What's Tomac's WORST finish the rest of the way?

TDeath21
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2/16/2020 7:09am
kage173 wrote:
I think OP has it about right. The problem for the 3 is Cooper wont finish off the podium for the rest of the year.
Yep it’s obvious Webb isn’t gonna go down without a fight. He will force Tomac to be near perfect the rest of the way. Dungey did the same to him in 17. Everyone knows when Tomac is on there’s nobody beating him. Very similar to Stewart really. It’s just about pressuring him, both championship wise and within the race itself, to force those mistakes that cause him to lose points in bunches. I don’t wanna speak too soon but this year does seem like it might be a new Eli.
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RandyS
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2/16/2020 7:49am
RandyS wrote:
I would have to call bullshit on that statement because probably every comment I've made about Tomac has been negative, he's a guy who should have...
I would have to call bullshit on that statement because probably every comment I've made about Tomac has been negative, he's a guy who should have been a multiple time SX champion. I have said multiple times he's not my favorite rider but I don't believe I have ever used the word hate about any rider. I'm basing that on last year when Webb owned Tomac. I think the days of Tomac winning half the races have passed. Webb may not look like he was dominant but he won what 7 or 8 last year, most of Tomacs wins were when Webb was managing the title. You put Roczen in the mix and there's no room for the kind of weekends Tomac has had his entire 450 career. Had Webb not started out the season sick I think that would be more obvious.
You are delusional. Your “hate” is clear. Just own it and you’ll get at least some respect.
Not looking for respect on the internet, and saying a guy who has failed to deliver every year he has been in the big boy class despite being the fastest rider much of the time isn't hate, it's the truth. I was called a racist by Stewart fanboys for pointing out the same thing, Stewart at least delivered titles occasionally. Who got second last night?
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mxb2
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2/16/2020 7:52am
RandyS wrote:
I would have to call bullshit on that statement because probably every comment I've made about Tomac has been negative, he's a guy who should have...
I would have to call bullshit on that statement because probably every comment I've made about Tomac has been negative, he's a guy who should have been a multiple time SX champion. I have said multiple times he's not my favorite rider but I don't believe I have ever used the word hate about any rider. I'm basing that on last year when Webb owned Tomac. I think the days of Tomac winning half the races have passed. Webb may not look like he was dominant but he won what 7 or 8 last year, most of Tomacs wins were when Webb was managing the title. You put Roczen in the mix and there's no room for the kind of weekends Tomac has had his entire 450 career. Had Webb not started out the season sick I think that would be more obvious.
You are delusional. Your “hate” is clear. Just own it and you’ll get at least some respect.
RandyS wrote:
Not looking for respect on the internet, and saying a guy who has failed to deliver every year he has been in the big boy class...
Not looking for respect on the internet, and saying a guy who has failed to deliver every year he has been in the big boy class despite being the fastest rider much of the time isn't hate, it's the truth. I was called a racist by Stewart fanboys for pointing out the same thing, Stewart at least delivered titles occasionally. Who got second last night?
At least kawy is getting some return on their $$,. Wins,sx, mx outdoor titlesm. What has hrc, ktm gotten from musquin, kroc? Spending alot of money for a couple wins.
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Mr. Afterbar
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2/16/2020 7:56am
RandyS wrote:
I would have to call bullshit on that statement because probably every comment I've made about Tomac has been negative, he's a guy who should have...
I would have to call bullshit on that statement because probably every comment I've made about Tomac has been negative, he's a guy who should have been a multiple time SX champion. I have said multiple times he's not my favorite rider but I don't believe I have ever used the word hate about any rider. I'm basing that on last year when Webb owned Tomac. I think the days of Tomac winning half the races have passed. Webb may not look like he was dominant but he won what 7 or 8 last year, most of Tomacs wins were when Webb was managing the title. You put Roczen in the mix and there's no room for the kind of weekends Tomac has had his entire 450 career. Had Webb not started out the season sick I think that would be more obvious.
You are delusional. Your “hate” is clear. Just own it and you’ll get at least some respect.
RandyS wrote:
Not looking for respect on the internet, and saying a guy who has failed to deliver every year he has been in the big boy class...
Not looking for respect on the internet, and saying a guy who has failed to deliver every year he has been in the big boy class despite being the fastest rider much of the time isn't hate, it's the truth. I was called a racist by Stewart fanboys for pointing out the same thing, Stewart at least delivered titles occasionally. Who got second last night?
Blah blah blah. You cry about Eli every chance you get and your take on things is completely delusional. I’m not going to argue with you. You’re not worth my time.
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The Shop

H4L
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2/16/2020 7:57am Edited Date/Time 2/16/2020 7:57am
kage173 wrote:
I think OP has it about right. The problem for the 3 is Cooper wont finish off the podium for the rest of the year.
Yup. I don’t believe #2 can beat him straight up..
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RandyS
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2/16/2020 8:03am
You are delusional. Your “hate” is clear. Just own it and you’ll get at least some respect.
RandyS wrote:
Not looking for respect on the internet, and saying a guy who has failed to deliver every year he has been in the big boy class...
Not looking for respect on the internet, and saying a guy who has failed to deliver every year he has been in the big boy class despite being the fastest rider much of the time isn't hate, it's the truth. I was called a racist by Stewart fanboys for pointing out the same thing, Stewart at least delivered titles occasionally. Who got second last night?
Blah blah blah. You cry about Eli every chance you get and your take on things is completely delusional. I’m not going to argue with you...
Blah blah blah. You cry about Eli every chance you get and your take on things is completely delusional. I’m not going to argue with you. You’re not worth my time.
OK, fanboy.
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Crossup
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2/16/2020 8:08am
BobbyM wrote:
DNF or DNS.
NateDawg wrote:
Serious question, has Tomac ever DNF'd a Supercross race that wasn't caused by a mechanical? Because I see no historical basis for your statement.
You are wrong. Tomac DNF'd 2013 Rnd 4, and DNS 2018 Rnd 2. It doesn't matter why, but it did happened. So it has and can happen.
Racer111
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2/16/2020 8:08am
RandyS wrote:
I can see Webb winning half of them more than I can see Tomac doing it.
Then you need an eye doctor because your eye sight is shit like most of your posts.
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Mr. Afterbar
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2/16/2020 8:10am
RandyS wrote:
OK, fanboy.
Did you come up with that all by yourself? Thanks for observing. I am a fan of the sport, unlike you, who gets his little feelings hurt over some guy he doesn’t know getting beat by ELI all the time. Laughing Laughing Get used to it.
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Mr. Afterbar
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2/16/2020 8:17am
Crossup wrote:
You are wrong. Tomac DNF'd 2013 Rnd 4, and DNS 2018 Rnd 2. It doesn't matter why, but it did happened. So it has and can...
You are wrong. Tomac DNF'd 2013 Rnd 4, and DNS 2018 Rnd 2. It doesn't matter why, but it did happened. So it has and can happen.
Is there anyone in the current era that had missed less races than Eli the past 4 years? I can’t think of any.
2/16/2020 8:18am Edited Date/Time 2/16/2020 8:19am
These threads are so fucking old and stupid.
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NateDawg
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2/16/2020 8:33am
BobbyM wrote:
DNF or DNS.
NateDawg wrote:
Serious question, has Tomac ever DNF'd a Supercross race that wasn't caused by a mechanical? Because I see no historical basis for your statement.
Crossup wrote:
You are wrong. Tomac DNF'd 2013 Rnd 4, and DNS 2018 Rnd 2. It doesn't matter why, but it did happened. So it has and can...
You are wrong. Tomac DNF'd 2013 Rnd 4, and DNS 2018 Rnd 2. It doesn't matter why, but it did happened. So it has and can happen.
I can't be wrong when I didn't make a statement...I asked a question so calm your tits.

So he's DNF'd/DNS'd one race since 2013?? That's not very good support for your argument, lol.
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RandyS
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2/16/2020 8:37am
Crossup wrote:
You are wrong. Tomac DNF'd 2013 Rnd 4, and DNS 2018 Rnd 2. It doesn't matter why, but it did happened. So it has and can...
You are wrong. Tomac DNF'd 2013 Rnd 4, and DNS 2018 Rnd 2. It doesn't matter why, but it did happened. So it has and can happen.
Is there anyone in the current era that had missed less races than Eli the past 4 years? I can’t think of any.
Going after everyone who posts a negative about your rider=Fanboy.
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Blgdaddy
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2/16/2020 8:38am

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Sluggo77
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2/16/2020 9:00am
RandyS wrote:
I would have to call bullshit on that statement because probably every comment I've made about Tomac has been negative, he's a guy who should have...
I would have to call bullshit on that statement because probably every comment I've made about Tomac has been negative, he's a guy who should have been a multiple time SX champion. I have said multiple times he's not my favorite rider but I don't believe I have ever used the word hate about any rider. I'm basing that on last year when Webb owned Tomac. I think the days of Tomac winning half the races have passed. Webb may not look like he was dominant but he won what 7 or 8 last year, most of Tomacs wins were when Webb was managing the title. You put Roczen in the mix and there's no room for the kind of weekends Tomac has had his entire 450 career. Had Webb not started out the season sick I think that would be more obvious.
You are delusional. Your “hate” is clear. Just own it and you’ll get at least some respect.
RandyS wrote:
Not looking for respect on the internet, and saying a guy who has failed to deliver every year he has been in the big boy class...
Not looking for respect on the internet, and saying a guy who has failed to deliver every year he has been in the big boy class despite being the fastest rider much of the time isn't hate, it's the truth. I was called a racist by Stewart fanboys for pointing out the same thing, Stewart at least delivered titles occasionally. Who got second last night?
Failed to deliver means not winning multiple SX titles? That label applies to every single rider on the starting line last night!
That includes KR, Osborne, Bagget, Wilson, Barcia, Mookie, Savatgy, Plessinger, Hill, Tickle, MM, Seely, and on and on.
Barcia or Bagget get one podium and everyone be like wow he sure is showing heart this year. lol
Why single out Tomac?
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deluxeman
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2/16/2020 9:37am
Leopards don’t change their spots. Eli will Eli at some point.

My point with Eli is he couldn’t even beat Dungey in 17 when Dungey didn’t even want to race. He won 9 races that year and couldn’t seal the deal. Anderson beat him with good consistent rides, Webb straight up beat him.

Outdoors is a different story. His style works much better in motocross, it is not so start dependent and the races are longer and there is two of them. It favors raw speed and fitness over good starts and racecraft.
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cityjack
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2/16/2020 11:26am
Whatever he does, we should take the time to enjoy his crazy fast ass skills. He won't be racing forever and will head to the hills to enjoy his new bow of choice and family.
Time is short enjoy him while we have him. Nobody can do what he does and who knows when there will be anybody close.

Enjoy!
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gantry25
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2/16/2020 11:42am
Webb's problem is that he has to hope that Eli has an off night, he is not as fast as Eli. Eli only needs to keep doing what he is doing and he will continue to build a points lead over Coop and Roczen. This looks to be Eli's year.
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2/16/2020 11:44am
That red plate seems to be heavy in the stadiums for Eli.
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resetjet
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2/16/2020 11:46am
The red plate is so heavy to tomac. We will see.
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2/16/2020 11:55am
deluxeman wrote:
Leopards don’t change their spots. Eli will Eli at some point. My point with Eli is he couldn’t even beat Dungey in 17 when Dungey didn’t...
Leopards don’t change their spots. Eli will Eli at some point.

My point with Eli is he couldn’t even beat Dungey in 17 when Dungey didn’t even want to race. He won 9 races that year and couldn’t seal the deal. Anderson beat him with good consistent rides, Webb straight up beat him.

Outdoors is a different story. His style works much better in motocross, it is not so start dependent and the races are longer and there is two of them. It favors raw speed and fitness over good starts and racecraft.
As downvoted as this has been, this is the smartest reply. Yes, Eli can absolutely dazzle us, but he is just as prone to the odd meltdown. And if Webb (who has taken Musquin's place as Mr. Consistent this season) keeps up the good work, even ONE Tomac goof-off could be fatal to the 3's championship hopes.
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Crossup
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2/16/2020 12:07pm
NateDawg wrote:
Serious question, has Tomac ever DNF'd a Supercross race that wasn't caused by a mechanical? Because I see no historical basis for your statement.
Crossup wrote:
You are wrong. Tomac DNF'd 2013 Rnd 4, and DNS 2018 Rnd 2. It doesn't matter why, but it did happened. So it has and can...
You are wrong. Tomac DNF'd 2013 Rnd 4, and DNS 2018 Rnd 2. It doesn't matter why, but it did happened. So it has and can happen.
NateDawg wrote:
I can't be wrong when I didn't make a statement...I asked a question so calm your tits. So he's DNF'd/DNS'd one race since 2013?? That's not...
I can't be wrong when I didn't make a statement...I asked a question so calm your tits.

So he's DNF'd/DNS'd one race since 2013?? That's not very good support for your argument, lol.
You said there's no historical basis... so you're wrong.
NateDawg
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2/16/2020 12:12pm
Crossup wrote:
You are wrong. Tomac DNF'd 2013 Rnd 4, and DNS 2018 Rnd 2. It doesn't matter why, but it did happened. So it has and can...
You are wrong. Tomac DNF'd 2013 Rnd 4, and DNS 2018 Rnd 2. It doesn't matter why, but it did happened. So it has and can happen.
NateDawg wrote:
I can't be wrong when I didn't make a statement...I asked a question so calm your tits. So he's DNF'd/DNS'd one race since 2013?? That's not...
I can't be wrong when I didn't make a statement...I asked a question so calm your tits.

So he's DNF'd/DNS'd one race since 2013?? That's not very good support for your argument, lol.
Crossup wrote:
You said there's no historical basis... so you're wrong.
I said there's no historical basis to say Tomac is sure to have a DNF/DNS this year. You pointing out that it has only happened once since 2013 actually supports my argument, dumbass... Eli hasn't had one in 7 years so history suggests it's not likely he'll have one this year. Did I spell that out enough for you?
2/16/2020 12:15pm
deluxeman wrote:
Leopards don’t change their spots. Eli will Eli at some point. My point with Eli is he couldn’t even beat Dungey in 17 when Dungey didn’t...
Leopards don’t change their spots. Eli will Eli at some point.

My point with Eli is he couldn’t even beat Dungey in 17 when Dungey didn’t even want to race. He won 9 races that year and couldn’t seal the deal. Anderson beat him with good consistent rides, Webb straight up beat him.

Outdoors is a different story. His style works much better in motocross, it is not so start dependent and the races are longer and there is two of them. It favors raw speed and fitness over good starts and racecraft.
As downvoted as this has been, this is the smartest reply. Yes, Eli can absolutely dazzle us, but he is just as prone to the odd...
As downvoted as this has been, this is the smartest reply. Yes, Eli can absolutely dazzle us, but he is just as prone to the odd meltdown. And if Webb (who has taken Musquin's place as Mr. Consistent this season) keeps up the good work, even ONE Tomac goof-off could be fatal to the 3's championship hopes.
Except Eli is riding different this year. Its very noticeable IMO. Eli of the past would have won last nights race by 30 seconds or crashed out and finished 5th. Last night, he "managed" the race and won handily. His fastest lap was about 0.8 seconds faster than the rest of the fast guys in the field. He seems more willing to settle on nights where he's not feeling it. He also took his time passing Adam and didn't pressure the issue where in the past, he would have just blown by people early to try and get a lead (then wash the front end trying to do so).

I think Eli is riding at that ~98-99% as opposed to the 101-102%.

I also think its worth nothing that there are more riders in the mix this season that can get between Eli and Cooper (Anderson is back and healthy, Barcia is riding better, AC is in the mix, and Kenny is as strong as he has been in a long time, and on any given weekend Osborne and Baggett could be in the top 5, or even podium). This isn't a 2 horse race.
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2/16/2020 3:06pm
deluxeman wrote:
Leopards don’t change their spots. Eli will Eli at some point. My point with Eli is he couldn’t even beat Dungey in 17 when Dungey didn’t...
Leopards don’t change their spots. Eli will Eli at some point.

My point with Eli is he couldn’t even beat Dungey in 17 when Dungey didn’t even want to race. He won 9 races that year and couldn’t seal the deal. Anderson beat him with good consistent rides, Webb straight up beat him.

Outdoors is a different story. His style works much better in motocross, it is not so start dependent and the races are longer and there is two of them. It favors raw speed and fitness over good starts and racecraft.
As downvoted as this has been, this is the smartest reply. Yes, Eli can absolutely dazzle us, but he is just as prone to the odd...
As downvoted as this has been, this is the smartest reply. Yes, Eli can absolutely dazzle us, but he is just as prone to the odd meltdown. And if Webb (who has taken Musquin's place as Mr. Consistent this season) keeps up the good work, even ONE Tomac goof-off could be fatal to the 3's championship hopes.
TbonesPop wrote:
Except Eli is riding different this year. Its very noticeable IMO. Eli of the past would have won last nights race by 30 seconds or crashed...
Except Eli is riding different this year. Its very noticeable IMO. Eli of the past would have won last nights race by 30 seconds or crashed out and finished 5th. Last night, he "managed" the race and won handily. His fastest lap was about 0.8 seconds faster than the rest of the fast guys in the field. He seems more willing to settle on nights where he's not feeling it. He also took his time passing Adam and didn't pressure the issue where in the past, he would have just blown by people early to try and get a lead (then wash the front end trying to do so).

I think Eli is riding at that ~98-99% as opposed to the 101-102%.

I also think its worth nothing that there are more riders in the mix this season that can get between Eli and Cooper (Anderson is back and healthy, Barcia is riding better, AC is in the mix, and Kenny is as strong as he has been in a long time, and on any given weekend Osborne and Baggett could be in the top 5, or even podium). This isn't a 2 horse race.
Yeah, this is his best start to the season yet. And don't get me wrong, my odds are on him, too. BUT you can't entirely write off his checkered past over a string of good early races (he has had absolutely BRILLIANT races every season!) and claim with 100% certainty that the hot streak will continue, and that Webb/Roczen/everyone else will keep eating his dust.
SWOHIO GUY
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2/16/2020 3:22pm Edited Date/Time 2/16/2020 3:23pm
It seems to me that Eli’s highs and lows are much closer together than they ever have been. Since 2018 at Indy, I think he has only had 3 races outside the top 10. 2018 Red Bud National and MXDN qualifier which were both mechanicals and a 12th at Arlington last year. We’re talking about 75+ Mains/motos where he has only had 1 race outside the top 10 that was his fault.

The Eli is going to Eli is the biggest sack of shit I have ever heard!
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toroP
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2/16/2020 3:25pm
SWOHIO GUY wrote:
I am not saying he didn’t. But his 3 titles were without his stiffest competition racing the full series. Very similar to Dungey, he was always...
I am not saying he didn’t. But his 3 titles were without his stiffest competition racing the full series. Very similar to Dungey, he was always 2nd-4th consistently that could steal a few wins here and there. But not on the same level as Ricky, James, or Villopoto.
yz133rider wrote:
Dude you're so off. Dungey is 2nd all time to only Carmichael in all time mx wins. Hes 4th all time in combined professional wins (250...
Dude you're so off. Dungey is 2nd all time to only Carmichael in all time mx wins. Hes 4th all time in combined professional wins (250 and 450s combined mx and sx combined)

Dungey did a ton of winning. Clearly.

Reed is also 4th all time in supercross wins and 10th overall in combined wins.

Dungey also left alot of wins and titles on the table
SWOHIO GUY wrote:
When comparing the all time greats of an era you get into the territory of splitting hairs. When comparing Reed to Ricky and James, my knock...
When comparing the all time greats of an era you get into the territory of splitting hairs. When comparing Reed to Ricky and James, my knock there is he never won a title against them when they all raced the whole series. He was damn close in 2003, 2006, 2007, and 2009. Also really close in 2011 in MX and SX against Villopoto, Dungey, and James. He won his titles in 04 without Ricky, 08 without James, and 09 MX without James. He’s an all time great but that hurts when comparing him to other greats. Dungey is a similar thing for me, he never beat Villopoto straight up for a title.

Reed and Dungey are both in the top 3% of the sports history but when comparing them to the other guys in that territory you start splitting hairs.
Funny that nobody notes that James never won a title against Ricky.
So who did James beat that validates his titles?
And who was the big shot that Ricky beat in 2003?
The truth is, Chad is one of the greats. Period. Chad had a win taken from him in 2004, and still beat Windham.
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SWOHIO GUY
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2/16/2020 3:27pm
yz133rider wrote:
Dude you're so off. Dungey is 2nd all time to only Carmichael in all time mx wins. Hes 4th all time in combined professional wins (250...
Dude you're so off. Dungey is 2nd all time to only Carmichael in all time mx wins. Hes 4th all time in combined professional wins (250 and 450s combined mx and sx combined)

Dungey did a ton of winning. Clearly.

Reed is also 4th all time in supercross wins and 10th overall in combined wins.

Dungey also left alot of wins and titles on the table
SWOHIO GUY wrote:
When comparing the all time greats of an era you get into the territory of splitting hairs. When comparing Reed to Ricky and James, my knock...
When comparing the all time greats of an era you get into the territory of splitting hairs. When comparing Reed to Ricky and James, my knock there is he never won a title against them when they all raced the whole series. He was damn close in 2003, 2006, 2007, and 2009. Also really close in 2011 in MX and SX against Villopoto, Dungey, and James. He won his titles in 04 without Ricky, 08 without James, and 09 MX without James. He’s an all time great but that hurts when comparing him to other greats. Dungey is a similar thing for me, he never beat Villopoto straight up for a title.

Reed and Dungey are both in the top 3% of the sports history but when comparing them to the other guys in that territory you start splitting hairs.
toroP wrote:
Funny that nobody notes that James never won a title against Ricky. So who did James beat that validates his titles? And who was the big...
Funny that nobody notes that James never won a title against Ricky.
So who did James beat that validates his titles?
And who was the big shot that Ricky beat in 2003?
The truth is, Chad is one of the greats. Period. Chad had a win taken from him in 2004, and still beat Windham.
I never said Chad wasn’t one of the greats and Stew beat chad in 2007 and 2009 straight up!
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2/16/2020 3:42pm
SWOHIO GUY wrote:
When comparing the all time greats of an era you get into the territory of splitting hairs. When comparing Reed to Ricky and James, my knock...
When comparing the all time greats of an era you get into the territory of splitting hairs. When comparing Reed to Ricky and James, my knock there is he never won a title against them when they all raced the whole series. He was damn close in 2003, 2006, 2007, and 2009. Also really close in 2011 in MX and SX against Villopoto, Dungey, and James. He won his titles in 04 without Ricky, 08 without James, and 09 MX without James. He’s an all time great but that hurts when comparing him to other greats. Dungey is a similar thing for me, he never beat Villopoto straight up for a title.

Reed and Dungey are both in the top 3% of the sports history but when comparing them to the other guys in that territory you start splitting hairs.
toroP wrote:
Funny that nobody notes that James never won a title against Ricky. So who did James beat that validates his titles? And who was the big...
Funny that nobody notes that James never won a title against Ricky.
So who did James beat that validates his titles?
And who was the big shot that Ricky beat in 2003?
The truth is, Chad is one of the greats. Period. Chad had a win taken from him in 2004, and still beat Windham.
SWOHIO GUY wrote:
I never said Chad wasn’t one of the greats and Stew beat chad in 2007 and 2009 straight up!
Haha, Stew kicked Chads arse all over the show indoors and out. But this is about Mr Inconsistent. Do I think he'll win the championship? Yes.
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