VP T4 vs VPR

nascarnate326
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nascarnate326
Edited Date/Time 12/10/2015 8:51am
What are the pros and cons of these two fuels in relation to each other? I need to get some fuel for the coming season and can't find any definitive information on why which one is better for my bikes. 09 CRF450 and 02 CR125. I have used VPR in the past but have not used T4.
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Rich Piano
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Rich Piano 12/7/2015 4:37pm
12/7/2015 4:37pm
100 LL. Save your money. Think about it.

Or you could run say 1 gallon of C12 to 4 gallons of 92 Pump.
You dont need better fuel.
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Spergen
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Spergen 12/7/2015 4:51pm
12/7/2015 4:51pm
Quick question for you guys. Have noticed lots of you run your bikes on race fuel and not pump gas. Is that because of quality or octane levels ? In the UK I only know of road bike racers at national level that run the race gas. Having ridden mx for over 20 yrs I have always used pump stuff at around an octane level off 98 to 102 Ron and never had a pinking issue.
Rich Piano
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Rich Piano 12/7/2015 5:10pm
12/7/2015 5:10pm

I really dont understand how so many people have problems with pump fuel.
Ive never had one. Although I am not a fan of the ethanol in pump fuel for bikes or vehicles, but regardless, I've never had a problem.

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nascarnate326
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nascarnate326 12/7/2015 5:11pm
12/7/2015 5:11pm
I like it because its stable, lasts a long time, and is ethanol free. I don't feel like I need any more power on my 450 more of a quality kind of thing.

The smell is also kinda bad ass. Especially when mixed with a castor bean oil for a 2 stroke.


I think there is two different kind of fuels. T4 and VPR are "cheap high end fuel" ($14 a gallon) then there is true "race fuel" MR-Pro6 ($33 a gallon).

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murph783
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murph783 12/7/2015 5:20pm
12/7/2015 5:20pm
Spergen wrote:
Quick question for you guys. Have noticed lots of you run your bikes on race fuel and not pump gas. Is that because of quality or...
Quick question for you guys. Have noticed lots of you run your bikes on race fuel and not pump gas. Is that because of quality or octane levels ? In the UK I only know of road bike racers at national level that run the race gas. Having ridden mx for over 20 yrs I have always used pump stuff at around an octane level off 98 to 102 Ron and never had a pinking issue.
Yeaaaah we don't get pump gas that nice here haha. Best we can generally get is 93 out of the pump, so most 2 strokes will ping unless you modify the head. Even at that though, pump gas is full of ethanol and is noooo good for small engines.
Crisp BRAAAP! 12/7/2015 5:29pm
12/7/2015 5:29pm
I never had a need until my current bike, a 06 YZ125. It's bone stock but was told by the previous owner that it needed an octane booster. I tried running straight pump and it didn't like it and I ran into problems. Between switching to race gas and cleaning up the jetting, I can't believe how much harder the bike runs. I don't think the gas per se is making the power, but it's really how clean the motor runs that is giving it the power. I don't burn enough gas for it to be cost prohibitive, especially considering how much tires, sprockets, top ends, practice, gear, etc. costs.
Rich Piano
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Rich Piano 12/7/2015 5:41pm
12/7/2015 5:41pm
Spergen wrote:
Quick question for you guys. Have noticed lots of you run your bikes on race fuel and not pump gas. Is that because of quality or...
Quick question for you guys. Have noticed lots of you run your bikes on race fuel and not pump gas. Is that because of quality or octane levels ? In the UK I only know of road bike racers at national level that run the race gas. Having ridden mx for over 20 yrs I have always used pump stuff at around an octane level off 98 to 102 Ron and never had a pinking issue.
murph783 wrote:
Yeaaaah we don't get pump gas that nice here haha. Best we can generally get is 93 out of the pump, so most 2 strokes will...
Yeaaaah we don't get pump gas that nice here haha. Best we can generally get is 93 out of the pump, so most 2 strokes will ping unless you modify the head. Even at that though, pump gas is full of ethanol and is noooo good for small engines.
You didn't read. We dont sell pump gas here for street use with just a RON or a MON Number.

The Motor Octane number is whats important for our use.

731chopper
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731chopper 12/7/2015 5:41pm
12/7/2015 5:41pm
Spergen wrote:
Quick question for you guys. Have noticed lots of you run your bikes on race fuel and not pump gas. Is that because of quality or...
Quick question for you guys. Have noticed lots of you run your bikes on race fuel and not pump gas. Is that because of quality or octane levels ? In the UK I only know of road bike racers at national level that run the race gas. Having ridden mx for over 20 yrs I have always used pump stuff at around an octane level off 98 to 102 Ron and never had a pinking issue.
Ethanol. Ethanol is mandated to be mixed in with gasoline and in many places it's as much as 15%. The biggest problem with the ethanol is what it does to your jets and tubing if it sits for a while. Quality as far as dirt/debris/crud in the fuel is also a concern some people have but for me it's about not having ethanol and the VP fuel I run doesn't have any.
c0ncEpT
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c0ncEpT 12/7/2015 5:57pm
12/7/2015 5:57pm
U4.4 is great stuff as well
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Calihusky
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Calihusky 12/7/2015 6:01pm
12/7/2015 6:01pm
After I found black particles in my pump gas(California) I switched to T4 and I've been very happy. It stores well in the metal container. I noticed that with pump gas it would take a few extra kicks to start especially if it sat for a couple of weeks. My 2014 crf250r starts better with the T4. I'm not using it for performance as much as it doesn't have ethanol and hopefully no particles.
IceMan446
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IceMan446 12/7/2015 6:12pm
12/7/2015 6:12pm
T4 is just fine.

A little cheaper than the U4.4 also
nascarnate326
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nascarnate326 12/7/2015 6:18pm
12/7/2015 6:18pm
IceMan446 wrote:
T4 is just fine.

A little cheaper than the U4.4 also
So you think T4 would be a better fit than VPR? Sounds like you run T4?
murph783
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murph783 12/7/2015 6:34pm
12/7/2015 6:34pm
Spergen wrote:
Quick question for you guys. Have noticed lots of you run your bikes on race fuel and not pump gas. Is that because of quality or...
Quick question for you guys. Have noticed lots of you run your bikes on race fuel and not pump gas. Is that because of quality or octane levels ? In the UK I only know of road bike racers at national level that run the race gas. Having ridden mx for over 20 yrs I have always used pump stuff at around an octane level off 98 to 102 Ron and never had a pinking issue.
murph783 wrote:
Yeaaaah we don't get pump gas that nice here haha. Best we can generally get is 93 out of the pump, so most 2 strokes will...
Yeaaaah we don't get pump gas that nice here haha. Best we can generally get is 93 out of the pump, so most 2 strokes will ping unless you modify the head. Even at that though, pump gas is full of ethanol and is noooo good for small engines.
Rich Piano wrote:
You didn't read. We dont sell pump gas here for street use with just a RON or a MON Number. The Motor Octane number is whats...
You didn't read. We dont sell pump gas here for street use with just a RON or a MON Number.

The Motor Octane number is whats important for our use.

I stand corrected. In fairness I did read, I just didn't comprehend lol
IceMan446
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IceMan446 12/7/2015 6:52pm
12/7/2015 6:52pm
nascarnate326 wrote:
So you think T4 would be a better fit than VPR? Sounds like you run T4?
I don't run T4.

Go do some searches on google, one from Kris Keefer will do some explaining on both.

Are you going to mix with pump or run just straight VP?

From my experience if you are going to mix with pump, you are better of with the cheaper race fuel. No point in paying more when you are diluting it with pump fuel that has ethanol. Also, if your motors aren't set up for full race there is no need for it either.
Loftin79
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Loftin79 12/8/2015 5:40am
12/8/2015 5:40am
IceMan446 wrote:
T4 is just fine.

A little cheaper than the U4.4 also
nascarnate326 wrote:
So you think T4 would be a better fit than VPR? Sounds like you run T4?
If you are riding a 4 stroke use VPR. I believe I read that the leaded stuff is better for the valves
Reefer Sutherland 12/8/2015 5:59am
12/8/2015 5:59am
VPR is glorified avgas for twice the price.

I run Cam2 in everything.

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CarlinoJoeVideo
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CarlinoJoeVideo 12/8/2015 7:09am
12/8/2015 7:09am
I ran 93 ethonal free in Oregon until I came to CA and just could find any non-ethonal. My dream scenario was when I was mixing T4 with that non-eth, best bang for your buck..

T4 is crazy expensive and it has that consistent feel with added throttle response.
CarlinoJoeVideo
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CarlinoJoeVideo 12/8/2015 7:12am
12/8/2015 7:12am Edited Date/Time 12/8/2015 7:13am
Oops, posted twice.
Loftin79
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Loftin79 12/8/2015 7:21am
12/8/2015 7:21am
CarlinoJoeVideo wrote:
I ran 93 ethonal free in Oregon until I came to CA and just could find any non-ethonal. My dream scenario was when I was mixing...
I ran 93 ethonal free in Oregon until I came to CA and just could find any non-ethonal. My dream scenario was when I was mixing T4 with that non-eth, best bang for your buck..

T4 is crazy expensive and it has that consistent feel with added throttle response.
$65 for 5 gallon can here in Oklahoma
mb
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mb 12/8/2015 7:31am
12/8/2015 7:31am
If your 4 stroke isn't modded it would probably run better on pump. The specialty fuels I see people running is crazy.

If you have pinging issues just blend race gas into the pump you have been running until it stops. You can also try adding lead in small increments until pinging stops.
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bsharkey 12/8/2015 8:37am
12/8/2015 8:37am Edited Date/Time 12/8/2015 8:38am
Rich Piano wrote:
I really dont understand how so many people have problems with pump fuel. Ive never had one. Although I am not a fan of the ethanol...

I really dont understand how so many people have problems with pump fuel.
Ive never had one. Although I am not a fan of the ethanol in pump fuel for bikes or vehicles, but regardless, I've never had a problem.

if your a int rider or better even some c riders then you need to blend your gas or the biies detonate. we use c12 or Sunoco 110 50/50 with no problems at all
Reefer Sutherland 12/8/2015 10:51am
12/8/2015 10:51am Edited Date/Time 12/8/2015 10:52am
Only on Vital will you find people actually recommending ethanol pump gas for modern MX bikes. Is thumpertalk down or something? Between this and the boot-bending thread, the IQ has hit rock bottom.
murph783
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murph783 12/8/2015 11:24am
12/8/2015 11:24am
Related to the ethanol issue, anyone have experience with that star tron treatment? I use 93 cut 50/50 with Sunoco 110 in both my bikes, started adding star tron this year in hopes it'd help keep deposits from forming. Haven't had it apart since though so I'm curious
mb
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mb 12/8/2015 11:25am
12/8/2015 11:25am
Look up E98 (Ethanol) and see what "modern day" race engines are doing in the 1/4 mile with it.

Reefer Sutherland 12/8/2015 11:50am
12/8/2015 11:50am
mb wrote:
Look up E98 (Ethanol) and see what "modern day" race engines are doing in the 1/4 mile with it.

apples/oranges

Those cars are tuned for it. Your 450 isn't.

Worst analogy ever. Fill your bikes up with ethanol, I don't care.
731chopper
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731chopper 12/8/2015 11:52am
12/8/2015 11:52am
mb wrote:
Look up E98 (Ethanol) and see what "modern day" race engines are doing in the 1/4 mile with it.

I don't think anyone is saying that ethanol can't be a good fuel but in our little motors, especially carbureted ones, mixed with gasoline it can have adverse affects. I've seen it first hand in some little play bikes I've got.
mb
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mb 12/8/2015 12:14pm
12/8/2015 12:14pm
mb wrote:
Look up E98 (Ethanol) and see what "modern day" race engines are doing in the 1/4 mile with it.

Reefer Sutherland wrote:
apples/oranges

Those cars are tuned for it. Your 450 isn't.

Worst analogy ever. Fill your bikes up with ethanol, I don't care.
The same way the 450 isn't tuned to run 100 octane leaded & oxygenated fuel? Wink
bgpn35
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bgpn35 12/8/2015 12:20pm
12/8/2015 12:20pm
I run vpr in my yz450, the only problem I had was a little lean pop and I fixed that with my tuner. I would probably run cam2 but no one around here sells it, all the gas stations that had it quit selling it and have started selling ethanol free gas in its place. i have to drive to concord near the speedway to get vpr but it's worth it to me and a plus is in going to make a coffee table with the empties in my man cave!

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