Fill Ins? Who’s even worthy?

2/24/2020 8:27am
Only thing I can think would be ARay for Kawi POSSIBLY. Other than that theres not anyone I can think of that stands out.
haydos25
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2/24/2020 2:30pm
MXMattii wrote:
Dan Reardon (Yamaha 250 & 450), Brian Hsu (KTM & Husqvarna 250), Cedric Soubeyras (KTM & Husqvarna 250 & 450), Thomas Ramette signed with Yamaha now...
Dan Reardon (Yamaha 250 & 450), Brian Hsu (KTM & Husqvarna 250), Cedric Soubeyras (KTM & Husqvarna 250 & 450), Thomas Ramette signed with Yamaha now in France but knows the Suzuki well, Charles LeFrancois (Suzuki 450), Thomas Do signed with KTM now but also knows the Suzuki well, Greg Aranda (Yamaha 450), Valentin Teillet knows the Suzuki also very well and has now his own Husqvarna team if I'm correct.

And all those guys will be qualifying for the main events, for sure if they are on factory material. After these names you've riders such as Fabien Izoird, Jason Clermont, Angelo Pellegrini, Adrien Escoffier, Nicolas Dercourt, Yannis Irsuti, Calvin Fonvieille, Maxime Desprey, ... Tons of French Supercross riders who have enough level to be a fill in. But maybe guys like Kyle Bitterman, Richard Jackson, Darian Sanayei, ... deserve a shot too?!
haydos25 wrote:
You've just basically named every european thats raced or is currently racing supercross in that list as being potential fill ins. Maybe some of them are...
You've just basically named every european thats raced or is currently racing supercross in that list as being potential fill ins. Maybe some of them are fill in calibre, but when you throw names like Darian Sanayei who has attempted to qualify for exactly 1 race in his entire career and failed then you lose a bit of credibility.

I dont see Kawi filling in for AC, he'll probably be back in a month. JGR havent had any success with fill ins, i say they just throw AMart on for the odd race here and there and call it good.
MXMattii wrote:
That ain't true. The first set of riders are riders who are factory fill in worthy. The second set are riders are semi-factory or private teams...
That ain't true. The first set of riders are riders who are factory fill in worthy. The second set are riders are semi-factory or private teams worthy riders.

If I would name all European SX riders then I could name Håkon Fredriksen, Kevin Ballanger, Boris Maillard, Filip Neugebauer, Hugo Basaula... Tongue
With the exception of Charles LeFrancois every rider you named in the first paragraph are already affiliated with brands that wouldn't be looking to fill in in the US. Explain how that would be likely?

But I agree Filip Neugebauer has been overlooked for far too long. Get him on AC's bike asap.
Sully
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2/24/2020 4:06pm Edited Date/Time 2/24/2020 5:17pm
EngIceDave wrote:
You guys naming every Euro really need to get over it. I've been to a ton of those Euro races, and while some of those guys...
You guys naming every Euro really need to get over it. I've been to a ton of those Euro races, and while some of those guys are fast, the Euro-SX race tracks (ADAC, French, etc...) vs the US race tracks is night and day.

You're basically asking nearly totally inexperienced (in AMA SX) racers to come over, with minimal testing, and be able to make mains.....that's crazy talk.

One other thing, many of you guys think that just because a rider doesn't have a factory contract, that somehow they have zero obligations to anyone....How much money you think ARMA or CBDmd has paid to CR22??
You don't think Chiz has obligations?
Bloss has obligations as well.

And then what happens when the primary rider returns, these guys can just hop off and hop on again, and no one will give a crap?

Chiz might be a possibility, as I don't believe he plans to race outdoors, but he still has sponsor issues
MA800 might be interesting, but there is some risk....

Best I have read on here is Hartranft, but he in a top 3 position if I remember right, want to risk his injury over a few one off races, especially when an even stronger outdoors guy?
Hartranft is sitting in 4th, which is one of the reasons I suggested him. I think he's only 23 points back, though, so technically, he still has an outside shot.

Edited to add: Kind of a moot point now, since KTM said Webb plans to line up this weekend.
EngIceDave
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2/24/2020 4:13pm
haydos25 wrote:
With the exception of Charles LeFrancois every rider you named in the first paragraph are already affiliated with brands that wouldn't be looking to fill in...
With the exception of Charles LeFrancois every rider you named in the first paragraph are already affiliated with brands that wouldn't be looking to fill in in the US. Explain how that would be likely?

But I agree Filip Neugebauer has been overlooked for far too long. Get him on AC's bike asap.
You mean the Filip Neugebauer who got smoked by experienced AMA SX racers like Bowers and Breece, who are, let's just say nicely, aren't necessarily getting into main events by a large margin?

Filip Neugebauer, who to my knowledge has never raced an AMA Pro SX track?

Filip Neugebauer who would have zero testing time on AC's set up?
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haydos25
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2/24/2020 4:41pm
haydos25 wrote:
With the exception of Charles LeFrancois every rider you named in the first paragraph are already affiliated with brands that wouldn't be looking to fill in...
With the exception of Charles LeFrancois every rider you named in the first paragraph are already affiliated with brands that wouldn't be looking to fill in in the US. Explain how that would be likely?

But I agree Filip Neugebauer has been overlooked for far too long. Get him on AC's bike asap.
EngIceDave wrote:
You mean the Filip Neugebauer who got smoked by experienced AMA SX racers like Bowers and Breece, who are, let's just say nicely, aren't necessarily getting...
You mean the Filip Neugebauer who got smoked by experienced AMA SX racers like Bowers and Breece, who are, let's just say nicely, aren't necessarily getting into main events by a large margin?

Filip Neugebauer, who to my knowledge has never raced an AMA Pro SX track?

Filip Neugebauer who would have zero testing time on AC's set up?
Sarcasm is very hard to read on the interwebs. You cant believe i actually want Filip Neugebauer on factory Kawi?
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2/24/2020 5:28pm Edited Date/Time 2/24/2020 5:29pm
The only non US based rider worthy of one of these rides would be soubeyras. The other guys would be lucky to make the night show, let alone the mains. Doubt soubs would (could) leave his deal for a couple rounds on a 450. Ktm would move Davalos over to the factory rig (already been talked about on pulp that he could be moved if needed) but looks like Webb ain’t going anywhere. Bowers would likely be the Kawi guy. And at this point, I don’t think anyone would ride the jgr bike. Chiz would be the first guy those teams would call if the previous mentioned declined. After him, they wouldn’t waste their time on a hit or miss guy
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MXMattii
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2/24/2020 5:47pm Edited Date/Time 2/24/2020 5:59pm
Renner153 wrote:
The only non US based rider worthy of one of these rides would be soubeyras. The other guys would be lucky to make the night show...
The only non US based rider worthy of one of these rides would be soubeyras. The other guys would be lucky to make the night show, let alone the mains. Doubt soubs would (could) leave his deal for a couple rounds on a 450. Ktm would move Davalos over to the factory rig (already been talked about on pulp that he could be moved if needed) but looks like Webb ain’t going anywhere. Bowers would likely be the Kawi guy. And at this point, I don’t think anyone would ride the jgr bike. Chiz would be the first guy those teams would call if the previous mentioned declined. After him, they wouldn’t waste their time on a hit or miss guy
Brian Hsu could be a good fill in, if KTM is looking for someone to replace Moreau (he smoked the field including Soub in the AXUK). Angelo Pellegrini rides Suzuki too if I'm not mistaken, as well as Charles LeFrancois and to be honest I think both are Main Event material if you see how close Clermont gets. Little disappointing you think only Soubeyras can make a main.



PS: Dutch Amateur Jeffrey Meurs got into the night show twice from his three tries, and he fell short to make the main event in his home Supercross at Zuidbroek. Just sayin'.
Renner153
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2/25/2020 4:14am
Renner153 wrote:
The only non US based rider worthy of one of these rides would be soubeyras. The other guys would be lucky to make the night show...
The only non US based rider worthy of one of these rides would be soubeyras. The other guys would be lucky to make the night show, let alone the mains. Doubt soubs would (could) leave his deal for a couple rounds on a 450. Ktm would move Davalos over to the factory rig (already been talked about on pulp that he could be moved if needed) but looks like Webb ain’t going anywhere. Bowers would likely be the Kawi guy. And at this point, I don’t think anyone would ride the jgr bike. Chiz would be the first guy those teams would call if the previous mentioned declined. After him, they wouldn’t waste their time on a hit or miss guy
MXMattii wrote:
Brian Hsu could be a good fill in, if KTM is looking for someone to replace Moreau (he smoked the field including Soub in the AXUK)...
Brian Hsu could be a good fill in, if KTM is looking for someone to replace Moreau (he smoked the field including Soub in the AXUK). Angelo Pellegrini rides Suzuki too if I'm not mistaken, as well as Charles LeFrancois and to be honest I think both are Main Event material if you see how close Clermont gets. Little disappointing you think only Soubeyras can make a main.



PS: Dutch Amateur Jeffrey Meurs got into the night show twice from his three tries, and he fell short to make the main event in his home Supercross at Zuidbroek. Just sayin'.
Its a different world over here, buddy. Hsu can barely make a 6 minute moto without destroying himself. If you are talking about the 250 class....sure he could maybe make the main at a triple crown. But no way would I put him on a factory bike when there are plenty of proven guys that can/will make the main over a guy that has a 50/50 shot of ending up in the main or ending up in the wall.

Remember when Ramette filled in for Star? Yeah...that well extremely well. LeFrancois is decent, but give him the rest of the year and he might make 2 main events. Does that qualify you for a factory ride? Didnt think so. There are enough guys here that are better than the Euros (in american SX) that could get on the factory bike and make the mains pretty regularly.

Having said that, if those guys want to try their hand at American SX and see if they are good enough to earn a factory ride here. They need to invest in themselves and get over here. They can contact me and I will even help them out. For what its worth, I tried to get Hsu on my brothers team (the team Soubs rides for here) because I think hes good.
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2/25/2020 4:38am
haydos25 wrote:
You've just basically named every european thats raced or is currently racing supercross in that list as being potential fill ins. Maybe some of them are...
You've just basically named every european thats raced or is currently racing supercross in that list as being potential fill ins. Maybe some of them are fill in calibre, but when you throw names like Darian Sanayei who has attempted to qualify for exactly 1 race in his entire career and failed then you lose a bit of credibility.

I dont see Kawi filling in for AC, he'll probably be back in a month. JGR havent had any success with fill ins, i say they just throw AMart on for the odd race here and there and call it good.
MXMattii wrote:
That ain't true. The first set of riders are riders who are factory fill in worthy. The second set are riders are semi-factory or private teams...
That ain't true. The first set of riders are riders who are factory fill in worthy. The second set are riders are semi-factory or private teams worthy riders.

If I would name all European SX riders then I could name Håkon Fredriksen, Kevin Ballanger, Boris Maillard, Filip Neugebauer, Hugo Basaula... Tongue
haydos25 wrote:
With the exception of Charles LeFrancois every rider you named in the first paragraph are already affiliated with brands that wouldn't be looking to fill in...
With the exception of Charles LeFrancois every rider you named in the first paragraph are already affiliated with brands that wouldn't be looking to fill in in the US. Explain how that would be likely?

But I agree Filip Neugebauer has been overlooked for far too long. Get him on AC's bike asap.
My fellow dudes.

Filip Neugebauer is done with Kawis. From 2020 onwards he should ride KTM all year long. ACs bike is no go i am affraid. Cool

But it warms my heart that you guys mentioned him. He is good dude and top notch AX rider for the conditions we have here. SX would be too much at this stage. He also started family last year (if i'm not mistaken) so the risk might not be worth it.

Charles LeFrancois would be very good "draft" pick imho.
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2/25/2020 4:47am Edited Date/Time 2/25/2020 4:48am
Renner153 wrote:
The only non US based rider worthy of one of these rides would be soubeyras. The other guys would be lucky to make the night show...
The only non US based rider worthy of one of these rides would be soubeyras. The other guys would be lucky to make the night show, let alone the mains. Doubt soubs would (could) leave his deal for a couple rounds on a 450. Ktm would move Davalos over to the factory rig (already been talked about on pulp that he could be moved if needed) but looks like Webb ain’t going anywhere. Bowers would likely be the Kawi guy. And at this point, I don’t think anyone would ride the jgr bike. Chiz would be the first guy those teams would call if the previous mentioned declined. After him, they wouldn’t waste their time on a hit or miss guy
Please don't put Chizz on the cursed death machine. He is making decent STOCK points every weekend recently.

He's got that going on very nicely, 18th place overall standings is best advertisement the blue guys can get.

Don't forget guys "Better dead than red, but also better blue than chewed. (referring to Tickleback's hand Sad )"
UpTiTe
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2/25/2020 5:31am Edited Date/Time 2/25/2020 5:33am
agn5009 wrote:
Teams arent making any money anyways. Team Factory KTM has two options. Pay someone a salary, health insurance, bikes, parts, mechanic, truck driver etc etc etc...
Teams arent making any money anyways. Team Factory KTM has two options. Pay someone a salary, health insurance, bikes, parts, mechanic, truck driver etc etc etc to go out and "maybe" make a main event or just dont pay anyone new and wait for Coop/Musquin to return.

Honestly, you guys act like theres tons of people out there capable of making the 450 mains every single week. There simply isn't. We're not talking about a fill in rider for a 250 east/west coast series. We're talking about the 450 class which has 12+ past champs in it. I love guys like Hsu, Ramette, Do etc and I would love to see them come over and give it a shot. But honestly, is it worth ktm doing that? Are they really gonna gain anything financially by having one of those guys who may squeak into the main racing for them?

No. They're not. Think with your heads, not your heart's. This is a business for KTM, not a charity.
I see your point, but in reality a fill in guy cost you about 2500 a week if your other rider stays home.

There is no salary, just a weekly check for 1500-2000 plus Perdiem, there is zero healthcare insurance.

You’re still paying the support staff
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2/25/2020 6:25am
UpTiTe wrote:
I see your point, but in reality a fill in guy cost you about 2500 a week if your other rider stays home. There is no...
I see your point, but in reality a fill in guy cost you about 2500 a week if your other rider stays home.

There is no salary, just a weekly check for 1500-2000 plus Perdiem, there is zero healthcare insurance.

You’re still paying the support staff
Does Bowers collect a check every week now ? I would think Bowers or Chiz would be great fill in riders.
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2/25/2020 6:29am
Since this turned into "Name craziest and least likely rider to fill-in" thread my pick is *drumm roll* Mr. Austin Stroupe *canned laughter* Thank you. Beat...
Since this turned into "Name craziest and least likely rider to fill-in" thread my pick is

*drumm roll*

Mr. Austin Stroupe

*canned laughter*

Thank you.
Beat this. i dare you.
-MAVERICK- wrote:
Nico Izzi.

/thread.
He could auction off his gear for charity after the races.
davistld01
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2/25/2020 6:49am
UpTiTe wrote:
I see your point, but in reality a fill in guy cost you about 2500 a week if your other rider stays home. There is no...
I see your point, but in reality a fill in guy cost you about 2500 a week if your other rider stays home.

There is no salary, just a weekly check for 1500-2000 plus Perdiem, there is zero healthcare insurance.

You’re still paying the support staff
mb60 wrote:
Does Bowers collect a check every week now ? I would think Bowers or Chiz would be great fill in riders.
I agree, but I believe Bowers has some behavioral issues that might make some teams shy away from the drama/liability that he might bring. Chiz is a good rider that seems to have a great attitude...but, the question is, like the thread title asks "who is worthy?". Neither one of those guys could hope to break top-10 the way the class is stacked with super fast guys now. Would the investment be worth the return?
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2/25/2020 7:59am
UpTiTe wrote:
I see your point, but in reality a fill in guy cost you about 2500 a week if your other rider stays home. There is no...
I see your point, but in reality a fill in guy cost you about 2500 a week if your other rider stays home.

There is no salary, just a weekly check for 1500-2000 plus Perdiem, there is zero healthcare insurance.

You’re still paying the support staff
mb60 wrote:
Does Bowers collect a check every week now ? I would think Bowers or Chiz would be great fill in riders.
No, but he has a pretty nice portfolio of personal sponsors that pay decently.

I don’t think he will take a fill in ride from anyone but Kawasaki. They like him and they give free bikes and special parts.
Renner153
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2/25/2020 8:17am
Renner153 wrote:
The only non US based rider worthy of one of these rides would be soubeyras. The other guys would be lucky to make the night show...
The only non US based rider worthy of one of these rides would be soubeyras. The other guys would be lucky to make the night show, let alone the mains. Doubt soubs would (could) leave his deal for a couple rounds on a 450. Ktm would move Davalos over to the factory rig (already been talked about on pulp that he could be moved if needed) but looks like Webb ain’t going anywhere. Bowers would likely be the Kawi guy. And at this point, I don’t think anyone would ride the jgr bike. Chiz would be the first guy those teams would call if the previous mentioned declined. After him, they wouldn’t waste their time on a hit or miss guy
Please don't put Chizz on the cursed death machine. He is making decent STOCK points every weekend recently. He's got that going on very nicely, 18th...
Please don't put Chizz on the cursed death machine. He is making decent STOCK points every weekend recently.

He's got that going on very nicely, 18th place overall standings is best advertisement the blue guys can get.

Don't forget guys "Better dead than red, but also better blue than chewed. (referring to Tickleback's hand Sad )"
I dont think Chiz would take the deal anyways. Hes a good buddy of mine, I dont want him to even park his rig near JGR at this point haha. I was meaning more for the Kawi ride or KTM (if they needed someone). just saying after Chiz, there is no one else they would call up to ride a factory bike.
TeamGreen
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2/25/2020 8:53am
Sully wrote:
Depending on how long Webb will be out, I wouldn't mind seeing KTM move Hartranft up. He looks like a big dude, so a 450 might...
Depending on how long Webb will be out, I wouldn't mind seeing KTM move Hartranft up. He looks like a big dude, so a 450 might actually work better for him.
Good point and this set up has worked in the past with Shane.
Bruce372
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2/25/2020 9:20am
Renner153 wrote:
The only non US based rider worthy of one of these rides would be soubeyras. The other guys would be lucky to make the night show...
The only non US based rider worthy of one of these rides would be soubeyras. The other guys would be lucky to make the night show, let alone the mains. Doubt soubs would (could) leave his deal for a couple rounds on a 450. Ktm would move Davalos over to the factory rig (already been talked about on pulp that he could be moved if needed) but looks like Webb ain’t going anywhere. Bowers would likely be the Kawi guy. And at this point, I don’t think anyone would ride the jgr bike. Chiz would be the first guy those teams would call if the previous mentioned declined. After him, they wouldn’t waste their time on a hit or miss guy
Please don't put Chizz on the cursed death machine. He is making decent STOCK points every weekend recently. He's got that going on very nicely, 18th...
Please don't put Chizz on the cursed death machine. He is making decent STOCK points every weekend recently.

He's got that going on very nicely, 18th place overall standings is best advertisement the blue guys can get.

Don't forget guys "Better dead than red, but also better blue than chewed. (referring to Tickleback's hand Sad )"
Renner153 wrote:
I dont think Chiz would take the deal anyways. Hes a good buddy of mine, I dont want him to even park his rig near JGR...
I dont think Chiz would take the deal anyways. Hes a good buddy of mine, I dont want him to even park his rig near JGR at this point haha. I was meaning more for the Kawi ride or KTM (if they needed someone). just saying after Chiz, there is no one else they would call up to ride a factory bike.
What's wrong with the Suzuki? Or is it because it's a jgr Suzuki?

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