TOMAC BEATS STEWART - Lap Time Comparison Charts - Freestone

S.Loyer
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Palmer, AK, USA
Edited Date/Time 5/29/2012 7:30am
Of course not literally but ELI WAS THE FASTEST MAN OF THE DAY AT FREESTONE clocking in the fastest time of the day along with the fastest average time at Freestone.

The Freestone charts for every class were a blast to do this weekend and really interesting to see, specially when you see how Tomac did against James and Dungey in the Head 2 Head charts comapring the top 3 250 Riders against the top 3 450 Riders. Then how James and Ryan blew away the rest of the field in the 2nd 450 moto.

To see the charts CLICK HERE! As alway's they are something awesome

A preview of what the charts look like, this the first moto of the 250 class:
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ky_savage
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5/28/2012 11:37am
Red arrow beat them all!
5/28/2012 11:51am
The top 5 in the 250 class this year is so "Talented" its not even funny, seems like they get better and better i cannot wait for Barcia to hop on a 450 full time and coming in to a season fully trained and ready!!Cool
IWreckALot
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5/28/2012 1:27pm
I keep trying to figure out how the 450 guys aren't 5 seconds a lap faster than the 250 guys. James and Dungey looked like they never let off the gas and yet the 250guys matched times so I don't think it's a lack of trying. The track deteriorates between motos and the 250s have the disadvantage there even. Anyone have any suggestions?
kongols
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5/28/2012 1:28pm
IWreckALot wrote:
I keep trying to figure out how the 450 guys aren't 5 seconds a lap faster than the 250 guys. James and Dungey looked like they...
I keep trying to figure out how the 450 guys aren't 5 seconds a lap faster than the 250 guys. James and Dungey looked like they never let off the gas and yet the 250guys matched times so I don't think it's a lack of trying. The track deteriorates between motos and the 250s have the disadvantage there even. Anyone have any suggestions?
You have to control the power of 450.

The Shop

gsxrcr28
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5/28/2012 1:45pm
IWreckALot wrote:
I keep trying to figure out how the 450 guys aren't 5 seconds a lap faster than the 250 guys. James and Dungey looked like they...
I keep trying to figure out how the 450 guys aren't 5 seconds a lap faster than the 250 guys. James and Dungey looked like they never let off the gas and yet the 250guys matched times so I don't think it's a lack of trying. The track deteriorates between motos and the 250s have the disadvantage there even. Anyone have any suggestions?
kongols wrote:
You have to control the power of 450.
Also you can corner much faster on a lighter bike. It's nothing new, depending on the track, lites bikes have been running faster lap times for years.
5/28/2012 1:54pm
.

Plain and simple:
450's are BIG FAT PIGS.
Same with the 500 TS
Always have been always will be.

.
newmann
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5/28/2012 2:09pm
.

Plain and simple:
450's are BIG FAT PIGS.
Same with the 500 TS
Always have been always will be.

.
Yep. The 450's were on and off the gas while the 250's were freakin pinned. The 250F class did sound a lot better from trackside. Nothing quite like a high revving small bore to get the crowd on their feet.
mccread
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5/28/2012 2:11pm
I think Dungey and Stewart should drop down the 250f class then they would have some comp other than each other..250f class is for sure the main class in the US.
5/28/2012 2:54pm Edited Date/Time 5/28/2012 2:55pm
That is nothing new, welcome to moto, JS used to beat 250 times all the on his 125, RV used to beat 450 times on his 250 Tongue
Három
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5/28/2012 3:17pm
mccread wrote:
I think Dungey and Stewart should drop down the 250f class then they would have some comp other than each other..250f class is for sure the...
I think Dungey and Stewart should drop down the 250f class then they would have some comp other than each other..250f class is for sure the main class in the US.
Or the other riders could move up? Seems like I've seen that happen before.
TannerMxer
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5/28/2012 3:34pm
IWreckALot wrote:
I keep trying to figure out how the 450 guys aren't 5 seconds a lap faster than the 250 guys. James and Dungey looked like they...
I keep trying to figure out how the 450 guys aren't 5 seconds a lap faster than the 250 guys. James and Dungey looked like they never let off the gas and yet the 250guys matched times so I don't think it's a lack of trying. The track deteriorates between motos and the 250s have the disadvantage there even. Anyone have any suggestions?
kongols wrote:
You have to control the power of 450.
gsxrcr28 wrote:
Also you can corner much faster on a lighter bike. It's nothing new, depending on the track, lites bikes have been running faster lap times for...
Also you can corner much faster on a lighter bike. It's nothing new, depending on the track, lites bikes have been running faster lap times for years.
Agreed. At a track with ZERO hills, a 250f is going to be just as competitive or more competitive than a 450. Granted, Eli is haulin' the mail. Dude was fast.
DrSweden
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5/28/2012 3:49pm
More odd is that so many C and B riders thinks the 250Fs are to mellow!Whistling
fader418
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Lake Forest, CA, USA
5/28/2012 4:00pm
This is just another reason to allow 250 2 strokes in the 250 class....
5/28/2012 4:06pm
I'd rather watch a midpack pro on a small bore than a top 5 pro on a BFP 450 ANYDAY.
Faceaz
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5/28/2012 4:29pm
Pretty incredible average for Tomac to be under Stewart / Dungey, especially considerring how much the 250's dropped off at the end of moto 2. Both classes are really exciting this summer, but IMO the 250's are generally more impressive, having to carry more corner speed.
5/28/2012 4:38pm
Ah, this is nothing new.
You guys must be forgetting the epic moto battles between RV and BT. Some guys definitely prefer being able to simply twist the throttle wide open and point the bike where you want it to go - just ask Tedesco.
jleews6
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5/28/2012 5:51pm
Sometimes it's not how fast you go but how little you slow down.
txmxer
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5/28/2012 6:05pm
Tomac did a great job of carrying momentum into the few corners I could see at the race, but watching the TV, it was hard to see where he was making so much time on everyone--basically, he was doing it everywhere. It was and impressive ride.

Those graphs are cool to look at. Seeing 7 and 5 so close lap after lap is/was awesome and impressive.

I think the biggest difference is riding to protect your line versus riding out front and charging. Once Eli made a pass, he was gone. No pressure. Hope he keeps the heat on and we get to see BB and Eli battle. Maybe KROC can get in that mix.
5/28/2012 6:25pm
DrSweden wrote:
More odd is that so many C and B riders thinks the 250Fs are to mellow!Whistling
I doubt the B and C guys have the same engine that these guys have. Just sayin...
dean122
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Upland, CA, USA
5/28/2012 6:38pm Edited Date/Time 5/28/2012 6:43pm
250 vs. 450 lap times are never apples to apples. Espeically when looking at actual motos.

Besides corner speed for the 250 class they get a freshly groomed track to lay down some good times. 450 class is on a track that has 30+2 already..

No 250 class riders dropped below 2:06 in the 2nd moto whereas the 450 class did it both motos. To make any kind of comparison you have to scrap the 1st 250 moto with a pristine track and compare their 2nd moto to the 450 2nd moto.
ATKpilot99
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5/28/2012 6:44pm
dean122 wrote:
250 vs. 450 lap times are never apples to apples. Espeically when looking at actual motos. Besides corner speed for the 250 class they get a...
250 vs. 450 lap times are never apples to apples. Espeically when looking at actual motos.

Besides corner speed for the 250 class they get a freshly groomed track to lay down some good times. 450 class is on a track that has 30+2 already..

No 250 class riders dropped below 2:06 in the 2nd moto whereas the 450 class did it both motos. To make any kind of comparison you have to scrap the 1st 250 moto with a pristine track and compare their 2nd moto to the 450 2nd moto.
The 450s run first. The had a heavily watered track to deal with in the 1st moto though.
dean122
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5/28/2012 6:46pm
ATKpilot99 wrote:
The 450s run first. The had a heavily watered track to deal with in the 1st moto though.
ah yer right, my bad.
bullpen58
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5/28/2012 6:49pm
dean122 wrote:
250 vs. 450 lap times are never apples to apples. Espeically when looking at actual motos. Besides corner speed for the 250 class they get a...
250 vs. 450 lap times are never apples to apples. Espeically when looking at actual motos.

Besides corner speed for the 250 class they get a freshly groomed track to lay down some good times. 450 class is on a track that has 30+2 already..

No 250 class riders dropped below 2:06 in the 2nd moto whereas the 450 class did it both motos. To make any kind of comparison you have to scrap the 1st 250 moto with a pristine track and compare their 2nd moto to the 450 2nd moto.
Wrong dude. The 450s go first these days. They have been that way for a year or two.

Also, like noted by panic revver above, those 250Fs of the top dudes put out SERIOUS ponies. They have a very short life though. Basically, they are built to last 30+2. Add another lap and those engines would grenade into oblivion.

If I were rich, I would buy a new 250F every year and have the engine COMPLETELY breathed-on. I am fat but a highly modded 250F would haul my fat ass around just fine. I just can't afford to rebuild an engine every two months so I ride a 450.
MX4EVR
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5/28/2012 7:21pm
Stewart has more left in he tank don't be stupid
Crush
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5/28/2012 10:26pm
Wonder how James would do on a RM125 in the 250 class... Whistling Whistling Whistling Whistling Whistling
Bob454
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5/29/2012 5:48am
bullpen58 wrote:
Wrong dude. The 450s go first these days. They have been that way for a year or two. Also, like noted by panic revver above, those...
Wrong dude. The 450s go first these days. They have been that way for a year or two.

Also, like noted by panic revver above, those 250Fs of the top dudes put out SERIOUS ponies. They have a very short life though. Basically, they are built to last 30+2. Add another lap and those engines would grenade into oblivion.

If I were rich, I would buy a new 250F every year and have the engine COMPLETELY breathed-on. I am fat but a highly modded 250F would haul my fat ass around just fine. I just can't afford to rebuild an engine every two months so I ride a 450.
Grenade after one more lap? Get a grip man they last 2 motos plus practice....and I bet they would last alot more
mark_swart
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5/29/2012 6:24am
There's also no elevation changes to speak of at Freestone.
burnside
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5/29/2012 6:51am
The top 5 in the 250 class this year is so "Talented" its not even funny, seems like they get better and better i cannot wait...
The top 5 in the 250 class this year is so "Talented" its not even funny, seems like they get better and better i cannot wait for Barcia to hop on a 450 full time and coming in to a season fully trained and ready!!Cool
It's nuts isn't it? A cluster fuck of moto prodigies!
jamma10
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5/29/2012 7:18am
The top 5 in the 250 class this year is so "Talented" its not even funny, seems like they get better and better i cannot wait...
The top 5 in the 250 class this year is so "Talented" its not even funny, seems like they get better and better i cannot wait for Barcia to hop on a 450 full time and coming in to a season fully trained and ready!!Cool
burnside wrote:
It's nuts isn't it? A cluster fuck of moto prodigies!
I thought the Blake Wharton interview they showed during the first moto at Freestone was pretty on point.

He touched on the difference in race intensity between the classes and the fact that most 450 riders have been been racing for a quite a long time. I've always thought this, that once riders reach the 450 class and find themselves finishing in the same sort of position year after year they lose the hunger. Which is natural in any job I guess.
Cook441
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Fantasy
5/29/2012 7:30am
I think JS commented in his interview regarding how the track got better by the end of the moto..almost likje they broke it in by the end. Wish theyd leave it alone all day personally. I hate to say it but I also wish one of these fast lites guys would go outta contention and hop up like Barcia last year then you'd have a real comparison and a little more action in the bigs....selfish I know.

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