Additional $1225 in fees over MSRP for new bikes? Really?

8tensolutions
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3563
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11/15/2009
Location
Salt Lake City, UT, USA
5/26/2021 8:34pm Edited Date/Time 5/26/2021 8:36pm
agn5008 wrote:
Some dealers aren’t charging it. And I found a good one who doesn’t. See here’s the thing, I have been spending A LOT of money on...
Some dealers aren’t charging it. And I found a good one who doesn’t. See here’s the thing, I have been spending A LOT of money on this sport for a really long time. And I’m gonna continue to spend a lot of money until I’m gone. I’m a lifer, much like a ton of other people here. We are the ones who will be here til the end. These dealers are taking advantage of the new comers who buy a bike then sell it after they figure out they aren’t that into it. All that’s doing is pissing the “lifers” off. We will remember which dealers tried to bone us when all this passes. My closest Gas Gas dealer tried selling me a 300 for $12,500. I burst out laughing then told him I’ll never spend another penny there. Then found a place to sell me a KTM 300 for $10k OTD. Now put that into perspective once. I got a bike that costs almost $1000 more MSRP for $2500 cheaper. That’s a $3500 swing between the two dealers. Don’t you think that’s a little excessive on a $9600 MSRP item? How much do you expect these guys to make? Like I said, they can take advantage of the newbies who will buy one bike then never buy another again. That’s fine, but us lifers won’t forget it. This is making it very easy to figure out who the honorable dealers are.
If you have been spending "all this money for a long time", how do you not have a relationship with a local shop.....or have you just...
If you have been spending "all this money for a long time", how do you not have a relationship with a local shop.....or have you just been spending all this money wherever was cheapest etc? And if you think a 35% margin is excessive I will ask again what you do for a living.
CKNY wrote:
None of your business what the guy or any other poster here does for a living. You just can’t seem to get it through your head...
None of your business what the guy or any other poster here does for a living.
You just can’t seem to get it through your head the point people are making. We know we have a choice where we buy. Pretty sure most of us are not idiots as you seem to be alluding in some way.
Please stop trying to advise or convince us, we don’t give a shit.
I am not suggesting you are an idiot. If the shoe fits bro.....and if you don't give a shit, why are you posting about it? You clearly are angry a dealer wants to make a reasonable margin, but yet you still expect a paycheck from your employer....and in order to pay you they have to make a reasonable margin. The concept is a challenge, I understand.
1
6
mxtech1
Posts
1968
Joined
7/21/2011
Location
Galesburg, IL, USA
5/26/2021 8:45pm
It’s been awhile since I’ve worked at a motorcycle dealership, but I seem to remember that when we did PDIs, the OEM specified an allotted labor amount (say 2 hours) to complete the job and file the PDI checklist into the OEMs system. if I remember correctly, the PDI labor from the service department was then returned to the dealership as some sort of payment or credit every month.

So why does the customer get charged $300 to $400 in setup fees when the OEM is going to give the dealer a PDI labor credit at the national average rates? Isn’t that double dipping?

I work for John Deere and I know all of our dealer PDIs are handled this way. The dealership receives a PDI credit for each machine that is sold, but the credit is not processed until the PDI information is entered into the system because the PDI is essentially the OEMs last line of defense for quality or performance defects before the product reaches the customers hands.
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davis224
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Location
Cornland, IL, USA
Fantasy
5/27/2021 3:00am
mxtech1 wrote:
It’s been awhile since I’ve worked at a motorcycle dealership, but I seem to remember that when we did PDIs, the OEM specified an allotted labor...
It’s been awhile since I’ve worked at a motorcycle dealership, but I seem to remember that when we did PDIs, the OEM specified an allotted labor amount (say 2 hours) to complete the job and file the PDI checklist into the OEMs system. if I remember correctly, the PDI labor from the service department was then returned to the dealership as some sort of payment or credit every month.

So why does the customer get charged $300 to $400 in setup fees when the OEM is going to give the dealer a PDI labor credit at the national average rates? Isn’t that double dipping?

I work for John Deere and I know all of our dealer PDIs are handled this way. The dealership receives a PDI credit for each machine that is sold, but the credit is not processed until the PDI information is entered into the system because the PDI is essentially the OEMs last line of defense for quality or performance defects before the product reaches the customers hands.
2 hours? Blink I was working in the wrong dealership apparently
1

The Shop

agn5008
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Location
PA, PA, USA
Fantasy
5/27/2021 4:14am
If you have been spending "all this money for a long time", how do you not have a relationship with a local shop.....or have you just...
If you have been spending "all this money for a long time", how do you not have a relationship with a local shop.....or have you just been spending all this money wherever was cheapest etc? And if you think a 35% margin is excessive I will ask again what you do for a living.
CKNY wrote:
None of your business what the guy or any other poster here does for a living. You just can’t seem to get it through your head...
None of your business what the guy or any other poster here does for a living.
You just can’t seem to get it through your head the point people are making. We know we have a choice where we buy. Pretty sure most of us are not idiots as you seem to be alluding in some way.
Please stop trying to advise or convince us, we don’t give a shit.
I am not suggesting you are an idiot. If the shoe fits bro.....and if you don't give a shit, why are you posting about it? You...
I am not suggesting you are an idiot. If the shoe fits bro.....and if you don't give a shit, why are you posting about it? You clearly are angry a dealer wants to make a reasonable margin, but yet you still expect a paycheck from your employer....and in order to pay you they have to make a reasonable margin. The concept is a challenge, I understand.
You can get as upset as you’d like but here are the facts: a lot of people don’t appreciate paying over MSRP. This results in us finding better deals and purchasing those units somewhere else.

I really don’t understand why that bothers you so much. Unsure
4
JBecker 72
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3/25/2014
Location
Eastern Panhandle, WV, USA
5/27/2021 4:16am
CKNY wrote:
None of your business what the guy or any other poster here does for a living. You just can’t seem to get it through your head...
None of your business what the guy or any other poster here does for a living.
You just can’t seem to get it through your head the point people are making. We know we have a choice where we buy. Pretty sure most of us are not idiots as you seem to be alluding in some way.
Please stop trying to advise or convince us, we don’t give a shit.
I am not suggesting you are an idiot. If the shoe fits bro.....and if you don't give a shit, why are you posting about it? You...
I am not suggesting you are an idiot. If the shoe fits bro.....and if you don't give a shit, why are you posting about it? You clearly are angry a dealer wants to make a reasonable margin, but yet you still expect a paycheck from your employer....and in order to pay you they have to make a reasonable margin. The concept is a challenge, I understand.
agn5008 wrote:
You can get as upset as you’d like but here are the facts: a lot of people don’t appreciate paying over MSRP. This results in us...
You can get as upset as you’d like but here are the facts: a lot of people don’t appreciate paying over MSRP. This results in us finding better deals and purchasing those units somewhere else.

I really don’t understand why that bothers you so much. Unsure
I have never bought a bike or truck for MSRP or more, and I never will. It’s worked out so far the past 15 years.
2
yak651
Posts
9087
Joined
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Location
Appleton, WI, USA
Fantasy
5/27/2021 5:22am
I am not suggesting you are an idiot. If the shoe fits bro.....and if you don't give a shit, why are you posting about it? You...
I am not suggesting you are an idiot. If the shoe fits bro.....and if you don't give a shit, why are you posting about it? You clearly are angry a dealer wants to make a reasonable margin, but yet you still expect a paycheck from your employer....and in order to pay you they have to make a reasonable margin. The concept is a challenge, I understand.
agn5008 wrote:
You can get as upset as you’d like but here are the facts: a lot of people don’t appreciate paying over MSRP. This results in us...
You can get as upset as you’d like but here are the facts: a lot of people don’t appreciate paying over MSRP. This results in us finding better deals and purchasing those units somewhere else.

I really don’t understand why that bothers you so much. Unsure
JBecker 72 wrote:
I have never bought a bike or truck for MSRP or more, and I never will. It’s worked out so far the past 15 years.
This is the first time I paid MSRP for my '21 YZ250F but didn't mind because A. the dealer held the last bike he had for me after I messaged him on facebook to confirm the price (with no $$ down) and he had one and B. he doesn't add any BS fees, just the price and tax.
1
5/27/2021 6:09am
Anyone went and priced a new truck lately? Prices are rising, they are several factors at work. The law of supply and demand is at work. The market is working as it supposed to. Bikes are at an all time high demand, so naturally the price is going to go up.

Another factor is shear inflation. The dollar is dropping in value, everything is going up. Check your grocery store bill, or go buy some lumber....

It's not just motorcycle dealers, it's America in 2021!
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4
agn5008
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Location
PA, PA, USA
Fantasy
5/27/2021 6:49am
I would love to know what some of you jerky's do for a living and what the margin is on the work/product/service you're responsible for. Margins...
I would love to know what some of you jerky's do for a living and what the margin is on the work/product/service you're responsible for. Margins on new bikes are garbage to start with, the manufacturer charges the freight (not the dealer), a doc fee pays the office staff to handle the title app/financing/mso etc, and the assembly pays for just that. How is any of that unfair? If it is so bad, then other dealers likely aren't charging it ,so go see them or buy a used bike.

agn5008 wrote:
Some dealers aren’t charging it. And I found a good one who doesn’t. See here’s the thing, I have been spending A LOT of money on...
Some dealers aren’t charging it. And I found a good one who doesn’t. See here’s the thing, I have been spending A LOT of money on this sport for a really long time. And I’m gonna continue to spend a lot of money until I’m gone. I’m a lifer, much like a ton of other people here. We are the ones who will be here til the end. These dealers are taking advantage of the new comers who buy a bike then sell it after they figure out they aren’t that into it. All that’s doing is pissing the “lifers” off. We will remember which dealers tried to bone us when all this passes. My closest Gas Gas dealer tried selling me a 300 for $12,500. I burst out laughing then told him I’ll never spend another penny there. Then found a place to sell me a KTM 300 for $10k OTD. Now put that into perspective once. I got a bike that costs almost $1000 more MSRP for $2500 cheaper. That’s a $3500 swing between the two dealers. Don’t you think that’s a little excessive on a $9600 MSRP item? How much do you expect these guys to make? Like I said, they can take advantage of the newbies who will buy one bike then never buy another again. That’s fine, but us lifers won’t forget it. This is making it very easy to figure out who the honorable dealers are.
If you have been spending "all this money for a long time", how do you not have a relationship with a local shop.....or have you just...
If you have been spending "all this money for a long time", how do you not have a relationship with a local shop.....or have you just been spending all this money wherever was cheapest etc? And if you think a 35% margin is excessive I will ask again what you do for a living.
I’ve been riding dirt bikes for about 30 years. I’ve always gone to one amazing dealership. I still go there for parts most of the time. They sell Honda, Yamaha and Suzuki. I ride a lot of hard enduro now, so obviously none of those manufacturers make a bike that’s comparable to the KTM/husky/gas gas/sherco/beta/Tm bikes made specifically for that type of riding. So, in 2017 I made the switch to husky and had to seek another dealership. Now I’m getting a 22 KTM. If my dealer sold any one of those bikes I would be riding that.

Is that a sufficient enough reason for you? Or should I go back to riding Suzuki’s, convert to riding a 4 stroke for hard enduro, just stop riding enduro and go back to MX so I can purchase a formidable bike from the same dealer I’ve gone to for nearly 30 years or quit riding all together? It’s up to you. You make the call for me. I assume you’re one of the dealers who is charging more than MSRP judging by how upset you are by the fact that most of us not willing to pay more than what a bikes worth.
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1
sandhills
Posts
320
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Location
Scotts Valley, CA, USA
5/27/2021 6:54am
sgrimmxdad wrote:
Anyone went and priced a new truck lately? Prices are rising, they are several factors at work. The law of supply and demand is at work...
Anyone went and priced a new truck lately? Prices are rising, they are several factors at work. The law of supply and demand is at work. The market is working as it supposed to. Bikes are at an all time high demand, so naturally the price is going to go up.

Another factor is shear inflation. The dollar is dropping in value, everything is going up. Check your grocery store bill, or go buy some lumber....

It's not just motorcycle dealers, it's America in 2021!
Groceries aren't up though.
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MXer391
Posts
434
Joined
2/10/2014
Location
Altoona, PA, USA
5/27/2021 7:06am
MXer391 wrote:
Here's how to buy a new bike: Call dealer, ask out the door price, write down price, hang up and call the next dealer and ask...
Here's how to buy a new bike: Call dealer, ask out the door price, write down price, hang up and call the next dealer and ask the same thing. I couldn't give a sh*t less what fees they charge for this and that. All that matters is the out the door price. Once you find a reasonable out the door price, go buy your bike or negotiate with dealer you want. I dunno how you guys get all wrapped up in this dealer fees stuff. Who cares.
mattyhamz2 wrote:
Not sure about your area, but maybe 5% of dealerships here will actually give an OTD price over the phone. The other 95% tell you that...
Not sure about your area, but maybe 5% of dealerships here will actually give an OTD price over the phone. The other 95% tell you that you need to come in first.
lostboy819 wrote:
Exactly, people are wasting their time calling and trying to get a OTD price over the phone. Most sales people wont waste time on people over...
Exactly, people are wasting their time calling and trying to get a OTD price over the phone. Most sales people wont waste time on people over the phone because 90% of them are blowhards with no money or kids. If you are serious about buys a bike you go to the shop.
You guys must have lousy dealers. I have never, ever, in 22 years of buying motocross bikes, had a dealer not quote me a price over the phone. I agree that physically going in and talking to a salesperson is definitely the way to get a good deal but it is not necessary. Sales people work off commission. What the heck difference does it make taking the 30 seconds it takes to give someone a price over the phone or in person? If its a good deal, they're gonna buy the bike either way. I feel bad for you guys if this is the case and I'd be looking for alternative options.
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1
LoudLove
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3008
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Location
USA
5/27/2021 10:22am Edited Date/Time 5/27/2021 11:47am
Are we arguing about supply and demand? Moto riders are notoriously money-conscious, but since COVID, the bike market has experienced an influx of new customers, many with deep pockets. If a dealer can mark up the price and close the deal, more power to them.

If any of us provided a high demand product or service, you owe it to your shareholders (and family) to maximize the value of your asset. It’s not price-gouging if demand exceeds supply across an industry with multiple competitors. And motorcycles compete against ATVs, SXS, plastic surgery, and vacations to Disneyland. It all falls under “disposable income”.
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4
yak651
Posts
9087
Joined
8/26/2006
Location
Appleton, WI, USA
Fantasy
5/27/2021 11:20am
mattyhamz2 wrote:
Not sure about your area, but maybe 5% of dealerships here will actually give an OTD price over the phone. The other 95% tell you that...
Not sure about your area, but maybe 5% of dealerships here will actually give an OTD price over the phone. The other 95% tell you that you need to come in first.
lostboy819 wrote:
Exactly, people are wasting their time calling and trying to get a OTD price over the phone. Most sales people wont waste time on people over...
Exactly, people are wasting their time calling and trying to get a OTD price over the phone. Most sales people wont waste time on people over the phone because 90% of them are blowhards with no money or kids. If you are serious about buys a bike you go to the shop.
MXer391 wrote:
You guys must have lousy dealers. I have never, ever, in 22 years of buying motocross bikes, had a dealer not quote me a price over...
You guys must have lousy dealers. I have never, ever, in 22 years of buying motocross bikes, had a dealer not quote me a price over the phone. I agree that physically going in and talking to a salesperson is definitely the way to get a good deal but it is not necessary. Sales people work off commission. What the heck difference does it make taking the 30 seconds it takes to give someone a price over the phone or in person? If its a good deal, they're gonna buy the bike either way. I feel bad for you guys if this is the case and I'd be looking for alternative options.
Exactly. If the dealer or salesman can't find/take the time to provide a valid price over the phone that would take 5-15 minutes how are they going to find the time to talk to the person when they walk into the shop?
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1
LungButter
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8684
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Location
Yellow Pine, ID, USA
5/27/2021 12:09pm
sandhills wrote:
Groceries aren't up though.
100% wrong.
5
5/27/2021 12:20pm
lostboy819 wrote:
Exactly, people are wasting their time calling and trying to get a OTD price over the phone. Most sales people wont waste time on people over...
Exactly, people are wasting their time calling and trying to get a OTD price over the phone. Most sales people wont waste time on people over the phone because 90% of them are blowhards with no money or kids. If you are serious about buys a bike you go to the shop.
MXer391 wrote:
You guys must have lousy dealers. I have never, ever, in 22 years of buying motocross bikes, had a dealer not quote me a price over...
You guys must have lousy dealers. I have never, ever, in 22 years of buying motocross bikes, had a dealer not quote me a price over the phone. I agree that physically going in and talking to a salesperson is definitely the way to get a good deal but it is not necessary. Sales people work off commission. What the heck difference does it make taking the 30 seconds it takes to give someone a price over the phone or in person? If its a good deal, they're gonna buy the bike either way. I feel bad for you guys if this is the case and I'd be looking for alternative options.
yak651 wrote:
Exactly. If the dealer or salesman can't find/take the time to provide a valid price over the phone that would take 5-15 minutes how are they...
Exactly. If the dealer or salesman can't find/take the time to provide a valid price over the phone that would take 5-15 minutes how are they going to find the time to talk to the person when they walk into the shop?
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you got nothing going on then some quotes that are not set in stone can we given over the phone. Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price. Now if you walk into a dealer with cash then you can deal for a good price as its a sin to let a customer with cash leave , but they aint gonna give it away either especially now when they have more buyers than they have bikes, if they let you and your cash walk then you you were not willing to pay a price that reflects the current market and they will sell it to the next guy. Cool
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4
5/27/2021 12:23pm
sandhills wrote:
Groceries aren't up though.
You need to quit raiding your parents kitchen Laughing
8
JBecker 72
Posts
1812
Joined
3/25/2014
Location
Eastern Panhandle, WV, USA
5/27/2021 12:40pm
lostboy819 wrote:
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you...
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you got nothing going on then some quotes that are not set in stone can we given over the phone. Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price. Now if you walk into a dealer with cash then you can deal for a good price as its a sin to let a customer with cash leave , but they aint gonna give it away either especially now when they have more buyers than they have bikes, if they let you and your cash walk then you you were not willing to pay a price that reflects the current market and they will sell it to the next guy. Cool
“Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price.”

Please explain this. Because I’m trying to figure out what kind of mental gymnastics you had to jump through to get to that viewpoint.
3
davis224
Posts
7608
Joined
8/15/2006
Location
Cornland, IL, USA
Fantasy
5/27/2021 12:47pm
MXer391 wrote:
You guys must have lousy dealers. I have never, ever, in 22 years of buying motocross bikes, had a dealer not quote me a price over...
You guys must have lousy dealers. I have never, ever, in 22 years of buying motocross bikes, had a dealer not quote me a price over the phone. I agree that physically going in and talking to a salesperson is definitely the way to get a good deal but it is not necessary. Sales people work off commission. What the heck difference does it make taking the 30 seconds it takes to give someone a price over the phone or in person? If its a good deal, they're gonna buy the bike either way. I feel bad for you guys if this is the case and I'd be looking for alternative options.
yak651 wrote:
Exactly. If the dealer or salesman can't find/take the time to provide a valid price over the phone that would take 5-15 minutes how are they...
Exactly. If the dealer or salesman can't find/take the time to provide a valid price over the phone that would take 5-15 minutes how are they going to find the time to talk to the person when they walk into the shop?
lostboy819 wrote:
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you...
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you got nothing going on then some quotes that are not set in stone can we given over the phone. Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price. Now if you walk into a dealer with cash then you can deal for a good price as its a sin to let a customer with cash leave , but they aint gonna give it away either especially now when they have more buyers than they have bikes, if they let you and your cash walk then you you were not willing to pay a price that reflects the current market and they will sell it to the next guy. Cool
They make more money if you finance vs cash. I never understood the thinking that you can get a better deal if you pay cash, unless private party selling maybe.
2
5/27/2021 1:01pm Edited Date/Time 5/27/2021 1:13pm
lostboy819 wrote:
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you...
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you got nothing going on then some quotes that are not set in stone can we given over the phone. Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price. Now if you walk into a dealer with cash then you can deal for a good price as its a sin to let a customer with cash leave , but they aint gonna give it away either especially now when they have more buyers than they have bikes, if they let you and your cash walk then you you were not willing to pay a price that reflects the current market and they will sell it to the next guy. Cool
JBecker 72 wrote:
“Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price.” Please explain this. Because I’m trying to figure out what kind of mental gymnastics you had...
“Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price.”

Please explain this. Because I’m trying to figure out what kind of mental gymnastics you had to jump through to get to that viewpoint.
Will you pay cash or finance? what is credit score ? are you trading anything in ? what city and or county do you live in for taxes? are you using a credit card to pay or partial payment, those are just a few things that will affect the price. Its not as cut and dried as you may think. And to let you in on a little secret, there is no guaranteed OTD price on a phone call.
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1
5/27/2021 1:10pm Edited Date/Time 5/27/2021 1:21pm
yak651 wrote:
Exactly. If the dealer or salesman can't find/take the time to provide a valid price over the phone that would take 5-15 minutes how are they...
Exactly. If the dealer or salesman can't find/take the time to provide a valid price over the phone that would take 5-15 minutes how are they going to find the time to talk to the person when they walk into the shop?
lostboy819 wrote:
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you...
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you got nothing going on then some quotes that are not set in stone can we given over the phone. Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price. Now if you walk into a dealer with cash then you can deal for a good price as its a sin to let a customer with cash leave , but they aint gonna give it away either especially now when they have more buyers than they have bikes, if they let you and your cash walk then you you were not willing to pay a price that reflects the current market and they will sell it to the next guy. Cool
davis224 wrote:
They make more money if you finance vs cash. I never understood the thinking that you can get a better deal if you pay cash, unless...
They make more money if you finance vs cash. I never understood the thinking that you can get a better deal if you pay cash, unless private party selling maybe.
Let me rephrase it, its not if its cash its how well qualified you are to be able to buy. You would be surprised how few people can buy a bike with cash/check without having to use some sort of financing and how many people cant qualify to even finance a bike. Its all about time, if you are selling you dont want to waste and hour or two on someone who cant get the money to buy and is turned down for financing because then you just lost the time you could have been making a sale to a cash customer or a well qualified buyer. Sales isn't a charity its the way people make their money and time is money and right now its a sellers market so most people will have to pay more.
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1
5/27/2021 1:12pm
yak651 wrote:
Exactly. If the dealer or salesman can't find/take the time to provide a valid price over the phone that would take 5-15 minutes how are they...
Exactly. If the dealer or salesman can't find/take the time to provide a valid price over the phone that would take 5-15 minutes how are they going to find the time to talk to the person when they walk into the shop?
lostboy819 wrote:
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you...
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you got nothing going on then some quotes that are not set in stone can we given over the phone. Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price. Now if you walk into a dealer with cash then you can deal for a good price as its a sin to let a customer with cash leave , but they aint gonna give it away either especially now when they have more buyers than they have bikes, if they let you and your cash walk then you you were not willing to pay a price that reflects the current market and they will sell it to the next guy. Cool
davis224 wrote:
They make more money if you finance vs cash. I never understood the thinking that you can get a better deal if you pay cash, unless...
They make more money if you finance vs cash. I never understood the thinking that you can get a better deal if you pay cash, unless private party selling maybe.
Less headaches for the dealer, paying with cash. A guy stops making payments, turns into a big hassle trying to get the bike back.
3
5/27/2021 1:25pm
lostboy819 wrote:
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you...
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you got nothing going on then some quotes that are not set in stone can we given over the phone. Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price. Now if you walk into a dealer with cash then you can deal for a good price as its a sin to let a customer with cash leave , but they aint gonna give it away either especially now when they have more buyers than they have bikes, if they let you and your cash walk then you you were not willing to pay a price that reflects the current market and they will sell it to the next guy. Cool
davis224 wrote:
They make more money if you finance vs cash. I never understood the thinking that you can get a better deal if you pay cash, unless...
They make more money if you finance vs cash. I never understood the thinking that you can get a better deal if you pay cash, unless private party selling maybe.
Less headaches for the dealer, paying with cash. A guy stops making payments, turns into a big hassle trying to get the bike back.
Yep, just one of the hassles and the reason you dont see many dealers who also do in house financing anymore and banks and finance company's see dirt bikes as high risk loans. Not many people will keep making payments on the 10k race bike that blew up and will cost 4K to fix. Pinch
3
MXer391
Posts
434
Joined
2/10/2014
Location
Altoona, PA, USA
5/27/2021 1:30pm
lostboy819 wrote:
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you...
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you got nothing going on then some quotes that are not set in stone can we given over the phone. Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price. Now if you walk into a dealer with cash then you can deal for a good price as its a sin to let a customer with cash leave , but they aint gonna give it away either especially now when they have more buyers than they have bikes, if they let you and your cash walk then you you were not willing to pay a price that reflects the current market and they will sell it to the next guy. Cool
JBecker 72 wrote:
“Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price.” Please explain this. Because I’m trying to figure out what kind of mental gymnastics you had...
“Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price.”

Please explain this. Because I’m trying to figure out what kind of mental gymnastics you had to jump through to get to that viewpoint.
Same here. I bought a new bike the day after Christmas. I saw the bike I wanted on a particular dealers website. I called and asked OTD price. It was a good deal that I was willing to pay so I told them I'd be there in 2.5 hours (they were 2 hours away from me). I took my checkbook, wrote a check, signed a couple papers and went home with the bike in my truck. Why is this so hard to understand? I don't care what fees they wrote on the invoice. Heck they could have charged me a dog walking fee and lunch fee for the guy who put it together but I don't give a crap because all that matters is OTD price. If you can't get an OTD price over the phone, either 1.) the dealer you called sucks or 2.) you suck at buying stuff. End of rant.
5
MXer391
Posts
434
Joined
2/10/2014
Location
Altoona, PA, USA
5/27/2021 1:37pm
lostboy819 wrote:
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you...
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you got nothing going on then some quotes that are not set in stone can we given over the phone. Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price. Now if you walk into a dealer with cash then you can deal for a good price as its a sin to let a customer with cash leave , but they aint gonna give it away either especially now when they have more buyers than they have bikes, if they let you and your cash walk then you you were not willing to pay a price that reflects the current market and they will sell it to the next guy. Cool
JBecker 72 wrote:
“Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price.” Please explain this. Because I’m trying to figure out what kind of mental gymnastics you had...
“Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price.”

Please explain this. Because I’m trying to figure out what kind of mental gymnastics you had to jump through to get to that viewpoint.
lostboy819 wrote:
Will you pay cash or finance? what is credit score ? are you trading anything in ? what city and or county do you live in...
Will you pay cash or finance? what is credit score ? are you trading anything in ? what city and or county do you live in for taxes? are you using a credit card to pay or partial payment, those are just a few things that will affect the price. Its not as cut and dried as you may think. And to let you in on a little secret, there is no guaranteed OTD price on a phone call.
Yes there is. All of these things can be answered over the phone. Have you been living under a rock? I can buy a bike from across the country and have it dropped off at my doorstep. The dealer two miles from my house just sold 2 Gas Gas 450s to a guy in Texas. I'm in Pennsylvania. Do you think he drove to PA to get the best deal? Heck no, he picked up the phone and called their sales manager. C'mon dude.
2
5/27/2021 1:40pm
MXer391 wrote:
Same here. I bought a new bike the day after Christmas. I saw the bike I wanted on a particular dealers website. I called and asked...
Same here. I bought a new bike the day after Christmas. I saw the bike I wanted on a particular dealers website. I called and asked OTD price. It was a good deal that I was willing to pay so I told them I'd be there in 2.5 hours (they were 2 hours away from me). I took my checkbook, wrote a check, signed a couple papers and went home with the bike in my truck. Why is this so hard to understand? I don't care what fees they wrote on the invoice. Heck they could have charged me a dog walking fee and lunch fee for the guy who put it together but I don't give a crap because all that matters is OTD price. If you can't get an OTD price over the phone, either 1.) the dealer you called sucks or 2.) you suck at buying stuff. End of rant.
Because buyers like you are the exception and not the rule. Buyers like you are what make the motorcycle business fun and good place to work. It would be so much better if more buyers were like you and I bet you will get a good deal the next time too because of your first purchase and you are establishing a great relationship with that dealer. Smile
2
2
5/27/2021 1:47pm
Has anyone started a buisness selling used bikes- totally rebuilt. And had there own in house financing ? Have a pre order fee 2,000 the customer makes a list of mods. You get it built and charge interest on the bike sale. Document the build with pics, etc.
3
5/27/2021 1:50pm
JBecker 72 wrote:
“Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price.” Please explain this. Because I’m trying to figure out what kind of mental gymnastics you had...
“Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price.”

Please explain this. Because I’m trying to figure out what kind of mental gymnastics you had to jump through to get to that viewpoint.
lostboy819 wrote:
Will you pay cash or finance? what is credit score ? are you trading anything in ? what city and or county do you live in...
Will you pay cash or finance? what is credit score ? are you trading anything in ? what city and or county do you live in for taxes? are you using a credit card to pay or partial payment, those are just a few things that will affect the price. Its not as cut and dried as you may think. And to let you in on a little secret, there is no guaranteed OTD price on a phone call.
MXer391 wrote:
Yes there is. All of these things can be answered over the phone. Have you been living under a rock? I can buy a bike from...
Yes there is. All of these things can be answered over the phone. Have you been living under a rock? I can buy a bike from across the country and have it dropped off at my doorstep. The dealer two miles from my house just sold 2 Gas Gas 450s to a guy in Texas. I'm in Pennsylvania. Do you think he drove to PA to get the best deal? Heck no, he picked up the phone and called their sales manager. C'mon dude.
I am sure there was a little more too it than that but again well qualified buyers make it much easier on both ends. I can call my local shop and not even ask a price, all I need to do is tell him what I want and then go get it.
1
JBecker 72
Posts
1812
Joined
3/25/2014
Location
Eastern Panhandle, WV, USA
5/27/2021 1:53pm
lostboy819 wrote:
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you...
When a person walks into a dealership that is money walking into a dealership and it always trumps a guy on the phone. Now if you got nothing going on then some quotes that are not set in stone can we given over the phone. Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price. Now if you walk into a dealer with cash then you can deal for a good price as its a sin to let a customer with cash leave , but they aint gonna give it away either especially now when they have more buyers than they have bikes, if they let you and your cash walk then you you were not willing to pay a price that reflects the current market and they will sell it to the next guy. Cool
JBecker 72 wrote:
“Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price.” Please explain this. Because I’m trying to figure out what kind of mental gymnastics you had...
“Way too many variables to give a guaranteed OTD price.”

Please explain this. Because I’m trying to figure out what kind of mental gymnastics you had to jump through to get to that viewpoint.
lostboy819 wrote:
Will you pay cash or finance? what is credit score ? are you trading anything in ? what city and or county do you live in...
Will you pay cash or finance? what is credit score ? are you trading anything in ? what city and or county do you live in for taxes? are you using a credit card to pay or partial payment, those are just a few things that will affect the price. Its not as cut and dried as you may think. And to let you in on a little secret, there is no guaranteed OTD price on a phone call.
So how does asking a few follow up questions on what the exact situation is matter? This really shouldn’t be hard, and yet it is most places.

When I called the dealer I bought my YZ at in March, he gave me a price in 30 seconds. Then I gave him my credit card number over the phone to put a deposit down and hold it. When it came in I picked it up and was out the door in under a half hour.
3
Preston412
Posts
995
Joined
10/5/2012
Location
Saint Augustine, FL, USA
Fantasy
5/27/2021 1:55pm
Fees suck and they will never go away. some small some large, some are ok and some aren't ok with us. Regardless, buyers need to decide what OTD works for them and not be so concerned with how the dealer got to that price. The bottom line is the bottom line that you are willing to pay and the starting price can be raised or lowered to get to your OTD when adding in the fees.

Your best deals are not generally made on the phone but sitting at the desk with the cash or credit app sitting in front of you.

Phone calls are either a potential customer getting information (don't usually ask for the OTD because they have a price in mind already-the informed/knowledgeable buyer and ready to give a deposit for the right price) or some one shopping around for the OTD to shop dealers against each other(the B.S. buyer).

Cash in not king. Dealers make money from the banks with approved buyers BUT there is a certain number of payments that must be made before the bank hands over the money. So, if you are able to pay cash and have the good credit to finance, then finance and pay it off on the first invoice and the dealer more than likely will not get their kick back and you got some money off the deal anyways. MFG's financing deals with their approved lender generally don't have dealer kick backs because the interest rate or monthly payment is set based on your credit worthiness. Outside banks use a point system. EX. you qualified for a 4.0% rate but the dealer got you to go with a 5.0% not telling you, you got 4.0%, now the dealer is making 1 point for every .25% rate over the 4.0% which is 4 pts. Now, 4 pts of the amount financed, lets say $10,000 is $400 incentive to the dealer and finance man gets $80 of it.

Bike setup/assembly is paid to the dealer by the MFG when bike is sold, cost varies so I can not tell you what each MFG pays the dealer, set up fee is all profit. Shipping cost is set and can be find on the MFG website, any amount above that is profit. Registration is set by the state, any amount above that is profit. Admin fee is mostly profit, except for the 1 hour that cost them for the office clerk.
Dealers have kick backs and sometimes sales incentives (based on the number of units sold for the month) that they get from MFG. MFG rebates are mostly used to close the deal and generally counted as profit.
7
JBecker 72
Posts
1812
Joined
3/25/2014
Location
Eastern Panhandle, WV, USA
5/27/2021 2:03pm
Preston412 wrote:
Fees suck and they will never go away. some small some large, some are ok and some aren't ok with us. Regardless, buyers need to decide...
Fees suck and they will never go away. some small some large, some are ok and some aren't ok with us. Regardless, buyers need to decide what OTD works for them and not be so concerned with how the dealer got to that price. The bottom line is the bottom line that you are willing to pay and the starting price can be raised or lowered to get to your OTD when adding in the fees.

Your best deals are not generally made on the phone but sitting at the desk with the cash or credit app sitting in front of you.

Phone calls are either a potential customer getting information (don't usually ask for the OTD because they have a price in mind already-the informed/knowledgeable buyer and ready to give a deposit for the right price) or some one shopping around for the OTD to shop dealers against each other(the B.S. buyer).

Cash in not king. Dealers make money from the banks with approved buyers BUT there is a certain number of payments that must be made before the bank hands over the money. So, if you are able to pay cash and have the good credit to finance, then finance and pay it off on the first invoice and the dealer more than likely will not get their kick back and you got some money off the deal anyways. MFG's financing deals with their approved lender generally don't have dealer kick backs because the interest rate or monthly payment is set based on your credit worthiness. Outside banks use a point system. EX. you qualified for a 4.0% rate but the dealer got you to go with a 5.0% not telling you, you got 4.0%, now the dealer is making 1 point for every .25% rate over the 4.0% which is 4 pts. Now, 4 pts of the amount financed, lets say $10,000 is $400 incentive to the dealer and finance man gets $80 of it.

Bike setup/assembly is paid to the dealer by the MFG when bike is sold, cost varies so I can not tell you what each MFG pays the dealer, set up fee is all profit. Shipping cost is set and can be find on the MFG website, any amount above that is profit. Registration is set by the state, any amount above that is profit. Admin fee is mostly profit, except for the 1 hour that cost them for the office clerk.
Dealers have kick backs and sometimes sales incentives (based on the number of units sold for the month) that they get from MFG. MFG rebates are mostly used to close the deal and generally counted as profit.
Imagine the arrogance to say someone calling and asking the price of a big ticket item is a B.S buyer.
3
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