Should Lapped Riders Be Removed in a SX Main Event? | @Ping 16

B_Rez991
2/4/2022 12:13pm

 

Welcome back to the latest format of @Ping!

In this episode, Ping covers the difference between cable and hydraulic clutches, why tuff blocks are not used on practice tracks, and whether or not lapped riders should be removed from a race.

Do you have burning questions that need answering?

We are now accepting video and voice recordings directly to ping@vitalmx.com. As always, you can submit your written questions to the @ Ping VitalMX Forum or send them directly to ping@vitalmx.com.

Related:
Troy Lee Designs
Boyesen
EKS Brand
David Pingree
SKDA
@PING
2022 Monster Energy Supercross
hydraulic clutch
cable clutch
Tuff Blocks
@Ping
16 comments

View replies to: Should Lapped Riders Be Removed in a SX Main Event? | @Ping

c50 B3B61D9B 7E94 4006 9762 BF799BD76992 1666221488
RaceFace58
2 years ago
Here’s why you can’t remove riders after being lapped. Instead of pulling safely out of the way, they will now desperately be trying to not get lapped. Guys going two laps down and just circulating aren’t that slow. They are doing it to finish. If you make any kind of mandate, whether it be minimum lap time or two laps down you still create a scenario where slower riders will be racing to stay in the race and less willing to pull out of the way. You create a worse problem than the one trying to be solved.
1
1
c50 fb picture 1155845706 1370038890
RF145
2 years ago
But what you see as a problem is part of the solution. To keep anyone that is on the track racing forward. That in itself keeps the speed differential much lower and allows for easier passing by the leaders. Those rolling the track, are much more dangerous and difficult to judge where they will be at any given time due to the higher delta.
c50 B3B61D9B 7E94 4006 9762 BF799BD76992 1666221488
RaceFace58
2 years ago
You’re not paying attention tj what I said. Right now guys rolling the track move out of the way. Usually far out of the way. If you make them desperate to stay out there they’ll become a bigger danger as they aren’t pulling over to lose time and get flagged off. Guys going a lap down will desperately try and stay on the lead lap etc. the real reason anyone would want this is because Lappers who are still racing are interfering with the leaders’ race. The “solution” would just create more of this at amore desperate level. To me having lappers that are harder to pass and don’t pull over is increasing the existing problem. It would be garbage if they have to maintain a minimum lap time but are also expected to pull over for faster riders. Last place don’t forget is still trying to make money and likely needs it a lot more than first place does.
avatar
Frank Tuesday
2 years ago
But you pull them before they get lapped. You don't wait until they've already gotten in the way of the leaders, you pull them before they have a chance to get in the way of the leaders. Pick the last timing loop before the Finish Line, and if they are less than 8 (or whatever other time is agreed upon) seconds ahead of the leader, they get a black flag at the finish line. They are off the track before the leader comes through the finish. And if they ignore the black flag, they miss the next race.
c50 IMG 20140918 194513 859 1432415181
HD1200
2 years ago
My answer is simply no! (Title question only) you might as well have a top 10 gate...
1
avatar
Frank Tuesday
2 years ago
They still get to race until they get pulled. It's not like most of the guys getting pulled are able to go fast for the full 20 minutes anyway.
c50 IMG 6854 1650086183
devindavisphoto
2 years ago
I think the better way to figure this out is black flag a rider if their lap times can't stay within a certain percentage of the leaders pace. They do this for qualifying in the SX Futures class. I don't see why they can't do something similar for the pro class.. once you log in consecutive laps at a certain % off the pace of the leaders, you get black flagged. I'm sure there's a way to do this.
3
c50 2014 03 15 10 48 56cropped 1394907345
Gravel
2 years ago
Ping is absolutely right, lapped once can easily happen while the rider is still putting in a great effort. Lapped twice usually shows a lack of effort or ability (due to physical, mental or equipment factors) and when that happens the rider should be pulled. It just bugs me to see a guy just rolling the track in a national level race. You’re a professional, put out a good effort.
4
avatar
Bradshaw Fan
2 years ago
Minimum lap times. Nascar does this. There is a speed they can not go below or they are back flagged due to dangerous race conditions.. Give the riders a minimum lap time they have to achieve every lap or they are back flagged. Along with if you are lap twice your gone. Lappers should not play a part in the finish. Webb should NOT get a win because another brand sharing platform rider gets in the way. Can not wait to see how Anderson treats Webb when he is in his way now that he is on a green. #letsgopaul
4
c50 fb picture 1155845706 1370038890
RF145
2 years ago
Lappers; as described by the submission, “out of contention”.
If a racer is just circulating the track, two laps down at the minimum, black flag them please. Anyone under the two lap minimum should be allowed to continue at their race pace. Anyone rolling the track, should be black flagged. With the Webb/KR94/DW15 incident, that is a failure on KR94’s part as his racecraft needs to aware of what is going on around him and make the correct choices to pass said lapped and hold off any pass attempts by Webb.
I think this is not a complex as one would think, but add in Feld and the AMA and a paper bag becomes very complex.
avatar
boaz
2 years ago
Good point about being able to go a lap down but still be in the race to salvage points / fight for a potential top 10 or 15 whatever. I think if you go 2 laps down, your race should be over when you cross the line and that is your finishing position.
1
c50 img 1 1643121809233 1643122178
Joey_Bridges
2 years ago
If they're out there just circulating the track, not actively battling for a position, then out you go once the leader laps you.

And in all reality there should be a way to get them off one or two turns before they get lapped, and potentially spode out in front of leader.

Fine line to draw though.
2