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this sport is small with sides/teams to choose...reeks of nepotism in many cases.
Well no shit Tonto.
A buddy of mine has been in the cycling business for years ( Mfg) and as long as they give the mags loads of free shit including the bike being "tested" and take them out to lavish dinners with booze flowing freely they can actually WRITE THE TESTS THEMSELVES !!!! Then the mag just proofs and prints.
In my biz I have people constantly advertising "We'll beat your lowest quoted price by 10 % " So, following that logic, you find two companies doing that and you end up getting whatever you need for nothing and a backpocket full of cash.
Not sure if this is relevant but - ho hum !!
I know real journalism isn't really present in this biz, but sometimes they should at least pretend/try...
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Top guys like Frank, Simon and Kinney as well as Paul Buckley (when he was with us) have and do get season long contracts with clients - thats fairly normal nowadays ( I have had a few of my own ) thats not really the issue here or will prevent undercutting down the road.
What needs to happen is the economy needs to improve and the companies need to realize that there is a cost of doing business and that photography IMAGE ADS are VITAL to their success and that when they skimp on the visual impact of their company they are reducing their overall image. I will say that a majority of them do understand this very well.
Since my first day in this industry I have known there to be a "swag for service" mentality with too many companies.
I have had to say things like.... "Im sorry sir but I tried to feed my kids the photo credit out of the magazine and they just keep telling me cereal tastes better so ill be needing cash or check instead of a photo credit as payment (this way I can buy groceries you see)
On the other hand there are some damn fine companies who throw swag around and expect nothing back - they are just happy that you are running their gear and putting the word out there in your travels - which is the true point of swag, it shouldnt be used as barter for service.
I had the national forest service call me once for photos - the woman was the AD AGENCY for the forest service, she told me right off the bat that she didnt have a budget for photography and i was flabbergasted - I asked her again to confirm...you are an AD AGENCY for the national forest service? "yes I am" ....so since there is no budget your agency is doing the work pro bono for the forest service? "click"
some people (too many) just dont want to pay for photos, they dont think photography is a valued commodity and let me be the first to say that it is the photographer him/herself who is to blame for things getting this way. we have all cut our costs to get work, given up this or made that concession in order to keep working and make "some" money...even working for free to get a foot in the door ( this is a tool that so many new photographers use to break into the industry ) thats why you see such a turnover of photogs ... when they go broke and cant afford the travel or new equipment they quit and a whole new batch come in and take their place doing the same thing - there are companies who dont have a photo budget or bank on this fact and employ it to save costs. but the bottom line is that whoring ourselves out is gonna do exactly that - turn us into whores!
I got tired of the travel and the schedule (and to some extent the inner workings of this industry to be honest), thats why I settled down here in Vegas and got a regular job - mostly though... my kids & Danya deserved better and MX photos wasnt cutting it anymore - I dont blame anyone in the industry though, if I was better at what I did then I would probably still be here full time - my hat goes off to Frank and all the guys shooting hardcore still - it seems like a great job to those looking in but its really not what its cracked up to be ....grass is always greener on the other side as they say.
Speaking of regular jobs - the photo below is where i work now - Aria at the new CityCenter - it opens this wednesday at midnight and it is AMAZING inside and out! words & photos dont do it justice - last night Danya and I were one of the first to see a dress rehearsel of the Circe show "Viva Elvis" here at Aria ...a show celebrating the young elvis - in attendance - Priscilla and Lisa Marie Presley...pretty cool stuff!
When you guys come into town if ya dont stay here at Aria...make sure you visit, it will blow you away...its one of the largest buildings ever to earn a gold LEED rating, it has 4,004 rooms over 500 suites, it has radiant heat and cooled floors, smoke curtains at all the gaming tables - in room technology with touch screen remote that controls everything from lighting, temperature, television, music and services to a fully stocked mini bar and media hub for you techies. it cost 9 billion dollars and is spread out over 67 acres and there are 5 properties in all - Aria the crowning jewel and only one that has gaming - Vdara which is a non gaming hotel for those guests who want gaming close by but can escape back to amore serene setting - Crystals which is top shelf shopping (all the top designers etc) Veer towers which are a residential condo community right in the middle of it all and they lean at 5 degrees like the leaning tower of pisa - both towers have an infinity pool at the top overlooking the strip - Mandarin Oriental and The Harmon which wont open until late 2010. The Aria alone is worth coming for - trust me.
Wasn't Team Kawasaki just being smart, as was Swap, by making the most of an opportunity?
Look, how different is this than the Suzuki shoot over at Racer-X, last week?
The only difference may be that Simon (Cudby, shot the Suzuki stuff if I'm not mistaken...) may have been paid as a "Free-Lance" and Transworld shoots their own stuff.
There it is.
PERIOD.
No Black-Helicopters. No "Lone-Gun-man". No Tin-Foil hat.
The "TMZ" of Moto...Classic.
Oh, I see...the whole issue of whether or not this affects the relationship between the OEM's and the Magazines is truly "not" at hand, right?
Or the "Biases" there-in.
Or whether or not this is just a misinterpretation of what actually went down.
It's obvious that folks don't even read Reponses by "The Accused" in here...so...let's try this again:
The offer WAS made to EVERY team, not just Kawasaki. Kawasaki was the only major team that didn't already have their plans finalized. And the request for photo credit in other magazines is completely false, Frank. There was a misunderstanding about that.
Our job is to gather the best content possible, and to gain the best access possible, for our readers. Here is how our offer went: TransWorld Motocross would like the opportunity to shoot photos and video with your race team before the start of your season. You may use the photos however you wish, free of charge, as long as we are allowed to use them in our magazine and on our web site.
Donn's words as posted a few pages back.
So, where's the smoking gun?
Where's the real "Meat' to the implied accusation?
Btw, I've seen Donn 'shoot' on more than a few ocassions. Supercross races come to mind.
At the end of the day: It was a Budget Decision by Kawi. A wise one. Pay for images or not.
Gee...did Donn get a "Scoop" on something by being on the scene? Hmmmmmmmmmm...
Now I see why Davey has made the decison NOT to do 'Tests'...
but who's keeping track
I dont think anyone blames anyone for that. I certainly dont.
there are several subjects and tones in this thread and one of the questions brought up was ethics - There was a miscommunication apparently and he thought TWMX was doing it for free in order to get photo credits wherever you used the images- Donn said this wasnt the case so Frank posed the question if it was ethical for a magazine to engage in practices normally done by freelance photographers? and not editorial outlets.
I dont think thats an unfair question.
haha...no, not at all... I took that in myown time and you guys are actually the first ones ive shown it too - Im just sincerely proud to work there, I have medical and dental for the first time since 1997 ( when i started shooting moto seriously) and i honestly think you guys would enjoy going there. thats it ( no black helicopters here either )
Although TMZ will probly be there new years to cover Eva Longoria opening her new restaurant "Beso"
Pit Row
Ill be going for my first checkup soon since 97 - ill probly have 2 weeks to live once they start doing tests on me.
No one can compete with FREE.
Did I say you were an ass already?
)....all tests are biased one way or another.......they all get free shit and compensation one way or another.............mxa suggest everyone run the same spring rates and clicker settings.....that is impossible..........over the years they all contradict themselves and to be honest i trust dirt bike mag over all of em......
I think this strayed way off the original topic, and is more of a personal attack than something that adds to the discussion.
If you're going to lay out stuff like this, maybe you should add your own name to it, rather than be an anonymous heckler.
During my time at TWMX, Donn was a tough boss, but his push always helped make the final product better.
Thanks for the heads up.....Thanks a lot! lol
Sorry dude, you ruined your entire post with that last paragraph, you confirmed their results by asking riders at the races about their bikes? Give me a break! As someone who has ridden mx bikes for nearly 20 years now, and has owned all 5 of the popular mx brands, i can say all of them are great, shootouts are weird deals to begin with, no one can tell you what bike is best for you. What you can do though, is read all the magazine shootouts and try to decipher which details/results seem to be most consistent for each bike. Shootouts are also good ways of knowing if any particular bike has an inherent flaw that just cannot be fixed, but these days all experienced motocross riders will tell you to generally take them with a grain of salt.
Tony Fuckin Scavo
hahaha ...sorry couldnt resist
Cool on the dentist referal, as long as she is in my network of providers ill definitely take her - I belong to the culinary union so we have better insurance if we use the listed providers, tell me her name or practice she is with and ill look at my list ( im also on the NW side of town
Thank you
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