Best VP fuel for stock 4 stroke

JBecker 72
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JBecker 72 3/8/2017 5:23am
3/8/2017 5:23am
T4 for the four strokes, and T2 for the two strokes. E10 pump gas is garbage.
mxb2
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mxb2 3/8/2017 6:48am
3/8/2017 6:48am
JBecker 72 wrote:
T4 for the four strokes, and T2 for the two strokes. E10 pump gas is garbage.
X2 or low end renegade
pbody
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pbody 3/8/2017 7:38am
3/8/2017 7:38am
Just confirming what everyone else has said......for stock use, no mapping use T4.

Been using it in my 4 strokes for over a year now and have had no problems. Bikes sit for 30+ days a couple of times and start-up and runs with no problem.
rclmx159
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rclmx159 3/8/2017 7:38am
3/8/2017 7:38am
I have use VP C12 in my 2012 CRF250R with no problems.

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rclmx159
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rclmx159 3/8/2017 7:39am
3/8/2017 7:39am
No remapping either. Runs great.
sesker15
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sesker15 3/8/2017 7:41am
3/8/2017 7:41am
VP has a new T4 out. It is called T4E!
JBecker 72
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JBecker 72 3/8/2017 9:00am
3/8/2017 9:00am Edited Date/Time 3/8/2017 9:01am
sesker15 wrote:
VP has a new T4 out. It is called T4E!
That has ethanol in it. From what I understand, some areas won't allow non ethanol blended fuels to be sold. If you have the choice, regular T2/T4 is the better option.
redrider_714
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redrider_714 3/8/2017 9:08am
3/8/2017 9:08am
So should I pass on the VPR or would it be okay to use?
rrjr
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rrjr 3/8/2017 5:25pm
3/8/2017 5:25pm
I use C12 in my weed wacker and chainsaw and they run freaking great. Not sure how that helps the OP but I just wanted to throw that out there.
TeamGreen
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TeamGreen 3/8/2017 5:38pm
3/8/2017 5:38pm
Compared good non-ethanol pump premium to VP T-4 in a 2017 RMZ450 and 2017 Husky FC350 today.

They BOTH Accelerated Better out of turns and were "snappier" on the T-4.

Period.
RickA
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RickA 3/8/2017 5:45pm
3/8/2017 5:45pm Edited Date/Time 3/8/2017 5:46pm
gharmon wrote:
If race fuel isnt warranted it will COST you horsepower. I'm not talking about the oxygenated stuff. But say VP 112/116. That stuff is to prevent...
If race fuel isnt warranted it will COST you horsepower. I'm not talking about the oxygenated stuff. But say VP 112/116. That stuff is to prevent detonation not make horsepower. I know this is cars but back when I used to drag race cars a lot they did a dyno test with pump gas (93) and race gas VP112. On a fairly stock 5.0 mustang the car made over 6 more hp with pump gas over race gas! If the motor doesn't need the high octane you are wasting money and losing power. To my knowledge, all modern 4 strokes run fine on 93 pump gasoline.
731chopper wrote:
T-4 is basically quality premium pump gas with 0 Ethenol. I've got firsthand experience with what Ethenol does and won't let it run in my 250F...
T-4 is basically quality premium pump gas with 0 Ethenol. I've got firsthand experience with what Ethenol does and won't let it run in my 250F. I've got some other play bikes that I just run the cheap premium pump gas in but have to do a lot more fiddling and cleaning in the fuel delivery system because of it. I've been very happy with VP and unlike other race fuels, there's no Ethenol.
Ethanol is a good fuel. Lots of myths..
if you take a motor and run it on straight methanol, or straight ethanol, you will benefit in performance. Better latent heat dissipation, intake cooling upon evaporation, need to burn MORE of it (btu's) and an Octane rating of 100+. Yes, I know, people will say it has fewer BTUs than gasoline, but then they don't know your required to burn twice as much for combustion.. hence, more BTUs. Approx 5.7:1 methanol and 12:1 gasoline for peak power.

I run E85 in my drag car, I gained .2 in a quarter mile over gasoline. 100LL Avgas (no ethanol) gave me no benefits. That's my experience anyway, aside shitty mileage, I'm not scared of it.

(I should add subsidizing it, makes it a shitty fuel)
731chopper
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731chopper 3/8/2017 5:56pm
3/8/2017 5:56pm
RickA wrote:
Ethanol is a good fuel. Lots of myths.. if you take a motor and run it on straight methanol, or straight ethanol, you will benefit in...
Ethanol is a good fuel. Lots of myths..
if you take a motor and run it on straight methanol, or straight ethanol, you will benefit in performance. Better latent heat dissipation, intake cooling upon evaporation, need to burn MORE of it (btu's) and an Octane rating of 100+. Yes, I know, people will say it has fewer BTUs than gasoline, but then they don't know your required to burn twice as much for combustion.. hence, more BTUs. Approx 5.7:1 methanol and 12:1 gasoline for peak power.

I run E85 in my drag car, I gained .2 in a quarter mile over gasoline. 100LL Avgas (no ethanol) gave me no benefits. That's my experience anyway, aside shitty mileage, I'm not scared of it.

(I should add subsidizing it, makes it a shitty fuel)
I've heard that pure ethenol is a great fuel when it's fresh in motors built to run it. I don't think my little dirt bike motors were though and I've seen what it does to carbs and fuel lines when it sits for extended periods of time so I prefer not to have it blended in my fuel when I have a choice. I'm not a chemist or a master engine builder though so everyone can take my opinion with a grain of salt.
RickA
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RickA 3/8/2017 6:08pm
3/8/2017 6:08pm Edited Date/Time 3/8/2017 6:08pm
RickA wrote:
Ethanol is a good fuel. Lots of myths.. if you take a motor and run it on straight methanol, or straight ethanol, you will benefit in...
Ethanol is a good fuel. Lots of myths..
if you take a motor and run it on straight methanol, or straight ethanol, you will benefit in performance. Better latent heat dissipation, intake cooling upon evaporation, need to burn MORE of it (btu's) and an Octane rating of 100+. Yes, I know, people will say it has fewer BTUs than gasoline, but then they don't know your required to burn twice as much for combustion.. hence, more BTUs. Approx 5.7:1 methanol and 12:1 gasoline for peak power.

I run E85 in my drag car, I gained .2 in a quarter mile over gasoline. 100LL Avgas (no ethanol) gave me no benefits. That's my experience anyway, aside shitty mileage, I'm not scared of it.

(I should add subsidizing it, makes it a shitty fuel)
731chopper wrote:
I've heard that pure ethenol is a great fuel when it's fresh in motors built to run it. I don't think my little dirt bike motors...
I've heard that pure ethenol is a great fuel when it's fresh in motors built to run it. I don't think my little dirt bike motors were though and I've seen what it does to carbs and fuel lines when it sits for extended periods of time so I prefer not to have it blended in my fuel when I have a choice. I'm not a chemist or a master engine builder though so everyone can take my opinion with a grain of salt.
I'm not sure what could be built differently, maybe switched up leaded bearings.
Alcohol does have issues.. when it's cold, it will not atomize, and it makes it way past rings.. diluting the oil. That's why monster trucks are now running SAE 60w. The right way to do it, is start the motor on gasoline (with a mustard bottle) and switch over to alcohol once it warms up a little..

Premium pump gas makes a big difference over standard pump fuel. Your right about that, I've noticed premium doesn't corrode up in a carb when it sits over the winter, like cheap fuel. I studied fuels quite a bit, but I'm also not an expert. I just worked in a R&D dept blowing shit up, and testing for a lot of years. You learn a LOT. Lots of funny stories that most people wouldn't believe, until they see it.
RickA
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RickA 3/8/2017 6:17pm
3/8/2017 6:17pm
RickA wrote:
Ethanol is a good fuel. Lots of myths.. if you take a motor and run it on straight methanol, or straight ethanol, you will benefit in...
Ethanol is a good fuel. Lots of myths..
if you take a motor and run it on straight methanol, or straight ethanol, you will benefit in performance. Better latent heat dissipation, intake cooling upon evaporation, need to burn MORE of it (btu's) and an Octane rating of 100+. Yes, I know, people will say it has fewer BTUs than gasoline, but then they don't know your required to burn twice as much for combustion.. hence, more BTUs. Approx 5.7:1 methanol and 12:1 gasoline for peak power.

I run E85 in my drag car, I gained .2 in a quarter mile over gasoline. 100LL Avgas (no ethanol) gave me no benefits. That's my experience anyway, aside shitty mileage, I'm not scared of it.

(I should add subsidizing it, makes it a shitty fuel)
731chopper wrote:
I've heard that pure ethenol is a great fuel when it's fresh in motors built to run it. I don't think my little dirt bike motors...
I've heard that pure ethenol is a great fuel when it's fresh in motors built to run it. I don't think my little dirt bike motors were though and I've seen what it does to carbs and fuel lines when it sits for extended periods of time so I prefer not to have it blended in my fuel when I have a choice. I'm not a chemist or a master engine builder though so everyone can take my opinion with a grain of salt.
We had a glass intake manifold and glass oil pan on a small block Chevy. You would be shocked.. when the motor is cold, raw fuel is pooling up and running down the runners like a liquid river. Your surprised the motor is even running.. half the runners barely get any fuel. That's why the intake needs heat. Once it's hot, it's like a nice mist.. Of course, that's a catch 22... block the heat to the intake and you make 35hp peak.. it just runs like shit when it's cold.

The oil pan is even more strange, the oil is whipped up into a froth and barely 1/2" of oil resides in the bottom of the pan (even with a windage tray). I can't believe a motor even maintains oil pressure.
Just thought you may find that interesting anyway..

I like VP U4, I also mix it 50/50 with premium pump gas. I can't say whether it makes a difference or not, certainly doesn't do shit for my laptimes. Just hope maybe it helps on a start
Derek Harris 3/8/2017 6:43pm
3/8/2017 6:43pm
Purely for power - which is the only reason you should run race fuel in a modern stock bike - run MR12 if cost is no object.

More power any pipe from bottom to top.
VP pro6 is ama legal and similar but prefers more mapping changes to timing than mr12.

If cost is of concern - I prefer VP ms109 over 4.4. The dyno likes both about equally - but I have a host of issues internally with corrosion on 4.4 on customer motors.

Mapping for maximum power is suggested - but if the bike has a "rich" setting go with that.

The majority of fuels listed by people here will make less power than regular pump gas without mapping. EFI bikes that dont sit months at a time have minimal fuel gumming issues. Modern pump gas WITH ethanol actually produce very good HP - and most bikes are mapped extremely well for modern pump fuel.


People are free to do what they want - but as the guy that has dyno tested FOR VP on new fuels - some of what you are getting sold is exactly that...getting sold. The lower budget VP fuels are mostly to be ethanol free and decent storage - good smell and a slight edge in power over pump often with more detonation resistance for various builds that may require it. Great fuels - but not great fuels purely for power.

If you were to buy a 1000 gallons of pump gas in bulk- then buy 5 gallon pails, pay a guy to fill them (yep hand filled at VP) then meet osha and regulation requirements, warehouse them - then ship them to end dealer and add in a margin for him - you'd very quickly be at 60-70 bucks for 5 gallons. The high dollar fuels such as mr12 or pro6 (125-150 street price for 5) make incredible power.





1
motoarmageddon 3/8/2017 10:29pm
3/8/2017 10:29pm
Im going to drop some knowledge moto brothers: It seems like you guys dont know what oxygenated race gas is vs regular type race gas. Oxygenated race gas is like VP u4.4, mr6, mro2x etc. the oxygen has been packed into the gas, similar to what a turbo charger does to the fuel/air mixture on a turbo engine. so it will actually give your bike more horspower on a dyno. Regular race gas like VP 110 or C12 WILL NOT make your bike faster. Its higher octane, allowing you to run higher compression like a milled head or hi comp piston, without the engine pinging and blowing up
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bsharkey
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bsharkey 3/8/2017 11:08pm
3/8/2017 11:08pm
mr12 makes the most power hands down. remap the ignition for the most power
RickA
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RickA 3/9/2017 4:27am
3/9/2017 4:27am Edited Date/Time 3/9/2017 5:20am
motoarmageddon wrote:
Im going to drop some knowledge moto brothers: It seems like you guys dont know what oxygenated race gas is vs regular type race gas. Oxygenated...
Im going to drop some knowledge moto brothers: It seems like you guys dont know what oxygenated race gas is vs regular type race gas. Oxygenated race gas is like VP u4.4, mr6, mro2x etc. the oxygen has been packed into the gas, similar to what a turbo charger does to the fuel/air mixture on a turbo engine. so it will actually give your bike more horspower on a dyno. Regular race gas like VP 110 or C12 WILL NOT make your bike faster. Its higher octane, allowing you to run higher compression like a milled head or hi comp piston, without the engine pinging and blowing up
Oxygenated gasoline simple means ethanol or methanol has been added. It's an oxygenate, just another reaction with a hydrocarbon. Cleaner burning..

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jsmx97
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jsmx97 3/10/2017 11:23am
3/10/2017 11:23am
I have been using VP C9 for a couple years in my stock 450's with good results. It is 96 octane, unleaded, non-oxygenated. It is a great pump fuel replacement for a stock engine for someone who wants a clean, consistent fuel with a bit more detonation protection.
Canadad
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Canadad 3/10/2017 12:00pm
3/10/2017 12:00pm
rrjr wrote:
I use C12 in my weed wacker and chainsaw and they run freaking great. Not sure how that helps the OP but I just wanted to...
I use C12 in my weed wacker and chainsaw and they run freaking great. Not sure how that helps the OP but I just wanted to throw that out there.
X2 nothin better than doing yard work to the smell of C12 and castor oil.......and for us Canadians there is nothing better than race fuel in the snowblower for dreamin of rippin it up come spring while suffering in the winter cold.....this is when you run race fuel in a stock motor.
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Rooster579
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Rooster579 3/10/2017 1:31pm
3/10/2017 1:31pm
Just do what I do... go down to the local airport and grab some gas. I've run 100ll avgas in my bikes for years and ain't had a problem.
galvin451
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galvin451 3/27/2017 7:43am
3/27/2017 7:43am Edited Date/Time 3/27/2017 7:48am
I have 3 gas stations within 10 miles of me that carry Race Fuel. I'm sure the VP is better quality, however, is it worth almost $20 per gallon when you can get Regular Race Fuel for $4.50 a gallon? I have a 2015 YZ250FX and use either premium or race fuel, and every so often I'll add an octane booster.
Whymee 7/26/2017 3:13pm
7/26/2017 3:13pm
For those of you running VP T4...

I see that T4 is oxygenated. And you have not remapped? I always thought that with Oxy fuels that you had to remap.

This is my first 4T a 2017 YZ250F with 1/2 hour on it. I want quality fuel. I had planned on cutting the T4 with 90 octane non-ethanol pump gas.

What say the "experts"?

And while we are at it, where in the hell are all the maps for the 17 YZ250F? Only thing I see is on the Yamaha's site. I have searched high & low for 'em. Must be like hens teeth, rare...
mxb2
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mxb2 7/26/2017 3:15pm
7/26/2017 3:15pm Edited Date/Time 7/26/2017 3:16pm
Whymee wrote:
For those of you running VP T4... I see that T4 is oxygenated. And you have not remapped? I always thought that with Oxy fuels that...
For those of you running VP T4...

I see that T4 is oxygenated. And you have not remapped? I always thought that with Oxy fuels that you had to remap.

This is my first 4T a 2017 YZ250F with 1/2 hour on it. I want quality fuel. I had planned on cutting the T4 with 90 octane non-ethanol pump gas.

What say the "experts"?

And while we are at it, where in the hell are all the maps for the 17 YZ250F? Only thing I see is on the Yamaha's site. I have searched high & low for 'em. Must be like hens teeth, rare...
No need for a remap for t4,but it helps even more.
Swann
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Swann 7/26/2017 3:22pm
7/26/2017 3:22pm
Whymee wrote:
For those of you running VP T4... I see that T4 is oxygenated. And you have not remapped? I always thought that with Oxy fuels that...
For those of you running VP T4...

I see that T4 is oxygenated. And you have not remapped? I always thought that with Oxy fuels that you had to remap.

This is my first 4T a 2017 YZ250F with 1/2 hour on it. I want quality fuel. I had planned on cutting the T4 with 90 octane non-ethanol pump gas.

What say the "experts"?

And while we are at it, where in the hell are all the maps for the 17 YZ250F? Only thing I see is on the Yamaha's site. I have searched high & low for 'em. Must be like hens teeth, rare...
My carbureted motor drinks sweet, delicious T4 with no problems. I remapped my KX450 but I ran MR12 in that. Never heard of needing to remap a bike when running T4 unless there's a high-comp piston or something.

Just run it. You'll love the smell Smile
swtwtwtw
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swtwtwtw 7/26/2017 4:21pm
7/26/2017 4:21pm
So VP makes T4 ( avail. Over the counter) and a fuel called HP101 an oxygenated unleaded available by pump at some gasoline wholesalers. The fuels are near identical on paper, but i prefer tbe hp101. I mix 50/50 with pump gas and get a good 1/2 gear extra out of my 250f or 450f .
smoothies862 7/26/2017 6:31pm
7/26/2017 6:31pm
pro engine builder told me 4 strokes don't like high octane. I don't want to buy race gas. motor is ported decked etc. 93 octane fresh. it rips. lucas sells an ethanol treatment I ran it in my old bike for years. no problems.
Travis_Hudson 7/26/2017 7:02pm
7/26/2017 7:02pm
smoothies862 wrote:
pro engine builder told me 4 strokes don't like high octane. I don't want to buy race gas. motor is ported decked etc. 93 octane fresh...
pro engine builder told me 4 strokes don't like high octane. I don't want to buy race gas. motor is ported decked etc. 93 octane fresh. it rips. lucas sells an ethanol treatment I ran it in my old bike for years. no problems.
Just because it is "race gas" doesn't mean it is high octane. That's why they make it for four strokes and different kinds for two strokes.
bvm111
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bvm111 7/26/2017 7:57pm
7/26/2017 7:57pm
What's with the rash of old threads being brought back from the dead lately????

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