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Great...
Another guy who has absolutely no idea what woods is about.
Stay frosty in your pristine Fox gear, and immaculate graphics and plastic.
Every point Mike and me related here is from Moto Verte's video.
I think the consumers were influenced by the near 100% displacement advantage of four strokes over two strokes. Go four stroke or get left behind.
The greatest razor/razor blade scam in MX history. You could repair your 2T dirt bike with the coins in your couch now you need a bank loan when your 4T frags. Sell me more, please.
Understand that a lot of riders bypass that problem by selling before the 4T hourmeter gets up there. But the problem is pushed down to someone else who will pay or scrap the bike.
Maybe the AMA should allow the Varg in the 250MX class just to give it an advantage….oh wait no the mainstream manufacturers would never allow that.
Care to place a wager on them being out of business next year?
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Damn… this thread makes my head hurt 🤦🏼♂️
The volume is what Ford is banking on for sure. In the end they'll scale up and make money. That's the problem I see with Stark. If they sell the max number they project at $13,000 that puts them around $65,000,000 revenue. That's just not a lot to work with on something of this scale when you're starting out in the hole. Projecting not making a profit is one thing but you still have to end up close to your projected losses to make the plan work. Material or labor costs go up a little, production not up to projections, or any combination of problems and without more cash or a Ford keeping you afloat, you're just done.
No no, I think I know what kinda guy you are. You’re one of those shield of your helmet down, sunglasses instead of googles, blinker on, kickstand hanging down guys that’s putting around motocross tracks with 20 km/h. I mean, I‘d be afraid of eMX bikes too if I were you. The fear of getting landed on when you’re rolling every jump on the track with dead silent bikes coming up on you would give me nightmares as well…
Tesla is pretty profitable these days... Maybe Ford just isn't good at it?
Tesla make most of their money in a government facilitated scam, really.
They're selling carbon offset credits to companies who make IC vehicles.
Tesla made 80 billion $ of revenue in 2022 and 1.8 billion $ came from selling carbon credits…
Yeah, yeah, yeah, shoot the messenger, classic technique when you have nothing to answer. Throwing crap at me will clearly give the Varg more battery life.
LOL
Most if not all of what is left over, ie any profit, comes from the goverment sanctioned carbon credits scam on taxpayers.
Math is not your strength...
This must be Sanduskys burner account.
OK, so I finally read the magazine article. For the most part it doesn't say much more that what we already wrote: it's high-end built, very fast, feels light and nimble, and would probably be the best bike around if it could finish a moto, lol...
Holeshots a 450 everytime (even though they say you have to be real good at modulating the power and will end up on your ass if you go full gas) and turns on a dime, more easily than a 250. No laptimes.
Still, there's one very interesting part, it's a (very short) interview with some marketing/communication guy from Stark...
"An average rider won't necessarily have fun riding with the bike set at 60 hp. With 50, 40 or even 30hp, you have much more fun."
OK, so let's buy an ultra-powerful bike and detune it to have more fun.
"The bikes you are riding today have sensors that are set so the engine won't overheat. The sensors are not restrictive but safe, one can work on their settings."
So the bikes that were overheating have "not restrictive but safe" (whatever that means, lol) sensors settings, calculated NOT to overheat but you can push their limit farther so it overheats more?
"The hi-level buyer will be able to have his bike do a moto without overheating. Sebastien Tortelli, with his bike set at 62hp and 84% of engine braking, can ride for 30 minutes without a problem."
So, if you know the settings that allow him to do that, why didn't you put them on these test bikes?
So to summarize what I read, it can be one of the best or the best MX bike around... once a few "youth issues" are solved.
You are correct sir. Tesla only exist today because of the taxpayers tit that it continuously sucks off of. BUT,....you cannot convince the suckers into actually following the money or focusing on reality. They are too blind in "saving the planet" even though the vehicle is made of fossil fuels, has to have fossil fuels to power it and there are NO solutions to the afterlife of the failing battery systems.
As the famous Forrest Gump once stated, "stupid is as stupid does".
My info was accurate, just a bit old.
Point is Tesla selling their bombs is pretty much the same as the tax payer rip off credit for IC. People are buying these 50% overpriced, mediocre quality E cars for in-group leftist, social credit, virtue signaling.
Oh, btw, that Benjamin Cobb guy from Stark says another interesting thing: "With the rules in place, being able to race MXGP will be long and difficult. We're working with national federations, in France, Italy, Great Britain, so that people can buy our bike knowing the can go and race their championship."
So, for now, between "settings" and rules, it's the fastest playbike in the world, but not a race bike yet.
Pit Row
Maybe someone will have the time and courage to translate it all...
So all new Fords are crap, because the Ford Model T's performance doesn't match current cars manufactured by other car companies?
Thanks dude!
Anyone see the news story from the last few days of the guy that was locked inside of his Tesla because the battery died?
Did anyone watch the e-bike moto for the kids at lorettas? It was terrible not having any sound
Haha, really!? I don’t think that‘s gonna be a problem with the Varg!
I think some people are having a hard time separating the merits of the bike from the viability of the business model. Obviously if the bike sucks the business will fail, but even if the bike is perfect it doesn't mean the business succeeds.
People can Race Alta's and have been. Not Pro level racing but it can not run long enough anyway. In NESC , You can run the open and Vet classes on an Alta or Varg. So for somebody that is 30 there are 2 classes that I know you can run in. Jday allows the Alta too. I would be that many local organizations will allow it in similar classes. You can run one in the Am AMA Arenacross races in the Age classes. And so on.
The reason I asked if anybody watched the video was because You or Mike had said you only read the part you could read for free. And had not said anything about watching a video.
I would say that the sensors notify you that you are getting close to an overheating situation. And like a temp gage on a car, the temp gage tells you you should stop doing whatever is overheating the car. But do not stop the car for you. So It allows you to get to a safe area to stop. And that is what they were saying about the Varg.
If the goal is to have fun, than who cares if you detune it to have more fun? Its still there if you decide more power will be more fun. Should they just sell a bike limited to what they think is more fun? Thats the great thing with electric is how you can adjust the power.
As far as why they did not have the setting to limit the bike and prevent overheating and or extend the range. Perhaps the bikes started off in that setting and the testers were playing with the app and changed it? That doesn't seem to sound crazy to me.
When the bike or bikes " Overheated" . What happened? Did the rider ignore the warning of the temp getting high and keep riding. Or was the overheating they talk about , just the light or however the app communicates that the bike is getting too hot . And the rider stopped at that point? What was required when a bike overheated?
So they pretty much said, that Unless You are a top pro level speed the bike is amazing . If you are a top pro level speed guy, its amazing at the higher HP setting for 75% of a moto or lower the power output to 60ish and it can be amazing for the entire moto.
So what where the items that broke that You guys were talking about?
Maybe I'll try and translate that over the weekend if somebody doesn't before. I was trying to subscribe , but much of the stuff was not translating and then it would not take my payment. I probably did something wrong since it was in french and I only know a handful of french words. Thank You for posting the article.
It really doesn't sound like it said much bad about the bike. Definitely nothing that I can see that would be such a reason for Goldmembers celebration.
Very true. But the Guy behind the Varg has been building businesses in the moto industry since he was in highschool. And he has help from one of the biggest manufacturers of motorcycles in the world. I think he went into it knowing that there could be issues. And a lot of it was being done early on in the Covid stuff. So they were more informed on the issues that they would face as a result of Covid than they would have if they had started out 5 years ago. I'm not saying that its not possible for them to fail. I'm just saying that the Ford issues are not a great parallel for comparison.
How is Ford doing otherwise? Could it just be some moving around of numbers to avoid paying a giant amount of taxes? Spending a ton on R&D to offset high profits from other areas?
We really do not know what Starks money situation is . the 50M they got was not a " Buy Out" like Goldmember described it. And sometimes it makes more sense to get a loan than pay cash. Tax benefits , low interest rates , avoiding being cash poor, I'm sure there are others. I would not see such a small loan as signs of big trouble. The delays would be more of a sign to me. Since I'm sure they only planed for the possibility of things going so bad. But without knowing what the delays are caused by its hard to really say if its a sign of trouble or not.
I imagine it may also take a good amount of time to contact and transfer the funds from the buyers. Having some buyers opt out , but still having to contact them before jumping to next in line.
I wish anybody and everybody well that wants to start a business , that will provide more jobs and grow the industry we all love. I hope that Stark's story is more like Tesla than Alta.
OK, let's do this one more time...
Mike originally posted a link to the video part of the test.
I was asked questions by #434 and replied "I don't know, I'd have to buy the magazine and read the full article".
The overheating put the bike in "safety mode" (15% of the power, from what I understand, just enough to go back to the pits) after three laps with the two fastest riders.
Another one of the bikes was stopped with the engine cutting (unrelated to overheating). The Stark staff said it might be a problem with the connectors but was unable to fix it so it was out.
None of these were saved my the "magical Tortelli setting" which remains the interesting question: if you actually have a setting that allows a former pro to ride 40 minutes at 62hp without ant problem, why don't you use it for a press test with a major magazine?
It's funny that none of the Influencers that have Vargs have mentioned any overheating problems.
Perhaps there is a Tortelli setting, and an even better - Influencer setting
Haha yup. Hot day, battery died and was locked inside. There was another story last year of another guy who’s battery had an issue and the car caught fire. Guy struggled to get out because he was locked inside as well.
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