2016 HRC Team Honda CRF450RW

jhansen510
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3/13/2021 7:14pm
mxav8r wrote:
From God knows when through 2016, Honda HRC used a steel shift lever with a "Parkerized" finish on the CR/CRF's. What is a Parkerized finish? From...
From God knows when through 2016, Honda HRC used a steel shift lever with a "Parkerized" finish on the CR/CRF's. What is a Parkerized finish? From Wikipedia:
"Parkerizing is a method of protecting a steel surface from corrosion and increasing its resistance to wear through the application of a chemical phosphate conversion coating"

The HRC steel lever is actually considerably heavier than the OEM lever. But a lot stronger!

From 2017 through the present, HRC switched to a CNC machined titanium shift lever.

HRC Steel and Titanium shift levers



If you look closely to the second picture above, you'll see the traditional HRC "EK--" marking followed by the #101. I have always assumed the number 101 (or whatever number was used) referred to the length of the lever. But as you can see, 101 is on both levers and the titanium one is longer.

My guess is that the number actually refers to the distance between the lever tip and the foot peg. Since the 2017 and beyond CRF's have the shift spline closer to the foot peg. The lever needs to be longer to maintain the "101" Peg/Tip distance as marked.

When I bought the HRC titanium lever I wasn't sure it would fit (bend wise, knew it would be longer) my 2016 CRF. Figured worst case I could use it for a future build. Pleasant surprise it fit fine. Just longer for the reason discussed before.

HRC titanium lever on my bike



HRC machining, as usual, is amazing


Now of course the lever tip/foot peg distance is more than the HRC steel or OEM lever but since I wear size 14 boots this work perfectly in my favor!

Dude I love coming in here and going over your thread! Just pure bike porn! You should be extremely prideful about what you have created.
1
mxav8r
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3/13/2021 8:16pm Edited Date/Time 3/13/2021 8:24pm
jhansen510 wrote:
Dude I love coming in here and going over your thread! Just pure bike porn! You should be extremely prideful about what you have created.
Thank you very much!

Not to sound all sappy but one of the things I enjoy most, about this build, is being able to share it with my fellow Moto enthusiasts.
So I am honestly grateful and happy you all are enjoying it as much as me! And feel lucky I can do this build and share 🙏🏻🙏🏻🙏🏻

Still some cool updates to come... 😁
11
wicksy85
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3/15/2021 5:06pm
The attention to detail is just insanity!!! Love the commitment
1
Tokyo_Tiddler
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3/17/2021 2:40pm
Hi Mike,

The black coating on the HRC steel shift levers is done by Passivation. It is a process that creates a thin top layer that is non-reactive to the elements such as water and air. However, it wears off really quickly from your boots.. as fast as cheap paint if not faster, so my guess is that HRC just used it to keep the parts from rusting on the shelf. Coatings were not as advanced as today. The Dow coating used on the HRC clutch covers also wears off quickly and I believe it is just to keep the magnesium cover from reacting with the elements.

Good catch on the "101" length. However, the HRC foot pegs come in different offsets, so if you are right, we would have to assume it is relative to a zero offset foot peg, I suppose.

mike
2

The Shop

Tokyo_Tiddler
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3/17/2021 3:03pm
Also.. it begs the question that if the coating is not more durable than paint, why they didn't HRC just use paint over the coatings. My guess is weight.. paint adds weight to parts, while passivation creates a coating from the substrate, itself.

That would seem silly if true because that steel shift lever is so darn heavy compared to the OEM part.
1
mxav8r
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4/9/2021 9:45am Edited Date/Time 4/9/2021 10:10am
Hi Mike, The black coating on the HRC steel shift levers is done by Passivation. It is a process that creates a thin top layer that...
Hi Mike,

The black coating on the HRC steel shift levers is done by Passivation. It is a process that creates a thin top layer that is non-reactive to the elements such as water and air. However, it wears off really quickly from your boots.. as fast as cheap paint if not faster, so my guess is that HRC just used it to keep the parts from rusting on the shelf. Coatings were not as advanced as today. The Dow coating used on the HRC clutch covers also wears off quickly and I believe it is just to keep the magnesium cover from reacting with the elements.

Good catch on the "101" length. However, the HRC foot pegs come in different offsets, so if you are right, we would have to assume it is relative to a zero offset foot peg, I suppose.

mike
It's my understanding the passivation process would not create a "black coating". Parkerized finish would create a black color under certain applications (additional elements added during the process). So if the lever indeed went through "passivation" then the black color was applied after words.
1
mxav8r
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4/9/2021 10:05am
While I wait for additional parts to arrive I decided to disassemble my HRC steering damper for a rebuild. This damper is the first generation type while the second generation units have more external adjustments and are much bigger.
This first generation is basically a higher quality version (billet body, Kashima coatings, etc...) of the OEM unit.



Disassembled


Internally I notice these differences from the OEM unit:

Piston a different shape and shim surface faced




Shaft seal head is screwed in vs held in by a circlip. Also a different design.


I have not taken apart the adjuster. Need to order some OEM o-rings for the rebuild. Hopefully they'll fit.


3
Tokyo_Tiddler
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4/9/2021 10:25am
Hi Mike, The black coating on the HRC steel shift levers is done by Passivation. It is a process that creates a thin top layer that...
Hi Mike,

The black coating on the HRC steel shift levers is done by Passivation. It is a process that creates a thin top layer that is non-reactive to the elements such as water and air. However, it wears off really quickly from your boots.. as fast as cheap paint if not faster, so my guess is that HRC just used it to keep the parts from rusting on the shelf. Coatings were not as advanced as today. The Dow coating used on the HRC clutch covers also wears off quickly and I believe it is just to keep the magnesium cover from reacting with the elements.

Good catch on the "101" length. However, the HRC foot pegs come in different offsets, so if you are right, we would have to assume it is relative to a zero offset foot peg, I suppose.

mike
mxav8r wrote:
It's my understanding the passivation process would not create a "black coating". Parkerized finish would create a black color under certain applications (additional elements added during...
It's my understanding the passivation process would not create a "black coating". Parkerized finish would create a black color under certain applications (additional elements added during the process). So if the lever indeed went through "passivation" then the black color was applied after words.
Hi Mike.. please check with Corne as he actually had it done to his shift lever.

My understanding is that both can be used to create a black coating, but the Parkerizing is much more durable. Black passivation is just the creation of a black oxide coating. This wears off really quickly which is also the case with the HRC shift levers.

mike
3
mxav8r
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4/9/2021 10:34am
95% done with my HRC replica map mode switch. After about 10 attempts I got the guard portion of the switch done to my satisfaction. In order to replicate the 1 and 2 white numbering on the switch I used a label maker. I still need to refine the placement and shape of the labels (really hard to cut to size!). But overall I'm really happy with how it turned out.

The switch at the moment is just for looks. It's not hooked up to anything but fully capable to be used in the future once I find the appropriate ECU (either HRC or maybe a GET).


Actual HRC switch on the 2015 Honda HRC MXGP bike



My bike and HRC replica



11
bluth823
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Henderson, NV US
4/10/2021 10:29am
Is the Ti-2 silencer in the background foreshadowing a 2 stroke build??
1
mxav8r
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4/14/2021 3:48pm
bluth823 wrote:
Is the Ti-2 silencer in the background foreshadowing a 2 stroke build??
Haha...no. The Ti-2 is actually my brothers. I found one available and got it for him. Things are hard to find!
mxav8r
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4/14/2021 4:53pm
Recently got another piece of the puzzle for this build. Febur Racing Radiators as used on Tim Gajser's 2016 HRC CRF450RW.

In 2016 Tim Gajser rode for a HRC satellite team, Team Gariboldi. Although this team wasn't the official HRC MXGP team at the time, Tim's bike was a full works machine. He eventually went on to win the MX1 Championship.

Since Team Gariboldi wasn't the official HRC team, they used a number of different parts compared to the HRC bikes. Exhaust being one of them (Yoshimura vs FMF on the HRC bikes) and radiators made by Febur.
Febur is an Italian company (Gariboldi an Italian based team) and is mostly known in the street bike world.

Tim Gasjer 2016 CRF450RW at the USGP showing the Febur radiator


One notable feature of all the HRC works bike's (2013-2016),when it comes to the radiators, is the routing of the bottom crossover hose. The CRF450R OEM bike has the crossover hose going OVER the exhaust header while the works bikes have the hose going UNDER the exhaust. This is a very important detail when building an accurate HRC replica bike. So I was very happy getting a set of these radiators!

My Febur HRC spec radiators


A challenge in using these radiators was finding the appropriate crossover hose since the routing is different than OEM. The OEM spec CV4 hose would not work. Finding the appropriate HRC hose was not happening so I had to resort to using something that would just work! And it had to be a blue CV4 hose to make matters more difficult.

After a lot of Google image searching (just trying find a CRF that had a hose of similar shape and length, stock) and little luck. I came across a blue set of CV4 hoses for a 2009 CRF450R on eBay. The crossover hose isn't perfect but when mounted up it looks just fine.



I previously had a set of Fluidyne radiators mounted on the bike. The Febur set is overall an higher quality set of radiators. It's hard to show in pictures but the Febur cooling fin area is just way more higher quality. Also the Fluidyne radiators are way thicker in comparison to the Febur. Probably more suited for off-road type riding than motocross.
The Febur set also have built in reinforcements. Nice!

Febur vs Fluidyne






7
jerbert
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ES
4/15/2021 4:28am
In Spain we have a company that makes custom silicone pipes for old cars, you give them the specifications and they manufacture it for you.
1
mxav8r
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4/24/2021 1:05pm
Mounted up my Febur radiators. Fitment was perfect to the frame and with the radiator shrouds bolt holes (not always the case with aftermarket stuff, as many of you know). Having the crossover tube routed under the header gives the bike such a clean look! Really don't understand why the stock routing is over the header???

The only issue I ran into was the Febur radiator tubing was a slightly larger diameter than OEM. This made sliding on the OEM spec CV4 hoses a challenge. But in the end it worked out... I will keep my fingers crossed that I can get a set of blue HRC Samco hoses. Or have a set made to the correct spec as some of you have suggested.






A little titanium bling to top it off 😁👍


I still have some pretty cool parts on the way... updates to follow my friends!

9
Tokyo_Tiddler
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4/25/2021 12:03am
The other radiators you had were also quite nice, Mike. You pretty much have a complete HRC bike sans engine internals so wondering what you have left.. are going into the engine? Your rear axle nut is cool, but not factory.
mxav8r
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5/3/2021 7:23pm
The HRC bikes, far as I know, did not use anything special when it came to the rear brake caliper carrier. Since the rear guard was rarely used, the USA team would sometimes cut off the rear brake guard mounting points of the OEM carrier and Cerakote them but that was about as fancy as they went...

That said, Corné from Vintagehonda.nl made some beautiful CNC billet aluminum carriers and I knew it would be a great addition to my bike.

Beautiful work Corné!


Just adds a real nice finishing touch to the rear wheel. In this picture you can also see the HRC rear rotor bolts (with their tiny bolt heads) and the HRC wheel spacers (with the unique "gold" color). The HRC rear hub anodizing is amazing... such a nice red.


Another cool piece acquired from vintagehonda.nl A HRC titanium kickstarter bolt to match the HRC titanium kickstart knuckle. Always loved how this particular bolt looked on the factory bikes. Happy to get one!




17
mxav8r
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5/9/2021 8:49am
As this build is coming to a close (at least the purchase of parts, still need to get the hydraulic clutch operational) it's fitting one of the last parts I've obtained is one of the first I came across. It just took a little over a year and half to get it!

A Works SHOWA BFRC shock


I honestly gave up hope in getting this shock awhile ago. So in the meantime I was lucky in finding the "traditional" Works SHOWA shock. A beautiful piece in itself! But this Showa BFRC is just another level of awesomeness! Plus it's the type of shock the HRC MXGP bikes used (more on that shortly) and the type of bike I'm trying to replicate.

Beauty and The Beast



The Showa BFRC has gone through a couple of versions (body style) and revisions (main adjuster style) over the years for Honda. I would call my shock version 1.2

Will post more about this shock and the versions later.




21
kdiringer
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5/9/2021 8:58am
mxav8r wrote:
As this build is coming to a close (at least the purchase of parts, still need to get the hydraulic clutch operational) it's fitting one of...
As this build is coming to a close (at least the purchase of parts, still need to get the hydraulic clutch operational) it's fitting one of the last parts I've obtained is one of the first I came across. It just took a little over a year and half to get it!

A Works SHOWA BFRC shock


I honestly gave up hope in getting this shock awhile ago. So in the meantime I was lucky in finding the "traditional" Works SHOWA shock. A beautiful piece in itself! But this Showa BFRC is just another level of awesomeness! Plus it's the type of shock the HRC MXGP bikes used (more on that shortly) and the type of bike I'm trying to replicate.

Beauty and The Beast



The Showa BFRC has gone through a couple of versions (body style) and revisions (main adjuster style) over the years for Honda. I would call my shock version 1.2

Will post more about this shock and the versions later.




Woah! That’s sick! The machine work and packaging is incredible
2
Tokyo_Tiddler
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5/9/2021 9:40am Edited Date/Time 5/9/2021 9:40am
wait.. so you on your 3rd works shock...2nd full billet shock? You definitely have the bug, buddy. Perfection is never ending, isn't it. I think you ma find that when you think you are done.. an idea will come to you later, and the never ending pursuit of perfection will kick back in.

Any updated full bike pics to share?
3
mxav8r
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5/24/2021 5:13pm
So one of the challenges with this shock is finding/making the right upper shock mount bolt and nut suitable for the unusual design.





Since the body design, near the upper shock mount area, is significantly larger than the OEM design. The OEM bolt and nut will not work. Basically the OEM design has the bolt with rectangular shaped head slide in from the right side of the shock. And then a traditional nut on the other side.

This is not possible with this shock. The body doesn't provide enough clearance for the bolt. So the bolt has to come in from the other side.




From the pictures above, you can see that a traditional nut will not work. So I'll have to get a "triangle" shaped nut made. Which is exactly what the factory HRC teams used. Yeah... I can't claim I came up with the solution haha.

If you zoom in on the picture (This is Tim Gajser's 2016 HRC bike. You can also see he's using the last/latest version of the BFRC shock) you can see the triangle shaped nut used by HRC.


Well that's issue number one of three with this shock getting it mounted. The other two involves the clevis design and the fitment of the side panels (none of these are real challenges). I'll post more on that soon.




13
7/21/2021 9:03pm
Dude, you gotta spill the story on how you scored that, can't wait to see the internals!
1
Tokyo_Tiddler
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7/21/2021 10:10pm
It certainly is an amazing find. I am just as interested in hearing your feedback after you take it for a ride once its installed!

mike
1
mxracer666
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NE Iowa, IA US
7/21/2021 10:54pm
This build continues to impress!!
2
LOOnatic
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7/22/2021 4:03am
Rickyisms wrote:
Dude, you gotta spill the story on how you scored that, can't wait to see the internals!
What Ricky said!
1
JWACK
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7/22/2021 7:01am
Wow!
1
jhansen510
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7/22/2021 7:50pm
Damn man! I too would love to hear the story behind how the engine came to be at home in your shop!
1
jaun
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MX
7/23/2021 1:50am
mxav8r wrote:
As this build is coming to a close (at least the purchase of parts, still need to get the hydraulic clutch operational) it's fitting one of...
As this build is coming to a close (at least the purchase of parts, still need to get the hydraulic clutch operational) it's fitting one of the last parts I've obtained is one of the first I came across. It just took a little over a year and half to get it!

A Works SHOWA BFRC shock


I honestly gave up hope in getting this shock awhile ago. So in the meantime I was lucky in finding the "traditional" Works SHOWA shock. A beautiful piece in itself! But this Showa BFRC is just another level of awesomeness! Plus it's the type of shock the HRC MXGP bikes used (more on that shortly) and the type of bike I'm trying to replicate.

Beauty and The Beast



The Showa BFRC has gone through a couple of versions (body style) and revisions (main adjuster style) over the years for Honda. I would call my shock version 1.2

Will post more about this shock and the versions later.




Wow, that's all I have to say.
matt.3150
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San Jose, CA US
7/25/2021 5:59am
very nice! Good going, that’s a very special bike , especial you got that RW engine. I just finished building my CRF450r HRC american Engine, but not the same as your RW, really awesome, if your interested in a picture of mine i send you some
3
matt.3150
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7/25/2021 6:00am
mines an 2008 by the way
2
Tokyo_Tiddler
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7/25/2021 2:22pm
Thanks for sharing Mike and Matt! I am excited about the learning opportunity from sharing the pics. The intake, exhaust and valve area have obviously been modified to maximize flow. The flow testing and dyno testing were probably done as a collaboration between Honda and Yoshimura, with the later optimizing the exhaust pipe to match the set up.

Vey unlikely the springs are titanium since as much as builders would like to lighten the valve train to prevent "valve float" with more aggressive cam profiles, titanium is not a good material for valve springs. The valve retainers, keepers are likely titanium and perhaps even the valves themselves might even be titanium (would be interested to know that!). Titanium is also not a good idea for the lifters unless you can prevent the titanium riding on the cam lobe. Titanium galls too easily and would destroy the cam lobe unless you can prevent metal to metal contact. I wonder if DLC coating would be enough to prevent that for at least one race day. I don't know.

You do not want the intake polished as the machine marks help with atomization, but interesting they did not polish the exhaust port as that can help with exhaust flow.

All my 4-stroke knowledge comes from building race car engines, although I believe much of it should apply to these engines. Would be interesting to learn if anything is different.

mike
5

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