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JS7 was a mess by time RV hit his prime. Could never recover those lost backwards Yamaha engine years. I'll put up 2006-2009 James up against prime RV any day of the week. Was RV a stand in the corners guy? Not sure I remember that
I was no big huge Stew fan either but he is the only guy we still reference and talk about when something is super gnarly. Stew would do that or this. I just think of those guys he was the one that revolutionized things. He brought that style in and could probably smoke all of them on a KX125. The other guys are work horses no doubt but when it comes to who has blown your wig back more times with incredible things nobody thought possible for me at least it has to be Stew.
As great a recent run Eli has had, it wasn't that long ago he was the Chase Sexton that couldn't finish it out with weird moments stopping to pull his pants up. The fact he is now #2 in SX wins blows my mind.
His ability to just excel when tracks go to hell is just another level above most everyone.
That said he's the best of the current era, the others in theirs
RV
Stewart
Tomac
Dungey
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Despite all his wins, I don’t look at Eli in the same light as the others, he’s in his 11 season, and only has 2 titles.
Imagine how many wins RC, RV, or Dungey if they went another 2-3 years?
Kind of a loaded question of who is best, but not who has the most wins or titles? What is the criteria, cutest outfit, best smile?
Wouldnt longevity fit into the best? Burnout, fatigue...........he who outlasts, wins.
I grew up watching Stew and RC, I was obsessed with RC until Stew came along and showed a different way to ride a dirtbike which is adopted by todays riders across the world, RC brought in the professionalism when it came to fitness.
The fastest I've seen anyone go around a SX track was James at 2011 Daytona what he was doing was borderline asking for death, he ended up hitting the ground hard and concussed he got back on the bike and continued to set fastest laps, best ride in SX history imo.
Anyway those 2 showed the current and past riders what's possible and everyone who takes this sport serious now is following in their footsteps.
I believe RV was the most complete rider of US history, he was crazy enough, his mental was like RC's and he had the sickest style steering with the rear wheel, he also beat the most consistent rider in history in Dungey who was no slouch, he also beat a in form Stewart on multiple occasions, Reed also, my favorite part of RV is that the way he rode he just looked angry and hungry and gave it his all.
Tomac is the fastest America has ever produced especially outdoors, however if he had the same mental toughness as RV/RC the man would be completely and utterly unstoppable, if he had figured himself out like he has in the past 2 years 7 years ago he would have broken every record.
For me without championships in mind pure eye test my list goes like this.
RV
ET(Would be number one if he had the career he should have)
RC
JS
Dungey.
Just for reference James' best ever SX race.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jfSe3Jp4xY&
Ryan Dungey getting the shaft in the poll lol.
Eli and James are in a different league in my opinion. A league above.
Still lots of respect here for Dungey and Villopoto.
Good point about mental toughness being a weak area for Tomac. Even now. Weird races really hurt him in the past and even this year so far. 2022 he was on point the whole season. And starts were for sure a major weakness until 2022.
But as one person earlier suggested maybe those bad races are his version of a Stewart crash-or-win scenario. I had never thought of that before. We know when Eli doesn't feel it he backs off. So no huge crashes?
Maybe that was a key to making his career last so long and getting to the place he finds himself in right now. That is actually a major strength then.
I disagree with you on this... "RC brought in the professionalism when it came to fitness."
Hannah, O'Mara, and Bailey probably would disagree as well...just to name a few.
In my opinion you never had to wonder which RV was going to show up. That guy could just make it happen over and over. Tomacs longevity adds some points to his career also, so I really can’t pick between those two
All 4 are bad dudes, but James was just unreal! And I always tend to listen to the other greats when they’re asked these “best” questions and they almost always say James. Hell, James is on Eli’s mt. Rushmore 😂.
HaHa look at these poll numbers, it’s crazy that we all have such a difference of opinion of who we think is the best. I guess “best” is in the eye of the beholder. Poor dungey is not getting no love.
A bit off-topic, but I think 2022 Tomac and Sexton could run with anybody in the history of the sport in motocross...those two were psycho last summer.
All 4 are badass-I rank championships won in the premier class as the #1 criteria as the ultimate goal as it requires much more than just race wins. Each guy has their strengths, and should be ranked according to their titles, not win % or how long they raced. I won't rank these guys other than to say that James was the fastest guy to ever ride a 125, even faster than RC, Lamson, Reynard. James also had a hot lap in SX or MX that was faster than anyone, but in the end didn't have the consistency (for a million reasons) to win titles. Chad was a total SX badass, but could only muster 2 SX titles and 1 MX title, so he is not part of this conversation the same way the others are. Tomac has doggedly climbed into the conversation and if he closes out this title, he is a part of this elite group. And to continue to find speed as a +30 guy is so impressive. Right now Tomac is the total package and I don't think he can be beat for a title until he decides he doesn't want to be a badass any more. He might lose the odd race, the odd battle, but to beat him in a war is pretty tough. The rank I have is that everyone is really far behind RC and that ain't gonna change in our lifetimes.
Yeah you're probably right I wasn't old enough to experience it but I want to go look back on old tapes, I've seen 2000-2016 series multiple times I'll have to go back at some point to see what the 80s is about.
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I think behind Ricky Carmichael, Villopoto was the best Supercross/Motocross rider in History followed closely by Eli Tomac. The reason I give Villopoto the edge over Eli Tomac is because I believe he was mentally tougher just like RC was. Today, Tomac is simply the best and complete package physically and mentally, but earlier in his career I remember Eli making quite a few mistakes and crashes and it seemed like if he was having a bad day, he just lost his drive to keep charging. RC and RV seemed to have that relentless tenacity to never give up and understood that Championships are won on their worst days. I wish there was a way to see who was the best in History and how the greats like Hannah, Tripes, Johnson, Bailey and Johnny O'mara would have done on modern bikes or the current greats would have done on a 1974 Suzuki TM400. I think James Stewart was amazing to watch and could do things on a bike that were beyond disbelief, but he wasn't the best ever Racer and once the Adderall was taken away from him, he was never the same rider.
I can see that analogy is it kind of is spot on, I don't buy the whole pushing too hard thing for Tomac, I've seen all of his career and watched it closely because I always thought that he has it all from a riding perspective it's also why I and many others are so harsh on him because we can see what he can be.
When it comes to his crashes especially during Kawi years, if he washed a front end he would be so slow to remount the bike as if he couldn't care(obvious he does), another telling story about Tomac's mental was I think it was the 2017 championship with Dungey? anyway basically Tomac fell behind in the points at the start of the season, then he found his mojo and it was some of the best form he's ever had he would demolish the field week in weekout gapping Dungey every week, he closed the points chase in single digits and the race that would give him the championship lead he absolutely shat the bed and rode like a B rider and let Dungey take it away from him, that season confirmed his mental struggles to me, how do you go from waxing the field by 15-30 seconds every race when your chasing points only to ride like a squid when you had the championship.
RV/JS/RC/CR rode their tits off bad night or not every weekend, if any of those riders were in Tomac position that year Dungey wouldn't be champion that year.
RV by a fair bit
Dungey took on a new scooter and made KTM a winner. The BIKE didn't make a RD a winner, Dungey was a winner despite the scooter.
Bullshit
Bullshit! Ryan Villopoto was much closer to Jeremy McGrath's ability in Supercross than Jeremy McGrath was to RV in Motocross and nobody discounts McGraths greatness. James Stewart was simply NEVER! the same rider without his Adderall and that's a fact! it was like Spinach to him if he was Popeye. Eli Tomac, amazing rider, but earlier in his career he wasn't as mentally tough as Ryan Villopoto. Ryan Dungey another amazing rider, but he had his Ass handed to him more times than I can count by Ryan Villopoto. The poll is who's better ET, JS7,RD5 or RV2, unquestionably between those 4 riders in their prime and a James Stewart not on Adderall, Ryan Villopoto was the best without a doubt. The Poll didn't include RC, because everyone knows he was the best combined SX/MX rider of alltime.
I think there are top guys from all the eras...Tomac is a beast and has Sexton and Webb as competitors, but probably not at the point where the other two can challenge him for wins. The Stewart/Reed/RC era where the 3 of them were head to head and probably ended up splitting a lot more wins than Tomac/Webb/Sexton will. RV/RD were head to head for years while RD was on the Suzuki. RD won 3 years in a row against Roczen/Tomac/Anderson another era where wins were likely split amongst that talent. McGrath was totally dominant in his day . RJ on his mid-80s Hondas was also dominant with fierce competition from Ward and O'Mara, before that it was Glover/Hannah on Yamahas battling for dominance...It's all era dependent.
As a fan for an old guy like me, Stewart is the fastest of all time, McGrath the most dominant, RD the toughest, Ward the best racecraft, Bailey the smoothest (Maybe JMB too) and Glover the guy that made MX cool and kicked off the modern era.
So all to say, stop being NBC and only focusing on one rider and instead enjoy the whole sport and all the talented riders!
I can make a case that puts these four in any order on the list. They are all legends.
I don’t think RV ever smoked JS!? Beat him in championships, yes, smoked him, Nope.
I know numbers are numbers, but you also have to put each year in perspective as well. A season that stands out to me is…..
2011- If not for a broken chain at A3 and running out of fuel at Freestone, RD is your SX and MX champion.
Wild to imagine that Eli let a couple of SX titles slip away. Might be looking at 9 total 450 titles if he hadn't. Yet he's still in this discussion.
Sure, but those others won chunks of races and titles in a shorter time. All those other guys have a higher winning percentage.
This is a great point and long not recognized or forgotten. He took serious heat for making this switch and it was a HUGE gamble. The closest was RC or MC to Suzuki, but nowhere near this move.
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