Any thoughts about Ramon's neck injury and his Leatt?

DrSweden
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Edited Date/Time 1/26/2012 12:37am
Based on what I know (not enought), I'm still wearing mine, but his C7 injury and him wearing a Leatt are of great interest for me and many others that put in our fait and cash in the Leatt.

Maybe his Leatt saved his neck, but the force on an extension impact would focus the energy on the area around the C7 vertebrae, and he got a fracture on the C7.

I'm wearing my Leatt outside my chest protector which is not optimal? but the same impact would in this case spread the energy on my chest protector and on my back protector (UFO style).

So the Leatt is still great it seems? but that neck plate needs to be bigger so the energy gets more spread? What's your thoughts?
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Ashleymx
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5/17/2009 6:12am
Id like to put the Alpinestar back plate on the Leatt. If it could be done we'd have the best of both I believe.
lumpy790
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5/17/2009 6:27am
Protective devices can only do so much. They do help in most situations but we are always at some degree of risk.

We wear helmets.......Why do we still get concussions???
DrSweden
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5/17/2009 6:28am
Ashleymx wrote:
Id like to put the Alpinestar back plate on the Leatt. If it could be done we'd have the best of both I believe.
Yes! Who said competition is bad? I guess then Alpinestars will sue back? Smile
KAWboy14
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5/17/2009 6:45am
i broke my foot one time wearing boots.....

The Shop

zookrider62!
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5/17/2009 7:13am
lumpy790 wrote:
Protective devices can only do so much. They do help in most situations but we are always at some degree of risk. We wear helmets.......Why do...
Protective devices can only do so much. They do help in most situations but we are always at some degree of risk.

We wear helmets.......Why do we still get concussions???
Helmets arent made for concussions
Ashleymx
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5/17/2009 7:20am
lumpy790 wrote:
Protective devices can only do so much. They do help in most situations but we are always at some degree of risk. We wear helmets.......Why do...
Protective devices can only do so much. They do help in most situations but we are always at some degree of risk.

We wear helmets.......Why do we still get concussions???
I dont really get your argument. Its obvious those concussions would have been death or at least serious brain damage if the helmet was not worn.
todder
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5/17/2009 7:46am Edited Date/Time 5/17/2009 7:48am
I heard something interesting regarding concussions. I help out with my sons football team and a sports doctor talked to us about the importance of a proper mouth guard. He said the Majority of severe consussions come from the jaw getting slammed shut very hard and the shock from the teeth slamming together is very bad on the brain. A properly fit mouth guard cuts those type of concussions by 80% or more. As many times as I have smacked my jaw on the bars over the years I can see how that might be a big help in MX. I know of nobody really who wears a mouthguard in mx. I thought that was good info. Thanks.
mr50racer
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5/17/2009 7:58am
DrSweden wrote:
Based on what I know (not enought), I'm still wearing mine, but his C7 injury and him wearing a Leatt are of great interest for me...
Based on what I know (not enought), I'm still wearing mine, but his C7 injury and him wearing a Leatt are of great interest for me and many others that put in our fait and cash in the Leatt.

Maybe his Leatt saved his neck, but the force on an extension impact would focus the energy on the area around the C7 vertebrae, and he got a fracture on the C7.

I'm wearing my Leatt outside my chest protector which is not optimal? but the same impact would in this case spread the energy on my chest protector and on my back protector (UFO style).

So the Leatt is still great it seems? but that neck plate needs to be bigger so the energy gets more spread? What's your thoughts?
I think if he wasn't wearing it he might have been in a wheelchair......
todder
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5/17/2009 8:02am
Dr Sweden, I think there is a problem in your post by saying you are putting your faith in the Leatt. That is the wrong attitude I think. You cant still break your neck with a Leatt or worse. Each time you get into your car and buckle up you know your chances are bettter with your seat belt but you could still get hurt or killed in a bad crash. Same thing. Your odds are better but it wont exclude you completely.
5/17/2009 9:23am
One thing I have noticed is there are far less posts about injured riders this past year or so in regards to neck injuries.
Just an observation maybe not the fact.
Yamaha24
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5/17/2009 10:20am
Its dumb how everyone thinks if you wear the leatt your invinceable. It's just an extra step to take to try an prevent serious injuries. I wear $400 dollar boots....and still broke my foot....you can't expect the leatt to stop all injuries!
DrSweden
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5/17/2009 10:46am
todder wrote:
Dr Sweden, I think there is a problem in your post by saying you are putting your faith in the Leatt. That is the wrong attitude...
Dr Sweden, I think there is a problem in your post by saying you are putting your faith in the Leatt. That is the wrong attitude I think. You cant still break your neck with a Leatt or worse. Each time you get into your car and buckle up you know your chances are bettter with your seat belt but you could still get hurt or killed in a bad crash. Same thing. Your odds are better but it wont exclude you completely.
"Faith" maybe was to strong. I just want to feel a bit safer and delete some of that anxiety I have. Sad

I want all cards on the table that's all and maybe discussions like this makes the Leatt even safer! Smile
level
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5/17/2009 10:47am
todder wrote:
I heard something interesting regarding concussions. I help out with my sons football team and a sports doctor talked to us about the importance of a...
I heard something interesting regarding concussions. I help out with my sons football team and a sports doctor talked to us about the importance of a proper mouth guard. He said the Majority of severe consussions come from the jaw getting slammed shut very hard and the shock from the teeth slamming together is very bad on the brain. A properly fit mouth guard cuts those type of concussions by 80% or more. As many times as I have smacked my jaw on the bars over the years I can see how that might be a big help in MX. I know of nobody really who wears a mouthguard in mx. I thought that was good info. Thanks.
I wore one a couple times but couldn't get used to wearing it. I came down hard and my teeth slammed together and your right it rattled my brain. That's why I started wearing it. I may consider to start wearing one again if I can find one that is comfortable. It is a good idea.
09450f
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5/17/2009 11:02am
todder wrote:
I heard something interesting regarding concussions. I help out with my sons football team and a sports doctor talked to us about the importance of a...
I heard something interesting regarding concussions. I help out with my sons football team and a sports doctor talked to us about the importance of a proper mouth guard. He said the Majority of severe consussions come from the jaw getting slammed shut very hard and the shock from the teeth slamming together is very bad on the brain. A properly fit mouth guard cuts those type of concussions by 80% or more. As many times as I have smacked my jaw on the bars over the years I can see how that might be a big help in MX. I know of nobody really who wears a mouthguard in mx. I thought that was good info. Thanks.
level wrote:
I wore one a couple times but couldn't get used to wearing it. I came down hard and my teeth slammed together and your right it...
I wore one a couple times but couldn't get used to wearing it. I came down hard and my teeth slammed together and your right it rattled my brain. That's why I started wearing it. I may consider to start wearing one again if I can find one that is comfortable. It is a good idea.
interesting..thanx
mmcmx
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5/17/2009 11:36am
todder wrote:
I heard something interesting regarding concussions. I help out with my sons football team and a sports doctor talked to us about the importance of a...
I heard something interesting regarding concussions. I help out with my sons football team and a sports doctor talked to us about the importance of a proper mouth guard. He said the Majority of severe consussions come from the jaw getting slammed shut very hard and the shock from the teeth slamming together is very bad on the brain. A properly fit mouth guard cuts those type of concussions by 80% or more. As many times as I have smacked my jaw on the bars over the years I can see how that might be a big help in MX. I know of nobody really who wears a mouthguard in mx. I thought that was good info. Thanks.
level wrote:
I wore one a couple times but couldn't get used to wearing it. I came down hard and my teeth slammed together and your right it...
I wore one a couple times but couldn't get used to wearing it. I came down hard and my teeth slammed together and your right it rattled my brain. That's why I started wearing it. I may consider to start wearing one again if I can find one that is comfortable. It is a good idea.
09450f wrote:
interesting..thanx
wow, i'll try my kick boxing one, at least i'm used to it!
5/17/2009 12:21pm
level wrote:
I wore one a couple times but couldn't get used to wearing it. I came down hard and my teeth slammed together and your right it...
I wore one a couple times but couldn't get used to wearing it. I came down hard and my teeth slammed together and your right it rattled my brain. That's why I started wearing it. I may consider to start wearing one again if I can find one that is comfortable. It is a good idea.
Shock Doctor is the way to go. I got a Gravity Lower Mouth Guard and won't ride without it. I got one because I was grinding my teeth and didn't want to ruin all the work braces did. Motosport Outlet and sporting goods stores can get you one.
The Rock
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5/17/2009 12:45pm
todder wrote:
I heard something interesting regarding concussions. I help out with my sons football team and a sports doctor talked to us about the importance of a...
I heard something interesting regarding concussions. I help out with my sons football team and a sports doctor talked to us about the importance of a proper mouth guard. He said the Majority of severe consussions come from the jaw getting slammed shut very hard and the shock from the teeth slamming together is very bad on the brain. A properly fit mouth guard cuts those type of concussions by 80% or more. As many times as I have smacked my jaw on the bars over the years I can see how that might be a big help in MX. I know of nobody really who wears a mouthguard in mx. I thought that was good info. Thanks.
I used to wear a mouthguard.....it was a Jofa
devindavis410
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5/17/2009 12:56pm
think about this

you can get a concussion wearing a helmet

okay, yeah? think about what would happen if you werent wearing a helmet... dead?
MX45
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5/17/2009 1:31pm
"So the Leatt is still great it seems? but that neck plate needs to be bigger so the energy gets more spread? What's your thoughts?"

I've always thought the point of contact spots on the leatt were too small. lbs per square inch common sense says this is bad.
I havnt seen an alpinestars one in person, but it appears it would spread the load better.
5/17/2009 1:33pm
todder wrote:
I heard something interesting regarding concussions. I help out with my sons football team and a sports doctor talked to us about the importance of a...
I heard something interesting regarding concussions. I help out with my sons football team and a sports doctor talked to us about the importance of a proper mouth guard. He said the Majority of severe consussions come from the jaw getting slammed shut very hard and the shock from the teeth slamming together is very bad on the brain. A properly fit mouth guard cuts those type of concussions by 80% or more. As many times as I have smacked my jaw on the bars over the years I can see how that might be a big help in MX. I know of nobody really who wears a mouthguard in mx. I thought that was good info. Thanks.
level wrote:
I wore one a couple times but couldn't get used to wearing it. I came down hard and my teeth slammed together and your right it...
I wore one a couple times but couldn't get used to wearing it. I came down hard and my teeth slammed together and your right it rattled my brain. That's why I started wearing it. I may consider to start wearing one again if I can find one that is comfortable. It is a good idea.
a riding buddy of mine uses one for that reason id had never heard of it before but he wont ride with out it. i started looking into them after that just havent bought one yet...
todder
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5/17/2009 1:46pm
The local dentist fits our football team with custom ones, they are pretty cheap. Maybe they will even give you one if you put a sticker on your trailer. Most Dentists are locally operated and might like the advertising.
Jabjr222
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5/17/2009 1:47pm
There is no proof those braces have ever saved anyone. There was a need and a market and a company came in with a product.

I'm not arguing against them although I have been very vocal in people putting their faith in them and all the nonsense about how anyone who crashed while wearing one would be dead or paralyzed had they not been wearing a brace.

Remember the incidence of catastrophic spinal injuries before the Leatts and look at them now. I want to see the research if anyone has it. Someone has to have the data.
DrSweden
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5/17/2009 2:31pm
MX45 wrote:
"So the Leatt is still great it seems? but that neck plate needs to be bigger so the energy gets more spread? What's your thoughts?" I've...
"So the Leatt is still great it seems? but that neck plate needs to be bigger so the energy gets more spread? What's your thoughts?"

I've always thought the point of contact spots on the leatt were too small. lbs per square inch common sense says this is bad.
I havnt seen an alpinestars one in person, but it appears it would spread the load better.
Yes, and now we have a rider with a fractured C7. I don't get why we talk about teeth all of a sudden?

Didn't Mard DeReuver talk about a buddy of his that could penetrated by the same piece on the Leatt?
redrider52
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5/17/2009 2:50pm
KAWboy14 wrote:
i broke my foot one time wearing boots.....
Have you read the article about Izzi's crash on vurbmoto.com? It's messed up, go check it. out
DrSweden
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5/17/2009 2:55pm
redrider52 wrote:
Have you read the article about Izzi's crash on vurbmoto.com? It's messed up, go check it. out
Is it possible to talk about the Leatt? Is the question really THAT boring?
todder
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5/17/2009 2:59pm
Wear the Leatt Doc. Your odds are better. Period.
andymoto
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5/17/2009 5:09pm Edited Date/Time 4/16/2016 11:57pm
Jabjr222 wrote:
There is no proof those braces have ever saved anyone. There was a need and a market and a company came in with a product. I'm...
There is no proof those braces have ever saved anyone. There was a need and a market and a company came in with a product.

I'm not arguing against them although I have been very vocal in people putting their faith in them and all the nonsense about how anyone who crashed while wearing one would be dead or paralyzed had they not been wearing a brace.

Remember the incidence of catastrophic spinal injuries before the Leatts and look at them now. I want to see the research if anyone has it. Someone has to have the data.
So you're basically saying all this is a sham; a couple of companies like Leatt and Alpinestar put their names and reputations on a product that have never addressed the neck area before....?

You do the research if you think these things haven't saved one from catastrophic injury.

You think both these companies just use crash test dummies instead of the millions of R&D dollars having imput from experts like orthopedic doctors, neurological specialist and so forth.....They just get an idea and use no science....your nuts.

Their names and reputations are on the line and it sure sounds like you think they both are out fleecing the riders that use them.

You must ride without a helmet.

Jabjr222
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5/18/2009 1:57am
Andy....

What I was addressing is how everyone now says whenever someone crashes that their neckbrace saved them from a catastrophic injury. I hate that. Seriously, "dude, did you see Sammy crash? Yeah, if it wasn't for his Leatt he would be in a chair," or "He only broke his C7 and if he hadn't worn his brace he'd be toast." That's what I have a problem with.

What I am saying is that we need to look at the long term effectiveness of the braces and whether they are cutting down on the number of catastrophic injuries. I hear people all the time say a brace saved someone... well, how do you know? I mean, I know we are all personally involved and the mind wants to believe what it is wants to believe.

Show the research. Its not there and it can't be. Sure, they test it on dummies and because we don't all crash in controlled ways in controlled environments a direct correlation can't really be drawn. In theory, it sounds great. But in practical application, who knows. Only long term testing will let us know.

I give the companies kudos for trying to solve a serious issue and keep us safe, but don't fool yourself. There was an open market and a pool of consumers with disposable income.

I mean, if you know something (other than your assumptions), please let us know. I mean, give us scientific evidence other than what you want to believe.
jemcee
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5/18/2009 3:46am
Jabjr222 wrote:
Andy.... What I was addressing is how everyone now says whenever someone crashes that their neckbrace saved them from a catastrophic injury. I hate that. Seriously...
Andy....

What I was addressing is how everyone now says whenever someone crashes that their neckbrace saved them from a catastrophic injury. I hate that. Seriously, "dude, did you see Sammy crash? Yeah, if it wasn't for his Leatt he would be in a chair," or "He only broke his C7 and if he hadn't worn his brace he'd be toast." That's what I have a problem with.

What I am saying is that we need to look at the long term effectiveness of the braces and whether they are cutting down on the number of catastrophic injuries. I hear people all the time say a brace saved someone... well, how do you know? I mean, I know we are all personally involved and the mind wants to believe what it is wants to believe.

Show the research. Its not there and it can't be. Sure, they test it on dummies and because we don't all crash in controlled ways in controlled environments a direct correlation can't really be drawn. In theory, it sounds great. But in practical application, who knows. Only long term testing will let us know.

I give the companies kudos for trying to solve a serious issue and keep us safe, but don't fool yourself. There was an open market and a pool of consumers with disposable income.

I mean, if you know something (other than your assumptions), please let us know. I mean, give us scientific evidence other than what you want to believe.
well i don't know for absolute sure but i put one on the other day and i'm pretty certain it would have saved me..
i broke mine cause i landed square on top of my head..

and level you won't wear yours cause it wasn't comfortable? try livin in a chair champ

"he only broke his C7" what? thats what i broke! C7 or T1 or whatever is the level of paralysis!

I don't care what anyone says they should be compulsory
Ashleymx
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5/18/2009 4:25am Edited Date/Time 5/18/2009 4:27am
Jabjr222 wrote:
Andy.... What I was addressing is how everyone now says whenever someone crashes that their neckbrace saved them from a catastrophic injury. I hate that. Seriously...
Andy....

What I was addressing is how everyone now says whenever someone crashes that their neckbrace saved them from a catastrophic injury. I hate that. Seriously, "dude, did you see Sammy crash? Yeah, if it wasn't for his Leatt he would be in a chair," or "He only broke his C7 and if he hadn't worn his brace he'd be toast." That's what I have a problem with.

What I am saying is that we need to look at the long term effectiveness of the braces and whether they are cutting down on the number of catastrophic injuries. I hear people all the time say a brace saved someone... well, how do you know? I mean, I know we are all personally involved and the mind wants to believe what it is wants to believe.

Show the research. Its not there and it can't be. Sure, they test it on dummies and because we don't all crash in controlled ways in controlled environments a direct correlation can't really be drawn. In theory, it sounds great. But in practical application, who knows. Only long term testing will let us know.

I give the companies kudos for trying to solve a serious issue and keep us safe, but don't fool yourself. There was an open market and a pool of consumers with disposable income.

I mean, if you know something (other than your assumptions), please let us know. I mean, give us scientific evidence other than what you want to believe.
Id rather hear them say "It saved me all day long" than "I wish I was wearing one"! The only way to have statistical evidence is if everyone wears them for the next 5 - 10 years and crashes as per normal. So do your bit to help and wear one if you want statistical evidence. In theory they work, maybe thats all we have for now. Its good enough for me anyway. I also know my buddy wouldnt be a quad today if he had of crashed post neck brace creation.

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