Durhamtown closed?

1/4/2022 3:22pm
DB97 wrote:
Had a friend die from injuries sustained there last year. I had the chance to go a few weeks ago and passed.
I'm sorry that happened to your friend. Can you say how they were injured/died out there?
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DB97
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1/4/2022 3:29pm
I'm sorry that happened to your friend. Can you say how they were injured/died out there?
Cased a table and went off the track into rocks/boulders. Was in the hospital for a month or so and never recovered.
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Skylebones
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1/4/2022 3:55pm
The list of local places to ride is getting smaller and smaller around here. Super bummed about it.
tripleup05
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1/4/2022 5:33pm Edited Date/Time 1/4/2022 5:37pm
Oof. It figures I bought a new Outlander Max two weeks ago for the sole purpose of having my wife and daughter start joining me on Durhamtown trips Sad

My personal poor financial decision aside, I wish the best to the Durhamtown folks. Mike could be a bit gruff in my experience but overall I loved that place.
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The Shop

wwoberg
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1/4/2022 7:44pm
We use to make 2 trips a year there. Redneck heaven. It wasn't a place for city folk. Stop going as it got rougher and rougher.
1/4/2022 9:34pm
Sad day. I loved that place. Almost seems unreal ..... like an April Fools thing .... but it's January.
Ramrod
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1/4/2022 9:41pm
Great place, nothing but positives to say about it.

It's literally out in the middle of nowhere and offers the opportunity for so many to enjoy. Of course some people will get hurt, we all have free will to make our own decisions and sometimes they are bad ones.

In my opinion the place was run well and very safe. Lots of signage and one way direction.

I only went during the week so less squids.
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Ramrod
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1/5/2022 4:47am
I think I will try Highlnd Park in GA this winter now, looks good.
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CG118
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1/5/2022 5:33am
Highland Park is as safe as it gets regarding off-road riding. One way, well marked trails and tracks. I took my kids to ride there when they were young, and felt safe.
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CG118
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1/5/2022 5:38am
I never want to see a riding facility close. But, DT was a fucking madhouse mainly due to two way traffic and tons of inexperienced flippant people flying around on seriously powerful 4 wheeled vehicles. Bad combo of bikes, quads and SxSs.
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1/5/2022 6:03am
sounds like it was mismanaged and no risk management was put into place by the owner/operator

bummer though. would it have been that hard to design a one-way trail system with signs ?
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Ramrod
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1/5/2022 7:02am
sounds like it was mismanaged and no risk management was put into place by the owner/operator bummer though. would it have been that hard to design...
sounds like it was mismanaged and no risk management was put into place by the owner/operator

bummer though. would it have been that hard to design a one-way trail system with signs ?
The only 2 way traffic area I recall there was up front by the proshop and it had lanes, signs and slow speed. I only rode there in winters mid week with minimal people so it was good.

Everywhere else was direction arrow one way. That said I did hear of a guy who crashed hard on a track out in the woods because some doofus's entered the track on sxs's and ran it backwards...Can't help stupid.
ChaseW
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1/5/2022 7:52am
sounds like it was mismanaged and no risk management was put into place by the owner/operator bummer though. would it have been that hard to design...
sounds like it was mismanaged and no risk management was put into place by the owner/operator

bummer though. would it have been that hard to design a one-way trail system with signs ?
Ramrod wrote:
The only 2 way traffic area I recall there was up front by the proshop and it had lanes, signs and slow speed. I only rode...
The only 2 way traffic area I recall there was up front by the proshop and it had lanes, signs and slow speed. I only rode there in winters mid week with minimal people so it was good.

Everywhere else was direction arrow one way. That said I did hear of a guy who crashed hard on a track out in the woods because some doofus's entered the track on sxs's and ran it backwards...Can't help stupid.
I made an account here just so I could put my two cents into this conversation. I have been going to Durhamtown at least twice a year for up to a week at a time for the last 10 years. I got to know a lot of the staff personally there and I think a lot of this needs to be shared.

Durhamtown was not a safe place, there is no doubt about that. However I don't think two-ways were ever really a problem. I rode nearly every trail at that place and the only two ways I can think of are the main road from the lodge to the parking area, the ingress/egress for the GP track, and the area back by MX4 and Monster mountain. The only one that was particularly egregious was the one by MX4. That one had about 3 blind corners on that little stretch of trail. The main trail was two lanes, one towards lodge and the other towards the trails. The two-way by GP monitored by a staff member that (in theory) is making sure nobody is getting on to the GP track while someone was either rounding that corner or trying to get off the track.

I think the biggest issue with this place was the staff. A lot of really pleasant people, but most were either not trained to handle the danger and throughput that place had, or didn't care/respect the danger that comes with a place like this. I almost fractured my hip on the GP track because the staff that was supposed to be timing when someone could enter the GP track didn't do his job and let a kid on an ATV on the track just as I was coming down the big turn and I had to dump my bike at speed to make sure I didn't demolish myself and a child.

Mike on the other hand was a dick. I spoke to him with my dad at length on multiple occasions. He always was at odds with his staff, and pretty much everyone I talked to who worked there said they had been fired multiple times. I also heard that prior to his "incident" on the rhythm track with an improperly assembled SxS that he was a very abusive employer. Not to mention most of the people that worked there lived in trailers on property and bunked with other employees. The place was a veritable Tiger King of offroad resorts complete with incompetent staff and doubly so for the owner.

As for why they closed so abruptly, I can't imagine that the lawsuit didn't hit them pretty hard. Sure, they had a lot of gross income, but between the cost to maintain a place like that must be astronomical. Also it probably doesn't help that they just lost a negligent safety suit and likely have an (allegedly) wrongful death verdict coming down the pipeline that finding insurance at this point was nigh on impossible.

Also, that land wasn't owned by Mike, from what he told us he leased it from the Durham Brothers which is an operation that owned all that land and the better part of the surrounding area for lumber. Given how high the cost of lumber has gotten maybe when the time came for them to renew the lease they thought that actually using the land for the lumber is a better investment than leasing it to a rinky dink offroad camp?

There's definitely a lot that's likely going to come to the surface whether it be old drama or new(er) stuff coming to the surface. I already have talked to a few ex-employees on reddit who think there was some (allegedly) suspicious activity going on, especially around the Adam White death, who was impaled on the Bomber track as I understand it.
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tripleup05
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1/5/2022 7:59am
sounds like it was mismanaged and no risk management was put into place by the owner/operator bummer though. would it have been that hard to design...
sounds like it was mismanaged and no risk management was put into place by the owner/operator

bummer though. would it have been that hard to design a one-way trail system with signs ?
Ramrod wrote:
The only 2 way traffic area I recall there was up front by the proshop and it had lanes, signs and slow speed. I only rode...
The only 2 way traffic area I recall there was up front by the proshop and it had lanes, signs and slow speed. I only rode there in winters mid week with minimal people so it was good.

Everywhere else was direction arrow one way. That said I did hear of a guy who crashed hard on a track out in the woods because some doofus's entered the track on sxs's and ran it backwards...Can't help stupid.
Yep it was mostly one way, but there were several areas that were kind of a free for all such as parking lot, Redlands, area between GP track and road crossing, travel between main parking lot and Bomber, etc. But for the most part those were slow speed areas and common sense kept people safe. As you mentioned though, the danger was on the weekend where far too many doofuses didn't exercise good sense in the unmarked areas (even parking lot could be sketchy with knuckleheads zipping around) and especially going the wrong way on marked areas.

I guess it's time to visit Highland Park again. Its been a long time since I've been there. While Durhamtown conjures up imaging of Bubba trashing his SxS in a mudhole, Highland Park makes me think of James the Accountant whose Klim gear costs more than my dirtbikeLaughing
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piscokid
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1/5/2022 10:37am Edited Date/Time 1/5/2022 10:38am
Highland Park is one of those places that you say to yourself after spending the day there: "This is why I ride motorcycles." That place is incredible.
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1/5/2022 10:59am Edited Date/Time 1/5/2022 11:00am
sounds like it was mismanaged and no risk management was put into place by the owner/operator bummer though. would it have been that hard to design...
sounds like it was mismanaged and no risk management was put into place by the owner/operator

bummer though. would it have been that hard to design a one-way trail system with signs ?
Ramrod wrote:
The only 2 way traffic area I recall there was up front by the proshop and it had lanes, signs and slow speed. I only rode...
The only 2 way traffic area I recall there was up front by the proshop and it had lanes, signs and slow speed. I only rode there in winters mid week with minimal people so it was good.

Everywhere else was direction arrow one way. That said I did hear of a guy who crashed hard on a track out in the woods because some doofus's entered the track on sxs's and ran it backwards...Can't help stupid.
That's not true. Multiple times on one way trails I was surprised by a couple goofs in SxS's hauling ass around a corner towards me, going the wrong direction. If trails are marked one way nobody abides by those rules.

The exposed culvert pipe is inexcusable. Leaving hazards like that then pointing back to the waiver makes zero sense. Fix the obvious dangerous shit, AND point back to the waiver. Do both and you won't be open to this type of bs in the future.

A few folks give Ricky a hard time at SnD for being so strict, but damn, he is protecting his investment and making sure there ARE no incidents, while also making people sign a waiver. Its not wrong to do both.

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ChaseW
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1/5/2022 11:28am
That's not true. Multiple times on one way trails I was surprised by a couple goofs in SxS's hauling ass around a corner towards me, going...
That's not true. Multiple times on one way trails I was surprised by a couple goofs in SxS's hauling ass around a corner towards me, going the wrong direction. If trails are marked one way nobody abides by those rules.

The exposed culvert pipe is inexcusable. Leaving hazards like that then pointing back to the waiver makes zero sense. Fix the obvious dangerous shit, AND point back to the waiver. Do both and you won't be open to this type of bs in the future.

A few folks give Ricky a hard time at SnD for being so strict, but damn, he is protecting his investment and making sure there ARE no incidents, while also making people sign a waiver. Its not wrong to do both.

I think the SxS's were a huge detriment to the safety of DT. Pretty much anyone can hop in one of those and drive off. They're seen as more approachable than ATVs and a hell of a lot more approachable than dirtbikes. That really opened the park up to idiots who had no respect for the safety and wellbeing of others since they were in 2-ton golf carts with a roll cage.

Places like that need to be strict too, if someone goes the wrong way down a one-way, especially in a SxS they will kill a bike rider going the correct way. Especially with the speed you can carry down those trails and the sheer amount of blind corners. I just don't know how you can feasibly enforce that much acreage without constant surveillance or a staff member at every junction. A lot of places like that have to work on the honor system.

I never found the trails there to be poorly marked if you're going the right way. Granted, I never went the wrong way so I can't vouch for how obvious the signage was for people who were going the wrong way.

Regarding the culvert and whatever happened to the guy off Bomber that got killed I have to emphasize that there was definitely negligence in the actual safety of the place regardless of how respectful and conscientious the other riders were.
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Moto829CP
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1/6/2022 5:59am
Made a account just because of my love for Durhamtown. My family has been going to DT for over 10 years and its always a great time. When I found out about its sudden closing tuesday I was heart broken. After reading all I can find about its sudden closing I am disgusted with all of the bashing that DT is receiving. Place was awesome, I hope it comes back soon......
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DoctorJD
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1/6/2022 6:10am
Moto829CP wrote:
Made a account just because of my love for Durhamtown. My family has been going to DT for over 10 years and its always a great...
Made a account just because of my love for Durhamtown. My family has been going to DT for over 10 years and its always a great time. When I found out about its sudden closing tuesday I was heart broken. After reading all I can find about its sudden closing I am disgusted with all of the bashing that DT is receiving. Place was awesome, I hope it comes back soon......
Why be disgusted? Tell me anything that was said about DT that wasn't true/accurate.
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kijen
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1/6/2022 6:25am
Moto829CP wrote:
Made a account just because of my love for Durhamtown. My family has been going to DT for over 10 years and its always a great...
Made a account just because of my love for Durhamtown. My family has been going to DT for over 10 years and its always a great time. When I found out about its sudden closing tuesday I was heart broken. After reading all I can find about its sudden closing I am disgusted with all of the bashing that DT is receiving. Place was awesome, I hope it comes back soon......
DoctorJD wrote:
Why be disgusted? Tell me anything that was said about DT that wasn't true/accurate.
Every track i ride at had someone die, none of the tracks have flaggers on practice day etc....only been to DT 3 times in the last 10 years, and seems other than the fact 100's of people riding off road vehicles, seemed as safe as any other place I ride.
Rode Lucerne, apple valley, el mirage etc...as a kid and plenty of people goy hurt or died too. Only difference is public vs private property. To be honest the riders/drivers themselves are the issue, imo not a specific facility, within reason of course.
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Moto829CP
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1/6/2022 6:32am
How could I not be. The place was amazing. Was it perfect? No. That is not possible to make everyone happy, we all have different ability's and things we prefer over someone else. That being said I have personally been involved with running a local track and what was a dream became a terrible nightmare. Non stop complaining no matter how much effort or time was put in, and that 1 track doesn't even come close to the amount of land/tracks dtown had to maintain and upkeep.
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Ramrod
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1/6/2022 8:14am
Moto829CP wrote:
How could I not be. The place was amazing. Was it perfect? No. That is not possible to make everyone happy, we all have different ability's...
How could I not be. The place was amazing. Was it perfect? No. That is not possible to make everyone happy, we all have different ability's and things we prefer over someone else. That being said I have personally been involved with running a local track and what was a dream became a terrible nightmare. Non stop complaining no matter how much effort or time was put in, and that 1 track doesn't even come close to the amount of land/tracks dtown had to maintain and upkeep.
You are spot on and totally get it. I agree with you.
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bh
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1/6/2022 8:34am
There are other places that have a motocross lawsuit looming over their heads
gtr? If that's what you're referring to that gentleman deserves every penny that will be coming his way. Hopefully the track too, maybe he can run the place to its full potential.
1/6/2022 9:10am
wwoberg wrote:
We use to make 2 trips a year there. Redneck heaven. It wasn't a place for city folk. Stop going as it got rougher and rougher.
After experiencing the regular weekend free-for-alls there years ago, I decided to limit my visits to weekdays when it's much less crowded. My last ride there was two days before Christmas ('21), and even then -- not particularly crowded -- there were people ripping up the parking lots and idle-speed lanes in ATVs and SxS. But the most concerning behavior was riders going the wrong way on single-direction trails. When I finally came across an employee and let him know about a group of four riders who decided to turn around and head back to the trailhead, he told me he was the lone person monitoring the trails that day and there was little he could do alone. In the past, I've expressed my concerns about wrong-way riders to people at the check-in desk, but got blank stares in response.
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Ramrod
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1/6/2022 10:04am
After experiencing the regular weekend free-for-alls there years ago, I decided to limit my visits to weekdays when it's much less crowded. My last ride there...
After experiencing the regular weekend free-for-alls there years ago, I decided to limit my visits to weekdays when it's much less crowded. My last ride there was two days before Christmas ('21), and even then -- not particularly crowded -- there were people ripping up the parking lots and idle-speed lanes in ATVs and SxS. But the most concerning behavior was riders going the wrong way on single-direction trails. When I finally came across an employee and let him know about a group of four riders who decided to turn around and head back to the trailhead, he told me he was the lone person monitoring the trails that day and there was little he could do alone. In the past, I've expressed my concerns about wrong-way riders to people at the check-in desk, but got blank stares in response.
Perhaps those riding backwards on a single direction trail should have to pass an IQ test above 70 before getting a wrist band to ride. Frustrating I imagine. Hard to police everything at a place that big cost effectively.

A couple of us got ripped on once by the owner for taking a shortcut jaunt on the road to get over to the Mike's place house where we were staying. He was right to rip us. He said "Can't you read the signs! If there weren't signs to follow there would be chaos!" We all do dumb stuff occasionally I guess.
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DoctorJD
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1/6/2022 10:08am
Moto829CP wrote:
How could I not be. The place was amazing. Was it perfect? No. That is not possible to make everyone happy, we all have different ability's...
How could I not be. The place was amazing. Was it perfect? No. That is not possible to make everyone happy, we all have different ability's and things we prefer over someone else. That being said I have personally been involved with running a local track and what was a dream became a terrible nightmare. Non stop complaining no matter how much effort or time was put in, and that 1 track doesn't even come close to the amount of land/tracks dtown had to maintain and upkeep.
I live less than an hour from DT (40 minutes to be exact) and rode there very frequently from 2004-2016. My son did his first laps on his JR50 on the peewee track and then went on to be a total ripper on his 250 on the Bomber. We had an absolute blast out there with all of our riding buddies. That being said, I saw the "experience" at DT degrade as the years went on. It became the riding facility equivalent of Wal-Mart.

The conditions of the tracks (except the Bomber) was suspect almost every time I rode there in the latter years. Then there was the proliferation of quads, and that was soon matched by an even worse scourge: SxSs. I don't know a single person who didn't have a quad/SxS near-death experience out there. If you haven't, consider yourself lucky.

I hate it that DT is no longer going to be an option for fellow dirt riders. It's a shame. They had a kick ass formula that simply wasn't destined to remain successful...for a litany of reasons. Yes, it started out as "amazing" but the experience in the last few years was from from it. Sorry, just my opinion.





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Moto829CP
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1/6/2022 10:24am
Moto829CP wrote:
How could I not be. The place was amazing. Was it perfect? No. That is not possible to make everyone happy, we all have different ability's...
How could I not be. The place was amazing. Was it perfect? No. That is not possible to make everyone happy, we all have different ability's and things we prefer over someone else. That being said I have personally been involved with running a local track and what was a dream became a terrible nightmare. Non stop complaining no matter how much effort or time was put in, and that 1 track doesn't even come close to the amount of land/tracks dtown had to maintain and upkeep.
DoctorJD wrote:
I live less than an hour from DT (40 minutes to be exact) and rode there very frequently from 2004-2016. My son did his first laps...
I live less than an hour from DT (40 minutes to be exact) and rode there very frequently from 2004-2016. My son did his first laps on his JR50 on the peewee track and then went on to be a total ripper on his 250 on the Bomber. We had an absolute blast out there with all of our riding buddies. That being said, I saw the "experience" at DT degrade as the years went on. It became the riding facility equivalent of Wal-Mart.

The conditions of the tracks (except the Bomber) was suspect almost every time I rode there in the latter years. Then there was the proliferation of quads, and that was soon matched by an even worse scourge: SxSs. I don't know a single person who didn't have a quad/SxS near-death experience out there. If you haven't, consider yourself lucky.

I hate it that DT is no longer going to be an option for fellow dirt riders. It's a shame. They had a kick ass formula that simply wasn't destined to remain successful...for a litany of reasons. Yes, it started out as "amazing" but the experience in the last few years was from from it. Sorry, just my opinion.





That's your opinion and you can obviously have it, I however disagree. That to me is what separated dtown from every other place, if a track was to knarly that day just move on to the next. That simple. And yes of course I had my run ins with sxs/quadtards but I would simply stop them if they were going backwards on a trail or a track and tell them what they were doing wrong. Almost all of them said sorry they didn't see any signs and would do the right thing.
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Hammer 663s
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1/6/2022 10:36am
Moto829CP wrote:
How could I not be. The place was amazing. Was it perfect? No. That is not possible to make everyone happy, we all have different ability's...
How could I not be. The place was amazing. Was it perfect? No. That is not possible to make everyone happy, we all have different ability's and things we prefer over someone else. That being said I have personally been involved with running a local track and what was a dream became a terrible nightmare. Non stop complaining no matter how much effort or time was put in, and that 1 track doesn't even come close to the amount of land/tracks dtown had to maintain and upkeep.
DoctorJD wrote:
I live less than an hour from DT (40 minutes to be exact) and rode there very frequently from 2004-2016. My son did his first laps...
I live less than an hour from DT (40 minutes to be exact) and rode there very frequently from 2004-2016. My son did his first laps on his JR50 on the peewee track and then went on to be a total ripper on his 250 on the Bomber. We had an absolute blast out there with all of our riding buddies. That being said, I saw the "experience" at DT degrade as the years went on. It became the riding facility equivalent of Wal-Mart.

The conditions of the tracks (except the Bomber) was suspect almost every time I rode there in the latter years. Then there was the proliferation of quads, and that was soon matched by an even worse scourge: SxSs. I don't know a single person who didn't have a quad/SxS near-death experience out there. If you haven't, consider yourself lucky.

I hate it that DT is no longer going to be an option for fellow dirt riders. It's a shame. They had a kick ass formula that simply wasn't destined to remain successful...for a litany of reasons. Yes, it started out as "amazing" but the experience in the last few years was from from it. Sorry, just my opinion.





Moto829CP wrote:
That's your opinion and you can obviously have it, I however disagree. That to me is what separated dtown from every other place, if a track...
That's your opinion and you can obviously have it, I however disagree. That to me is what separated dtown from every other place, if a track was to knarly that day just move on to the next. That simple. And yes of course I had my run ins with sxs/quadtards but I would simply stop them if they were going backwards on a trail or a track and tell them what they were doing wrong. Almost all of them said sorry they didn't see any signs and would do the right thing.
Did you ride there with your kids? Would you? No f-ing way I'd take my boys to a place w/o sufficient safely standards. Sport is dangerous enough w/o a bunch of backwoods clowns on SxS running around. Sounds like DT got away from the mgmt and became dangerous.

It's exactly why we don't ride the Dunes or Browns Camp or certain PNW tracks. Poor or no management leads to chaos out there, and people die as a result.

Mike
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Moto829CP
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1/6/2022 10:52am
DoctorJD wrote:
I live less than an hour from DT (40 minutes to be exact) and rode there very frequently from 2004-2016. My son did his first laps...
I live less than an hour from DT (40 minutes to be exact) and rode there very frequently from 2004-2016. My son did his first laps on his JR50 on the peewee track and then went on to be a total ripper on his 250 on the Bomber. We had an absolute blast out there with all of our riding buddies. That being said, I saw the "experience" at DT degrade as the years went on. It became the riding facility equivalent of Wal-Mart.

The conditions of the tracks (except the Bomber) was suspect almost every time I rode there in the latter years. Then there was the proliferation of quads, and that was soon matched by an even worse scourge: SxSs. I don't know a single person who didn't have a quad/SxS near-death experience out there. If you haven't, consider yourself lucky.

I hate it that DT is no longer going to be an option for fellow dirt riders. It's a shame. They had a kick ass formula that simply wasn't destined to remain successful...for a litany of reasons. Yes, it started out as "amazing" but the experience in the last few years was from from it. Sorry, just my opinion.





Moto829CP wrote:
That's your opinion and you can obviously have it, I however disagree. That to me is what separated dtown from every other place, if a track...
That's your opinion and you can obviously have it, I however disagree. That to me is what separated dtown from every other place, if a track was to knarly that day just move on to the next. That simple. And yes of course I had my run ins with sxs/quadtards but I would simply stop them if they were going backwards on a trail or a track and tell them what they were doing wrong. Almost all of them said sorry they didn't see any signs and would do the right thing.
Did you ride there with your kids? Would you? No f-ing way I'd take my boys to a place w/o sufficient safely standards. Sport is dangerous...
Did you ride there with your kids? Would you? No f-ing way I'd take my boys to a place w/o sufficient safely standards. Sport is dangerous enough w/o a bunch of backwoods clowns on SxS running around. Sounds like DT got away from the mgmt and became dangerous.

It's exactly why we don't ride the Dunes or Browns Camp or certain PNW tracks. Poor or no management leads to chaos out there, and people die as a result.

Mike
Yes I have rode there with my kid. I understand what your saying and agree with you to a point. But people die as a result of riding alot unfortunately. Being aware of your surroundings and confident in your capabilities and doing the right thing when you see someone doing something wrong helps the situation. See someone going the wrong way, you say something and explain it to them. See someone going way to fast in a slow area you say something if it bothers you that much, its really that simple.
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hollifield
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Woodstock, GA, USA
1/6/2022 12:11pm Edited Date/Time 1/6/2022 12:12pm
My guess is the track closed due to the jury's decision to award the kid $15 million. D-town did not have liability insurance, I know because I was approached to write it, I'm a commercial insurance broker. D-town wasn't insurable due to the claims they had. With the $15 million judgement sitting out there and no insurance policy to backstop the claim the clock was ticking. Ultimately they likely closed to sell off assets and accumulate some money to pay the kid. The kid will never see $15 million. You buy insurance to protect your balance sheet and your assets. They didn't have it...
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