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There are many things in this post to take issue with but I will use this one:
"We MUST acknowledge that the authority of the State is illegitimate."
Dude! This sounds like the first line of a speech at a "sovereign citizen" rally. The state has authority as defined in the Constitution. In the opinion of many of us, a great deal of their authority goes beyond the original charter. That is where the tipping point is and so far, people like me have been outvoted. Which, btw is the ultimate power.
Your post had meaning?
Why should we think the authority of the state is illegitimate in general (as opposed to disagreeing with certain particular aspects of the state we inhabit)? There are plenty of arguments for the need for political authorities, laws, etc - from Plato and Aristotle to Hobbes, Locke and Rousseau, to more contemporary philosophers like Joseph Raz. Even thoroughgoing libertarians like Jan Narveson and Robert Nozick think that we need the authority of the state for the enforcement of contracts and national security (get rid of the state and the courts that you go to when someone stiffs you are gone, and someone else will come along and impose another state on us - your guns aren't going to do much against their tanks, planes, and bombs). What Narveson and Nozick argue against is the welfare state, not the state in general - though your complaint about the concentration of wealth with the 1% seems to indicate that you'd like to see redistribution, which is the fundamental thing the welfare state aims to do. You also seems to be expressing more of a discontent with the global order than with any particular state. It's not entirely clear whether it's "the state" (states in general), "a state" (a particular state), or the global order that you're objecting to.
Why want a state at all? If the state fulfills its function in a generally competent way, it is providing us with the conditions for the possibility of pursuing our interests. (As opposed to a chaos where we are each pitted against each other in a solitary, nasty, brutish and short life, to adopt Hobbes' characterization of the state of nature). Unless you want to move to an island where you and like minded people can be self sufficient and left alone, there's an awful lot of people to get along with, and some of them are hostile, selfish, and dangerous.
So what's your alternative and your argument that it's feasible? So far, you've made assertions but not arguments. It's one thing to advocate for a more minimalistic state, but to outright deny that the state's claim to authority is, in general, legitimate is quite another. Unless there is a compelling case that includes a demonstrably better alternative, we should probably not just blow the whole thing up and hope for the best. Be careful what you wish for - you might get it.
This thread needs to take an Ambien. Maybe Hunters laptop can share one.
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I fully comprehended what the, copypasta quote changer, wrote.
And again, have pity on anyone who thinks money is all we have.
I don’t know exactly what these sovereign citizens are but I’ve seen some of their stuff in social media and I think they’re kooks. anyone who thinks they can somehow remain sovereign as an individual while living under the existence of the state I think doesn’t understand certain things. They’re trying to use the authority of the state to claim themselves free and independent of it? Seems very strange
As far as the constitution goes. I’m saying I don’t care what it says. And I don’t claim to know its ins and outs, but I do assume it has some very good and important elements within it that can offer advice and help man live with man. However once there is an authority that exists to help enforce it under the threat of violence, it looses all validity to me. Rules of men within man, that is to say Honor, hold far more legitimacy then the rule of laws in my opinion
As far as the rest of what you say- “In the opinion of many of us, a great deal of their authority goes beyond the original charter. That is where the tipping point is and so far, people like me have been outvoted. Which, btw is the ultimate power.” you will have to expand on that if you’d like. I don’t understand what your saying.
For those of us who actually believe that the US Constitution is the best roadmap for civilization, al least so far, it's the constant pressure to get around it and even ignore it that puts us in jeopardy. One example is "rent seeking". If you do a little research on it, it is one person or group, using government, to gain advantage over their competition. It was one of the reasons we quit using tariffs to the extent we did. There are many others which have allowed the federal government to get involved in issues that are state issues. 9th and 10th amendment stuff. As originally written, the us Constitution allowed for the the kind of autonomy that you are looking for but not for many years. Once the Fed's started getting involved in area like education, it put control further and further away from the PTA and city councils, where it should be. I could turn this into a text wall but most understand federal government overreach.
Oh Christ Joey.... now you're crying because your username was tagged?
Such a victim.
It's pathetic how insecure you are but then still parade around here like the smartest fucker in the world.
You gonna own up to posting that fake ass letter or are you just gonna ignore that because you ain't ever man enough to admit fault?
We should think of the state as illegitimate because it needs and uses violence to enforce its authority. It’s a hierarchical structure where we have less than or in some cases no power to control what it ultimately decides is best for us. It assumes that it knows better than I as to what I need for my life. And It has monopolized violence in order to enforce this concept. A good example of this would be Social Security in America and the idea that THEY know better then I, as to how to save MY money and they have the legal (though illegitimate imo) backing of the law to enforce this using violence.
I do not want a State at all. And it is not competent in any way. It does not allow us to pursue our interests because it fundamentally does not allow for individuals to take full responsibility for their lives and actions and therefore does not allow us to utilize all of our functions and utilities as human beings. It is illegal to take full responsibility for oneself. Requiring car insurance in order to drive on the road would be a good example of this.
I do not want a State. I do not want a nation. I have zero nationalistic tendencies, though different regions and cultures are certainly valued and would be appreciated even more so for their differing qualities in a would without nations.
As far as Hobbes goes, are we not already pitted against each other in a solitary, nasty, brutish and short life? This is already the world we live in and it can be seen throughout the pages of this very thread. Also, I believe Hobbes to be wholly incorrect and I’m not the only one.
I believe that most people are mostly good and will choose to do the right thing most of the time as long as it does not jeopardize their own existence. In this modality peoples existence and quality of existence is largely based on money and so of doing the right thing means jeopardizing your existence most won’t act in a just way. Doing the wrong thing and acting in the wrong way is actually rewarded in our society. Lazy people on welfare getting paid to be lazy. Or individuals like king leopold of Belgium committing atrocities beyond belief in order to exploit and control the natural resources of the Congo are good examples of doing bad pays.
The alternative. I don’t have all the answers. And I openly admit that it will take a sort of leap of faith on our part to make it happen. We’ve been so conditioned over many generations to believe in and defend our masters. Just look how quickly (though I welcome the discussion) all of you guys responded from an apologist position defending the status quo.
Asking me this is like asking a blind man to describe a color he’s never seen. It is like asking me to prove that love exists.
I don’t have all the answers but I can provide a compelling case that what we have now is not working! The absolute incompetency of government on every level proves this every day.
Could I do better? Yes I could! Just like if I had all the same resources available to me that say Chevrolet has, I could in about 2 weeks and without using any sort of new technology (that may or may not exist) design and begin to manufacture a vehicle that could easily get twice the gas mileage, last easily 100 years, be at least half the price and 10 times easier to maintain and cheaper to fix.
Things are not functioning to be efficient because efficiency is not what pays. See what I’m saying?
It looked real; was kind of harmless though.
But why is it so hard for folks to admit they got duped?
Duped by the letter? Okay, we got duped… Are we sure it’s fake? Oh well, this guy will be out the door soon anyway, for all his fancy expenditures - $300 pair of socks, a fur sink, and a 30 story one bedroom apartment. Crazy stuff
Does the seal on the letter look real to you? Have you seen his resignation reported anywhere in the news?
It'd be great if @Joey Bridges could come back and give some more context since he posted it and then doubled down on it being real.... but we all know he ain't man enough. His fragile little ego could NEVER handle having to admit he was wrong, he's way too fucking scared for that. Rest assured though, he'll still be around throwing out insults and telling anyone he doesn't agree with to shut up....but he won't ever use facts to back up what he says.
America would be soooooo much better off without the complete fucking losers on both political teams that just care about their team winning and don't care about America.
I’m running around all the damn time with Sirius on and I hadn’t heard anything…hence, I asked if it was real…
I've written extensively on the topic of legal authority. I'd be happy to make this paper available as a PDF if you're interested. It spells out the theory of authority that I think is right and how it applies to what I call "the circumstances of politics", where there is lack of agreement about which laws to enact but the need to make a choice anyways. I think that you probably gathered that I do think that political and legal authorities can be legitimate. I'm not going to get into the details of it here or I'd be writing a dissertation. There's much I could say, and whether we ultimately agree or not is unimportant - I enjoy reading your thoughts on this topic as they are novel and interesting (I'd rather read something that I think is wrong but interesting vs right but banal).
https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/canadian-journal-of-law-and-jurisprudence/article/abs/authority-of-law-in-the-circumstances-of-politics/0E4C9423524BC522B631EB250498D6EE
So, here’s the seal I pulled off federalreserve.gov. So I guess he’s not going anywhere 😏
He's not going anywhere voluntarily.
Manny, I don’t think that anyone is ‘drawing parallels’ and saying that the conditions of those two men are the ‘same’.
The question is, at what point do you care about the president’s cognitive abilities? It’s obvious that Trump has lost a bit since 2016, so at what point do you begin to call it out? How would you measure or quantify it?
If the answer is just “But what about Biden?”, then it’s pretty clear that cognitive decline isn’t really the issue, it’s just something that is convenient as a partisan tool.
Pit Row
Yeah, I’m not an expert but he’s older, duh. And there may be obvious times where he might not remember something exactly. Why bring it up now? Why is it so bad if we bring up Biden?
Sometimes it's best to let shit go, unfortunately.
I do agree that I wish we could generally make being accountable great again. We are all human and make mistakes, own it and move on. Try and learn from our mistakes and be better than yesterday. This is lost on a lot of folks these days unfortunately, hopefully it gets found at some point.
The AI summary was pretty hilarious.
We humans will continue to make mistakes. The protocol now seems to mostly be to deflect, blame others, etc. I appreciate you owning some of yours earlier in this thread. We may not agree on everything, but that shit is refreshing to see. Kudos brotha.
Nice! ^
Yep, dick thing for me to say for sure, I don't actually believe what I said either just got caught up in wanting to put Joey down.
Felt better to admit that than to run and hide from it though, I wish more people felt that way.
Wait a second…
You’re saying The Donald’s lost a step?
I’m not. I am seeing a dude that’s calmed way the fuck down…since being shot at.
But, that’s just me.
Honest question.... how many 79 year olds do you know in real life that haven't lost at least a little bit of a step?
I think it's a reflection of how big of a shitshow America is that the last President clearly had dementia and the best thing we could replace him with was someone over a decade past retirement age.
America is cooked.
You should really get your well water tested Professor Positive. 🙃😁
In academic philosophy, some scholars do their best work after retiring from teaching. Bertrand Russell wrote his last book when he was in his late 90s. Old doesn’t mean useless.
Not to speak to the works of Russell cause I'm ignorant but wisdom (age plus experience) is very real. My great grandmother lived to 103 and was extremely sharp and witty til the end. It definitely isn't the norm but shouldn't be discarded off hand.
It would be interesting to gather a few of those sharp old birds and ask them what they think about the state of things.
The answer lies in the evolution of our beautiful two party system.
Pick from one of two increasingly shittier buckets of bullshit. Where everyone has had to compromise on their own beliefs and values more and more.
And some how both shitty buckets pick old white dudes to carry them. Just as we have minimum age requirement for the job, we need to have a maximum age limit too.
President Trump is the best President we have had since Ronald Reagan. He has positive accomplishments reported every day. He knows how to run our country better than anyone we could have put in the position. Lower energy costs, a secure border, and deregulation help every American.
Laughable
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