Modern 450s really gnarly?

DB505
Posts
739
Joined
12/5/2013
Location
Rowlett, TX, USA
12/22/2020 9:30am
Again I ask where & what kind of riding your going to do?
1
Ryan625
Posts
1689
Joined
9/14/2019
Location
Lynnwood, WA, USA
12/22/2020 10:12am
I can honestly say as a former A rider/current 30+ rider, I will never own another 450. IMO they are more than I’ll ever need. I feel the fastest and most consistent on a 250F, but I’m also 170 without gear.
4
1
STLSharky
Posts
464
Joined
11/12/2016
Location
Edwardsville, IL, USA
12/22/2020 10:22am
Motodave15 wrote:
450, i just got my first 2018 450 (husky) last December, I was 250lbs at the time and it is by far the best bike ive...
450,

i just got my first 2018 450 (husky) last December, I was 250lbs at the time and it is by far the best bike ive ever ridden. It can be tame or it can be a fire breather... Really depends on that wrist control and the mapping you choose. I love the ability to get out of pinches that a 250f just cant do (I cant speak for a 350, never ridden one)...you also sound like someone who rides similar to me and once you learn how the bike rides and work on the basics again and get improvement.. you will not want to go back to a smaller bore.
the 19.5 Rockstar husky i have now though, motor is unreal compared to 18-19 totally better
2
mxrider641
Posts
572
Joined
4/5/2011
Location
Endicott, NY, USA
12/22/2020 10:29am
Titan1 wrote:
How long do you plan to keep the bike? Replacing a new 250f every 100 hours (or less) avoids the costly rebuilds...and I’m sure it would...
How long do you plan to keep the bike? Replacing a new 250f every 100 hours (or less) avoids the costly rebuilds...and I’m sure it would have plenty of power for you to have fun (and fun is what it’s about right? Or are you planning to make a run for Lorettas and ama pro?), and save you some more money.

If you are a ride a bike for 200-300 hours guy...and don’t want to spend big money on motor work...I’d avoid a 250...well, Id avoid a four stroke all together...but if you get one, get a 450 (especially if you like to ride a gear high and let the torque do it’s thing...which is a fun way to ride a bike too...as it’s easy on the motor) and if you are concerned about too much power, drop in one of the mild maps, and it will feel like a 250.

I’m 6 foot 185 lbs...been on 450’s since 2011....Currently a 2019 YZ450FX (which I love)...and I’m seriously considering a 2021 YZ250FX for my next bike. I rode a 20 and the only place I felt it was down on power was top end (top speed...I was always looking for another gear on that thing...but it was on stock gearing) and pure straight line acceleration. I’m a desert guy, so those two things are important to me. But everywhere else, I loved it! So you probably shouldn’t rule out a 250f....
Thanks for the info on the YZ250FX - On my short list - I am just an old guy who wants to ride again, some light moto and some trails. I agree with the previous comments on the 450's, very easy to ride, but also very easy to get in way over your heat quickly. Incredible acceleration, and fun to ride, but more than I need at my age/speed I want to go.
2

The Shop

hubbardmx50
Posts
2845
Joined
11/17/2016
Location
Rancho Cucamonga, CA, USA
12/22/2020 10:34am
Honestly they’re easier to ride than ever, but that’s what makes them gnarly. You think you’re only cruising at 75% but you’re actually hauling ass
So true, every time I hop on a 250 then back to my bike it feels like a stiff rocket ship.
2
sandtrack315
Posts
2861
Joined
7/19/2013
Location
Philadelphia, PA, USA
12/22/2020 10:45am
Ryan625 wrote:
I can honestly say as a former A rider/current 30+ rider, I will never own another 450. IMO they are more than I’ll ever need. I...
I can honestly say as a former A rider/current 30+ rider, I will never own another 450. IMO they are more than I’ll ever need. I feel the fastest and most consistent on a 250F, but I’m also 170 without gear.
Yeah, former B rider, 30+ now, and I love riding a 250F, but I am also 160 without gear.

I have never really felt like my 2020 YZ250F needs more power, except a bit on top.
2
LKHill
Posts
851
Joined
9/8/2020
Location
USA
12/22/2020 10:50am
I think the person who talked about throttle control nailed it. They are indeed gnarly. If you have the riding style of not just hammering it out WFO they can be civil. If you are the pin it to win it kind of rider you will find it a hard go moving up to a 450.


Whiskey throttle can be an issue for the lesser skilled not used to them.
2
1
jkoch249
Posts
88
Joined
10/3/2020
Location
Pardeeville, WI, USA
12/22/2020 11:13am
I haven't raced(or really ridden a dirt bike) since 1994, but I had no hesitation buying a YZ450 as my way back into the sport. I'm a bigger guy, at 6'4" 215, and I like to have power available if I want it. You can always add flywheel weight and change gearing to accommodate your preferences. I say go with the 450
1
Ryan625
Posts
1689
Joined
9/14/2019
Location
Lynnwood, WA, USA
12/22/2020 11:34am
Ryan625 wrote:
I can honestly say as a former A rider/current 30+ rider, I will never own another 450. IMO they are more than I’ll ever need. I...
I can honestly say as a former A rider/current 30+ rider, I will never own another 450. IMO they are more than I’ll ever need. I feel the fastest and most consistent on a 250F, but I’m also 170 without gear.
Yeah, former B rider, 30+ now, and I love riding a 250F, but I am also 160 without gear. I have never really felt like my...
Yeah, former B rider, 30+ now, and I love riding a 250F, but I am also 160 without gear.

I have never really felt like my 2020 YZ250F needs more power, except a bit on top.
Exactly. All the mods I’ve done are in an attempt to get a little more top. I’m a fan of the Yamaha hard hitting (loan) map. PC pipe and intake kit helped too
2
1
Grovesy98
Posts
246
Joined
10/14/2019
Location
GB
12/22/2020 12:39pm
I have a 2020 KX450 and run it with black (slower) mapping plug and stock engine/exhaust. It's light, nimble, smooth, and really easy to ride. The suspension is great and super plush, you would just need heavier springs. Super easy to go fast or slow on, and corners well at any speed. The 19 - 21 has electric start and hydraulic clutch which are awesome and make life so easy. I had a 17 KTM sxf 350 before this and I found it awkward to ride. Not much bottom end, but crazy fast mid to top. I'd get in more trouble riding that than the many 450s I've had over the last 17 years. I didn't mind the air forks performance, but was a right pain checking the pressure all the time. The 16 - 18 KXF450 is also a good bike, but the air forks are horrible. I raced an 18 for a season and ended up with a spring conversion on the forks which was better, but not as good as the newer model spring forks. The older models feel bigger and a little heavier than the newer shape.

I'd say a newer model 450 with slower mapping is perfect for any rider that wants an easy bike to ride, and wants to progress. Just up the mapping and add exhaust etc if you want more poke
4
Brent
Posts
5905
Joined
8/16/2006
Location
Temecula, CA, USA
12/22/2020 12:43pm Edited Date/Time 12/22/2020 12:44pm
Modern 450 Motocross bikes are the friendliest, most forgiving dirt bikes ever made.

Just don't try to ride it like a 125 unless your last name is Barcia.
9
Motodave15
Posts
4252
Joined
8/7/2010
Location
Temple City, CA, USA
12/22/2020 12:58pm
Motodave15 wrote:
450, i just got my first 2018 450 (husky) last December, I was 250lbs at the time and it is by far the best bike ive...
450,

i just got my first 2018 450 (husky) last December, I was 250lbs at the time and it is by far the best bike ive ever ridden. It can be tame or it can be a fire breather... Really depends on that wrist control and the mapping you choose. I love the ability to get out of pinches that a 250f just cant do (I cant speak for a 350, never ridden one)...you also sound like someone who rides similar to me and once you learn how the bike rides and work on the basics again and get improvement.. you will not want to go back to a smaller bore.
STLSharky wrote:
the 19.5 Rockstar husky i have now though, motor is unreal compared to 18-19 totally better
Thats saying alot.. i didnt think it could get much better from my 18.5... i put a ECU on it as well... Now i kinda want to try out a 19.5 lol
1
12/22/2020 1:12pm
on my 19' YZ450 you can ride the whole track in 3rd if you want. It's better to shift but if you want to mellow out the hit just ride it a gear high
2
Richy
Posts
3093
Joined
7/18/2020
Location
UK, GB
12/22/2020 1:23pm
I do totally get where the 250F crowd are coming from but:
I cannot buy new, I can't stretch to it and don't do credit on toys,
I would be SERIOUSLY reluctant to buy a used 250F.
I'd likely not be able to buy this bike's replacement for a year or two afterwards allowing money for proper upkeep and most importantly seat time. Hopefully that goes some way to explaining the big bore fixation.
I also do not have the skill and fitness to ride a 250F WFO to get it to move with 240lbs plus gear on it.

I am sure a 250F would be plenty fast enough, and I 100% appreciate folks looking out. I will TOTALLY consider one if I luck out and find a mad low hour bargain. It's not an ego / more power thing steering me to bigger bikes, it's a used bike / maintenance thing.
If I was light enough, I'd probably just revert to a 125 like when I was in 7th Grade.

DB505, first post said MX only and location is next to my name, wasn't ignoring you or anything bro sorry, just thought you'd have spotted both by the time I could have replied.
sandtrack315
Posts
2861
Joined
7/19/2013
Location
Philadelphia, PA, USA
12/22/2020 2:00pm
Richy wrote:
I do totally get where the 250F crowd are coming from but: I cannot buy new, I can't stretch to it and don't do credit on...
I do totally get where the 250F crowd are coming from but:
I cannot buy new, I can't stretch to it and don't do credit on toys,
I would be SERIOUSLY reluctant to buy a used 250F.
I'd likely not be able to buy this bike's replacement for a year or two afterwards allowing money for proper upkeep and most importantly seat time. Hopefully that goes some way to explaining the big bore fixation.
I also do not have the skill and fitness to ride a 250F WFO to get it to move with 240lbs plus gear on it.

I am sure a 250F would be plenty fast enough, and I 100% appreciate folks looking out. I will TOTALLY consider one if I luck out and find a mad low hour bargain. It's not an ego / more power thing steering me to bigger bikes, it's a used bike / maintenance thing.
If I was light enough, I'd probably just revert to a 125 like when I was in 7th Grade.

DB505, first post said MX only and location is next to my name, wasn't ignoring you or anything bro sorry, just thought you'd have spotted both by the time I could have replied.
Yeah at 240 pounds, get a 450.
2
Titan1
Posts
9482
Joined
2/3/2010
Location
Lehi, UT, USA
12/22/2020 3:00pm
Titan1 wrote:
How long do you plan to keep the bike? Replacing a new 250f every 100 hours (or less) avoids the costly rebuilds...and I’m sure it would...
How long do you plan to keep the bike? Replacing a new 250f every 100 hours (or less) avoids the costly rebuilds...and I’m sure it would have plenty of power for you to have fun (and fun is what it’s about right? Or are you planning to make a run for Lorettas and ama pro?), and save you some more money.

If you are a ride a bike for 200-300 hours guy...and don’t want to spend big money on motor work...I’d avoid a 250...well, Id avoid a four stroke all together...but if you get one, get a 450 (especially if you like to ride a gear high and let the torque do it’s thing...which is a fun way to ride a bike too...as it’s easy on the motor) and if you are concerned about too much power, drop in one of the mild maps, and it will feel like a 250.

I’m 6 foot 185 lbs...been on 450’s since 2011....Currently a 2019 YZ450FX (which I love)...and I’m seriously considering a 2021 YZ250FX for my next bike. I rode a 20 and the only place I felt it was down on power was top end (top speed...I was always looking for another gear on that thing...but it was on stock gearing) and pure straight line acceleration. I’m a desert guy, so those two things are important to me. But everywhere else, I loved it! So you probably shouldn’t rule out a 250f....
mxrider641 wrote:
Thanks for the info on the YZ250FX - On my short list - I am just an old guy who wants to ride again, some light...
Thanks for the info on the YZ250FX - On my short list - I am just an old guy who wants to ride again, some light moto and some trails. I agree with the previous comments on the 450's, very easy to ride, but also very easy to get in way over your heat quickly. Incredible acceleration, and fun to ride, but more than I need at my age/speed I want to go.
For the riding you are doing...I think a 250f could be your perfect intro back into the sport. You don't have to keep it forever if you don't like it.

But with how easy it is to change maps on the 450's these days...running the mild maps could be the best of both worlds...mild maps while you get your feet wet, and then you have more at the push of a button when/if you are ready for it (or riding in the sand, or a nice loamy track or something).

Either way (250, 450, 350), you should also look at the off road offerings: Yamaha FX, Honda RX, Kawasaki X, KTM XC...they are very capable on the track, for all but fast A and pro guys, and are better enough (compared to the MX bikes) off road to more than justify the slight additional cost.
1
Mxracer394
Posts
100
Joined
9/6/2014
Location
Hattiesburg, MS, USA
12/22/2020 8:04pm
I recently got back riding on tracks after being off for 7 years. 30+ 160lbs and I went with a 450 because it was a good deal. After the first day I made my mind up to sale it. I couldn’t replace it with anything close to the shape it is in so I still have it. I had the suspension revalved. Got comfortable riding in a higher gear. I can easily control the bike now and have gotten somewhat quick on it. When I quit I was a b rider. Not back to that shape but I think having the 450 grunt has saved me on several occasions. I’d say go 450 and just be cautious on it for a little while and the comfort and speed will come.
3
nickm
Posts
702
Joined
9/15/2011
Location
CA
12/22/2020 8:24pm
just another opinion here, if you think a throttle is a light switch with two positions - idle and rev limter then stick to 250, if not then get the 450.

IMO I'd get over the air forks dislike and the other internet BS. You've been out of it for 20 years. Any bike will be so far above your capabilities that you'd never notice subtle differences between brands. If you like KXs then go get one and make sure you get the mellow coupler. If you like the KTM or Husky then go get one of those and flip it to the mild map and TC on.
2
Single_Sac
Posts
80
Joined
2/12/2017
Location
Albuquerque, NM, USA
12/22/2020 8:40pm Edited Date/Time 12/23/2020 6:51am
Get the 450 and gear it to 14/48. You're a big guy so you'll appreciate the power over a 250. Just remember to force your brain to keep your right hand in control... Oh, get the Honda, Yamaha or Kawasaki....better suspension out of the box.....spring it and you're done for most terrain for average riding.
1
Richy
Posts
3093
Joined
7/18/2020
Location
UK, GB
12/23/2020 1:02am
nickm wrote:
just another opinion here, if you think a throttle is a light switch with two positions - idle and rev limter then stick to 250, if...
just another opinion here, if you think a throttle is a light switch with two positions - idle and rev limter then stick to 250, if not then get the 450.

IMO I'd get over the air forks dislike and the other internet BS. You've been out of it for 20 years. Any bike will be so far above your capabilities that you'd never notice subtle differences between brands. If you like KXs then go get one and make sure you get the mellow coupler. If you like the KTM or Husky then go get one of those and flip it to the mild map and TC on.
Ain't that the truth, I hear you and really thinking about it I can't see a company like KTM/Husky putting out a fork on a motocross bike which isn't fit for purpose for 90% of people (of which I am in the lowest percentile skill wise right now).

Just an external aversion to air suspension from MTB's / Cars haha, but obviously this is different and I need to get over it, agreed entirely man and enough people have said the same now.

As said I'm pretty relaxed, throttle control used to be pretty good and I'm happy feeding it in instead of grabbing a handful and happy to grab some clutch, breathe and get my shit together if I get outta shape.

I don't wanna tie up anyone's time any more than I have, so consider it case closed and I do MASSIVELY appreciate all the replies, whatever your opinion / input, it is all great to read and consider.

Thanks again folks, Happy Holidays and enjoy and look after yourselves!
1
12/23/2020 3:04am
I’m a c rider in my forties and sold my crf 250 and picked up a brand new 2018 Ktm 450. Took a bit of getting used to with the power but I ride well within my means. It seems easier to ride in map 2 for me but I like to lug it around in 3rd gear. Don’t get me wrong though when it goes wrong it goes wrong badly and fast😂😂 just upgrade the rear spring and I’m 220 pounds and run around 160 psi in the forks
1
12/23/2020 3:45am
I'm 240lbs been riding for many years and I still enjoy a 250F. I have recently started riding a YZ250 and really enjoy that, as well. The issue I'm having though, is the same issue I feel I'd have on a 450. I rode 125s for way too long (big screw up) on my part..but it just ingrained in me to hold the thing wide open and clutch the crap out of it. I can't seem to get away from that way of riding and on a 450, that ain't gonna work for me. I'm no Tomac or even 1/10th hahahah. I see some guys say you ride the thing a gear high and keep at low RPMs (Roczen style). I keep saying I'm going to try to learn this..but when I jump on a 450..it just doesn't seem to work for me.

The number 1 goal here is fun. Get whatever you think you'll have the most fun on. If its revving hard and clutching a bunch, go with a 250F or even 350. If you want to go with the baddest machines out there right now...450 all day. The technology is incredible on these bikes. 250 and 450. The 450s are just a whole different level of performance.
2
cloud41
Posts
293
Joined
8/28/2020
Location
Chicago, IL, USA
Fantasy
12/23/2020 4:21am Edited Date/Time 12/23/2020 4:31am
250 two stroke and learn how to ride. I see WAY too many people at the track on a 450 with terrible technique and out of shape just waiting for a WWE smack down.
2
1
STLSharky
Posts
464
Joined
11/12/2016
Location
Edwardsville, IL, USA
12/23/2020 6:19am
cloud41 wrote:
250 two stroke and learn how to ride. I see WAY too many people at the track on a 450 with terrible technique and out of...
250 two stroke and learn how to ride. I see WAY too many people at the track on a 450 with terrible technique and out of shape just waiting for a WWE smack down.
true
1
1
Mr. Afterbar
Posts
2431
Joined
5/13/2019
Location
Green Bay, WI, USA
12/23/2020 7:04am
Richy wrote:
Thanks again for the input guys, I totally appreciate the 350 is probably as fast as a 450 in outright pace if ridden accordingly, and is...
Thanks again for the input guys, I totally appreciate the 350 is probably as fast as a 450 in outright pace if ridden accordingly, and is probably more than enough to tool around for a returning n00b either way, so I have no disrespect for the 350 at all 👌 I'm really trying to get a handle on whether I could get away with a 450 instead to open up more options than Austria's finest.

The aversion to air forks comes from a life of building fast cars, I just don't like the concept or the air spring and I don't doubt they can be good, and checking air pressure when warm / for different environments isn't a big ask, but on a pure performance machine I would just be much happier personally with springs especially at my (over)weight which could tax it further.

The reduced stress on a used 450's motor is another point for it, though I know some go 150 hours or more on an untouched 350, I'd be the guy who bought a 30 hour 350 and rode it slowly and it STILL went pop just from bad luck 😂

For the record, I have ridden a modern TC 250 although only in a field briefly so I don't really count it, and I thought it was sweet but I'd prefer the smoother power these days.
Air forks work good for bigger guys. I was probably around 210 at my heaviest on the ‘16 KX 450 and had no complaints really other than a little harshness at the top of the stroke. They are excellent for bottoming resistance. I wouldn’t let that hold me back. I will say that I had to do fork seals more frequently on that bike. Usually at least once a year. 35 y/o Vet A rider.
1
JohnMatrix
Posts
331
Joined
1/31/2017
Location
Irvine, CA, USA
12/23/2020 7:27am
Maybe unpopular opinion but I also second the rmz 450. I can put in way more laps on my buddy’s well sorted 18 rmz 450 than I ever could on my previous crf450. It has a super friendly power delivery with plenty of juice on tap for 98% of the guys on a 450. You’ll want to have the suspension set up for you, and pro circuit did a fantastic job on the bike I speak of. If you can find a clean 18+ second hand they can be had for a bargain. There’s a bit of a stigma with that bike but don’t be fooled, it is a fantastic machine.
Teej317
Posts
909
Joined
4/30/2010
Location
Colstrip, MT, USA
12/23/2020 8:08am
Skerby wrote:
I rode a 250 2 stroke as a young B rider. Thought i was gonna buy a 450 and go pro, turns out I didnt quite...
I rode a 250 2 stroke as a young B rider. Thought i was gonna buy a 450 and go pro, turns out I didnt quite have it like that lol. Bike scared the crap out of me, more oh shit moments than I could count.Deceptively hard to control is how I would describe a modern 450, but then again I know plenty vet riders that get around great on them for years.
My experience as well. That 450 power is irreplaceable, but it can be a lot to handle. 250 two stroke all day for me.
1
1
bultokid
Posts
2144
Joined
8/13/2007
Location
Houston, TX, USA
12/23/2020 8:17am
57, 6-2 250lbs lard a$$ here :-) Have you tried the 17+ KTM/Husky 250 SX/TC ? Great bikes and you can really tune the motor to suit your style....lug it or rip your arms out depending on how you tune it. Hauls my fat a$$ around just fine and man, do they turn..wow....and more importantly, just fun to ride I'd also second as others have said on the RMZ450, don't listen to all the bs you see online...they're great bikes as well, very smooth and handle great
1
JWACK
Posts
2588
Joined
8/7/2009
Location
USA
12/23/2020 8:19am
Buy the bike you want to look at in the garage when your not riding it.

5
Kayser618
Posts
34
Joined
12/23/2020
Location
Rockford, IL, USA
12/23/2020 8:40am
I’ve got a 2018 RMZ450 moving to south Beloit area early Jan I’ve got about 10 hours on it I’d sell if Your looking
2

Post a reply to: Modern 450s really gnarly?

The Latest