COVID thread

7/23/2020 5:35am
I don't think excess deaths are a reliable method of estimating covid deaths, too many unknown variables from lockdown. As the piece suggests there will be more deaths caused by people not wanting to go to hospital for stuff they've subsequently died from. Also you'd expect the lockdown to have accounted for far fewer road accident deaths etc.

In the UK where they've had a LOT of covid deaths the excess death rate is actually normal now.
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Robgvx
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7/23/2020 10:35am
kongols wrote:
I don't think excess deaths are a reliable method of estimating covid deaths, too many unknown variables from lockdown. As the piece suggests there will be...
I don't think excess deaths are a reliable method of estimating covid deaths, too many unknown variables from lockdown. As the piece suggests there will be more deaths caused by people not wanting to go to hospital for stuff they've subsequently died from. Also you'd expect the lockdown to have accounted for far fewer road accident deaths etc.

In the UK where they've had a LOT of covid deaths the excess death rate is actually normal now.
Total UK deaths have been below the five year average for four consecutive weeks now.

But now we have to wear a mask...
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lestat
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7/23/2020 12:41pm
WCRider wrote:
Just because your world doesn't cross the line of good and evil and smart people think beyond good and evil. Free will is a religious concept...
Just because your world doesn't cross the line of good and evil and smart people think beyond good and evil.

Free will is a religious concept to make civilization possible and based on law and individual responsibility. But the reality is that you are determined by a lot of things that you are not even aware of.

People who believe in free will generally support death penalty. The determinists are against it. Not seeing beyond good and evil makes you more sectarian and binary. Your world basically boils down to monsters and saints.

Can you empathize with the worst people in human history ?

Do you think steroids didn't help Chris Benoit to kill his family or it was just his free will ?

"There is an old illusion called good and evil." Nietzsche.



A rambling incoherent response . You got nothing .

Free will is a property of consciousness . The materialist reductionist methodology has completely failed to explain how consciousness emerges from the physical world . The top neurologists today will freely admit that . You try to portray your viewpoint as being a ‘scientific’ one but you have zero scientific evidence to support it . Nada . Zip . Go back to your pseudo social science mysticism YouTube videos ... brah .
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The Shop

JAFO92
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7/23/2020 1:00pm

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7/23/2020 4:20pm
Just dropped by to say good job you guys in the USA just hit 4,000,000 cases. Remember not that long ago I said that about the world hitting 4,000,000 cases and just like back then I'm still being sarcastic.

The world figure now is 15,600,000. That's not a good job and no I'm not being sarcastic now.

I also remember all the people saying the hospitals are empty and it's all bullshit. Doesn't seem the case now though so maybe it wasn't bullshit?

But you have your freedom now yeah?

Carry on, you're doing great and the economy is now thriving and everything is back to normal. (that was sarcasm)

At least you still have the BLM distraction from other important topics that need serious discussion and investigation.
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sandtrack315
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7/23/2020 5:06pm
Remember when Ping told us we didn’t have anything to worry about because the ERs he was at were empty? Quaint times.
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7/23/2020 5:38pm
Stupid people will be the reason that this thing continues on. I heard a story about a kid who showed up to work with a fever of 103. He tested positive. He kept going to work because he thought he just had a sunburn. These are the people that will keep this thing going.
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7/23/2020 5:50pm Edited Date/Time 7/23/2020 5:52pm
If Murdoch (FOX media owner) is bailing out of backing the administration, they are done. Seen it before how well his papers control the swing voters.
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APLMAN99
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7/23/2020 5:55pm
JAFO92 wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/07/23/439837/s1200_Selfish_Gene.jpg[/img]

Some days I feel like I have way too many of those genes.....
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JAFO92
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7/23/2020 7:18pm
APLMAN99 wrote:
Some days I feel like I have way too many of those genes.....
Lots going on in that book and it applies perfectly to what those monkeys were squabbling over. Worth the read.
APLMAN99
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7/23/2020 7:24pm Edited Date/Time 7/23/2020 7:27pm
APLMAN99 wrote:
Some days I feel like I have way too many of those genes.....
JAFO92 wrote:
Lots going on in that book and it applies perfectly to what those monkeys were squabbling over. Worth the read.
I’m just going by the title, but I’m more aware of how selfish I am every day.

Correcting that is far harder than realizing that, though....

To quote Bush from the song Swallowed:

Piss on, self-esteem
Forward, busted knee
Sick head, blackened lungs
And I'm simple, selfish son

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WCRider
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7/23/2020 8:48pm Edited Date/Time 7/23/2020 8:54pm
lestat wrote:
A rambling incoherent response . You got nothing . Free will is a property of consciousness . The materialist reductionist methodology has completely failed to explain...
A rambling incoherent response . You got nothing .

Free will is a property of consciousness . The materialist reductionist methodology has completely failed to explain how consciousness emerges from the physical world . The top neurologists today will freely admit that . You try to portray your viewpoint as being a ‘scientific’ one but you have zero scientific evidence to support it . Nada . Zip . Go back to your pseudo social science mysticism YouTube videos ... brah .
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Ted722
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7/24/2020 1:18am Edited Date/Time 7/24/2020 7:30am
CDC paper (published today) on the importance of re-opening schools this fall. In person.

Cites reports on low transmission rates of Covid from adolescents and lower adolescent deaths than in each of the last 5 flu seasons and certainly on track to be much lower than H1N1.

Weeks late IMO, but in the aggregate completely on point. The essential role in-person school/instruction has on kids education, development, and overall well being is just that...essential.
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Spurdo
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7/24/2020 3:14am
Confirmed = probably [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/07/22/439683/s1200_Screenshot_20200722_093730.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/07/22/439684/s1200_Screenshot_20200722_093719.jpg[/img]
Confirmed = probably




In your professional opinion - how much have the numbers been fluffed up? How many "suspected" cases versus confirmed? Whats the likelihood the cases of Corona related deaths have been padded?
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7/24/2020 3:20am
Just noticing that by tomorrow the 24th in the USA, New York will be knocked off the top spot for most cases. Florida should relegate it back to 3rd by the 30th and followed by Texas a couple of days later. Who could see NY being overtaken and what's more down in 5th with more affected than all the other states combined only a few short months ago?

Saying that, Australia is nearly back to March record numbers so shit's not looking to good here although it is mostly confined to the state of Victoria (our Mexico) and Melbourne in particular. There has been small outbreaks from on the run Victorians jumping the border with one near me so went in for the bottle brush down the nose treatment yesterday just to be sure as I work close to others and can't maintain a safe distance. There's been more than a few memes and jokes about building a wall around that place too.
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7/24/2020 3:29am
Confirmed = probably [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/07/22/439683/s1200_Screenshot_20200722_093730.jpg[/img] [img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2020/07/22/439684/s1200_Screenshot_20200722_093719.jpg[/img]
Confirmed = probably




Spurdo wrote:
In your professional opinion - how much have the numbers been fluffed up? How many "suspected" cases versus confirmed? Whats the likelihood the cases of Corona...
In your professional opinion - how much have the numbers been fluffed up? How many "suspected" cases versus confirmed? Whats the likelihood the cases of Corona related deaths have been padded?
https://ktla.com/news/california/were-just-overwhelmed-california-hospitals-report-beds-filling-up-as-coronavirus-surge-hits/
https://www.vox.com/2020/7/15/21317776/covid-19-coronavirus-florida-arizona-texas-california-hospitals
Well this never happens from the Flu

With Covid-19 hospitalizations steadily approaching a record high in the US, states like Arizona have activated emergency plans and requested refrigerated trucks to prepare for overflow at morgues. Doctors there say packed emergency rooms and ICUs are forcing them to prioritize the sickest patients, leaving other ill patients to deteriorate while waiting for care they’d ordinarily receive right away.

Hospitals in hot spots across the country are expanding and even maxing out their staff, equipment, and beds, with doctors warning that the worst-case scenario of hospital resources being overwhelmed is on the horizon if their states don’t get better control of the coronavirus.

“With Covid, a lot of times people who aren’t sick enough yet get pushed to the back, and then they can become really, really sick unfortunately because we were focusing our efforts on the people who are on the brink of death,” an emergency room doctor at the Banner Health system in the Phoenix metro area, who asked to go unnamed fearing retaliation from his employer, told Vox.

Other doctors in Arizona, where 90 percent of hospital beds statewide were in use Tuesday, say the scarcity of resources means they’ll soon be rationing medical care, as doctors in Italy were forced to do.

“The fear is we are going to have to start sharing ventilators, or we’re gonna have to start saying, ‘You get a vent, you don’t.’ I’d be really surprised if in a couple weeks we didn’t have to do that,” says Murtaza Akhter, an emergency medicine physician at Valleywise Health Medical Center in Phoenix.
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Ted722
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7/24/2020 7:53am
Interesting WSJ article. In the flu season for the Southern Hemisphere, the flu has been almost non-existent. That’s one hell of a silver lining if holds true for the Northern Hemisphere’s upcoming flu season. Flu’s no joke with‘an estimated 1 billion cases worldwide and 650,000 deaths.

“From Argentina to South Africa to New Zealand, countries in the Southern Hemisphere are reporting far lower numbers of influenza and other seasonal respiratory viral infections this year. In some countries, the flu seems to have all but disappeared, a surprise silver lining that health experts attribute to measures to corral the coronavirus, like mask use and restrictions on air travel.”
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peelout
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7/24/2020 9:38am
Ted722 wrote:
Interesting [url=https://www.wsj.com/articles/covid-19-measures-have-all-but-wiped-out-the-flu-in-the-southern-hemisphere-11595440682]WSJ article.[/url] In the flu season for the Southern Hemisphere, the flu has been almost non-existent. That’s one hell of a silver lining if holds...
Interesting WSJ article. In the flu season for the Southern Hemisphere, the flu has been almost non-existent. That’s one hell of a silver lining if holds true for the Northern Hemisphere’s upcoming flu season. Flu’s no joke with‘an estimated 1 billion cases worldwide and 650,000 deaths.

“From Argentina to South Africa to New Zealand, countries in the Southern Hemisphere are reporting far lower numbers of influenza and other seasonal respiratory viral infections this year. In some countries, the flu seems to have all but disappeared, a surprise silver lining that health experts attribute to measures to corral the coronavirus, like mask use and restrictions on air travel.”
Or you know, calling it Covid instead of the flu
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1911
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7/24/2020 9:54am


LOL
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lestat
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7/24/2020 10:30am
Like I said , materialists have been trying to determine the nature of consciousness and free will for decades and have gotten nowhere . Your google link states my point exactly . From your link .

Q : Why do we need to study free will in the first place? And does what we may find have practical applications in neurology and law?

A: As I always say, the first thing about doing basic science is that you should want to satisfy human curiosity because we never know what applications there could be in 10 years that we have not thought about right now. So, there is value in doing basic science for its own sake.

Second, it may well turn out that neuroscience is not able to completely tell us whether or not there is free will. But I think studying it is important because it teaches us about processes in the brain and how things like volition come about.


Try reading a book google boy ...


http://consc.net/the-character-of-consciousness/
7/24/2020 3:07pm
Spurdo wrote:
In your professional opinion - how much have the numbers been fluffed up? How many "suspected" cases versus confirmed? Whats the likelihood the cases of Corona...
In your professional opinion - how much have the numbers been fluffed up? How many "suspected" cases versus confirmed? Whats the likelihood the cases of Corona related deaths have been padded?
I wouldn't really have any way of knowing. One thing I do see is perfectly healthy people coming in and lying about having symptoms so they can get a swab. I would imagine that those numbers would be considered probable cases, even if they are lying, which is a little interesting.
I can tell you that hospitals are putting a lot of emphasis on collecting data on any patient that comes in that was related to covid in any way. Whether its a previous swab, positive result, or pending swab. Something tells me that is related to getting federal $$$$$$
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WCRider
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7/25/2020 4:30am
lestat wrote:
Like I said , materialists have been trying to determine the nature of consciousness and free will for decades and have gotten nowhere . Your google...
Like I said , materialists have been trying to determine the nature of consciousness and free will for decades and have gotten nowhere . Your google link states my point exactly . From your link .

Q : Why do we need to study free will in the first place? And does what we may find have practical applications in neurology and law?

A: As I always say, the first thing about doing basic science is that you should want to satisfy human curiosity because we never know what applications there could be in 10 years that we have not thought about right now. So, there is value in doing basic science for its own sake.

Second, it may well turn out that neuroscience is not able to completely tell us whether or not there is free will. But I think studying it is important because it teaches us about processes in the brain and how things like volition come about.


Try reading a book google boy ...


http://consc.net/the-character-of-consciousness/
Keep your pedantry, I'm not your dog.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/there-is-no-such-thing-as-co…

Waste of time, we are surely too biased by our convictions but free will...
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Chance1216
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7/25/2020 4:39am
lestat wrote:
Like I said , materialists have been trying to determine the nature of consciousness and free will for decades and have gotten nowhere . Your google...
Like I said , materialists have been trying to determine the nature of consciousness and free will for decades and have gotten nowhere . Your google link states my point exactly . From your link .

Q : Why do we need to study free will in the first place? And does what we may find have practical applications in neurology and law?

A: As I always say, the first thing about doing basic science is that you should want to satisfy human curiosity because we never know what applications there could be in 10 years that we have not thought about right now. So, there is value in doing basic science for its own sake.

Second, it may well turn out that neuroscience is not able to completely tell us whether or not there is free will. But I think studying it is important because it teaches us about processes in the brain and how things like volition come about.


Try reading a book google boy ...


http://consc.net/the-character-of-consciousness/
WCRider wrote:
Keep your pedantry, I'm not your dog.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/there-is-no-such-thing-as-co…

Waste of time, we are surely too biased by our convictions but free will...
Your de-railing the thread genius.
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mikec265
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7/25/2020 10:45am

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7/25/2020 11:35am Edited Date/Time 7/25/2020 11:38am
Different areas different problems. Hospitals Still empty around my parts.....holds in hiring. (Hospitals are broke—they need that ER to be hoppin to bill Medicaid, Medicare, caresource and HMO/PPOs.... they need the census to be high to make money. Hospitals don’t make money if nobody is in them.


ICU beds in major cities are always full. Hell people sit for days waiting to go to a regular level of care because the hospital wards are full to capacity. This isn’t a new concept here. Hospitals operate at almost full capacity all the time. This 90% full and blah blah is heavy media embellishment for what is common in the United States. And People still can get care here—fast.
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KennyT
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7/25/2020 11:45am
Different areas different problems. Hospitals Still empty around my parts.....holds in hiring. (Hospitals are broke—they need that ER to be hoppin to bill Medicaid, Medicare, caresource...
Different areas different problems. Hospitals Still empty around my parts.....holds in hiring. (Hospitals are broke—they need that ER to be hoppin to bill Medicaid, Medicare, caresource and HMO/PPOs.... they need the census to be high to make money. Hospitals don’t make money if nobody is in them.


ICU beds in major cities are always full. Hell people sit for days waiting to go to a regular level of care because the hospital wards are full to capacity. This isn’t a new concept here. Hospitals operate at almost full capacity all the time. This 90% full and blah blah is heavy media embellishment for what is common in the United States. And People still can get care here—fast.
You are 100% correct. I’ve had 2 family members in the hospital in the past 2 weeks here in the “hotbed” if the virus and there is no overflowing bodies in tents at either hospital. It’s becoming very hard to listen to anything anyone in the media has to say. I’m relying on real life experience, not what the media is throwing down our throats
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7/25/2020 12:05pm
Before COVID the ER, ICU and PACU would call me non stop for overtime.

Now it’s “oh we will keep You in mind but really slow and cutting back sorry”
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Dirtysmile56
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7/25/2020 5:02pm
I tested positive for COVID yesterday. We're going riding tomorrow.... Smile
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