Fill Ins? Who’s even worthy?

agn5009
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agn5009 2/23/2020 11:57am
2/23/2020 11:57am
agn5009 wrote:
Teams arent making any money anyways. Team Factory KTM has two options. Pay someone a salary, health insurance, bikes, parts, mechanic, truck driver etc etc etc...
Teams arent making any money anyways. Team Factory KTM has two options. Pay someone a salary, health insurance, bikes, parts, mechanic, truck driver etc etc etc to go out and "maybe" make a main event or just dont pay anyone new and wait for Coop/Musquin to return.

Honestly, you guys act like theres tons of people out there capable of making the 450 mains every single week. There simply isn't. We're not talking about a fill in rider for a 250 east/west coast series. We're talking about the 450 class which has 12+ past champs in it. I love guys like Hsu, Ramette, Do etc and I would love to see them come over and give it a shot. But honestly, is it worth ktm doing that? Are they really gonna gain anything financially by having one of those guys who may squeak into the main racing for them?

No. They're not. Think with your heads, not your heart's. This is a business for KTM, not a charity.
1911 wrote:
Wut? Your first sentence says, teams aren’t making money anyways. Which I agree. But with your logic, why field a team at all?
There are reasons to field a team. Ktm has cooper and marvin, for obvious and good reasons. Now both title contenders are hurt. Why field a second rate team with riders who probably wont even qualify. That's all I'm saying. There really ain't many healthy privateers available capable of taking top 15 every week.
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agn5009
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agn5009 2/23/2020 12:00pm
2/23/2020 12:00pm
1911 wrote:
Perhaps teams do not get paid from sponsors, unless the have bikes on the track?
agn5009 wrote:
Teams arent making any money anyways. Team Factory KTM has two options. Pay someone a salary, health insurance, bikes, parts, mechanic, truck driver etc etc etc...
Teams arent making any money anyways. Team Factory KTM has two options. Pay someone a salary, health insurance, bikes, parts, mechanic, truck driver etc etc etc to go out and "maybe" make a main event or just dont pay anyone new and wait for Coop/Musquin to return.

Honestly, you guys act like theres tons of people out there capable of making the 450 mains every single week. There simply isn't. We're not talking about a fill in rider for a 250 east/west coast series. We're talking about the 450 class which has 12+ past champs in it. I love guys like Hsu, Ramette, Do etc and I would love to see them come over and give it a shot. But honestly, is it worth ktm doing that? Are they really gonna gain anything financially by having one of those guys who may squeak into the main racing for them?

No. They're not. Think with your heads, not your heart's. This is a business for KTM, not a charity.
texasmoto423 wrote:
The riders are subcontractors. The teams 1099 them. No health insurance cost to the team. Also almost all fill ins are bonus only. Zero salary. It’s...
The riders are subcontractors. The teams 1099 them. No health insurance cost to the team. Also almost all fill ins are bonus only. Zero salary. It’s basically a chance for someone to get a shot on factory equipment and for the teams to fulfill their responsibilities to the sponsors. The mechanic and truck drivers on on salary and getting paid regardless and are figured in in the yearly budget. I’d imagine the fine from Red Bull or Monster would be much higher than the cost of putting a 12-22 place guy on the bike a few rounds.
Then why didn't KTM put someone on Marvin's bike for all of SX? Theres clearly reasons why, and I trust the judgement of those guys running the team.
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TeamGreen
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TeamGreen 2/23/2020 12:03pm
2/23/2020 12:03pm
Cole Thompson on the RB-KTM
MA800 on the Kawasaki (with MC as his coach)
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crockett
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crockett 2/23/2020 12:10pm
2/23/2020 12:10pm
I heard #100 may be at press day and available for a fill in
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1911
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1911 2/23/2020 12:21pm
2/23/2020 12:21pm
agn5009 wrote:
Then why didn't KTM put someone on Marvin's bike for all of SX? Theres clearly reasons why, and I trust the judgement of those guys running...
Then why didn't KTM put someone on Marvin's bike for all of SX? Theres clearly reasons why, and I trust the judgement of those guys running the team.
Because JLaw was not available, clearly a podium guySilly
struth
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struth 2/23/2020 12:48pm
2/23/2020 12:48pm
MXMattii wrote:
Brian Hsu, Thomas Ramette, Charles LeFrancois, Cedric Soubeyras, Thomas Do, ... All guys who are race ready and don't need to come out of retirement.
RTDRacing wrote:
Yes, yes and yes. Would love to see these guys over here. They run yellow, and run them well
Hsu or dan reardon ,dan raced in ama b4
Top End
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Top End 2/23/2020 1:06pm
2/23/2020 1:06pm
How is Weston Peick doing?
hellbillyohio 2/23/2020 1:13pm
2/23/2020 1:13pm
Filthy Phil for JGR?
-MAVERICK-
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-MAVERICK- 2/23/2020 1:16pm
2/23/2020 1:16pm
hellbillyohio wrote:
Filthy Phil for JGR?
Phil is already contracted up here in Canada with the Rockstar Energy OTSFF Yamaha team. They're not going to let him go.

He's the defending Triple Crown Series champion with a very good chance to win it again this year. No way he's leaving to go to JGR.
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ajk423
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ajk423 2/23/2020 1:28pm
2/23/2020 1:28pm
Why not Alex martin fill in, his bro did pretty good on a 450 in Daytona a few yrs ago
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Tonynz
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Tonynz 2/23/2020 1:35pm
2/23/2020 1:35pm
Ryan Sipes on the KTM team could be an option.
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ML512
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ML512 2/23/2020 2:00pm
2/23/2020 2:00pm
backinthesaddleagain wrote:
Give Catanzaro a chance?
A-Ray would get that call up first
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mxb2
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mxb2 2/23/2020 2:12pm
2/23/2020 2:12pm
backinthesaddleagain wrote:
Give Catanzaro a chance?
ML512 wrote:
A-Ray would get that call up first
Bowers?
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agn5009
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agn5009 2/23/2020 2:18pm
2/23/2020 2:18pm
backinthesaddleagain wrote:
Give Catanzaro a chance?
ML512 wrote:
A-Ray would get that call up first
mxb2 wrote:
Bowers?
Bowers is the only one that makes sense. He makes most mains. But I dont see his results improving much. He will still be around 15th.
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agn5009
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agn5009 2/23/2020 2:22pm
2/23/2020 2:22pm
backinthesaddleagain wrote:
Give Catanzaro a chance?
When was the last time he qualified for a main? Over a year ago? Not happening.
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TymeMoto
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TymeMoto 2/23/2020 2:25pm
2/23/2020 2:25pm
backinthesaddleagain wrote:
Give Catanzaro a chance?
ML512 wrote:
A-Ray would get that call up first
mxb2 wrote:
Bowers?
Teams are tired of his shit
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inthebadboycorner 2/23/2020 2:33pm
2/23/2020 2:33pm
MXMattii wrote:
Brian Hsu, Thomas Ramette, Charles LeFrancois, Cedric Soubeyras, Thomas Do, ... All guys who are race ready and don't need to come out of retirement.
RTDRacing wrote:
Yes, yes and yes. Would love to see these guys over here. They run yellow, and run them well
struth wrote:
Hsu or dan reardon ,dan raced in ama b4
Dan Reardon would be a good choice, easy qualifier and would finish 15th ish.
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backinthesaddleagain 2/23/2020 2:43pm
2/23/2020 2:43pm
backinthesaddleagain wrote:
Give Catanzaro a chance?
agn5009 wrote:
When was the last time he qualified for a main? Over a year ago? Not happening.
I know. Just seeing the guy out there trying to make it week after week. I am not thinking from a biz standpoint and it is a business.
britt423
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britt423 2/23/2020 3:36pm
2/23/2020 3:36pm
agn5009 wrote:
Weimer and Grant would have a hard time making mains. No offense to them but it ain't 2016. I never understood the logic of putting someone...
Weimer and Grant would have a hard time making mains. No offense to them but it ain't 2016. I never understood the logic of putting someone on a bike just to put them on.
1911 wrote:
Perhaps teams do not get paid from sponsors, unless the have bikes on the track?
agn5009 wrote:
Teams arent making any money anyways. Team Factory KTM has two options. Pay someone a salary, health insurance, bikes, parts, mechanic, truck driver etc etc etc...
Teams arent making any money anyways. Team Factory KTM has two options. Pay someone a salary, health insurance, bikes, parts, mechanic, truck driver etc etc etc to go out and "maybe" make a main event or just dont pay anyone new and wait for Coop/Musquin to return.

Honestly, you guys act like theres tons of people out there capable of making the 450 mains every single week. There simply isn't. We're not talking about a fill in rider for a 250 east/west coast series. We're talking about the 450 class which has 12+ past champs in it. I love guys like Hsu, Ramette, Do etc and I would love to see them come over and give it a shot. But honestly, is it worth ktm doing that? Are they really gonna gain anything financially by having one of those guys who may squeak into the main racing for them?

No. They're not. Think with your heads, not your heart's. This is a business for KTM, not a charity.
That’s kind of my thinking! I’ve thought of some the guys mentioned too. I didn’t mean who’s available, I meant more of who would KTM / Kawi actually think was worthy? (In their opinion)
britt423
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britt423 2/23/2020 3:37pm
2/23/2020 3:37pm
hellbillyohio wrote:
Filthy Phil for JGR?
-MAVERICK- wrote:
Phil is already contracted up here in Canada with the Rockstar Energy OTSFF Yamaha team. They're not going to let him go. He's the defending Triple...
Phil is already contracted up here in Canada with the Rockstar Energy OTSFF Yamaha team. They're not going to let him go.

He's the defending Triple Crown Series champion with a very good chance to win it again this year. No way he's leaving to go to JGR.
But wouldn’t that be awesome? I love Phil lol
britt423
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britt423 2/23/2020 3:39pm
2/23/2020 3:39pm
backinthesaddleagain wrote:
Give Catanzaro a chance?
ML512 wrote:
A-Ray would get that call up first
A Ray is hurt now too as of this weekend, if I read correctly
-MAVERICK-
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-MAVERICK- 2/23/2020 3:48pm
2/23/2020 3:48pm
hellbillyohio wrote:
Filthy Phil for JGR?
-MAVERICK- wrote:
Phil is already contracted up here in Canada with the Rockstar Energy OTSFF Yamaha team. They're not going to let him go. He's the defending Triple...
Phil is already contracted up here in Canada with the Rockstar Energy OTSFF Yamaha team. They're not going to let him go.

He's the defending Triple Crown Series champion with a very good chance to win it again this year. No way he's leaving to go to JGR.
britt423 wrote:
But wouldn’t that be awesome? I love Phil lol
Would it be cool? Yes. However, from Phil's standpoint it has to make sense for the bank account and that's staying up here.

Winning the 100k last year plus his salary and bonuses, I don't blame him.

He's made our series that much better, so I might be a little biased in him staying up here.

His steed for the year:
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Luke_Richards
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Luke_Richards 2/23/2020 4:01pm
2/23/2020 4:01pm
crockett wrote:
I heard #100 may be at press day and available for a fill in
Lol he won’t race he can’t do that fake ass style in race conditions
WheelieNelson 2/23/2020 4:14pm
2/23/2020 4:14pm
Brett metcalf?
Dan reardon?
Ryan sipes?

Hell just throw Ricky on that jgr zook, he’d prob set that bike up right for once and get their highest finish. Two birds gettin stoned at once
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agn5009
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agn5009 2/23/2020 5:15pm
2/23/2020 5:15pm
backinthesaddleagain wrote:
Give Catanzaro a chance?
agn5009 wrote:
When was the last time he qualified for a main? Over a year ago? Not happening.
backinthesaddleagain wrote:
I know. Just seeing the guy out there trying to make it week after week. I am not thinking from a biz standpoint and it is...
I know. Just seeing the guy out there trying to make it week after week. I am not thinking from a biz standpoint and it is a business.
Theres a bunch of guys trying to make it in every week. And a few who actually do every now and then. Ronnie Stewart got in this weekend, Chiz, Cunningham and dare I say... Reed.
mx617
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mx617 2/23/2020 6:08pm
2/23/2020 6:08pm
agn5009 wrote:
Teams arent making any money anyways. Team Factory KTM has two options. Pay someone a salary, health insurance, bikes, parts, mechanic, truck driver etc etc etc...
Teams arent making any money anyways. Team Factory KTM has two options. Pay someone a salary, health insurance, bikes, parts, mechanic, truck driver etc etc etc to go out and "maybe" make a main event or just dont pay anyone new and wait for Coop/Musquin to return.

Honestly, you guys act like theres tons of people out there capable of making the 450 mains every single week. There simply isn't. We're not talking about a fill in rider for a 250 east/west coast series. We're talking about the 450 class which has 12+ past champs in it. I love guys like Hsu, Ramette, Do etc and I would love to see them come over and give it a shot. But honestly, is it worth ktm doing that? Are they really gonna gain anything financially by having one of those guys who may squeak into the main racing for them?

No. They're not. Think with your heads, not your heart's. This is a business for KTM, not a charity.
1911 wrote:
Wut? Your first sentence says, teams aren’t making money anyways. Which I agree. But with your logic, why field a team at all?
agn5009 wrote:
Why would a factory team such as KTM put a rider who probably wont qualify on their team. That's what I'm saying. There is absolutely no...
Why would a factory team such as KTM put a rider who probably wont qualify on their team. That's what I'm saying. There is absolutely no point for them to do that. If a solid top 15 guy was available then sure, they may pull the trigger. But they're not going to dump a pile of money into bringing in someone who will be on the cusp of not qualifying each week. They have nothing to gain and lots of money to lose.

I know guys love to see former pros like Weimer and Grant come back but let's be realistic, they may not be able to qualify consistently anymore. It's been a long time (in racing years) since they've done it.
I think the point is a fill in doesn't cost a pile of money. The teams are going to have significant fixed costs whether they get a fill in or not. The actual rider doesn't cost a lot.

And to agn, there's at least 22 guys capable of making a main each week. Not all of them are on teams. What about a guy like Joey crown? He should be able to make mains in 450.
Aaryn234
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Aaryn234 2/23/2020 6:36pm
2/23/2020 6:36pm
agn5009 wrote:
When was the last time he qualified for a main? Over a year ago? Not happening.
backinthesaddleagain wrote:
I know. Just seeing the guy out there trying to make it week after week. I am not thinking from a biz standpoint and it is...
I know. Just seeing the guy out there trying to make it week after week. I am not thinking from a biz standpoint and it is a business.
agn5009 wrote:
Theres a bunch of guys trying to make it in every week. And a few who actually do every now and then. Ronnie Stewart got in...
Theres a bunch of guys trying to make it in every week. And a few who actually do every now and then. Ronnie Stewart got in this weekend, Chiz, Cunningham and dare I say... Reed.
I say with Reed getting healthier and the field depleting, he will comfortably qualify for the rest of the races this year with no need for the LCQ,

He was just outside the top ten in the second race last night, qualified 15th I think from memory.

I only see him continuing to get better this year if he has no more injuries, not race-winning or podium better (would love to be proved wrong) but see him breaking free from the privateer island guys battling for the final transfer spots each week.
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MXMattii
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MXMattii 2/23/2020 6:40pm
2/23/2020 6:40pm
RTDRacing wrote:
Yes, yes and yes. Would love to see these guys over here. They run yellow, and run them well
struth wrote:
Hsu or dan reardon ,dan raced in ama b4
inthebadboycorner wrote:
Dan Reardon would be a good choice, easy qualifier and would finish 15th ish.
Dan Reardon (Yamaha 250 & 450), Brian Hsu (KTM & Husqvarna 250), Cedric Soubeyras (KTM & Husqvarna 250 & 450), Thomas Ramette signed with Yamaha now in France but knows the Suzuki well, Charles LeFrancois (Suzuki 450), Thomas Do signed with KTM now but also knows the Suzuki well, Greg Aranda (Yamaha 450), Valentin Teillet knows the Suzuki also very well and has now his own Husqvarna team if I'm correct.

And all those guys will be qualifying for the main events, for sure if they are on factory material. After these names you've riders such as Fabien Izoird, Jason Clermont, Angelo Pellegrini, Adrien Escoffier, Nicolas Dercourt, Yannis Irsuti, Calvin Fonvieille, Maxime Desprey, ... Tons of French Supercross riders who have enough level to be a fill in. But maybe guys like Kyle Bitterman, Richard Jackson, Darian Sanayei, ... deserve a shot too?!
Philly215
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Philly215 2/23/2020 6:48pm
2/23/2020 6:48pm
Jason Lawrence. Let’s gooooo.
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