level is low. But it's 4x what i normally test at. To have 4x elevated levels after minor exposure to me seems like it could be a concern. I will admit I have been riding indoors for a long time and it hasn't ever been this bad, so maybe a one off, but just worried about the little kids who's parents are running leaded gas chasing each other around on the track.

2
1
Radical
Posts
2829
Joined
10/20/2012
Location
San Diego, CA US
1/29/2024 4:03pm

I'll just say it. Lead has no place in Motocross.

If the pros can get 20HP more out of their bikes than us without lead, then we don't need it either.

If you use race gas, get unleaded race gas.

Knowing it's a disadvantage performance wise, Chad Reed set the example and stopped running leaded fuel in his kid's bikes, and is advocating that everyone stop.

I used to always feel like crap the day after a ride day.  Not from getting a good workout, but from breathing exhaust.

If felt like toxins needing to work their way out of my body.  It felt like a hangover.

About 10 or 12 years ago, I started wearing one of the ventilated N95 masks, and now simply a bandana or neck gator over my nose and mouth.  My understanding is that Andrew Short used to wear the ventilated N95 mask as well.

Obviously it doesn't filter out everything, but It seems to filter out enough to make quite a difference.

Now, the day after a ride day, I feel fine.

I'm going to reiterate.  Leaded fuel has no place in Motocross.  Let's get rid of it, especially anywhere our children ride.

11
7
studworx
Posts
835
Joined
1/24/2022
Location
Canada, QC CA
1/29/2024 4:06pm Edited Date/Time 1/29/2024 4:07pm
Meister wrote:

He does and i believe him to be a solid dude for sure. Seems to really care about his patrons and what they think. 

Yea he's one of the best track owners around IMO.

I think this issue lies on riders/parents and not track owner. I think 95% of the bikes running leaded race gas are the minis. I think not running lead in an enclosed building should be self explanatory.. especially when you have a kid who will be chasing other kids around huffing all the fumes.

Not many (or any) big bikes out there are running on leaded race gas. No need to.

1
Meister
Posts
3209
Joined
3/21/2013
Location
Canton, OH US
1/29/2024 4:21pm

Youre right about the little bikes.. ill admit tho, lead never once crossed my mind..  My daughter rode her 110 with the 50s and when id go down by the start, i liked the smell because it reminded me of the old days but i was like damn this is intense in my head lol.. 

3
1/29/2024 4:26pm

Stark has a solution!

2
11
jameslowry
Posts
127
Joined
8/9/2023
Location
pearl, MS US
1/29/2024 5:02pm

only lead that's going to hurt you is from a bullet!!

I'm 64 y/o  been using leaded race fuel for the last 38 years in all my motorcycles chainsaws brush cutters with no problems

Mark

23
JazzyJJ
Posts
1776
Joined
12/1/2020
Location
Nunya, WY US
1/29/2024 7:14pm
jameslowry wrote:
only lead that's going to hurt you is from a bullet!! I'm 64 y/o  been using leaded race fuel for the last 38 years in all...

only lead that's going to hurt you is from a bullet!!

I'm 64 y/o  been using leaded race fuel for the last 38 years in all my motorcycles chainsaws brush cutters with no problems

Mark

This post might suggest otherwise…

4
4
1/29/2024 7:27pm
jameslowry wrote:
only lead that's going to hurt you is from a bullet!! I'm 64 y/o  been using leaded race fuel for the last 38 years in all...

only lead that's going to hurt you is from a bullet!!

I'm 64 y/o  been using leaded race fuel for the last 38 years in all my motorcycles chainsaws brush cutters with no problems

Mark

Thank god the boomer is here to tell us that huffing lead is perfectly acceptable. 

4
8

Post a reply to: Leaded fuel at indoor MX tracks

The Latest