Honda two stroke 2000's

Richy
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UK, GB
5/25/2023 10:48pm

What are people's thoughts on making the 250s more rideable/progressive? I'm sure I remember (maybe incorrectly) the '02/'03 250s being a little stunted on top and abrupt bottom to mid.

 

My first brand new bike was an '03 125 when I was 17. Even though it could hardly get out of its own way power wise, compared to the '96 I moved from, I loved it. I'm sure objectively it was a dog, but an HGS pipe, VForce 2 (I think) and paying a shop to spend time on jetting did help a little, though not much.

SmokinJoe439
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2407
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Location
Renton, WA, USA
5/26/2023 7:38am

Owned an 01 CR125 brand new my last honda. That bike sucked stock played around with jetting a ton. Until I figured out that going 2 to 3 sizes leaner on the needle made it much better jetting wise.

I went to yz's after it. Friend had a new 03 service honda CR500 then went to some 06 CR125 and CR250. 

The 500 old pic that's a 290mm front rotor on it and it's on holy grounds (washougal). 

Cliffs2003CR500AF

 

2
Steve125
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Location
USA
5/26/2023 7:50am

I love my 03 250. I must have the power valve set up just right because this thing rips. A Keihin Air striker, Pro-circuit exhaust and a V force intake round out the mods. 

CR250R.jpeg?VersionId=YBUHJJpOpoNeDjgYxHs

 

7
5/26/2023 12:35pm
Richy wrote:
What are people's thoughts on making the 250s more rideable/progressive? I'm sure I remember (maybe incorrectly) the '02/'03 250s being a little stunted on top and...

What are people's thoughts on making the 250s more rideable/progressive? I'm sure I remember (maybe incorrectly) the '02/'03 250s being a little stunted on top and abrupt bottom to mid.

 

My first brand new bike was an '03 125 when I was 17. Even though it could hardly get out of its own way power wise, compared to the '96 I moved from, I loved it. I'm sure objectively it was a dog, but an HGS pipe, VForce 2 (I think) and paying a shop to spend time on jetting did help a little, though not much.

i t hink the newer ones are more rideable than the 00-01 because they have a weak bottom end

 

getting it properly jetted, gearing it longer and perhaps using a flywheel weight would help take out some of the hit.

The Shop

Neek
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202
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Location
FR
5/26/2023 1:17pm Edited Date/Time 5/26/2023 1:18pm
hi everyone, I’m Marc, 30 years old in 3 days lol, I live in France. Passionate about Honda, probably because of one of my uncles who...

hi everyone,

I’m Marc, 30 years old in 3 days lol, I live in France. Passionate about Honda, probably because of one of my uncles who owns a honda store lol.

I started with a 2007 CR 125 with only 10H. a big regret to have sold it... I then ride another motorcycle, RM 125, YZ 125, CRF 250... then I bought again a CR 125 2002 then CR 125 2007 that I also sold because I could no longer ride a motorcycle.

I open this topic for share the passion for  Honda 2 strokes 2000's that I prefer, 

Have Nice days everyone.

PS: sorry for my bad english Smile

Hello Marc, 

Where are you from in France ?!

Here is my bike, not as beautiful as Tokyo_Tiddler's RC250 though !

Favorite bike I've ever had.

s1200 IMG20220505203608

s1200 IMG20220505203811 0.jpg?VersionId=0oF81

 

7
5/26/2023 1:51pm
Richy wrote:
What are people's thoughts on making the 250s more rideable/progressive? I'm sure I remember (maybe incorrectly) the '02/'03 250s being a little stunted on top and...

What are people's thoughts on making the 250s more rideable/progressive? I'm sure I remember (maybe incorrectly) the '02/'03 250s being a little stunted on top and abrupt bottom to mid.

 

My first brand new bike was an '03 125 when I was 17. Even though it could hardly get out of its own way power wise, compared to the '96 I moved from, I loved it. I'm sure objectively it was a dog, but an HGS pipe, VForce 2 (I think) and paying a shop to spend time on jetting did help a little, though not much.

i t hink the newer ones are more rideable than the 00-01 because they have a weak bottom end   getting it properly jetted, gearing it...

i t hink the newer ones are more rideable than the 00-01 because they have a weak bottom end

 

getting it properly jetted, gearing it longer and perhaps using a flywheel weight would help take out some of the hit.

Might be something to the weaker bottom argument but the 02-07 chassis and suspension were better. A friend of mine had a fairly modded '01 to try back to back at a couple of tracks with my pretty much stock '02, the '01 felt more powerful, '02 handled better and both of us were running lower lap times on the newer bike, and the '02 wasn't really losing corner to corner drag races to the '01, either.  That 2001 hit hard enough on the bottom I don't think I could hang on for 30 minutes at a time, though, so there is that, maybe there was just that much more wheelspin.

brocster
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Aliso Viejo, CA, USA
5/26/2023 6:06pm

IMG 4601

 My 00 on the left and my sons 04 on the right. Sold them both a few months back and damn I miss that 00 bike.  Had a Boyesen rad valve, Swede tech exhaust spacer, fmf fatty and shorty combo and a PWK air Stryker with JD jet kit. 1 tooth larger on the rear to carry my 6’ x 190# ass around. Too much fun!  

1
yota
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Location
Crystal River, FL, USA
5/26/2023 6:16pm
do you have some picture of your CR's ? the honda CR is safe bike, just need 6 gear.. but for rivaled with the new YZ...

do you have some picture of your CR's ?

the honda CR is safe bike, just need 6 gear.. but for rivaled with the new YZ, SX and co it's over but for pleasur it's fantastic.

the CR 250 is softer now with this modification ?

Not at the moment, as they sit in the warehouse where I keep them and not sure when I'll be over there, but can try to...

Not at the moment, as they sit in the warehouse where I keep them and not sure when I'll be over there, but can try to dust them off and take pics next time. As I said, they're not like one of Tokyo Tiddler's HRC replicas, they're virtually stock.

The cylinder/head mods on the 250 lowered the port timing and gave it a big improvement in low-end response/torque.

In the meantime, here's a pic of one of my '03s I made the mistake of parting with about 15 years ago. PinchP1012397.JPG?VersionId=JmnizTaq4vwBoVuwaUQ6lGq

 

I'm liking the white.

5/26/2023 7:56pm
r_outsider wrote:
Might be something to the weaker bottom argument but the 02-07 chassis and suspension were better. A friend of mine had a fairly modded '01 to...

Might be something to the weaker bottom argument but the 02-07 chassis and suspension were better. A friend of mine had a fairly modded '01 to try back to back at a couple of tracks with my pretty much stock '02, the '01 felt more powerful, '02 handled better and both of us were running lower lap times on the newer bike, and the '02 wasn't really losing corner to corner drag races to the '01, either.  That 2001 hit hard enough on the bottom I don't think I could hang on for 30 minutes at a time, though, so there is that, maybe there was just that much more wheelspin.

i had an 01 and also had an 04

 

the 02-07 def handled better and with the right mods, was a better bike than the 01. some people swap in the 93-01 motor into the newer frames but in all honesty, with the right carb setup you could get pretty close. there was a thread here awhile ago and one of the guys had a writeup on what you needed to really make the 05-07 engines work ..it involved some porting/milling of the head and some airbox mods but apparently this would really make it rip.

another thing alot of ppl forget to do is keep the powervalve cables adjusted or dont replace them frequently enough.

 

its a shame they stopped developing this motor because if they did, it would've been really, really good 

1
ratonmacias
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Location
Guadalajara, MX
5/26/2023 8:28pm

had a 04 cr 250 the cylinder was decked and the squish adjusted. after those mods the bike ripped. sold it to get a yz 250x which feels smoother thn the cr.

Lightning78
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Huntington Beach, CA, USA
5/26/2023 9:59pm
hi everyone, I’m Marc, 30 years old in 3 days lol, I live in France. Passionate about Honda, probably because of one of my uncles who...

hi everyone,

I’m Marc, 30 years old in 3 days lol, I live in France. Passionate about Honda, probably because of one of my uncles who owns a honda store lol.

I started with a 2007 CR 125 with only 10H. a big regret to have sold it... I then ride another motorcycle, RM 125, YZ 125, CRF 250... then I bought again a CR 125 2002 then CR 125 2007 that I also sold because I could no longer ride a motorcycle.

I open this topic for share the passion for  Honda 2 strokes 2000's that I prefer, 

Have Nice days everyone.

PS: sorry for my bad english Smile

Magoofan wrote:
Funny that I just read a "retro test" in MXA on the 2007 Honda CR125...the final year.     Big 2-stroke fan here... lots of beauties in...

Funny that I just read a "retro test" in MXA on the 2007 Honda CR125...the final year.  

 

Big 2-stroke fan here... lots of beauties in this thread.

 

BTW - never apologize about "bad english" my friend.   At least you know a 2nd language, unlike many of us Americans.

 

I got to ride one of Jessy Nelson's cr125's from when he was an amateur 06 or 07 cr125 and I swear it was literally one of the slowest 125's I've ever ridden till you hit the very end of the top end and even then it wasn't impressive. Had motor work don't to it but it didn't help. 

My buddy bought it and didn't know it was one of his bikes

Lightning78
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Huntington Beach, CA, USA
5/26/2023 10:03pm
Richy wrote:
What are people's thoughts on making the 250s more rideable/progressive? I'm sure I remember (maybe incorrectly) the '02/'03 250s being a little stunted on top and...

What are people's thoughts on making the 250s more rideable/progressive? I'm sure I remember (maybe incorrectly) the '02/'03 250s being a little stunted on top and abrupt bottom to mid.

 

My first brand new bike was an '03 125 when I was 17. Even though it could hardly get out of its own way power wise, compared to the '96 I moved from, I loved it. I'm sure objectively it was a dog, but an HGS pipe, VForce 2 (I think) and paying a shop to spend time on jetting did help a little, though not much.

i t hink the newer ones are more rideable than the 00-01 because they have a weak bottom end   getting it properly jetted, gearing it...

i t hink the newer ones are more rideable than the 00-01 because they have a weak bottom end

 

getting it properly jetted, gearing it longer and perhaps using a flywheel weight would help take out some of the hit.

r_outsider wrote:
Might be something to the weaker bottom argument but the 02-07 chassis and suspension were better. A friend of mine had a fairly modded '01 to...

Might be something to the weaker bottom argument but the 02-07 chassis and suspension were better. A friend of mine had a fairly modded '01 to try back to back at a couple of tracks with my pretty much stock '02, the '01 felt more powerful, '02 handled better and both of us were running lower lap times on the newer bike, and the '02 wasn't really losing corner to corner drag races to the '01, either.  That 2001 hit hard enough on the bottom I don't think I could hang on for 30 minutes at a time, though, so there is that, maybe there was just that much more wheelspin.

My 2002 cr250 with an fmf sst pipe and shorty with some boyson and leaned out jetting absolutely ripped up top! Hardest part was keeping it there but once I figured the bike out I was pretty fast on it ....just had to ride it a gear lower at spots and wring its neck lol. All the other 02 and 03's I rode that my friends had suuuuucked. Don't know why mine was so good but it was

CrGuy2T
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Santa Fe, TX, USA
5/27/2023 4:11am

01 I picked up a about a month ago my son and I freshened up for him.. 

IMG 4954 1

 

6
Tokyo_Tiddler
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Somewhere in, NJ, USA
5/27/2023 5:26am Edited Date/Time 5/27/2023 5:27am

Honda's prototype 3rd gen frame with an 01 HRC engine and 01 plastic.

RC250P~2.JPG?VersionId=

 RC250P~1

 RC250W~1

 Honda's last generation 2 stroke HRC engine in a 4th generation frame that never made it to production on the 2 stroke;

04 RC250.jpg?VersionId=f4S9scvlf pseYaR63F

 2004 RC250M i.jpg?VersionId=9G78cE.s3QYld0

 

7
1
5/27/2023 6:08am
Honda's prototype 3rd gen frame with an 01 HRC engine and 01 plastic.      Honda's last generation 2 stroke HRC engine in a 4th generation...

Honda's prototype 3rd gen frame with an 01 HRC engine and 01 plastic.

RC250P~2.JPG?VersionId=

 RC250P~1

 RC250W~1

 Honda's last generation 2 stroke HRC engine in a 4th generation frame that never made it to production on the 2 stroke;

04 RC250.jpg?VersionId=f4S9scvlf pseYaR63F

 2004 RC250M i.jpg?VersionId=9G78cE.s3QYld0

 

@Tokyo_Tiddler did HRC run a gear position sensor on the 4th generation frame bike?

Tokyo_Tiddler
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5/27/2023 7:13am
Honda's prototype 3rd gen frame with an 01 HRC engine and 01 plastic.      Honda's last generation 2 stroke HRC engine in a 4th generation...

Honda's prototype 3rd gen frame with an 01 HRC engine and 01 plastic.

RC250P~2.JPG?VersionId=

 RC250P~1

 RC250W~1

 Honda's last generation 2 stroke HRC engine in a 4th generation frame that never made it to production on the 2 stroke;

04 RC250.jpg?VersionId=f4S9scvlf pseYaR63F

 2004 RC250M i.jpg?VersionId=9G78cE.s3QYld0

 

@Tokyo_Tiddler did HRC run a gear position sensor on the 4th generation frame bike?

Yes, they did.. no more 2nd button on the handlebars that I have seen, but in the pic below, you can see the round, black gear position sensor behind the shift lever and the black sleeved wiring that goes to it running under the flywheel/ ignition cover.  A lot more electronics appeared from the 3rd generation HRC 2 strokes.

2004 RC250M h 0

 2004 RC250M b 0.jpg?VersionId=0ilzBQWx0NSq

 

6
Lightning78
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Location
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5/27/2023 8:15am
Honda's prototype 3rd gen frame with an 01 HRC engine and 01 plastic.      Honda's last generation 2 stroke HRC engine in a 4th generation...

Honda's prototype 3rd gen frame with an 01 HRC engine and 01 plastic.

RC250P~2.JPG?VersionId=

 RC250P~1

 RC250W~1

 Honda's last generation 2 stroke HRC engine in a 4th generation frame that never made it to production on the 2 stroke;

04 RC250.jpg?VersionId=f4S9scvlf pseYaR63F

 2004 RC250M i.jpg?VersionId=9G78cE.s3QYld0

 

@Tokyo_Tiddler did HRC run a gear position sensor on the 4th generation frame bike?

Yes, they did.. no more 2nd button on the handlebars that I have seen, but in the pic below, you can see the round, black gear...

Yes, they did.. no more 2nd button on the handlebars that I have seen, but in the pic below, you can see the round, black gear position sensor behind the shift lever and the black sleeved wiring that goes to it running under the flywheel/ ignition cover.  A lot more electronics appeared from the 3rd generation HRC 2 strokes.

2004 RC250M h 0

 2004 RC250M b 0.jpg?VersionId=0ilzBQWx0NSq

 

I wish they had released that 4th gen bike....

5
5/27/2023 7:14pm

I wish they had released that 4th gen bike....

I wish they didn't discontinue CR's, or at least kept making spare parts for them, parts are becoming harder to source.

3
1
5/27/2023 7:59pm
Honda's prototype 3rd gen frame with an 01 HRC engine and 01 plastic.      Honda's last generation 2 stroke HRC engine in a 4th generation...

Honda's prototype 3rd gen frame with an 01 HRC engine and 01 plastic.

RC250P~2.JPG?VersionId=

 RC250P~1

 RC250W~1

 Honda's last generation 2 stroke HRC engine in a 4th generation frame that never made it to production on the 2 stroke;

04 RC250.jpg?VersionId=f4S9scvlf pseYaR63F

 2004 RC250M i.jpg?VersionId=9G78cE.s3QYld0

 

I never new a 4th generation existed.  The spares look thinner.  IMO as far as 125 04 chassis it’s the best of the 125,s.  Beefier swing arm, linkage changes, small frame changes if I remember rt. Inner honed forks with the axle out more than a 05.  In really rough tracks it’s tracks straight threw. The 05-07 feels like a mt bike with an engine. Much lighter but they r 125,s . Still light tho.  On a high speed super rough track. I would pick the 04. You can also get the head stem bearing tighter than 05-07.  I barely touch the grips . So hitting square holes at a angle doesn’t jerk the bars & no head shake . 

2
Chance1216
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5/29/2023 6:04pm

E2B76CE5-DCE8-4A22-9260-C68074750EA48767F4EA-1B34-4CC5-80CE-3B0D63D8348D.jpeg?VersionId=a.ou

 01 CR 250 and, 04 CR 125

 

2
Tokyo_Tiddler
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5/29/2023 6:25pm

Found a few more pics of the 4th gen RC250M in my files.. this could have been the 2008 production CR250 if Honda hadn't abandoned 2 stroke mxers.

2003 RC250 4th gen prototype frame 58hp

 Takeshi Katsuya - 2004 RC250M

 ignition advance switch 2004 rc250.jpg?VersionId=FBpHV4snqnsQuhps8eo.j

 

11
Village Idiot
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MXoN - a term used by newbs, goobs and rubes, PW, USA
5/29/2023 6:39pm

I wish they didn't discontinue CR's, or at least kept making spare parts for them, parts are becoming harder to source.

Yeah, that would have been nice, but Honda decided to join the ranks of the "morally superior" and made a grand announcement that they were ceasing production of all products with 2T engines (to save the planet, of course).

Lucky us. Whistling

 

brocster
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5/29/2023 7:01pm

Love this thread!  Question for the tinkerers. What non RC valve engines fit in the 3rd gen frame?  I would like a 3rd gen frame with my 00 motor in it. Is that possible?

Village Idiot
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5/29/2023 7:09pm
brocster wrote:
Love this thread!  Question for the tinkerers. What non RC valve engines fit in the 3rd gen frame?  I would like a 3rd gen frame with...

Love this thread!  Question for the tinkerers. What non RC valve engines fit in the 3rd gen frame?  I would like a 3rd gen frame with my 00 motor in it. Is that possible?

Absolutely.

I know a couple of people who have done it. Do an internet search and you'll likely find details. A guy on TT detailed his swap (either 2000 or 2001 engine into a 2003 chassis) about 15 or more years ago.

1
Tokyo_Tiddler
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Somewhere in, NJ, USA
5/29/2023 7:17pm
brocster wrote:
Love this thread!  Question for the tinkerers. What non RC valve engines fit in the 3rd gen frame?  I would like a 3rd gen frame with...

Love this thread!  Question for the tinkerers. What non RC valve engines fit in the 3rd gen frame?  I would like a 3rd gen frame with my 00 motor in it. Is that possible?

I think MX Bonz was selling a frame adapter/ mount kit to bolt the 01 engine into a 3rd gen frame.

1
Village Idiot
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5/29/2023 7:35pm
brocster wrote:
Love this thread!  Question for the tinkerers. What non RC valve engines fit in the 3rd gen frame?  I would like a 3rd gen frame with...

Love this thread!  Question for the tinkerers. What non RC valve engines fit in the 3rd gen frame?  I would like a 3rd gen frame with my 00 motor in it. Is that possible?

Tokyo_Tiddler
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5/29/2023 7:36pm
Ozy wrote:
Starting in 02 the CR250R had a case reed engine; these engines sucked on 91 octane pump gas and were very susceptible to atmospheric changes. I...

Starting in 02 the CR250R had a case reed engine; these engines sucked on 91 octane pump gas and were very susceptible to atmospheric changes. I had my 03 jetted perfect one day at Lake Elsinore and it ripped. the next week at the same track the temp and humidity were different and it ran like a dog. I started running 1/2 91 octane pump gas and 1/2 VP c12 and it solved the problem. Once I got it jetted right on this gas it ran pretty consistently and the air temp didn't matter

 

i had an 01 and it had that garbage mikuni carb on it..i bougght a new pwk air stryker from a 2000 cr250 new from honda...

i had an 01 and it had that garbage mikuni carb on it..i bougght a new pwk air stryker from a 2000 cr250 new from honda and that bike RIPPED! i actually jetted it rich to de-tune it because it hit so hard w/ the fmf pipe i had on it. 

 

i think using a lectron today would have similar if not better results

The Mikuni carb was not garbage, that TMX carb was what the factory team used to win a number of championships in MXGP and Japan. It was finicky to jet but it made a little more power than the Keihin. Here is the jetting the factory team used for sea level. it fixed my jetting issues for good using the same set up in Japan and the east coast US;

Needle; #6BEH1-75 with clip in the 2nd slot

Main Jet; #30

Pilot Jet; #430

Air Screw; 1.75 turns out

The stock 01 pipe gives the hardest hit from mid-range on up. None of the FMF pipes will give a harder hit than stock and I have tried them all.  All the FMF pipes move the power down low to help with the soft bottom and to keep the mid-range hit from wearing you out.  The FMF SST pipe did the best job of moving the power around to help the bottom w/o losing too much of the top. Not a good idea to detune the hit by making it too rich. A lot of us softened the hit and widened the powerband by adding a higher volume exhaust valve cover or simply adding a spacer... this is an easy way to move around power.  The HRC engines also added an adjustable exhaust valve stopper in addition to the exhaust valve spacer sizes to make it very easy to adjust the power band.

HRC exhaust valve spacer 2

 

6
brocster
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5/29/2023 7:50pm Edited Date/Time 5/29/2023 7:57pm

Thanks for the info dudes.  I forgot I did the power valve spacer mod on my 00 has well. Thing ran clean and was pretty crispy for a tiddler.  Love the fit and finish of Honda’s.  Have to keep my eyes peeled and see what I can find out there. 

I’m talking 125’s not 250’s although I had one of those as well. (2001). My son and I like ripping around on the 12fives. 

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