Here's what we've learned...AMA vs GP

karsmakers
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759
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Yuba City, CA US
Edited Date/Time 4/22/2015 2:16am
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the AMA support class a bit deeper than MX2

2) The terrain and tracks are more varied and difficult than most AMA tracks......this requires more technical skill and experience

3) Both series are extremely difficult and when crossing the pond it will take a few years of experience before winning the series is possible for a top rider

4) Us Americans have been too AMA centric and have now had our ego's checked. We finally have to admire and give the GP's and their riders the credit that is rightly due them.

5) Most of us can now stop the childish US vs them bullshit and respect and enjoy the awesome racing in both series

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Mit12
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Lake Havasu City, AZ US
4/19/2015 4:05pm
karsmakers wrote:
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the...
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the AMA support class a bit deeper than MX2

2) The terrain and tracks are more varied and difficult than most AMA tracks......this requires more technical skill and experience

3) Both series are extremely difficult and when crossing the pond it will take a few years of experience before winning the series is possible for a top rider

4) Us Americans have been too AMA centric and have now had our ego's checked. We finally have to admire and give the GP's and their riders the credit that is rightly due them.

5) Most of us can now stop the childish US vs them bullshit and respect and enjoy the awesome racing in both series

Karsmakers,
I agree but you might be expection way to much for a lot of posters on here.
watson
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Houston, TX US
4/19/2015 4:26pm
Fully agree on all points.
4/19/2015 4:36pm
karsmakers wrote:
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the...
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the AMA support class a bit deeper than MX2

2) The terrain and tracks are more varied and difficult than most AMA tracks......this requires more technical skill and experience

3) Both series are extremely difficult and when crossing the pond it will take a few years of experience before winning the series is possible for a top rider

4) Us Americans have been too AMA centric and have now had our ego's checked. We finally have to admire and give the GP's and their riders the credit that is rightly due them.

5) Most of us can now stop the childish US vs them bullshit and respect and enjoy the awesome racing in both series

Mit12 wrote:
Karsmakers,
I agree but you might be expection way to much for a lot of posters on here.
The USA has the edge in entertainment value with SX and the rest of the world has GP's.
Stefan82
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NL
4/19/2015 4:44pm
karsmakers wrote:
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the...
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the AMA support class a bit deeper than MX2

2) The terrain and tracks are more varied and difficult than most AMA tracks......this requires more technical skill and experience

3) Both series are extremely difficult and when crossing the pond it will take a few years of experience before winning the series is possible for a top rider

4) Us Americans have been too AMA centric and have now had our ego's checked. We finally have to admire and give the GP's and their riders the credit that is rightly due them.

5) Most of us can now stop the childish US vs them bullshit and respect and enjoy the awesome racing in both series

Mit12 wrote:
Karsmakers,
I agree but you might be expection way to much for a lot of posters on here.
The Source wrote:
The USA has the edge in entertainment value with SX and the rest of the world has GP's.
SX is entertaining but with the championships already decided it's time for playoffs and concerts somewhere in between the show and all that kind of stuff.

The Shop

A. DLeary
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US
4/19/2015 4:49pm
We've learned that fans on both sides of the pond have 0 class.
Seamorbutts
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Lake Charles, LA US
4/19/2015 4:52pm
A. DLeary wrote:
We've learned that fans on both sides of the pond have 0 class.
Just listen to this guy will ya.
4/19/2015 4:59pm
A. DLeary wrote:
We've learned that fans on both sides of the pond have 0 class.
Imagine if fans of the Olympics were as vocal and contentious as what's been posted on Vital over the GP's this year. Wow.

Europe is clearly faster outdoors (in Europe) than America, but this is RV's first ever GP series. Maybe next year he'll get over the learning curve and compete like we all he's capable of. This season proves nothing except for what A. DLeary wrote right above.

I certainly didn't see the same level of nastiness when Clement came to the states to race the nats. If anything I read more comments saying it was cool for him to come over and run part of our series. I can't even read the race day threads.. I already knew there were plenty of obnoxious Americans eager to chime in but wow.

I bought my season pass on MXGP Live earlier this year- didn't have high hopes for Ryan but expected to see some great racing on circuits I've never really seen before. I am more a fan of motocross than any one country. Yeah I cheered Ryan on and will continue to. But I'm getting to know a little more about the top riders in Europe and am liking what I'm seeing on the track. I've become a fan of Cairoli and DeSalle, and Nagle continues to impress.

I just don't understand why people need to get their panties in a wad about whose country churns out better racers. Europe is due and is cashing in. Now that's out of the way can we all agree to tune down the nationalism and enjoy these awesome motocross races without all the ridiculous bickering?
plowboy
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Norwich, KS US
4/19/2015 5:10pm
karsmakers wrote:
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the...
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the AMA support class a bit deeper than MX2

2) The terrain and tracks are more varied and difficult than most AMA tracks......this requires more technical skill and experience

3) Both series are extremely difficult and when crossing the pond it will take a few years of experience before winning the series is possible for a top rider

4) Us Americans have been too AMA centric and have now had our ego's checked. We finally have to admire and give the GP's and their riders the credit that is rightly due them.

5) Most of us can now stop the childish US vs them bullshit and respect and enjoy the awesome racing in both series

Word. I am also coming around to the belief that the time our American riders spend testing and perfecting their SX skills is a detriment to their MX skills. It is what it is. Too much money in SX for it to go away but the SXish nature of some our tracks and the grooming of the outdoor tracks is not gonna help our guys against the rest of the world. My eyes have been opened brothers. I won't get into the politics of the GP world but you gotta admit as far as the Dunlops meeting the dirt they are keeping it real. Rough and tougher than a two dollar steak. I'm digging it...I bet that RV is too.
mehow2g
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AU
4/19/2015 5:17pm Edited Date/Time 4/19/2015 5:18pm
A. DLeary wrote:
We've learned that fans on both sides of the pond have 0 class.
Imagine if fans of the Olympics were as vocal and contentious as what's been posted on Vital over the GP's this year. Wow. Europe is clearly...
Imagine if fans of the Olympics were as vocal and contentious as what's been posted on Vital over the GP's this year. Wow.

Europe is clearly faster outdoors (in Europe) than America, but this is RV's first ever GP series. Maybe next year he'll get over the learning curve and compete like we all he's capable of. This season proves nothing except for what A. DLeary wrote right above.

I certainly didn't see the same level of nastiness when Clement came to the states to race the nats. If anything I read more comments saying it was cool for him to come over and run part of our series. I can't even read the race day threads.. I already knew there were plenty of obnoxious Americans eager to chime in but wow.

I bought my season pass on MXGP Live earlier this year- didn't have high hopes for Ryan but expected to see some great racing on circuits I've never really seen before. I am more a fan of motocross than any one country. Yeah I cheered Ryan on and will continue to. But I'm getting to know a little more about the top riders in Europe and am liking what I'm seeing on the track. I've become a fan of Cairoli and DeSalle, and Nagle continues to impress.

I just don't understand why people need to get their panties in a wad about whose country churns out better racers. Europe is due and is cashing in. Now that's out of the way can we all agree to tune down the nationalism and enjoy these awesome motocross races without all the ridiculous bickering?
This post is exactly how I feel, I've watched AMA series all my life and I know the American riders very well I've seen clips of MXGP's but I cannot compare "who is better" because I have no seen both MXGP/AMA riders on a track for a season.

Before MXGP started I used logic if Rozcen came from Europe and is winning in AMA then the guys over in MXGP land are very fast, also MXGP ride dirt bikes and looking at photos they clearly ride on tougher tracks so you'd have to be a fool thinking RV was going to sweep the floor over there, RV is not the shadow of his former self is actually is super fast he just lacks experience I think what he did yesterday pre-crash was incredible I didnt put him in the top 3 for this race as it wasnt his style of track he'd dominate.

In other news, I've always preferred outdoors over supercross, but it is evident that Supercross just needs either a overhaul how they do things or just remove it, it is the worst part of this sport, anyone who watched yesterdays race would tell you they haven't felt so tense and excited watching the races yesterday, it was like you could feel what the riders were going through a track were any error will ruin you as there was no real opportunity to make any passes.
h&m_cycle
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Steubenville, OH US
4/19/2015 5:26pm Edited Date/Time 4/19/2015 5:40pm
@ the outdoor nationals, we continue to worry about 2 minute lap times for live tv purposes, refusing to lose the keys
to the tractors, the start straight & the first turn only need disc. When it rains we scrape the mud off.

come & see our national daredevils fly high through the air throwing a whip while ripping a tearoff.

Outdoor reminds me of the back flip boys. Maybe were getting soft. Life is easier here.
watson
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Houston, TX US
4/19/2015 5:35pm
A. DLeary wrote:
We've learned that fans on both sides of the pond have 0 class.
Yup. It's not exclusive to American fans, at all. Although some of the worst seem to be from here.
A. DLeary
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4/19/2015 5:39pm Edited Date/Time 4/19/2015 5:43pm
A. DLeary wrote:
We've learned that fans on both sides of the pond have 0 class.
watson wrote:
Yup. It's not exclusive to American fans, at all. Although some of the worst seem to be from here.
I think if you quantified the amount of shitty posters from both sides of the pond, the ANOVA etc would show little difference.
cheers_22
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4/19/2015 5:41pm
karsmakers wrote:
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the...
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the AMA support class a bit deeper than MX2

2) The terrain and tracks are more varied and difficult than most AMA tracks......this requires more technical skill and experience

3) Both series are extremely difficult and when crossing the pond it will take a few years of experience before winning the series is possible for a top rider

4) Us Americans have been too AMA centric and have now had our ego's checked. We finally have to admire and give the GP's and their riders the credit that is rightly due them.

5) Most of us can now stop the childish US vs them bullshit and respect and enjoy the awesome racing in both series

Good post. X2.
Zracer
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Saint Clair, MI US
4/19/2015 5:54pm
karsmakers wrote:
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the...
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the AMA support class a bit deeper than MX2

2) The terrain and tracks are more varied and difficult than most AMA tracks......this requires more technical skill and experience

3) Both series are extremely difficult and when crossing the pond it will take a few years of experience before winning the series is possible for a top rider

4) Us Americans have been too AMA centric and have now had our ego's checked. We finally have to admire and give the GP's and their riders the credit that is rightly due them.

5) Most of us can now stop the childish US vs them bullshit and respect and enjoy the awesome racing in both series

I ve learned there are still some MX fans on both sides with some sense and knowledge. Its a pleasant suprise.
motomike137
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Fenton, MI US
4/19/2015 6:01pm
plowboy wrote:
Word. I am also coming around to the belief that the time our American riders spend testing and perfecting their SX skills is a detriment to...
Word. I am also coming around to the belief that the time our American riders spend testing and perfecting their SX skills is a detriment to their MX skills. It is what it is. Too much money in SX for it to go away but the SXish nature of some our tracks and the grooming of the outdoor tracks is not gonna help our guys against the rest of the world. My eyes have been opened brothers. I won't get into the politics of the GP world but you gotta admit as far as the Dunlops meeting the dirt they are keeping it real. Rough and tougher than a two dollar steak. I'm digging it...I bet that RV is too.
It's funny plowboy because once upon a time SX was credited for making our guys faster and more aggressive outdoors giving them a edge. It didn't hurt that that era included guys like Hannah, Glover, Ward, Bailey, Johnson etc.
Phillip_Lamb
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ORANGEVALE, CA US
4/19/2015 6:15pm
Im not surprised RV isnt dominating over there. He got so dominant here because he landed on the best 250 team, stayed with the brand all the way through his career so he didnt have to start from scratch every year on setup and he didnt have to adjust lifestyle.

In the GPs theyve already been to four contries, one in Europe, every track had different dirt and vastly different layouts. The bikes are true works bikes so the parts he is using are different and the setup required on the tracks is much different. Ironically the thailand GP was closest to american racing with the jumps and high heat. #texas.

Truth is if top ten from both series showed up at a US national Americans would dominate, and if they raced a GP the euros would dominate. the only exception is RC4. he would destroy either way
That_Guy
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4/19/2015 6:20pm
rv2 is going to lay waste to those slow euros because they suck their tracks sucks and and theyre slow and ama motocoss is the best in the world I read it on here so it must be true
4/19/2015 6:39pm
That_Guy wrote:
rv2 is going to lay waste to those slow euros because they suck their tracks sucks and and theyre slow and ama motocoss is the best...
rv2 is going to lay waste to those slow euros because they suck their tracks sucks and and theyre slow and ama motocoss is the best in the world I read it on here so it must be true
haha get real man..... .
That_Guy
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4/19/2015 6:47pm
bd
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Las Vegas, NV US
4/19/2015 6:54pm
karsmakers wrote:
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the...
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the AMA support class a bit deeper than MX2

2) The terrain and tracks are more varied and difficult than most AMA tracks......this requires more technical skill and experience

3) Both series are extremely difficult and when crossing the pond it will take a few years of experience before winning the series is possible for a top rider

4) Us Americans have been too AMA centric and have now had our ego's checked. We finally have to admire and give the GP's and their riders the credit that is rightly due them.

5) Most of us can now stop the childish US vs them bullshit and respect and enjoy the awesome racing in both series

Well said on all points.

- GPMX uses natural soil
- GPMX slows track via not grooming between motos
- GPMX is a weekend event

Its different than MX Nationals.

That said, never would of guessed Nagl would of won 3/4 overalls
4/19/2015 7:18pm
karsmakers wrote:
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the...
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the AMA support class a bit deeper than MX2

2) The terrain and tracks are more varied and difficult than most AMA tracks......this requires more technical skill and experience

3) Both series are extremely difficult and when crossing the pond it will take a few years of experience before winning the series is possible for a top rider

4) Us Americans have been too AMA centric and have now had our ego's checked. We finally have to admire and give the GP's and their riders the credit that is rightly due them.

5) Most of us can now stop the childish US vs them bullshit and respect and enjoy the awesome racing in both series

bd wrote:
Well said on all points. - GPMX uses natural soil - GPMX slows track via not grooming between motos - GPMX is a weekend event Its...
Well said on all points.

- GPMX uses natural soil
- GPMX slows track via not grooming between motos
- GPMX is a weekend event

Its different than MX Nationals.

That said, never would of guessed Nagl would of won 3/4 overalls
4). US americans, not everyone. Ive been following the gp´s for a long time and i was not one of those who thought rv would dominate. But otherwise great points !
lestat
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Piut RE
4/19/2015 7:21pm
karsmakers wrote:
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the...
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the AMA support class a bit deeper than MX2

2) The terrain and tracks are more varied and difficult than most AMA tracks......this requires more technical skill and experience

3) Both series are extremely difficult and when crossing the pond it will take a few years of experience before winning the series is possible for a top rider

4) Us Americans have been too AMA centric and have now had our ego's checked. We finally have to admire and give the GP's and their riders the credit that is rightly due them.

5) Most of us can now stop the childish US vs them bullshit and respect and enjoy the awesome racing in both series

nailed it .
Moto810
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Milton, WV US
4/19/2015 7:32pm
Might be true and might not be true. I will say that now we have seen one of the best USA riders go to the GP and win one GP out of 5. So now why not have one of the top GP riders come here and race in the USA and see if he can win one? Someone in the top 3 I would say should come here. It is not apples to apples until that happens.
ChrisB10
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4/19/2015 7:36pm
Clement DeSalle went 5, 6, 5, 7, in the Nationals he raced and he's won GP races so RV struggling doesnt prove shit.
captmoto
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Rancho Cucamonga, CA US
4/19/2015 7:58pm
It's also our tracks. Groomed for television appeal along with all the soil hauled in to make it "loamy". So far none of the FIM tracks have been even close to the same terrain. The FIM tracks are also hammered by the 125's and 150's.
4/19/2015 8:21pm
karsmakers wrote:
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the...
1) The Mx 1 class is fast and deep.....in my opinion it's a bit more competitive than the AMA open class 1-20.......and I would rate the AMA support class a bit deeper than MX2

2) The terrain and tracks are more varied and difficult than most AMA tracks......this requires more technical skill and experience

3) Both series are extremely difficult and when crossing the pond it will take a few years of experience before winning the series is possible for a top rider

4) Us Americans have been too AMA centric and have now had our ego's checked. We finally have to admire and give the GP's and their riders the credit that is rightly due them.

5) Most of us can now stop the childish US vs them bullshit and respect and enjoy the awesome racing in both series

Best post of the year.
The GP riders have amazed me.
It don't get no faster than that...
chillrich
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647
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Location
Kamloops CA
4/19/2015 8:22pm
Moto810 wrote:
Might be true and might not be true. I will say that now we have seen one of the best USA riders go to the GP...
Might be true and might not be true. I will say that now we have seen one of the best USA riders go to the GP and win one GP out of 5. So now why not have one of the top GP riders come here and race in the USA and see if he can win one? Someone in the top 3 I would say should come here. It is not apples to apples until that happens.
What did Ken Roczen do last year?
4/19/2015 8:24pm
chillrich wrote:
What did Ken Roczen do last year?
He won a championship after his what 4th season in america racing the tracks? Or did you want to say he won the championship coming straight from europe to race the big boys?
chillrich
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4/19/2015 8:43pm
Good Point, it's not a fair comparison, Roczen was a rookie on the big bike racing his third year MX in US and won the most important title in the universe..... if you're 'Merican.
4/19/2015 8:46pm
chillrich wrote:
Good Point, it's not a fair comparison, Roczen was a rookie on the big bike racing his third year MX in US and won the most...
Good Point, it's not a fair comparison, Roczen was a rookie on the big bike racing his third year MX in US and won the most important title in the universe..... if you're 'Merican.
He won it fair and square and deserved it if you ask me. I dont give a f*ying fuck if he is american or not. He deserve the respect he can get. The whole argue about europe, non american, vs american is getting beoynd pathetic.

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