STARK FUTURE VARG - An Electric Bike that is Faster and Lighter than a 450?

#434
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#434 2/5/2022 6:44am
2/5/2022 6:44am
#434 wrote:
Thanks for the Info! Was wondering what kinda cells are used. 21700 typically has 5 Ah of capacity which equals to 2000 Ah with 400 cells...
Thanks for the Info! Was wondering what kinda cells are used.
21700 typically has 5 Ah of capacity which equals to 2000 Ah with 400 cells. At a cell voltage of 3.7 V this equals to 7.4 kWh. So you guys are pretty conservative saying the battery has 6 kWh.
fs wrote:
I won't say exactly what cells we are using but they aren't 5Ah. While a battery with 5Ah cells would look great on paper, it wouldn't...
I won't say exactly what cells we are using but they aren't 5Ah. While a battery with 5Ah cells would look great on paper, it wouldn't be very good in real life -- the cells would have too much internal resistance to deliver the required power and a significant portion of the energy would go into heat instead of power out the rear wheel.
Ah ok, so less capacity, but higher C rate, right? I have to do some reading on current battery technology..
Man, I‘m so excited about this project. Let me know if you need an engineer with experience in fluid and thermodynamics for your team. I‘m okay on a bike too Whistling
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#434
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#434 2/5/2022 6:46am
2/5/2022 6:46am
Motofinne wrote:
The range thing is interesting because so many people that are skeptical are always saying they wont even consider the electric option if it can't go...
The range thing is interesting because so many people that are skeptical are always saying they wont even consider the electric option if it can't go a full 30 minutes on a moto track.

Firstly, the Stark is supposed to be able to do that. According to one of the investors i talked to Tortelli has been going his full speed on a moto track and it lasts up to 40 minutes. We'll see if that is true when the media has their intro day in Barcelona this spring, but i doubt that they're lying about the range.

Secondly. Very, very few average riders are able to go their maximum normal speed on a MX track for 30 minutes. Most are shot after 15 minutes and they have barely used 80% of the throttle. Most will go back to the pits with a lot of battery left and wont need to charge it from 0 to 100%.

Offroad/enduro/trail riding it a different topic. That is more tricky.
Yeah, if it can do a moto with a pro, it’s going to be enough for a weekend warrior’s day of riding!
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Motofinne
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Motofinne 2/5/2022 6:54am
2/5/2022 6:54am
Motofinne wrote:
The range thing is interesting because so many people that are skeptical are always saying they wont even consider the electric option if it can't go...
The range thing is interesting because so many people that are skeptical are always saying they wont even consider the electric option if it can't go a full 30 minutes on a moto track.

Firstly, the Stark is supposed to be able to do that. According to one of the investors i talked to Tortelli has been going his full speed on a moto track and it lasts up to 40 minutes. We'll see if that is true when the media has their intro day in Barcelona this spring, but i doubt that they're lying about the range.

Secondly. Very, very few average riders are able to go their maximum normal speed on a MX track for 30 minutes. Most are shot after 15 minutes and they have barely used 80% of the throttle. Most will go back to the pits with a lot of battery left and wont need to charge it from 0 to 100%.

Offroad/enduro/trail riding it a different topic. That is more tricky.
#434 wrote:
Yeah, if it can do a moto with a pro, it’s going to be enough for a weekend warrior’s day of riding!
And they are going to race the bike in national level races (eventually GPs and US SX). It will last, or they will make sure it does last the full 30 min + 2 laps.
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JackLHyde
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JackLHyde 2/5/2022 8:13am
2/5/2022 8:13am
Larry450 wrote:
Yep. I got that from message from the videos as well. But would you call it "slippery fingers"? Where the fingers? And why are they slippery...
Yep. I got that from message from the videos as well. But would you call it "slippery fingers"? Where the fingers? And why are they slippery? Any info on voltage of the battery? Maybe I am just an idiot but there might some cool tech that Stark is not telling us at least not yet.

Here is video some guy disassembling alta battery. Those cells in middle of pack must have been running hot hot hot.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BoWQ54NpU0&ab_channel=SheaNyquist
fs wrote:
The bottoms of the cells are held by the magnesium allow case. When the cells are inserted they are not perfectly vertical. There is a plastic...
The bottoms of the cells are held by the magnesium allow case. When the cells are inserted they are not perfectly vertical. There is a plastic part which is then placed on top that covers and holds the tops of the cells. The fingers are a clever design that guides the cell tops into the holes -- this allows quick assembly of the battery while keeping the mass penalty low. Two mirror image halves are made like this and then mated together.

There are 400 21700 cells in the pack, 100s4p.
#434 wrote:
Thanks for the Info! Was wondering what kinda cells are used. 21700 typically has 5 Ah of capacity which equals to 2000 Ah with 400 cells...
Thanks for the Info! Was wondering what kinda cells are used.
21700 typically has 5 Ah of capacity which equals to 2000 Ah with 400 cells. At a cell voltage of 3.7 V this equals to 7.4 kWh. So you guys are pretty conservative saying the battery has 6 kWh.
Probably more like 3.6V and 4Ah. The pack then has 360V with 16Ah.
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Larry450
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Larry450 2/5/2022 10:19am
2/5/2022 10:19am
Well this effing is awesome. Somebody working at Stark is answering peoples questions at vital. Thank you!

Any chance of you guys releasing the data from your frame/chassis stiffness tests? The one that you bought the all the current bikes and got a baseline for the varg? Maybe sell the data for some motorcycle site? Vitalmx?
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RaceFace58
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RaceFace58 2/6/2022 6:12am
2/6/2022 6:12am
I’m pulling for the Stark and the company but I don’t know. I was impressed to hear 5,000 sold in 6 weeks then find out it’s a $100 deposit to reserve. To find out the first one isn’t slated to deliver until when? I remember having so much anticipation when the Cannondales were at this stage and seeing a similar stream of people with one on order. I’m not sure exactly how many they ever delivered but that did not end well.
Pirate421
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Pirate421 2/6/2022 6:23am
2/6/2022 6:23am
I really just can’t wait until th media outlets can get a few of these. The bike looks awesome in their videos but any paid test rider will obviously say it’s the best bike they’ve ever ridden. While I believe it’s great I’d like to see some real world test to solidify that this bike is the real deal. The artsy 20 second ig clips look nice but I want to see ping, keefer and ML run it through its paces. I’m also really hopeful they meet the delivery dates and keep up the communication
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RaceFace58
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RaceFace58 2/6/2022 6:41am
2/6/2022 6:41am
Motofinne wrote:
The range thing is interesting because so many people that are skeptical are always saying they wont even consider the electric option if it can't go...
The range thing is interesting because so many people that are skeptical are always saying they wont even consider the electric option if it can't go a full 30 minutes on a moto track.

Firstly, the Stark is supposed to be able to do that. According to one of the investors i talked to Tortelli has been going his full speed on a moto track and it lasts up to 40 minutes. We'll see if that is true when the media has their intro day in Barcelona this spring, but i doubt that they're lying about the range.

Secondly. Very, very few average riders are able to go their maximum normal speed on a MX track for 30 minutes. Most are shot after 15 minutes and they have barely used 80% of the throttle. Most will go back to the pits with a lot of battery left and wont need to charge it from 0 to 100%.

Offroad/enduro/trail riding it a different topic. That is more tricky.
#434 wrote:
Yeah, if it can do a moto with a pro, it’s going to be enough for a weekend warrior’s day of riding!
That’s like thinking a 450 can do 30 minutes plus 2 laps with a Pro on board so a weekend warrior can go all day on one tank of gas on a 450 with a stick tank. I’d guess a weekend warrior might get an hour plus? But certainly not all day. Imagine all the generators that will be running all day long to recharge the batteries at the races. Lmao. When CA has banned all ICEngines, generators will be on the list as well. I’m not sure how this is all going to play out. I’m reading about a Ford F-150 EV that can have its range increased optionally to 300 miles. That means real world won’t sniff 300 miles, and 300 miles is not all that much when you then need to recharge for hours. This stuff is not adding up for me in terms of real world use. Saddest part is where is all this electricity being generated from? We have brownouts now from AC use. Our iPhones with “6 day charges” last an hour if you actually use it. Nowhere near the claims even if you don’t.
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-MAVERICK- 2/6/2022 6:50am
2/6/2022 6:50am
RaceFace58 wrote:
I’m pulling for the Stark and the company but I don’t know. I was impressed to hear 5,000 sold in 6 weeks then find out it’s...
I’m pulling for the Stark and the company but I don’t know. I was impressed to hear 5,000 sold in 6 weeks then find out it’s a $100 deposit to reserve. To find out the first one isn’t slated to deliver until when? I remember having so much anticipation when the Cannondales were at this stage and seeing a similar stream of people with one on order. I’m not sure exactly how many they ever delivered but that did not end well.
I believe the first deliveries are scheduled for September of this year.

The $100 fee to order one most likely affected the amount of bikes they "sold". If you back out you only lose $100. I guess we'll see when the time comes.

On another note, I don't know how the Stark bike will be in the sand. I recently saw a video of AJ Catanzaro riding the Alta in the sand at ClubMX, and he said it's terrible. I know this bike is supposed to be superior, but it might still be a concern. Sand tracks is all we have around my area.
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8500rpm
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8500rpm 2/6/2022 8:26am
2/6/2022 8:26am
RaceFace58 wrote:
I’m pulling for the Stark and the company but I don’t know. I was impressed to hear 5,000 sold in 6 weeks then find out it’s...
I’m pulling for the Stark and the company but I don’t know. I was impressed to hear 5,000 sold in 6 weeks then find out it’s a $100 deposit to reserve. To find out the first one isn’t slated to deliver until when? I remember having so much anticipation when the Cannondales were at this stage and seeing a similar stream of people with one on order. I’m not sure exactly how many they ever delivered but that did not end well.
-MAVERICK- wrote:
I believe the first deliveries are scheduled for September of this year. The $100 fee to order one most likely affected the amount of bikes they...
I believe the first deliveries are scheduled for September of this year.

The $100 fee to order one most likely affected the amount of bikes they "sold". If you back out you only lose $100. I guess we'll see when the time comes.

On another note, I don't know how the Stark bike will be in the sand. I recently saw a video of AJ Catanzaro riding the Alta in the sand at ClubMX, and he said it's terrible. I know this bike is supposed to be superior, but it might still be a concern. Sand tracks is all we have around my area.
Josh Hill on Gypsy had an interesting talk about this, he didn't go deep but talked about 'intertia', if I understood correctly he meant something that when an ICE engine get all those small pieces moving (piston + more) it's 'hard to stop' where as an electric motor somehow has a harder time or is suddenly not as strong or efficient.

Maybe there is something in that, physics of course.

I'm out on deep water now, don't know what I'm talking about Wink but is it so that an 450cc fully powered up is 'slower to stop' than a 'small electric engine' due to the fact that the 450cc finally got all the mass moving? (but the electric engine maybe accelerated faster as it didn't need to get all that mass (engine components) moving?)
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#434
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#434 2/6/2022 9:56am
2/6/2022 9:56am
RaceFace58 wrote:
I’m pulling for the Stark and the company but I don’t know. I was impressed to hear 5,000 sold in 6 weeks then find out it’s...
I’m pulling for the Stark and the company but I don’t know. I was impressed to hear 5,000 sold in 6 weeks then find out it’s a $100 deposit to reserve. To find out the first one isn’t slated to deliver until when? I remember having so much anticipation when the Cannondales were at this stage and seeing a similar stream of people with one on order. I’m not sure exactly how many they ever delivered but that did not end well.
-MAVERICK- wrote:
I believe the first deliveries are scheduled for September of this year. The $100 fee to order one most likely affected the amount of bikes they...
I believe the first deliveries are scheduled for September of this year.

The $100 fee to order one most likely affected the amount of bikes they "sold". If you back out you only lose $100. I guess we'll see when the time comes.

On another note, I don't know how the Stark bike will be in the sand. I recently saw a video of AJ Catanzaro riding the Alta in the sand at ClubMX, and he said it's terrible. I know this bike is supposed to be superior, but it might still be a concern. Sand tracks is all we have around my area.
8500rpm wrote:
Josh Hill on Gypsy had an interesting talk about this, he didn't go deep but talked about 'intertia', if I understood correctly he meant something that...
Josh Hill on Gypsy had an interesting talk about this, he didn't go deep but talked about 'intertia', if I understood correctly he meant something that when an ICE engine get all those small pieces moving (piston + more) it's 'hard to stop' where as an electric motor somehow has a harder time or is suddenly not as strong or efficient.

Maybe there is something in that, physics of course.

I'm out on deep water now, don't know what I'm talking about Wink but is it so that an 450cc fully powered up is 'slower to stop' than a 'small electric engine' due to the fact that the 450cc finally got all the mass moving? (but the electric engine maybe accelerated faster as it didn't need to get all that mass (engine components) moving?)
Yes, Josh talked about that. A big 450 crank has a lot more inertia than that small electric motor and takes of course much more energy to slow down. It can therefore pull you through certain moments when the track just want to swallow you up.
Interestingly, in the videos where they explain what can be adjusted on the Varg, they talk about adjusting the flywheel effect of the motor. I think, that's how they want to emulate the effect of the heavy crank of an ICE dirt bike.

BTW not having a heavy crank has a very positive effect on the handling of a bike. So by creating a flywheel effect you get one benefit of a heavy crank without messing with the handling.
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RaceFace58
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RaceFace58 2/6/2022 10:09am
2/6/2022 10:09am
It’s all foreign to me as well but there are certain common sense/logic type of thoughts that come into the equation with electric anything’s for me. Knowing how hard it is to get a well made production motorcycle up and profitable, the preproduction one-offs are the easy part. I also didn’t like seeing some new design ideas in the mix here. Like the indexed chain tensioners. Looks like the swing arm pivot is clamped in place too, no nut. The battery assembly being a stressed member of the frame I don’t like the sound of. I guess we’ll see down the road. What I really don’t like is this as a replacement for gas power. I’d love to have one dude by side with a regular bike. I’m not looking forward to being told this is it, take it or leave it.
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#434
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#434 2/6/2022 10:21am
2/6/2022 10:21am
RaceFace58 wrote:
It’s all foreign to me as well but there are certain common sense/logic type of thoughts that come into the equation with electric anything’s for me...
It’s all foreign to me as well but there are certain common sense/logic type of thoughts that come into the equation with electric anything’s for me. Knowing how hard it is to get a well made production motorcycle up and profitable, the preproduction one-offs are the easy part. I also didn’t like seeing some new design ideas in the mix here. Like the indexed chain tensioners. Looks like the swing arm pivot is clamped in place too, no nut. The battery assembly being a stressed member of the frame I don’t like the sound of. I guess we’ll see down the road. What I really don’t like is this as a replacement for gas power. I’d love to have one dude by side with a regular bike. I’m not looking forward to being told this is it, take it or leave it.
Haha, with guys like you I always have to think of this quote:

“If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.” ― Henry Ford
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RaceFace58
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RaceFace58 2/6/2022 2:51pm
2/6/2022 2:51pm
RaceFace58 wrote:
It’s all foreign to me as well but there are certain common sense/logic type of thoughts that come into the equation with electric anything’s for me...
It’s all foreign to me as well but there are certain common sense/logic type of thoughts that come into the equation with electric anything’s for me. Knowing how hard it is to get a well made production motorcycle up and profitable, the preproduction one-offs are the easy part. I also didn’t like seeing some new design ideas in the mix here. Like the indexed chain tensioners. Looks like the swing arm pivot is clamped in place too, no nut. The battery assembly being a stressed member of the frame I don’t like the sound of. I guess we’ll see down the road. What I really don’t like is this as a replacement for gas power. I’d love to have one dude by side with a regular bike. I’m not looking forward to being told this is it, take it or leave it.
#434 wrote:
Haha, with guys like you I always have to think of this quote: “If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster...
Haha, with guys like you I always have to think of this quote:

“If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.” ― Henry Ford
Hey good one! Thanks for adding something pertinent to the conversation. Careful Mr. Progessive. How do you know I’m a guy? I am but some might find your assumption very offensive.

I like this quote from the same man:
“Failure is simply the opportunity to begin again, this time more intelligently”.

I think like Alta, this bike will ultimately fail to deliver as promised. They will learn from their mistakes for the next guy. Just as Stark has learned from Alta. It’s not until the Big bike manufacturers get involved that this electric MX bike will be feasible as a complete replacement for gas powered bikes.

I for one am not at all eager to reach that point.
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ACBraap
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ACBraap 2/6/2022 3:15pm
2/6/2022 3:15pm
vitalriderCrf wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2022/02/04/532155/s1200_E8E5B457_EED0_4D16_8D76_A8F704A82821.jpg[/img]

That matters to Prius buyers, not electric dirt bike buyers. I’d buy electric because it’s quiet, tunable, and maintenance is reduced. It’s all about more riding time.
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86 honda
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86 honda 2/6/2022 5:43pm
2/6/2022 5:43pm
I love the sound of your chain slap man(said no one)
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#434
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#434 2/6/2022 10:38pm
2/6/2022 10:38pm Edited Date/Time 2/7/2022 1:20am
RaceFace58 wrote:
It’s all foreign to me as well but there are certain common sense/logic type of thoughts that come into the equation with electric anything’s for me...
It’s all foreign to me as well but there are certain common sense/logic type of thoughts that come into the equation with electric anything’s for me. Knowing how hard it is to get a well made production motorcycle up and profitable, the preproduction one-offs are the easy part. I also didn’t like seeing some new design ideas in the mix here. Like the indexed chain tensioners. Looks like the swing arm pivot is clamped in place too, no nut. The battery assembly being a stressed member of the frame I don’t like the sound of. I guess we’ll see down the road. What I really don’t like is this as a replacement for gas power. I’d love to have one dude by side with a regular bike. I’m not looking forward to being told this is it, take it or leave it.
#434 wrote:
Haha, with guys like you I always have to think of this quote: “If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster...
Haha, with guys like you I always have to think of this quote:

“If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses.” ― Henry Ford
RaceFace58 wrote:
Hey good one! Thanks for adding something pertinent to the conversation. Careful Mr. Progessive. How do you know I’m a guy? I am but some might...
Hey good one! Thanks for adding something pertinent to the conversation. Careful Mr. Progessive. How do you know I’m a guy? I am but some might find your assumption very offensive.

I like this quote from the same man:
“Failure is simply the opportunity to begin again, this time more intelligently”.

I think like Alta, this bike will ultimately fail to deliver as promised. They will learn from their mistakes for the next guy. Just as Stark has learned from Alta. It’s not until the Big bike manufacturers get involved that this electric MX bike will be feasible as a complete replacement for gas powered bikes.

I for one am not at all eager to reach that point.
I wouldn’t be so negative towards their team.

Of course, I don’t know if this bike will deliver, but they seem to take the right approach in studying all available bikes, learn from Alta‘s mistakes but implement their own ideas.

I wouldn’t count on the big manufacturers to deliver the first competitive electric bike. The wanna sell what they have and know how to manufacture.
Just like with cars, it will take an outsider to show it‘s possible.

Edit: I think it‘ll take a long time until it replaces ICE bikes. But for densely populated areas an electric bike can’t come soon enough.
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Darrin Willis 2/8/2022 5:53am
2/8/2022 5:53am
Larry450 wrote:
Yep. I got that from message from the videos as well. But would you call it "slippery fingers"? Where the fingers? And why are they slippery...
Yep. I got that from message from the videos as well. But would you call it "slippery fingers"? Where the fingers? And why are they slippery? Any info on voltage of the battery? Maybe I am just an idiot but there might some cool tech that Stark is not telling us at least not yet.

Here is video some guy disassembling alta battery. Those cells in middle of pack must have been running hot hot hot.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1BoWQ54NpU0&ab_channel=SheaNyquist
fs wrote:
The bottoms of the cells are held by the magnesium allow case. When the cells are inserted they are not perfectly vertical. There is a plastic...
The bottoms of the cells are held by the magnesium allow case. When the cells are inserted they are not perfectly vertical. There is a plastic part which is then placed on top that covers and holds the tops of the cells. The fingers are a clever design that guides the cell tops into the holes -- this allows quick assembly of the battery while keeping the mass penalty low. Two mirror image halves are made like this and then mated together.

There are 400 21700 cells in the pack, 100s4p.
#434 wrote:
Thanks for the Info! Was wondering what kinda cells are used. 21700 typically has 5 Ah of capacity which equals to 2000 Ah with 400 cells...
Thanks for the Info! Was wondering what kinda cells are used.
21700 typically has 5 Ah of capacity which equals to 2000 Ah with 400 cells. At a cell voltage of 3.7 V this equals to 7.4 kWh. So you guys are pretty conservative saying the battery has 6 kWh.
This is why Im anti electric. I dont understand a single thing your saying.
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#434
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#434 2/8/2022 6:07am
2/8/2022 6:07am
fs wrote:
The bottoms of the cells are held by the magnesium allow case. When the cells are inserted they are not perfectly vertical. There is a plastic...
The bottoms of the cells are held by the magnesium allow case. When the cells are inserted they are not perfectly vertical. There is a plastic part which is then placed on top that covers and holds the tops of the cells. The fingers are a clever design that guides the cell tops into the holes -- this allows quick assembly of the battery while keeping the mass penalty low. Two mirror image halves are made like this and then mated together.

There are 400 21700 cells in the pack, 100s4p.
#434 wrote:
Thanks for the Info! Was wondering what kinda cells are used. 21700 typically has 5 Ah of capacity which equals to 2000 Ah with 400 cells...
Thanks for the Info! Was wondering what kinda cells are used.
21700 typically has 5 Ah of capacity which equals to 2000 Ah with 400 cells. At a cell voltage of 3.7 V this equals to 7.4 kWh. So you guys are pretty conservative saying the battery has 6 kWh.
Darrin Willis wrote:
This is why Im anti electric. I dont understand a single thing your saying.
As if you have any idea how the Otto cycle works, but still you like dirt bikes Tongue
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wfopete
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wfopete 2/8/2022 6:09am
2/8/2022 6:09am
Darrin Willis wrote:
This is why Im anti electric. I dont understand a single thing your saying.
That's ok. You will likely have a mini-epiphany when you get passed by E-bike :-)
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TooTallJason
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TooTallJason 2/8/2022 7:26am
2/8/2022 7:26am
vitalriderCrf wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2022/02/04/532155/s1200_E8E5B457_EED0_4D16_8D76_A8F704A82821.jpg[/img]

ACBraap wrote:
That matters to Prius buyers, not electric dirt bike buyers. I’d buy electric because it’s quiet, tunable, and maintenance is reduced. It’s all about more riding...
That matters to Prius buyers, not electric dirt bike buyers. I’d buy electric because it’s quiet, tunable, and maintenance is reduced. It’s all about more riding time.
No, they just pretend it matters. Look at Boulder, Colorado. Probably as many or more hybrids than any other city and it's full of granola people but it's still a coal fired town.
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davis224
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davis224 2/8/2022 7:32am
2/8/2022 7:32am
TooTallJason wrote:
No, they just pretend it matters. Look at Boulder, Colorado. Probably as many or more hybrids than any other city and it's full of granola people...
No, they just pretend it matters. Look at Boulder, Colorado. Probably as many or more hybrids than any other city and it's full of granola people but it's still a coal fired town.
Not trying to go down that rabbit hole, but EVs charged with coal fired power result in less emissions overall (not a ton based on what I've seen, but still less) than if they were gas/diesel vehicles. Supposedly the "cleanest" car is a used hybrid, rather than buying a new all electric. Just food for thought.
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davis224 2/8/2022 7:34am
2/8/2022 7:34am
But anyway, one of the biggest positives I see from electric bikes becoming widespread is more indoor tracks, if they don't have to worry about ventilation and heating more to compensate for the ventilation in winter.
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38special
Profile picture for user 38special
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38special 2/8/2022 7:55am
2/8/2022 7:55am
I see Electric Bikes as a great supplement/alternative to IC bikes for the foreseeable future. Backyard tracks, indoor facilities, and general R&D for the technology for the future. It's an interesting niche.

I love my 2 strokes and you'll have to pry them out of my hands, but I don't feel threatened by a complete e-bike takeover in my lifetime. Even if there was, there will still be the vintage racing, which is all I race anymore anyway.
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brocster
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brocster 2/10/2022 4:26pm
2/10/2022 4:26pm
vitalriderCrf wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2022/02/04/532155/s1200_E8E5B457_EED0_4D16_8D76_A8F704A82821.jpg[/img]

ACBraap wrote:
That matters to Prius buyers, not electric dirt bike buyers. I’d buy electric because it’s quiet, tunable, and maintenance is reduced. It’s all about more riding...
That matters to Prius buyers, not electric dirt bike buyers. I’d buy electric because it’s quiet, tunable, and maintenance is reduced. It’s all about more riding time.
TooTallJason wrote:
No, they just pretend it matters. Look at Boulder, Colorado. Probably as many or more hybrids than any other city and it's full of granola people...
No, they just pretend it matters. Look at Boulder, Colorado. Probably as many or more hybrids than any other city and it's full of granola people but it's still a coal fired town.
Correct all while wearing there North Face gear. Thought this was funny as hell.

https://www.outsidebusinessjournal.com/issues/what-happens-when-an-oil-…

Another lil tid bit is that it took over 60 years to move away from coal as an energy source then once moving away it was realized that it was a necessity for the current world we live in. Pretty sure coal is still the largest producer of energy nearly 100 years from trying to get away from it. Our crazy president an my govenor think they can get it done in 10. We are a couple years in an I fail to see any infastructure being modified or added. Carry on…
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early
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early 2/10/2022 4:41pm
2/10/2022 4:41pm
vitalriderCrf wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2022/02/04/532155/s1200_E8E5B457_EED0_4D16_8D76_A8F704A82821.jpg[/img]

ACBraap wrote:
That matters to Prius buyers, not electric dirt bike buyers. I’d buy electric because it’s quiet, tunable, and maintenance is reduced. It’s all about more riding...
That matters to Prius buyers, not electric dirt bike buyers. I’d buy electric because it’s quiet, tunable, and maintenance is reduced. It’s all about more riding time.
TooTallJason wrote:
No, they just pretend it matters. Look at Boulder, Colorado. Probably as many or more hybrids than any other city and it's full of granola people...
No, they just pretend it matters. Look at Boulder, Colorado. Probably as many or more hybrids than any other city and it's full of granola people but it's still a coal fired town.
You guys know that most Priuses run on gasoline right? They just use less of it than most cars which reduces demand and lowers prices. You should be wishing that everybody not needing a truck drove a prius, leaves more gas for everyone else.
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RaceFace58
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RaceFace58 2/10/2022 6:46pm
2/10/2022 6:46pm
Sadly I think it will come too soon. Kawasaki has announced that in 12 years they will no longer have a single ICE bike of any kind. The manufacturers have signed an agreement to use the same batteries (kinds like an even displacement so to speak). What will the races be like with no engine noise? This is depressing.
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OrangeJuice158 2/10/2022 6:48pm
2/10/2022 6:48pm
brocster wrote:
Correct all while wearing there North Face gear. Thought this was funny as hell. https://www.outsidebusinessjournal.com/issues/what-happens-when-an-oil-company-publicly-accuses-the-north-face-of-hypocrisy/ Another lil tid bit is that it took over 60 years...
Correct all while wearing there North Face gear. Thought this was funny as hell.

https://www.outsidebusinessjournal.com/issues/what-happens-when-an-oil-…

Another lil tid bit is that it took over 60 years to move away from coal as an energy source then once moving away it was realized that it was a necessity for the current world we live in. Pretty sure coal is still the largest producer of energy nearly 100 years from trying to get away from it. Our crazy president an my govenor think they can get it done in 10. We are a couple years in an I fail to see any infastructure being modified or added. Carry on…
In 2020, Natural gas is about 40%, then nuclear at 19.7%, then coal at 19.3%, then wind at 8.4%

https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=427&t=3
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RaceFace58
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RaceFace58 2/10/2022 6:55pm
2/10/2022 6:55pm
38special wrote:
I see Electric Bikes as a great supplement/alternative to IC bikes for the foreseeable future. Backyard tracks, indoor facilities, and general R&D for the technology for...
I see Electric Bikes as a great supplement/alternative to IC bikes for the foreseeable future. Backyard tracks, indoor facilities, and general R&D for the technology for the future. It's an interesting niche.

I love my 2 strokes and you'll have to pry them out of my hands, but I don't feel threatened by a complete e-bike takeover in my lifetime. Even if there was, there will still be the vintage racing, which is all I race anymore anyway.
You don’t understand. They may ban gasoline powered dirt bikes altogether. CA has already doing it with landscaping equipment. What this will
Do at the very least is put almost all fuel producers out of business. Gas supplies could become a luxury item. So many industries are going to be impacted so many companies will be out of business. We are all flying headlong into this and the same people pushing for it are not looking to build new power plants. If anything they want less. I think in 20 years we’ll be looking at each other saying wtf were we thinking????
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lostboy819 2/10/2022 8:18pm
2/10/2022 8:18pm
RaceFace58 wrote:
You don’t understand. They may ban gasoline powered dirt bikes altogether. CA has already doing it with landscaping equipment. What this will Do at the very...
You don’t understand. They may ban gasoline powered dirt bikes altogether. CA has already doing it with landscaping equipment. What this will
Do at the very least is put almost all fuel producers out of business. Gas supplies could become a luxury item. So many industries are going to be impacted so many companies will be out of business. We are all flying headlong into this and the same people pushing for it are not looking to build new power plants. If anything they want less. I think in 20 years we’ll be looking at each other saying wtf were we thinking????
Did you get fired from Taco Bell and now think you have to post in every thread ?? Burger king is hiring.
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