Can I ask a question about European motocross?

JMX82
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JMX82 10/18/2021 10:43pm
10/18/2021 10:43pm
Finnish national classes :

• MX1 (pro) 100-500cc 2t / 175-650cc 4t
• MX2 (pro) 100-250cc 2t /175-250cc 4t
• MXJ (Juniors age 13-20) 100-150cc 2t / 175-250cc 4t
• MXB (amateur) 100-500cc 2t / 175-650cc 4t
• MXV35 (vet over 35) 100-500cc 2t / 175-650cc 4t
• MXV45 (vet over 45) 100-500cc 2t / 175-650cc 4t
• MXV55 (vet over 55) 100-500cc 2t / 175-650cc 4t
• MX125 100-125cc 2t
• MXC/C (beginner) 70-85cc 2t /150cc 4t
• MXC/B (amateur) 70-85cc 2t /150cc 4t
• MXC/A (pro) 70-85cc 2t / 150cc 4
• MX65 50-65cc 2t
• MX50 40-50cc 2t / electric
• MXD (women) 100-500cc 2t / 175-650cc 4t
• MXSV (sidecars)
• MXQUAD 200-750cc
• MXQUAD V35 (vet over 35) 200-750cc
• MXH (beginner) 100-500cc 2t / 175-650cc 4t
• TOP250 100-500cc 2t / 175-650cc 4t

In local club races we run only three classes:

Juniors 50-85cc 2t / 150cc 4
Open amateur 100-500cc 2t / 175-650cc 4t
Open pro 100-500cc 2t / 175-650cc 4t




1
Kawasaki-rider 10/18/2021 11:16pm
10/18/2021 11:16pm Edited Date/Time 10/18/2021 11:17pm
Boira wrote:
in Spain, at the Aragon World Championship Grinning
MX-65cc, MX-85cc, MX-1, MX-2, Master-30, Master-40, MX Sub-18, Master-50
long but nice day
What corner at what track?😂



Grovesy98
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Grovesy98 10/18/2021 11:42pm
10/18/2021 11:42pm
JB 19 wrote:
So when you guys are saying 50, 65, 85 you mean 1 class per size bike? Like 3 classes total right? ......which is how it was...
So when you guys are saying 50, 65, 85 you mean 1 class per size bike? Like 3 classes total right? ......which is how it was when I grew up racing in the US, except we had 80 JR (7-11 years old) and 80 Senior (12-15 years old) 60cc was just 7-11 years old. I feel like this made kids faster because you were almost always racing kids older than you. As a 12 year old it was like jumping cold water racing 14 and 15 year olds.

I hear these kids now talk about how they hardly race because there is no competition. In the 80's and 90's there was nearly always someone faster to race.

I think the US is completely out of control with all the classes.
Yeh one class per bike size, not split up for age or ability. My kid did his first season racing this year, started at 7 on a 65, and is racing against 11 year olds that are faster than some adults haha. His races typically have around 30 riders that range from super fast to complete beginners
Grovesy98
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Grovesy98 10/18/2021 11:47pm
10/18/2021 11:47pm
Grovesy98 wrote:
My local club in the UK is Autos 65s 85s (normally small and big wheels together but scored separately) Rookies (14 - 16) MX2 MX1 Vets...
My local club in the UK is

Autos
65s
85s (normally small and big wheels together but scored separately)
Rookies (14 - 16)
MX2
MX1
Vets

7 classes, each having a 2 lap practice and 3x 14 to 17min races. Practice is usually 9:30am and day finishes around 4:30pm.

I watch a few vlogs like Vlogepicness and see how many classes you guys have in the US and I'm shocked! Also not many in each race and short races?
queen of spodes wrote:
Do adult ladies run with the guys or are there sometimes separate classes?
Depends which club. Some clubs have separate ladies championships, but are usually out on track with another class. There's quite a few girls in my lads 65 class, and they aren't scored separately
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Slay896
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Slay896 10/19/2021 12:20am
10/19/2021 12:20am
In Spain we have
65cc
85cc
125cc
Under 18 years old 125-250cc (2stroke and 4stroke)
Mx2 (elite) 250cc (2-4 stroke) under 23 years old
Mx1 (elite) 450cc
Mx3 more than 35 years old
Mx4 more than 40 years old
65cc, under 18, mx3 and mx4 they race on different venues and diferent championship than the other categories
_barty_
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_barty_ 10/19/2021 12:55am
10/19/2021 12:55am
I'm sure it's common in other areas / countries too, but we (in the UK) also have youth clubs / adult clubs that assists with increasing saddle time(s).

Adult clubs for example may run Practice, Qualifying and then 3 x blocks of races with there being Adult A, B, C, D and then a two stroke-under / over class.

Youth I assume is similar (excluding Adult classes).
POWLEY256
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POWLEY256 10/19/2021 1:01am
10/19/2021 1:01am
My local area runs an adult series which is 16yrs+
They run, expert/pro 20mins+ 1lap then A,B,C,D classes at 15mins +1lap.
All groups get a 15min practice/qualifying session to determine class.

Other clubs that run youth is normally 50,65,85sw,85bw (somtimes mixed if theres not full gates) youth125/250 then adult a & b

Thats in the uk.
Mega Racing 10/19/2021 1:08am
10/19/2021 1:08am
Pre covid,
In northern Ireland for club days its
50s
65s
85 BW & SW scored seperate
Senior 125 & 250 scored seperate
Grade A
Grade B
Grade C

For adult national Champ days its
Grade A mx1 & mx2 scored seperate
Grade B Mx1 & mx2 scored seperate
Grade C Mx1
Grade C mx2
Vets (over 40)
Non qualifiers race if required

Youth national championship
50s
65s
85 BW & SW scored seperate
Senior 125 & 250 scored seperate
Grade B&C non championship support race. 40 riders
36Wheeler 10/19/2021 2:13am
10/19/2021 2:13am
At Hampshire MX we have 85s, A, B, C groups, and vets
1x 10 min practice and then 3x 20 min races.
Its not bad but I still prefer open practice tracks with no sessions where I can get around 2 hours riding time in.
1
luke11
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luke11 10/19/2021 2:49am
10/19/2021 2:49am
luke11 wrote:
50,65,85sw,85bw,senior/125,adultB,adultA,vets (plus35+)

Give or take a class or two. This is pretty much standard in U.K. for most events
queen of spodes wrote:
What is adult A and adult B?
Adults so over 18? And A and B are classes, faster riders in A. If you sandbag in B you will get moved up.
And it’s literally 125+ cc

Some clubs do mx1 and mx2 instead but more and more it’s mixed engine size and just A and B depending on your ability/speed regardless of bike.
chump6784
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chump6784 10/19/2021 2:54am
10/19/2021 2:54am
So the US promoters run so many classes to add gate fees but how many riders don't turn up because of the multiple classes? It would be interesting to see a US promoter put on a race day or 2 with the schedules posted here. When riders see and hear about the condensed schedule with more track time i wonder how that would affect the earnings for the weekend
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Boira
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Boira 10/19/2021 3:28am
10/19/2021 3:28am Edited Date/Time 10/19/2021 3:28am
Boira wrote:
in Spain, at the Aragon World Championship Grinning
MX-65cc, MX-85cc, MX-1, MX-2, Master-30, Master-40, MX Sub-18, Master-50
long but nice day
Kawasaki-rider wrote:
What corner at what track?😂 [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2021/10/18/514988/s1200_FB_IMG_1456661131132.jpg[/img]
What corner at what track?😂



from the grave to the track Smile
Quinto de Ebro
Grovesy98
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Grovesy98 10/19/2021 3:28am
10/19/2021 3:28am
How many riders does a typical local meeting in the US have on the day? Our club in UK has around 150, some days more and some less
Kawasaki-rider 10/19/2021 3:36am
10/19/2021 3:36am
Boira wrote:
in Spain, at the Aragon World Championship Grinning
MX-65cc, MX-85cc, MX-1, MX-2, Master-30, Master-40, MX Sub-18, Master-50
long but nice day
Kawasaki-rider wrote:
What corner at what track?😂 [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2021/10/18/514988/s1200_FB_IMG_1456661131132.jpg[/img]
What corner at what track?😂



Boira wrote:
from the grave to the track Smile
Quinto de Ebro
No, aragon motorland, left right before start straight 😁
1
Boira
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Boira 10/19/2021 4:46am
10/19/2021 4:46am
Kawasaki-rider wrote:
What corner at what track?😂 [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2021/10/18/514988/s1200_FB_IMG_1456661131132.jpg[/img]
What corner at what track?😂



Boira wrote:
from the grave to the track Smile
Quinto de Ebro
Kawasaki-rider wrote:
No, aragon motorland, left right before start straight 😁

are you the one in the picture?

Kawasaki-rider 10/19/2021 4:50am
10/19/2021 4:50am
Boira wrote:
from the grave to the track Smile
Quinto de Ebro
Kawasaki-rider wrote:
No, aragon motorland, left right before start straight 😁
Boira wrote:
[img]https://m.supergeek.cl/noticias/site/artic/20200609/imag/foto_0000000220200609105007/PICARD_FACEPALM_PRINCIPAL.jpg[/img] are you the one in the picture?

are you the one in the picture?

Si! It is 🙃


Sorry for offtopic!
1
Mucktub
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Mucktub 10/19/2021 4:50am
10/19/2021 4:50am
Are organizers/promoters in the US running these races like a business? In respect of are they taking a wage for themselves out of what is earnt?

I think in the UK the local clubs aren't in it to make money for the individuals running the event but more keeping the club afloat and able to run a "professional" meeting with any costs covered. The word promoter suggests to me that they are in it to make money.

There isn't big purse money given out to the winning riders at the local events and generally only the fastest class receives money.
1
Muscle-Milk-KTM 10/19/2021 4:54am
10/19/2021 4:54am
luke11 wrote:
Adults so over 18? And A and B are classes, faster riders in A. If you sandbag in B you will get moved up. And it’s...
Adults so over 18? And A and B are classes, faster riders in A. If you sandbag in B you will get moved up.
And it’s literally 125+ cc

Some clubs do mx1 and mx2 instead but more and more it’s mixed engine size and just A and B depending on your ability/speed regardless of bike.
You can race adults at 15 in the UK. Sandbagging in the South Eastern region is rife, especially at Sidcup & DMCC. People will sandbag practice then go win the D group by a mile. You can see their laps times for the race & they’ll be as fast as the top 10 in B’s.

The Vet race is a joke now. It’s 35 & over but now it’s full of experts who don’t wanna eat shit for 20 minutes in their class. Vets should be over 40’s no experts .
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mxdoctor
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mxdoctor 10/19/2021 4:55am
10/19/2021 4:55am
Most regional series in GERMANY have following classes:
50, 65, 85, MX2 juniors (-18y), MX2 (>18y), MX1 (>18y), Vet >35y (sometimes >40y), Vet >45y (sometimes >50y), women and hobby. Most of the time (before Covid) 2-day (weekend) events, sometimes combimed with special 2-stroke only classes or Classic, Twinshock MX or sidecar, Quad classes.
Highest racing series is ADAC MX Masters with 85, 125 2str, Youngster (250cc 2str and 4str) and Masters (MX1) class, since this year three races per event/weekend.
Richy
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Richy 10/19/2021 5:13am
10/19/2021 5:13am
36Wheeler wrote:
At Hampshire MX we have 85s, A, B, C groups, and vets 1x 10 min practice and then 3x 20 min races. Its not bad but...
At Hampshire MX we have 85s, A, B, C groups, and vets
1x 10 min practice and then 3x 20 min races.
Its not bad but I still prefer open practice tracks with no sessions where I can get around 2 hours riding time in.
How do you like the Hampshire MX deal? Looks pretty good fun and well run. If I ever pull my finger out and get in shape, and remember how to ride a bike, I'd be keen to get along to a few.
Mucktub
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Mucktub 10/19/2021 5:19am
10/19/2021 5:19am
luke11 wrote:
Adults so over 18? And A and B are classes, faster riders in A. If you sandbag in B you will get moved up. And it’s...
Adults so over 18? And A and B are classes, faster riders in A. If you sandbag in B you will get moved up.
And it’s literally 125+ cc

Some clubs do mx1 and mx2 instead but more and more it’s mixed engine size and just A and B depending on your ability/speed regardless of bike.
Muscle-Milk-KTM wrote:
You can race adults at 15 in the UK. Sandbagging in the South Eastern region is rife, especially at Sidcup & DMCC. People will sandbag practice...
You can race adults at 15 in the UK. Sandbagging in the South Eastern region is rife, especially at Sidcup & DMCC. People will sandbag practice then go win the D group by a mile. You can see their laps times for the race & they’ll be as fast as the top 10 in B’s.

The Vet race is a joke now. It’s 35 & over but now it’s full of experts who don’t wanna eat shit for 20 minutes in their class. Vets should be over 40’s no experts .
Completely agree about the Vets, should be over 40 really IMO.

I don't know what can be done about the sandbaggers, even though we're from Yorkshire we raced many club races at Canada Heights back in the day, I always gave it my all in qualifying as too a certain degree I'd rather be in the better class.

They used to do a qualifying race at Nantwich club, odd and even numbers had separate qualifying races after practice, then 3 A and B class races in the afternoon. I miss those days and the Hatherton Hall GP track, adult only meetings Exp, A, B and C class all with 3 20min motos, not including the qualifying race to sort out the A and B's.

Quality meetings.

1
Mucktub
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Mucktub 10/19/2021 5:21am
10/19/2021 5:21am
36Wheeler wrote:
At Hampshire MX we have 85s, A, B, C groups, and vets 1x 10 min practice and then 3x 20 min races. Its not bad but...
At Hampshire MX we have 85s, A, B, C groups, and vets
1x 10 min practice and then 3x 20 min races.
Its not bad but I still prefer open practice tracks with no sessions where I can get around 2 hours riding time in.
Richy wrote:
How do you like the Hampshire MX deal? Looks pretty good fun and well run. If I ever pull my finger out and get in shape...
How do you like the Hampshire MX deal? Looks pretty good fun and well run. If I ever pull my finger out and get in shape, and remember how to ride a bike, I'd be keen to get along to a few.
Which license is Hampshire MX run under?
Muscle-Milk-KTM 10/19/2021 5:22am
10/19/2021 5:22am
Mucktub wrote:
Completely agree about the Vets, should be over 40 really IMO. I don't know what can be done about the sandbaggers, even though we're from Yorkshire...
Completely agree about the Vets, should be over 40 really IMO.

I don't know what can be done about the sandbaggers, even though we're from Yorkshire we raced many club races at Canada Heights back in the day, I always gave it my all in qualifying as too a certain degree I'd rather be in the better class.

They used to do a qualifying race at Nantwich club, odd and even numbers had separate qualifying races after practice, then 3 A and B class races in the afternoon. I miss those days and the Hatherton Hall GP track, adult only meetings Exp, A, B and C class all with 3 20min motos, not including the qualifying race to sort out the A and B's.

Quality meetings.

Wow Kent is a long way away for a club meeting. Did you ever race the National/International that East Kent used to run in the 90’s at Canada Heights, quality event?
Mucktub
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Mucktub 10/19/2021 5:34am
10/19/2021 5:34am
We sometimes did it in the day, setting off at 5am, there for around 8-8.30. You have to remember there were no speed cameras and hardly any traffic on the roads on a Sunday morning, so it was a long day but Canada Heights in the 90's-00's was a class track.

Used to race the Lancashire grand national meeting, always had 20+ top pro GP and Brit champs riders like Herring, Malin, Nunn, Paul Cooper to name a few depending on how the it fell in the calender.
1
queen of spodes 10/19/2021 6:50am
10/19/2021 6:50am
Mucktub wrote:
Are organizers/promoters in the US running these races like a business? In respect of are they taking a wage for themselves out of what is earnt...
Are organizers/promoters in the US running these races like a business? In respect of are they taking a wage for themselves out of what is earnt?

I think in the UK the local clubs aren't in it to make money for the individuals running the event but more keeping the club afloat and able to run a "professional" meeting with any costs covered. The word promoter suggests to me that they are in it to make money.

There isn't big purse money given out to the winning riders at the local events and generally only the fastest class receives money.
Literally everything in the US is done to make as much money as possible.
2
luke11
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luke11 10/19/2021 7:07am
10/19/2021 7:07am Edited Date/Time 10/19/2021 7:07am
Mucktub wrote:
Are organizers/promoters in the US running these races like a business? In respect of are they taking a wage for themselves out of what is earnt...
Are organizers/promoters in the US running these races like a business? In respect of are they taking a wage for themselves out of what is earnt?

I think in the UK the local clubs aren't in it to make money for the individuals running the event but more keeping the club afloat and able to run a "professional" meeting with any costs covered. The word promoter suggests to me that they are in it to make money.

There isn't big purse money given out to the winning riders at the local events and generally only the fastest class receives money.
queen of spodes wrote:
Literally everything in the US is done to make as much money as possible.
Thing is that would never work in the U.K. Americans have a lot more expendable income than we do (I used to live in texas)
So whereas you may pay to enter multiple classes and pay hundreds of dollars, the average British rider full stop won’t pay more than they already are.
Recently a popular practise track Preston docks tried to re-open with a new pricing around double the going rate and it got serious backlash online and hasn’t re-opened as a result.
Hammer 663s
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Hammer 663s 10/19/2021 9:34am
10/19/2021 9:34am Edited Date/Time 10/19/2021 9:41am
Here's some pricing posted today for a Norcal race this weekend.

Practice - $30
Weekend Gate fee - $25
Per class - $50
Transponder rental - $15

So, 2 riders, 2 classes for Friday practice and 2 days of racing = $640 if you need transponder rentals.

Hard to tell from the flyer if the per class fee covers Saturday AND Sunday or just per day. Take off $200 if it's all weekend, which I doubt. Camping is free at this one at least. I bet there will be more than 25 classes too.

This is why we are turning into practice queens. I can't drop $750 2x a month on racing for $10 trophies and "glory".
2
kary
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kary 10/19/2021 9:35am
10/19/2021 9:35am
Here in France, in my Regional series (which is pretty much the same all around France) :

50cc
65cc
85cc
125cc
Open class (MX1 + MX2)
Vets (+40)

And that's it ! It's also pretty rare that you've got all these classes the same day !
For the big bikes classes there is 3 * 20 mins + 1 lap motos (+ 20 mins of qualifying practices in the morning)
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Motogoof
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Motogoof 10/19/2021 9:55am
10/19/2021 9:55am
Ontario Canada
With a few of the clubs closed this summer due to Covid the one remaining club that was running had huge turn outs. Lots of classes and made for long days but at least the gates were full.
queen of spodes 10/19/2021 9:56am
10/19/2021 9:56am
luke11 wrote:
Thing is that would never work in the U.K. Americans have a lot more expendable income than we do (I used to live in texas) So...
Thing is that would never work in the U.K. Americans have a lot more expendable income than we do (I used to live in texas)
So whereas you may pay to enter multiple classes and pay hundreds of dollars, the average British rider full stop won’t pay more than they already are.
Recently a popular practise track Preston docks tried to re-open with a new pricing around double the going rate and it got serious backlash online and hasn’t re-opened as a result.
That's where you are partly mistaken. A shrinking percent of Americans have increasing amounts of disposable income. The rest of us work our assess off and barely get by due to increasing rents, property taxes, and perma-flation seems to be setting in.
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