Posts
45
Joined
6/13/2023
Location
Manteca, CA
US
Edited Date/Time
6/13/2023 11:18pm
Do you think that they are causing more crashes near the first turn?
Seems like alot of riders are going down.
The new starting gate seems to make the start more even for all of the riders causing more traffic.
*Edited for the people who rode on the short bus.
what exactly does “at holeshot” mean?
Pretty much the first turn.
It's not just the grates, it's everything to do with starting combined. This is how i look at at.
The grates reduce separation between the riders, everyone is coming off the same surface with 100% traction.
The start devices stop the front wheel coming up meaning riders can accelerate harder off the line.
Riders have rpm lights so they know the exact revs to dump the clutch at
Bikes have start maps to ensure the engine is at its optimum throughout the start procedure.
Put all of these factors together and you have more riders getting to the first turn closer together and at higher speeds. What could go wrong?
Matthes discussed this with AP on Monday nights show
Don’t know about starts at pro narts, but I’m not a fan. This seems like something that will pressure amateur tracks to follow suit. That is, if the pro series keeps using start grates, local tracks will follow suit. This raises two issues.
First, it’s more expensive for track owners. This sport needs to stay cheap to enter and cheap to operate if it’s going to reach a wide audience. Slowly pressuring local track operators to invest more capital to operate a track will lead to fewer people undertaking the burden of operating a track.
Second, it’s more expensive for amateur racers. You’re starting on a literal cheese grater. The pros don’t care because they get free tires, but for the average amateur the difference between a starting grate and a traditional packed rut may be the difference between getting 8 hours out of a tire and getting 10 hours out of a tire.
I think this is one of those technologies that will gradually trickle into amateur racing because local tracks will be pressured to adapt to pro standards. This will raise costs for track operators and amateur racers without providing a consummate benefit.
get rid of them.
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"TheGetFresh wrote:
Second, it’s more expensive for amateur racers. You’re starting on a literal cheese grater. The pros don’t care because they get free tires, but for the average amateur the difference between a starting grate and a traditional packed rut may be the difference between getting 8 hours out of a tire and getting 10 hours out of a tire."
Any evidence for this 20% tyre life reduction due to grates?
Get rid of them.
Nope! Too novel. Hence “may”. But I’m confident In my conjecture that it’s worse on tires. If you’d like to argue that starting on a steel grate does not cause greater tire wear than a traditional start, you’re free to.
so can someone be second “at the holeshot?”
Don't play stupid.You knew exactly what I meant.
2 of the tracks in my area have installed them already. I'm not sure if grates are worse for tires than straight concrete. That shit just rounds the knobs like crazy
As the expert I'd like to ask you are the grates really steel, or the easier to handle aluminium?
Are they a sharp edged, slitted, expanded metal material or a rounded style?
They are steel. There is more traction one direction than the other, because of the expanded metal design that is used. At least at the pro level. The less aggressive direction is used. (Meaning the tire drives off the less aggressive angle-less sharp side of the metal). A tire lasts way longer doing grate starts than concrete starts. By a lot!!!! It’s kind of weird how the tire looks after multiple starts on grates. The sharp driving edge of the knobs doesn’t show much wear. But half way down the center knob shows some marks from the grate. Also, the scoop tires drive off grates just fine. Dirt starts are probably the easiest on tires. Unless it’s really hard packed dirt like most starts get after a long day of racing. Just my observations.
Motocross is raced on dirt. That includes the first 5 feet in my opinion.
I don’t think so, but I’m personally not a fan. I’d rather it be dirt all the way. Thought it was dumb when they started on concrete too.
Are you on a personal mission or something? Did I piss you off in another thread? Your questions have been answered. You’re free to make your point.
I say bring back rubber band starts!!!
I help run the start line at Hangtown. Have every year since 1989.
At first I was skeptical of the grates.
After using them I am more of a fan just from a working perspective. They are pretty heavy. It takes a crew of young bucks to get them in quickly Friday night.
But it is a lot less work on Saturday! For the first time ever I was able to even watch the first half of every moto because we didn't have to rake and shovel the ruts with a crew of aging volunteers, me included.
Do they cause more crashes? Way to early to tell in three races. Who is doing that study? Do they cause more in Supercross?
As a start line worker? So far I am a fan!
Thanks.
So same mesh for SX and Outdoors?
Pit Row
Calm down.
Yes. The design is different, but the wire mesh is the same.
Only 14 vote downs for me on this thread?
Let's get that number to 30 or 40 real quick.
Are you,or do you know Jim Moe?
You went back and added up the down votes for each of your posts in this thread? Get a life man.
No thanks. I'd rather have Nu Metal instead.
First question is WHO had the authority to say, "let's go to metal start grates".
Second question is if you asked him the reasoning, what would his answer be?
It's hard for me to believe the answer would be, "to pile everyone in the first corner all at once and cause major carnage".
In other words, someone thinks it's a good idea and I would like to hear why.
I know Jim.
Of course!
...the first 5 feet measured from the front wheel or back wheel? Asking for a friend.
Nice insight from someone who is involved. Thanks Dirtdgr
The grates cannot be blamed for what happens in the first turn. Period!
And I'm effing certain Martin's arm had nothing to do with the start process.
Random first turn pics from the outdoor season so far. Where is this bunching up?
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