Washougal National - Main Races Bench Racing

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7/24/2021 6:56pm
The Roczen slide has officially begun. Damn. Have to give credit to Tomac, he always makes Washougal exciting. But big props to Ferrandis for that moto...
The Roczen slide has officially begun. Damn.

Have to give credit to Tomac, he always makes Washougal exciting. But big props to Ferrandis for that moto win and props to Sexton for the overall. Good stuff.
-MAVERICK- wrote:
I honestly don't know what to think with Roczen. I'm thinking the effects of the crash last weekend are taking its toll, but on the other...
I honestly don't know what to think with Roczen.

I'm thinking the effects of the crash last weekend are taking its toll, but on the other hand how do you explain winning moto 2 last weekend?
the Ferrandis championship celebration train left the Spring Creek station without Roczen while he was still celebrating his 2. Moto win
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Ranman68
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7/24/2021 7:44pm Edited Date/Time 7/24/2021 7:48pm
That charge by Tomac was epic. The speed that guy can unleash when he wants to is mind blowing. Wow. The consistent grit and "almost Tomac in beast mode" speed that Ferdandis brings every single week is mind blowing. The combination of consistent speed and precision riding by Sexton today that earned him the overall victory over Tomac and Ferrandis was mind blowing. Three straight gangsters doing gangster shit today. Each of them getting the better of the other two at some point today between the two motos. Thats as good as racing can get. Awesome action today in both classes.
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prozach
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Eureka, CA, USA
7/24/2021 7:59pm
If only tomac didn't start 7-10 every moto. He is crazy consistent at starting in that range every single moto.
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motomike137
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Fenton, MI, USA
7/24/2021 8:54pm
You do understand that Roczen and Sexton are on different setups and that rider preference is different, right?
You do understand who's responsible for Kenny's bike setup correct?

The Shop

7/24/2021 10:02pm Edited Date/Time 7/24/2021 10:03pm
Agreed Mav. I don't know how he wins moto 2 at Millville but then drops a 6-10 egg today. He better not start complaining about his...
Agreed Mav. I don't know how he wins moto 2 at Millville but then drops a 6-10 egg today. He better not start complaining about his bike setup when Sexton won the overall.

I'd really just like Ken to win a series post-A2 2017. I think if he could win one championship the door might open to a few more. I'm not doubting his physical challenges, but his head is also part of the problem.
You do understand that Roczen and Sexton are on different setups and that rider preference is different, right?
-MAVERICK- wrote:
They're on different set-ups, yes, but to Bacon's point, Kenny can't exactly blame his setup after qualifying 3rd fastest. The bike looked pretty good. Simply put...
They're on different set-ups, yes, but to Bacon's point, Kenny can't exactly blame his setup after qualifying 3rd fastest. The bike looked pretty good.

Simply put, he didn't have the speed in the motos.

As to why that was, that's anyone's guess.
Im at a loss with Kenny....he should consistantly be a top 4 rider fighting for wins. These erratic results are a mind f##k.

Good series so far and I'm not gonna count Tomac out, he may be 59 some down but a bad day for Dylan (who is riding so damn solid that it may be unlikely)....and things can tighten up quickly. 5 left and enough points left for Tomac to try make it happen.

But this frenchie aint no snail...he's always up there...
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SilverSpurs
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7/24/2021 10:59pm
Sextons dogged riding in Moto2 to hold off Eli gave Ferrandis the win.
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parkman
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Nashville, TN, USA
7/24/2021 11:03pm
I swear motocross is one of the best sports in the world. I've been watching for nearly 15 years now and I have never seen the competition nor the racing be better.

Ferrandis digs deep man, and hearing his interview after the race, he's also clearly a smart rider, saving his energy for the end like that, well played. And my boy Tomac, ungodly speed. That charge had me on the edge of my seat. Hoping he can get some better starts soon. Sexton, was just as impressive as any though. Dude is so fast and looks so effortless, I think he's gonna be really tough as long as he keeps the bike upright.

Man I love motocross. What a race, what a season so far.
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Sideways
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7/24/2021 11:33pm Edited Date/Time 7/24/2021 11:35pm
Agreed Mav. I don't know how he wins moto 2 at Millville but then drops a 6-10 egg today. He better not start complaining about his...
Agreed Mav. I don't know how he wins moto 2 at Millville but then drops a 6-10 egg today. He better not start complaining about his bike setup when Sexton won the overall.

I'd really just like Ken to win a series post-A2 2017. I think if he could win one championship the door might open to a few more. I'm not doubting his physical challenges, but his head is also part of the problem.
"He better not start complaining about his bike setup when Sexton won the overall."

You mean like sexton has been doing all season when roczen was winning?

Stupid comment...
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7/25/2021 12:04am
Fastest lap of every race

250 race 1

1/ Justin Cooper = 2.14.287
2/ RJ Hampshire = 2.14.700
3/ Pierce Brown = 2.14.775
4/ Michael Mosiman = 2.14.781
5/ Jeremy Martin = 2.14.996
6/ Hunter Lawrence = 2.15.078
7/ Jo Shimoda = 2.15.104
8/ Jett Lawrence = 2.15.132
9/ Carson Mumford = 2.15.339
10/ Max Vohland = 2.15.853

450 race 1

1/ Chase Sexton = 2.13.700
2/ Marvin Musquin = 2.13.789
3/ Dylan Ferrandis = 2.13.791
4/ Eli Tomac = 2.14.205
5/ Ken Roczen = 2.14.303
6/ Cooper Webb = 2.14.848
7/ Justin Barcia = 2.14.914
8/ Joey Savatgy = 2.16.216
9/ Max Anstie = 2.16.355
10/ Christian Craig = 2.16.389

250 race 2

1/ Jett Lawrence = 2.16.139
2/ RJ Hampshire = 2.16.372
3/ Jeremy Martin = 2.16.393
4/ Justin Cooper = 2.16.508
5/ Dilan Schwartz = 2.16.698
6/ Jo Shimoda = 2.16.710
7/ Pierce Brown = 2.16.752
8/ Austin Forkner = 2.16.795
9/ Michael Mosiman = 2.16.871
10/ Hunter Lawrence = 2.16.958

450 race 2

1/ Eli Tomac = 2.13.597
2/ Dylan Ferrandis = 2.14.627
3/ Aaron Plessinger = 2.14.913
4/ Chase Sexton = 2.14.926
5/ Marvin Musquin = 2.15.404
6/ Christian Craig = 2.16.680
7/ Joey Savatgy = 2.16.767
8/ Ken Roczen = 2.16.958
9/ Cooper Webb = 2.17.038
10/ Justin Barcia = 2.17.038
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gregyou
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7/25/2021 12:25am
Fastest lap of every race 250 race 1 1/ Justin Cooper = 2.14.287 2/ RJ Hampshire = 2.14.700 3/ Pierce Brown = 2.14.775 4/ Michael Mosiman...
Fastest lap of every race

250 race 1

1/ Justin Cooper = 2.14.287
2/ RJ Hampshire = 2.14.700
3/ Pierce Brown = 2.14.775
4/ Michael Mosiman = 2.14.781
5/ Jeremy Martin = 2.14.996
6/ Hunter Lawrence = 2.15.078
7/ Jo Shimoda = 2.15.104
8/ Jett Lawrence = 2.15.132
9/ Carson Mumford = 2.15.339
10/ Max Vohland = 2.15.853

450 race 1

1/ Chase Sexton = 2.13.700
2/ Marvin Musquin = 2.13.789
3/ Dylan Ferrandis = 2.13.791
4/ Eli Tomac = 2.14.205
5/ Ken Roczen = 2.14.303
6/ Cooper Webb = 2.14.848
7/ Justin Barcia = 2.14.914
8/ Joey Savatgy = 2.16.216
9/ Max Anstie = 2.16.355
10/ Christian Craig = 2.16.389

250 race 2

1/ Jett Lawrence = 2.16.139
2/ RJ Hampshire = 2.16.372
3/ Jeremy Martin = 2.16.393
4/ Justin Cooper = 2.16.508
5/ Dilan Schwartz = 2.16.698
6/ Jo Shimoda = 2.16.710
7/ Pierce Brown = 2.16.752
8/ Austin Forkner = 2.16.795
9/ Michael Mosiman = 2.16.871
10/ Hunter Lawrence = 2.16.958

450 race 2

1/ Eli Tomac = 2.13.597
2/ Dylan Ferrandis = 2.14.627
3/ Aaron Plessinger = 2.14.913
4/ Chase Sexton = 2.14.926
5/ Marvin Musquin = 2.15.404
6/ Christian Craig = 2.16.680
7/ Joey Savatgy = 2.16.767
8/ Ken Roczen = 2.16.958
9/ Cooper Webb = 2.17.038
10/ Justin Barcia = 2.17.038
How does tomac set the fastest lap of the day second last lap of moto 2
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kongols
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Riga, LV
7/25/2021 12:33am
Sextons dogged riding in Moto2 to hold off Eli gave Ferrandis the win.
No, it gave Sexton overall win.
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7/25/2021 2:24am
The Roczen slide has officially begun. Damn. Have to give credit to Tomac, he always makes Washougal exciting. But big props to Ferrandis for that moto...
The Roczen slide has officially begun. Damn.

Have to give credit to Tomac, he always makes Washougal exciting. But big props to Ferrandis for that moto win and props to Sexton for the overall. Good stuff.
-MAVERICK- wrote:
I honestly don't know what to think with Roczen. I'm thinking the effects of the crash last weekend are taking its toll, but on the other...
I honestly don't know what to think with Roczen.

I'm thinking the effects of the crash last weekend are taking its toll, but on the other hand how do you explain winning moto 2 last weekend?
Adrenaline?
3
teamddr
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Location
IE
7/25/2021 2:39am
Fastest lap of every race 250 race 1 1/ Justin Cooper = 2.14.287 2/ RJ Hampshire = 2.14.700 3/ Pierce Brown = 2.14.775 4/ Michael Mosiman...
Fastest lap of every race

250 race 1

1/ Justin Cooper = 2.14.287
2/ RJ Hampshire = 2.14.700
3/ Pierce Brown = 2.14.775
4/ Michael Mosiman = 2.14.781
5/ Jeremy Martin = 2.14.996
6/ Hunter Lawrence = 2.15.078
7/ Jo Shimoda = 2.15.104
8/ Jett Lawrence = 2.15.132
9/ Carson Mumford = 2.15.339
10/ Max Vohland = 2.15.853

450 race 1

1/ Chase Sexton = 2.13.700
2/ Marvin Musquin = 2.13.789
3/ Dylan Ferrandis = 2.13.791
4/ Eli Tomac = 2.14.205
5/ Ken Roczen = 2.14.303
6/ Cooper Webb = 2.14.848
7/ Justin Barcia = 2.14.914
8/ Joey Savatgy = 2.16.216
9/ Max Anstie = 2.16.355
10/ Christian Craig = 2.16.389

250 race 2

1/ Jett Lawrence = 2.16.139
2/ RJ Hampshire = 2.16.372
3/ Jeremy Martin = 2.16.393
4/ Justin Cooper = 2.16.508
5/ Dilan Schwartz = 2.16.698
6/ Jo Shimoda = 2.16.710
7/ Pierce Brown = 2.16.752
8/ Austin Forkner = 2.16.795
9/ Michael Mosiman = 2.16.871
10/ Hunter Lawrence = 2.16.958

450 race 2

1/ Eli Tomac = 2.13.597
2/ Dylan Ferrandis = 2.14.627
3/ Aaron Plessinger = 2.14.913
4/ Chase Sexton = 2.14.926
5/ Marvin Musquin = 2.15.404
6/ Christian Craig = 2.16.680
7/ Joey Savatgy = 2.16.767
8/ Ken Roczen = 2.16.958
9/ Cooper Webb = 2.17.038
10/ Justin Barcia = 2.17.038
gregyou wrote:
How does tomac set the fastest lap of the day second last lap of moto 2
He smelled blood in the water and got his head down. DF upped his speed and Eli tried some moves but in doing so made a mistake. Tomac would have had most riders on that last lap but Ferandis has a lot a character. Brilliant entertainment and two fantastic riders.
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CPR
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7/25/2021 3:06am
Janko630 wrote:
Worst track of the season.
For all those who down voted this; can you please say which track has been worse this season so far?
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motomike137
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7/25/2021 4:23am
toroP wrote:
No, there was a battle, and DF won.
Just needed one more lap
toroP wrote:
He was there on the last lap and didn’t get it done. Finished 4 sec back. Another lap would not have helped. He rode great, set...
He was there on the last lap and didn’t get it done.
Finished 4 sec back. Another lap would not have helped. He rode great, set himself up for a last lap pass. Next time.
If he had another lap he may have been more patient once he got to him. Maybe.
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-MAVERICK-
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Ontario, CA
7/25/2021 7:32am
Adrenaline?
Adrenaline after sitting out the entire 1st moto in pain?
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Antonioni
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Engelberg, CH
7/25/2021 9:06am Edited Date/Time 7/25/2021 10:19am
Janko630 wrote:
Worst track of the season.
CPR wrote:
For all those who down voted this; can you please say which track has been worse this season so far?
Don't get me wrong, for me so far (and I don't worry at all for the next three tracks, while for the last two in Cali at the end of the summer…) all the tracks have been great and the vast majority have been crazy amazing (included this Washougal). The less good has been obviously Pala, imo fallowed by Southwick.

To note that Washougal was the "worst track", it lets think that the track was plainly bad, which is note the case at all, fairly. Crazy technical track, with some ballsy sections, just a tad less easy to pass than last few tracks (yes, just a tad… we haven't to be short memory...), but it was still absolutely workable.
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chadder44
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Location
Rochester, NY, USA
7/25/2021 10:06am Edited Date/Time 7/25/2021 10:07am
2nd 250 moto, the top 10 all had a fastest lap in the same second (2:16). Has that ever happened before? Seems impossible.
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kpiper
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Location
USA
7/25/2021 10:24am
teamddr wrote:
He smelled blood in the water and got his head down. DF upped his speed and Eli tried some moves but in doing so made a...
He smelled blood in the water and got his head down. DF upped his speed and Eli tried some moves but in doing so made a mistake. Tomac would have had most riders on that last lap but Ferandis has a lot a character. Brilliant entertainment and two fantastic riders.
Agree that Eli would have passed anyone else. DF is just in crazy good shape and solid. Took too long getting Chase.

Tomac still has the ability to show (at times) incredible speed that no one else can match.

He can't start 7-10th and expect to beat DF when Dylan has the holeshot.

Think how much harder Tomac had to work that second moto compared to DF. Not even comparable.
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Harv379
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7/25/2021 10:31am
I had to re-watch moto 2 this morning and get my Tomac fix. Watching a motorcycle be ridden like that and how he finds passes is just beyond me. The scrub to down hill/out brake Webb pass, the finish jump pass to get by AP, that mind bending berm bouncing to get by Sexton with what 30 seconds to go and then close 3 seconds to DF pushing that bike to it's absolute limits on a track that's risky and extremely tough to push on. To me, Eli is one of the greatest ever and when he's done with Kawi it'll be an ending of something that has kind of made the sport what it is for the past 5 years. I'm a bit nervous to see him on a different color and especially nervous for the days when these rides don't come around anymore because I've never seen anything like it in the 20+ years I've been watching moto. RC/Stew/RV were great in their own way, just as Eli is in his. Everyone likes to pick one GOAT but to me they are un comparable because they're all so unique and great in their own right. I get others can beat him today, but IMO those others can't ride or do things on a motorcycle like he does.
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kpiper
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Location
USA
7/25/2021 10:50am Edited Date/Time 7/25/2021 10:57am
Harv379 wrote:
I had to re-watch moto 2 this morning and get my Tomac fix. Watching a motorcycle be ridden like that and how he finds passes is...
I had to re-watch moto 2 this morning and get my Tomac fix. Watching a motorcycle be ridden like that and how he finds passes is just beyond me. The scrub to down hill/out brake Webb pass, the finish jump pass to get by AP, that mind bending berm bouncing to get by Sexton with what 30 seconds to go and then close 3 seconds to DF pushing that bike to it's absolute limits on a track that's risky and extremely tough to push on. To me, Eli is one of the greatest ever and when he's done with Kawi it'll be an ending of something that has kind of made the sport what it is for the past 5 years. I'm a bit nervous to see him on a different color and especially nervous for the days when these rides don't come around anymore because I've never seen anything like it in the 20+ years I've been watching moto. RC/Stew/RV were great in their own way, just as Eli is in his. Everyone likes to pick one GOAT but to me they are un comparable because they're all so unique and great in their own right. I get others can beat him today, but IMO those others can't ride or do things on a motorcycle like he does.
I agree with you 100%. Eli is truly amazing to watch.

The pass he finally made on Chase was incredible and he almost did the same pass on DF.

It will be boring when he is gone.
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Antonioni
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Engelberg, CH
7/25/2021 12:17pm Edited Date/Time 7/25/2021 12:30pm
kpiper wrote:
Agree that Eli would have passed anyone else. DF is just in crazy good shape and solid. Took too long getting Chase. Tomac still has the...
Agree that Eli would have passed anyone else. DF is just in crazy good shape and solid. Took too long getting Chase.

Tomac still has the ability to show (at times) incredible speed that no one else can match.

He can't start 7-10th and expect to beat DF when Dylan has the holeshot.

Think how much harder Tomac had to work that second moto compared to DF. Not even comparable.
It seems to me that, for this moto2, you (like some others) overestimate a bit the performance of Tomac relatively to the one of Ferrandis.

Tomac start 7th and lap3 he was 4th. Tomac race effort wasn't so much harder than the one of Ferrandis (and at the end he doesn't win, however effectively, he could expect).

Before last lap, Ferrandis wasn't in a completely full-throttle/agression mode.
Among others Ferrandis has already to completely avoid the least over-riding, as long as he has such comfortable gap in front of the championship (Millvillle race2 errors have been a strong reminder). Indeed, I don't doubt at all that during this race2 he was informed that Roczen was far back.

On a bigger picture, the more often it's Ferrandis who comes back with huge charge through the pack. Ferrandis proved already so much that he can really well manage to have to work way more all along motos, than his rivals, week after week (since years). The competition is now (in 450) highter, yet so far he demonstrated that he still can greatly deal with that.

This Washougal race2 remind RedBud race2... With Tomac on front and Ferrandis who comes back.

All in all, on a pure race speed wise, at this point of the season, Tomac has maybe a tad the upper hand on Ferrandis, but it's so much tight (more than some seem to think).
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7/25/2021 1:47pm
-MAVERICK- wrote:
Adrenaline after sitting out the entire 1st moto in pain?
Sounds like he was completely winded and thought he had broken ribs, probably a better idea to get that checked. The adrenaline would have carried him to the start of the second moto where he probably got a bit more out of the gate. Swelling still wouldn't have set in fully by then. I reckon there's a reasonable chance he felt stiffer and sorer this week.
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kongols
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7/25/2021 2:01pm Edited Date/Time 7/25/2021 2:02pm
-MAVERICK- wrote:
Adrenaline after sitting out the entire 1st moto in pain?
Sounds like he was completely winded and thought he had broken ribs, probably a better idea to get that checked. The adrenaline would have carried him...
Sounds like he was completely winded and thought he had broken ribs, probably a better idea to get that checked. The adrenaline would have carried him to the start of the second moto where he probably got a bit more out of the gate. Swelling still wouldn't have set in fully by then. I reckon there's a reasonable chance he felt stiffer and sorer this week.
Check his instagram. He`s been sick all week. Weege mentioned it before moto1 too.
2
Ranman68
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7/26/2021 7:19am
In past years, Tomac could come from much further back and win with 10 seconds to spare. He could even afford a tip over. Saturday's race shows clearly just how much deeper and faster the field is now. Tomac's performance on Saturday was as good as I've eaver seen. That was beast mode at it's finest and yet he still went 2-2. As riders like Gajser, Herlings, Sewer, and others became MX1 riders in MXGP, they pushed one another to higher and higher levels. They also pushed the competitive old dogs like Cairoli to higher levels. The field got better and the speed was taken to a new level. That same thing is occurring in ama, and the speed is on another level from where it was 2,3,4 years ago. It's less predictable as well. Just like mxgp. I cant wait for mxon just to see ama boys and mxgp boys throw down. Not just American ama riders. The euros, Australians, French, German, Japanese, and others who are seasoned ama riders as well. They represent the series regardless of the country they also represent. I think it will be a showdown.
bedu
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EE
7/26/2021 1:45pm
Hey everyone, thought I'd create an account after few years of creeping around here to share those race pace visualizations I've created which are based on PDF results.

250 Moto 1:


250 Moto 2:


450 Moto 1:


450 Moto 2:


* Only riders that finished on the lead lap are displayed
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Tim507
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Oregon City, OR, USA
7/26/2021 2:22pm
bedu wrote:
Hey everyone, thought I'd create an account after few years of creeping around here to share those race pace visualizations I've created which are based on...
Hey everyone, thought I'd create an account after few years of creeping around here to share those race pace visualizations I've created which are based on PDF results.

250 Moto 1:


250 Moto 2:


450 Moto 1:


450 Moto 2:


* Only riders that finished on the lead lap are displayed
Excellent presentation!!
bedu
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Location
EE
7/26/2021 3:30pm Edited Date/Time 7/26/2021 3:32pm
They're based on lap times. X axis is winner's mean lap, so every lap where riders exceed winner's mean lap time their line would rise (and vice versa). This should provide pretty accurate representation of a race without actually watching it (I will never miss though 😄).

Dean Wilson must have felt pretty lonely in moto 1.
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