My starts are terrible

Edited Date/Time 1/27/2012 11:51am
I took riding lessons last month and my instructor said my bike's clutch is almost fried and that is why I'm having a hard time on starts.

I've never changed a clutch in my bike - is there anything I need to do other than swapping out new plates for old? I read somewhere that the new plates have to be soaked in oil.
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KAWboy14
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9/2/2008 10:02am
if you cant tell your clutch is fried and you have never changed one.....take it to a mechanic!
bogdan912
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9/2/2008 11:06am
It's easy. Soak the plates in oil overnight. What kind of bike is it? Not all plates are the same so just make sure you put them in in the order they came out. Also for the metals one edge is sharp and the other is dull, put the sharp edge out. This whole process should take about 15 minutes with an oil change.
Crash82
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9/2/2008 11:10am
KAWboy14 wrote:
if you cant tell your clutch is fried and you have never changed one.....take it to a mechanic!
If you can't tell if your clutch is fried give the bike to someone that deserves it.
mxrose3
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9/2/2008 11:13am
bogdan912 wrote:
It's easy. Soak the plates in oil overnight. What kind of bike is it? Not all plates are the same so just make sure you put...
It's easy. Soak the plates in oil overnight. What kind of bike is it? Not all plates are the same so just make sure you put them in in the order they came out. Also for the metals one edge is sharp and the other is dull, put the sharp edge out. This whole process should take about 15 minutes with an oil change.
X2.
If you have any mechanical ability at all, its easy.
5 or 6 bolts hold the clutch pressure plate and springs in place, pull the old plates out and put the new ones in.

The Shop

mxmat813
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9/2/2008 11:27am
When you pull the plates out check the basket. Sometimes you'll get groves worn in the basket from the plates slamming back and forth. If this is the case you can either file the groves off or install a new basket. If it's never been filed I'd go ahead and do that. You can usually get away with it once or twice before you need to replace the basket. Good luck.
Cygnus
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9/2/2008 11:30am
Read the instructions on the clutch you buy . Some of the newer materials require no soaking of the clutch plates .
Tiki
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Fantasy
9/2/2008 1:01pm
I am suspect to think, if you didn't know your clutch was out, chances are your starts aren't going to be any better but with more wheelie. While you are at it, you may want to change the drive gears and chain, you will feel all sorts of new traction.
todder
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9/2/2008 1:31pm


Jabjr222
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9/2/2008 1:36pm
The best thing to do, because the clutch is an easy job, let a fellow racer who turns his own wrenches to change it and show you how to do it. It is a really easy job and once you see it done, you will be able to do it with no problems.

Also, I know the thoughts on soaking clutches or not, but all I ever did was coat each fiber plate with some oil before install. I never had clutch issues and was a 125 int.
WhKnuckle
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9/2/2008 1:42pm
Jabjr222 wrote:
The best thing to do, because the clutch is an easy job, let a fellow racer who turns his own wrenches to change it and show...
The best thing to do, because the clutch is an easy job, let a fellow racer who turns his own wrenches to change it and show you how to do it. It is a really easy job and once you see it done, you will be able to do it with no problems.

Also, I know the thoughts on soaking clutches or not, but all I ever did was coat each fiber plate with some oil before install. I never had clutch issues and was a 125 int.
Good idea. It can be done right at the track. You can even lay the bike on its side and avoid draining the oil.
9/2/2008 4:17pm Edited Date/Time 9/2/2008 4:18pm
Tiki wrote:
I am suspect to think, if you didn't know your clutch was out, chances are your starts aren't going to be any better but with more...
I am suspect to think, if you didn't know your clutch was out, chances are your starts aren't going to be any better but with more wheelie. While you are at it, you may want to change the drive gears and chain, you will feel all sorts of new traction.
Yep. Smile He also said I'd want to go one tooth bigger on the back sprocket the next time I change them.
KTM boy 137
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9/2/2008 4:18pm Edited Date/Time 4/16/2016 8:18pm
Jabjr222 wrote:
The best thing to do, because the clutch is an easy job, let a fellow racer who turns his own wrenches to change it and show...
The best thing to do, because the clutch is an easy job, let a fellow racer who turns his own wrenches to change it and show you how to do it. It is a really easy job and once you see it done, you will be able to do it with no problems.

Also, I know the thoughts on soaking clutches or not, but all I ever did was coat each fiber plate with some oil before install. I never had clutch issues and was a 125 int.
WhKnuckle wrote:
Good idea. It can be done right at the track. You can even lay the bike on its side and avoid draining the oil.
Yep.
That's exactly how my old roommate did it - right at the track before his race.

He raced 250 A & 125 A.
Jabjr222
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9/2/2008 4:45pm Edited Date/Time 4/16/2016 8:18pm
Just don't over torque the pressure plate bolts... My first time using a set of t-handles, I over torqued and popped one of the bolt heads off... I felt like an idiot busting out the screw extractors.


Queen* I would be careful changing the gearing. I believe beginners should keep everything as stock as possible. Even with the gearing, unless you are have some crazy riding conditions, learn to ride it stock. (everyone has a different opinion on this)


Adding a tooth will help the bike rev faster but that may not help you. It will also make you shift and use the clutch more (assuming you use it on shifts). It will make your bike want to wheelie off the start as well.


Why are you getting bad starts? Technique? Bad gate selection? Aggressive? Reaction time?
newmann
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9/2/2008 6:12pm
todder wrote:
[img]http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1096/1200659370_a6acd6fec1.jpg?v=0[/img]


Bad idea, that wrench is a little too big. Might damage something.6mm clutch bolts only torque between 5-6 ft.lbs. if I'm not mistakenSmile
9/2/2008 6:59pm Edited Date/Time 4/16/2016 8:18pm
Jabjr222 wrote:
Just don't over torque the pressure plate bolts... My first time using a set of t-handles, I over torqued and popped one of the bolt heads...
Just don't over torque the pressure plate bolts... My first time using a set of t-handles, I over torqued and popped one of the bolt heads off... I felt like an idiot busting out the screw extractors.


Queen* I would be careful changing the gearing. I believe beginners should keep everything as stock as possible. Even with the gearing, unless you are have some crazy riding conditions, learn to ride it stock. (everyone has a different opinion on this)


Adding a tooth will help the bike rev faster but that may not help you. It will also make you shift and use the clutch more (assuming you use it on shifts). It will make your bike want to wheelie off the start as well.


Why are you getting bad starts? Technique? Bad gate selection? Aggressive? Reaction time?
okay well I was told to start in first gear. My shoulders are supposed to be lined up with the handlebars, elbows up, sitting as far up on the tank as I can, and both feet touching the ground. I'm supposed to rev the bike and let out the clutch until I feel it starting to give a little, then pull in a smidge.. when the gate falls dump the clutch and twist the throttle. (for cement he said to lean back while sitting on the tank and not to dump the clutch, but let it out gently until my back tire is on dirt, then lean up on the tank like a dirt start).


So I had two issues. First when I let the clutch out to find when it starts to pull a little I'd feel it grab off and on. It's hard to explain. It wasn't very noticeable but the instructor said that's a sign that the clutch needs attention. The other thing is after dumping the clutch and shifting to second it often bogged a little, even with fanning the clutch. In case you were wondering the whole top end was redone a few months ago (new piston & rings). I was running pump gas that day and haven't had race gas since then to see if that makes starting any easier.


It is probably something I'm doing wrong with technique, but it seemed like I was doing everything OK. He didn't stop to correct me with starts like other riders in the class (he did correct me on braking - a lot!).
ninety3
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9/2/2008 7:47pm
How often do you change your oil?
Do you drain it hot?

If the oil has a black or dark gray look to it, the clutch will need attention.

A KX250 at WFO should not bog much Wink
GIwasB4
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9/2/2008 8:04pm
Fix your clutch, or have someone qualified fix it. Then.......count the gate-as early as possible-check the moto's before yours, 2 or 3 minimum or as many as possible (good thing about being last moto).

Watch the board handler, most important, watch the board go sideways and count 1000, 2000, 3000, etc; until the gate drops. Line up for your moto, board sideways, count and leave on your count that you just studied half the day. At an amatuer event, you'll make it 99 times out of a 100 across the gate and be one of the front runners into the turn. (Do not shut off until you know it's the last possible moment to brake and get back on the gas.) DON'T worry where or what anyone else is doing.

That's a holeshot.

BobbyM
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9/2/2008 8:32pm
I took riding lessons last month and my instructor said my bike's clutch is almost fried and that is why I'm having a hard time on...
I took riding lessons last month and my instructor said my bike's clutch is almost fried and that is why I'm having a hard time on starts.

I've never changed a clutch in my bike - is there anything I need to do other than swapping out new plates for old? I read somewhere that the new plates have to be soaked in oil.
sell the bike and join a cult...seriously.
davis224
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Fantasy
9/2/2008 8:39pm
After getting my 450, I cannot get anything but dead last starts on my 250f. It's really annoying. I rock the starts now on the 450 though. But my races go opposite, I start out front with the 450, then it wears me out fast and I go backwards, with the 250f, I get a shitty start and have to work my way up, until I start fading and head back again. I need to train.
Sinbad
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9/2/2008 8:43pm
What class did you go too?
oldx
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9/2/2008 9:07pm
Maybe a little practice on starts might help too. Learn to feel what the clutch is doing to the rear wheel.
Stopping or slowing for the first turn is important for holeshots too. Practice running up to something and breaking as hard as you can. Practice 1 finger locking the front wheel until it slides then easing off.
Your ears are very important to holeshots too. Listen for all the others to shut down on the throttle before you do.
Did I mention practice?
GIwasB4
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9/2/2008 9:10pm
Sinbad wrote:
What class did you go too?
338 School of MX Living Large?
9/2/2008 9:14pm
okay well I was told to start in first gear. My shoulders are supposed to be lined up with the handlebars, elbows up, sitting as far...
okay well I was told to start in first gear. My shoulders are supposed to be lined up with the handlebars, elbows up, sitting as far up on the tank as I can, and both feet touching the ground. I'm supposed to rev the bike and let out the clutch until I feel it starting to give a little, then pull in a smidge.. when the gate falls dump the clutch and twist the throttle. (for cement he said to lean back while sitting on the tank and not to dump the clutch, but let it out gently until my back tire is on dirt, then lean up on the tank like a dirt start).


So I had two issues. First when I let the clutch out to find when it starts to pull a little I'd feel it grab off and on. It's hard to explain. It wasn't very noticeable but the instructor said that's a sign that the clutch needs attention. The other thing is after dumping the clutch and shifting to second it often bogged a little, even with fanning the clutch. In case you were wondering the whole top end was redone a few months ago (new piston & rings). I was running pump gas that day and haven't had race gas since then to see if that makes starting any easier.


It is probably something I'm doing wrong with technique, but it seemed like I was doing everything OK. He didn't stop to correct me with starts like other riders in the class (he did correct me on braking - a lot!).
If you're bogging in second gear then your're not giving it full throttle, or there's a mechanical issue. You can be at a walking pace in second gear on a 250 2stroke and whack the throttle wide open- there should be no bogging.

One thing that seems to help with the launch is to have your boots in front of the pegs, then get your upper half leaning forward by bending at the waist. When you dump the clutch and snap the throttle wide open, all your feet need to do is raise up an inch or so. Learning to take off in 2nd gear makes it easier, as you have a longer amount of time before the shift to 3rd needs to occur.
TerryK
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9/2/2008 9:14pm
I start with both feet down and my legs hanging in FRONT of the pegs. When it comes time for the first shift, I use my heel as I'm pulling my feet up to put on the pegs. Works like a charm. Watch some pro's start and you can see them do the same thing. (which is why I started doing it)
JPT
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9/2/2008 9:28pm
My starts were always bad. It was either my clutch or the fact that I have the reaction time of a desert tortise.
Rim Lock
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9/2/2008 9:30pm
I always start on the inside to avoid calamity at the first turn.
Point A to point B shortest distance.
I always walk the first turn to find the rut I want.

2nd gear starts.
Even on a 250F.
Most like both feet down.
I like my left foot up on the peg ready for the next shift cause it is going to come quick.
Watch for the 30 second board to go sideways.
Then... tip your head down.
Watch the gate and nothing else.
Clutch lever out just to engagement not moving the bike.
1/2 throttle steady. Don't whick it in and out.
Feather the clutch to get out of a most likely rutted start area.
Twist the throttle to the nines and let the clutch work for you getting out of the gate.
Ignore your periphreal vision. Look straight forward and nail it like you are the only one on the track.
You 'feel' the other bikes around you but stay focused on the first turn.
In your mind they are going to chicken out.
Brake at the lost possible second and you have it.

I have holeshotted so many races but I am not good enough to hold the lead.
It is a weird twist when you holeshot a lot that most of your racing is getting passed by faster riders instead of coming from behind and / or passing other riders.


GIwasB4
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9/2/2008 9:32pm
GIwasB4 wrote:
Fix your clutch, or have someone qualified fix it. Then.......count the gate-as early as possible-check the moto's before yours, 2 or 3 minimum or as many...
Fix your clutch, or have someone qualified fix it. Then.......count the gate-as early as possible-check the moto's before yours, 2 or 3 minimum or as many as possible (good thing about being last moto).

Watch the board handler, most important, watch the board go sideways and count 1000, 2000, 3000, etc; until the gate drops. Line up for your moto, board sideways, count and leave on your count that you just studied half the day. At an amatuer event, you'll make it 99 times out of a 100 across the gate and be one of the front runners into the turn. (Do not shut off until you know it's the last possible moment to brake and get back on the gas.) DON'T worry where or what anyone else is doing.

That's a holeshot.

Count the effing gate, seriously, you nail that and you will beat most of these dickweeds to the first turn.
KTM boy 137
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9/2/2008 9:39pm
burn it in hard, and if you're going too hard, use another rider to slow you down..
works like a charm.
J.Saunders144
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St. Clair, MI, USA
9/2/2008 10:07pm
look at the gate and you should notice a pin holding the gate up when that drops the gate follows shorty after by the time ur delay on reaction time happens ull time it perfect use the body positioning others listed and learn how to start in 2nd gear and use ur brakes only if u need to some times the soft soil can slow u down enough or u can just lean it over and flat track kinda depending on the angle of the turn

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