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Edited Date/Time
5/29/2023 11:32pm
Watching various riders of the past and future and how they ride their bikes, it seems to me the smoothest are the ones not living on the rev limiter (Barcia and Deegan come to mind there for constant rev limiter)...what do you guys think?
What brought this to mind was watching Jett ride last weekend, Eli over last few years and remembering how Roczen rode in 2015...to me quite similar.
Certainly works doesn't it.
If you're picking smoother lines, "hopping around the track" like they say, using lumps and bumps to your advantage and smoothing out your path however possible, it's only a good thing.
At the same time, as you're not fighting the bike and if you're keeping the rpm civil, which helps keep the suspension from being any more loaded or bound up than it needs to be, and letting the engine do the work and torque itself along rather than ringing it out, you have a happy rider and a happy bike and both can do their job efficiently and predictably.
Eli still revs the shit out of it and slams through most obstacles using a rigid body to drive equally rigid suspension into the dirt, even "the last few years." But he has the freak strength and fitness to make that work.
True, ditto for Barcia and he's still FAST on a good day with almost pure aggression and feel.
Two different styles, both can clearly work. The smoother approach is bound to be easier on the bike and rider, like a "work smarter, not harder" kind of deal.
ah yes true....great points
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A great example of this is the 2006 mxdn when Everts passed JS standing on the pegs looking like he was on a seighting lap.
JS looked twice as fast that day but the laptimes told another story.
I will alwas be a fan of the smooth riding style, the agressive one will work some days but the first option will always be the better one during a whole season.
RV made a career out of keeping it pinned, but I don't think we'll ever see another rider with the rear wheel control that he had.
I find riders that aren’t smooth funner to watch. They always have a fun type of style to watch.
RV & that Kawasaki were soulmates. RV had, as you say, great rear wheel control...and a riding style that catered to the bike's handling and steering geometry. I think there have been riders that have had to smooth of a riding style for that bike. It rewards guys like RV and Tomac.
On the other hand, the Honda seems to be more of a "front end steering" bike...and seems to favor guys like Jett who is fluid smooth and picks lines carefully.
Both can work Eli and Herlings do both.
Freak strength and fitness? I don't think I would call it freak, just the advantage of living in the mountains. High elevation and grueling mtb trails make the physical and mental aspects of moto that much easier. It's on thing to pedal a smooth and flat road and another thing to climb up and down sandy, rocky trails for 3 hours.
Most of it has to do with growing up racing 2 strokes. Some adapted to the 4 strokes better and learned how to ride them more efficiently.
*Mud race disclaimer*
Watching the Euros at Red Bud MXoN ride in the meat of the power, hopping, skipping, flowing around the track and kicking our ass was something to witness. They were very smooth.
RC4 is the most successful MX racer of all time.
He was a lot of things......but he was never accused of being smooth.
Yeah Eli isn't who I picture when I think of smooth. Dungey, Sexton, and Jett from the more recent riders when I think smooth. Not sure who to compare Eli to for having a similar style. Same with RV. They were somewhat unique to me in the way they rode. Especially RV. I wasn't really a fan when he was racing but I really appreciate him now when I go back and watch. It always struck me how he seemed to be looking down at his front wheel when we're always told to look ahead
I think RV benefited and adapted the best to the 4 stroke. He was good, but not great racing 2 strokes back when Alessi was winning everything. He jumped on that 4 stroke and something just clicked.
One thing that always surprises me is how bulldog aggressive riders can quite often have pretty long careers.
Tomac, Bacia, Mike Brown, Brad Anderson John Dowd and I’m sure there are loads I’m forgetting. But they seem to stay fast longer where the smooth ones not quite so much.
maybe the extra fitness to ride aggressively carries them further into their later years. But as the natural ability goes there isn’t always the fitness to make up the difference in pace.
but I maybe way off with that one.
Both clearly work but I've always been a fan of the smooth guys, the ones that don't look like they are trying but are flying.
You could turn your back to the track In Nashville and knew when Tomac was coming out of the turn going up to the dragons back.
I do believe he is a gear high like Chase and Jett but I feel like he literally holds the throttle to the stop and lugs the shit out of the bike but he’s feathering the clutch so much it sounds like he’s reving it. Can someone with more knowledge correct me if I’m wrong
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Someone once reported that on data collection while RC was at Honda more than 90% of the time his throttle was open it was full throttle during races.
I think it just depends on the rider, and it's nice when there is a mix of styles.
Herlings has a special style. He rides with more finess than many riders, jumping over bumps, flowing on top of the sand etc, BUT he revs the bike pretty hard.
still not to the level of Tomac, Barcia and Deegan.
i feel that the new generation american top riders tend to ride more like the GP guys now days, with the likes of Sexton, Craig and the Lawrence brothers.
AC has a pretty calm style now days to, so the over agressive style are fading away now, if you want to beat Sexton or Jett, you will have a hard time doing that on a gear lower and smashing in to the bumps on track.
That's a great point, in fact I had a discussion with a riding buddy about it last weekend. With Chase and Jett having such flawless form and being so fast combined with the training that AJ and the moto academy is doing, it has really put a spotlight on rider technique and form - for many good and valuable reasons. With all that said, if you back and really study the form and technique of RC and even Stew (along with other elite riders), they were far from picture perfect, yet they were some of the fastest in the history of our sport to ever throw a leg over a dirt bike. Arguably 2 of THE best. Not trying to diminish the importance of form and technique, just making the point that a rider can go REALLY fast and have a ton of success in our sport even without the best form or riding technique. Hard to argue with the success of those guys.
Whatever happened to "slow down ti go fast" ?
Technique and therefore speed has evolved. It would be like saying, McGrath didn't scrub so therefore no one needs to scrub now in order to go fast and win championships. I think if RC and Stew were hitting their prime now, they're riding styles would be closer to Jett and Chase, just like if McGrath was in his prime right now, he'd be scrubbing every jump like a boss.
Watching Windham, Bayle, Reynard, Everts, etc ride has always been a thing of beauty, but it’s the guy who gets to the checkers first that gets paid.
Hannah said something like “I don’t want the message to Yamaha to be that Hannah got third, but he was really smooth, I want it to be that Hannah won.”
All those guys won though... Reynard, without his shoulder issues could have won races in 99-2000. He's who I try to ride like to this day.
What works for one, doesn't work for another.
A classic example is, shown in a few videos / written stories, was the differences between RJ and Bailey.
Two very different styles, each one effective for the individual.
Both tried the others style, with people saying to RJ to be more smooth, less 'Bull Dog', and, with people suggesting to David to get more 'wild'.
From what I recall, they both ended up sticking with how they naturally rode, for the most part.
But, there's no harm in trying things out, those 'things' you try, may help.
very true, things have just evolved. Same guy will have a higher max speed riding with modern day technique vs back when RC and Stew were the man.
Also seems like with the modern technique the way these guys ride there seems to be much less exploding off the bike type crashes, mainly the kind that Stewart use to have. I believe he rode a bit flat footed at least at times.
The "revvers" are just guys that are jealous of the 90's and the awesome 2 Strokes of the day! They hit the limiters to make it sound as "cool" as a 4S can actually sound.
They all won, and Everts won a lot! But Windham followed RC in to a lot of 2nds and RC was never a smooth rider. So as much as I loved watching Windham flow around the track like water, and I try my best to ride like a Tortoise version of him, it’s pretty hard to say that smoother is faster. RC hacked his way to many more wins than Windham flowed to..
But all that said, I still think smooth riding is better!
For all we know, had Windham not been a super smooth rider, he might have been a 10th place guy instead of a 2nd place guy. And by the same argument, had RC had a smoother riding style, he might have gapped Windham by an even bigger margin and broken MC's supercross record.
Your observation is not wrong, but its impossible to know what the differentiating factor was between the two riders, or how it would be different had they had different techniques.
What I do know is that the likes of RC, McGrath etc, have all commented and admitted that the guys are going faster than ever. Even Dungey said that the intensity and outright speed had gone up since he left the sport and come back. This is not to say that the current guys are 'gnarlier' than the previous guys, I don't subscribe to that thinking, this is just evolution.
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