2020 AC92 450

JBrockman856 3/19/2019 2:33pm
3/19/2019 2:33pm
Looby321 wrote:
I think it would be smart of Pro Circuit to have a couple 450’s in the stable for next year.
I agree with this, but seems to get written off fairly quickly. Does Mitch simply want to avoid a rider in the 450 class as seems to be the case in the past?
decano51
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decano51 3/19/2019 3:42pm
3/19/2019 3:42pm
Looby321 wrote:
I think it would be smart of Pro Circuit to have a couple 450’s in the stable for next year.
JBrockman856 wrote:
I agree with this, but seems to get written off fairly quickly. Does Mitch simply want to avoid a rider in the 450 class as seems...
I agree with this, but seems to get written off fairly quickly. Does Mitch simply want to avoid a rider in the 450 class as seems to be the case in the past?
Mitch has spoken about this many times. The funding for a 450 is nearly double of a 250 team.
He won’t go ahead unless Kawasaki put in the funding for support of it.

Mitch Payton has always wanted to do the 450 team. He’s pretty outspoken about it actually haha
jonesaustin
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jonesaustin 3/19/2019 3:53pm
3/19/2019 3:53pm
RC said he moved up too soon, but I think AC would do well to move up next year. testing on the 450 will prove it, but if he's feeling it, he should imo.
mattyhamz2 3/19/2019 4:09pm
3/19/2019 4:09pm
drt410 wrote:
AC to Kawi, Tomac to Honda, and Roczen to JGR makes SOOO much sense that it probably wont happen. It literally makes too much sense. JGR...
AC to Kawi, Tomac to Honda, and Roczen to JGR makes SOOO much sense that it probably wont happen. It literally makes too much sense.

JGR is known to make GREAT bikes, Roczen was an ANIMAL on Suzuki and has had a horrible career on Honda. Eli was a different rider on Honda. He did get injured, but he flowed like he has never since. Their bike is wayyy better now too. Plus Honda doesnt have a championship since what Mookie in 250s? He’ll at least get em an Mx championship. He rides the Kawi fine because hes strong so he can manhandle it, but Tomac in his top form is a finesse rider, one that puts Marvin to shame. Marvin is the finesse guy since Tomac went Kawi. If Tomac could get back to that his career will elevate. Tomac on Honda in 15 MAY be the fastest mx rider of all time. He was beating Dungey in 2nd by a minute 15... Let that sink in.

Then AC Savatgy on Kawi makes Absolute Perfect sense then Forkner moves up to bump off Savatgy in a few years.
3 words...

Honda Curse, Bro!
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BobKerr
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BobKerr 3/21/2019 5:42am
3/21/2019 5:42am Edited Date/Time 3/21/2019 5:43am
jonesaustin wrote:
RC said he moved up too soon, but I think AC would do well to move up next year. testing on the 450 will prove it...
RC said he moved up too soon, but I think AC would do well to move up next year. testing on the 450 will prove it, but if he's feeling it, he should imo.
I believe RC only did two years of 125SX, 1997 and 1998. He got 3rd in 97, and 1st in 98, then didn't stay down to defend his title in 99. I believe AC is in his 6th year of that class. I know he has missed a TON of races due to injuires. If he wins the title this year, he will likely get a BIG salary offer on a 450 with one of the factory teams. I think he should move up too.
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Boomslang 3/21/2019 6:13am
3/21/2019 6:13am
motox331 wrote:
I'm hoping he goes to Honda. I would love to see AC and Ken under the same tent on those sick HRC bikes.
I've been told that he is on Honda's radar.

Put it this way, I think all the big teams will be open to discussions with his Manager.

Silly season....looking forward to it.
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TDeath21
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TDeath21 3/21/2019 8:43am
3/21/2019 8:43am
jonesaustin wrote:
RC said he moved up too soon, but I think AC would do well to move up next year. testing on the 450 will prove it...
RC said he moved up too soon, but I think AC would do well to move up next year. testing on the 450 will prove it, but if he's feeling it, he should imo.
BobKerr wrote:
I believe RC only did two years of 125SX, 1997 and 1998. He got 3rd in 97, and 1st in 98, then didn't stay down to...
I believe RC only did two years of 125SX, 1997 and 1998. He got 3rd in 97, and 1st in 98, then didn't stay down to defend his title in 99. I believe AC is in his 6th year of that class. I know he has missed a TON of races due to injuires. If he wins the title this year, he will likely get a BIG salary offer on a 450 with one of the factory teams. I think he should move up too.
If I remember right I don’t think RC said he’d defend his title. He said he would/should have ran the west coast in 99 to get used to those tracks before moving up to the 250. I could be wrong though.
delonick347
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delonick347 3/21/2019 9:34am
3/21/2019 9:34am
Davolos to factory Kawasaki. They've invested a lot of money in him through the years. It's time the ROI in the form of a 450 SX championship.
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keinz
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keinz 3/21/2019 10:04am
3/21/2019 10:04am
toomanykaws wrote:
Eli to the MXGP's would be epic. Win the MX nationals this summer. Then go after a few World titles. SX isn't what it once was...
Eli to the MXGP's would be epic. Win the MX nationals this summer. Then go after a few World titles. SX isn't what it once was. It may pay the most. No doubt.
You forget a guy whose name is Herlings
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Looby321
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Looby321 3/21/2019 10:24am
3/21/2019 10:24am
delonick347 wrote:
Davolos to factory Kawasaki. They've invested a lot of money in him through the years. It's time the ROI in the form of a 450 SX...
Davolos to factory Kawasaki. They've invested a lot of money in him through the years. It's time the ROI in the form of a 450 SX championship.
Is this sarcasm? Please tell me it is.
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delonick347
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delonick347 3/21/2019 10:40am
3/21/2019 10:40am
delonick347 wrote:
Davolos to factory Kawasaki. They've invested a lot of money in him through the years. It's time the ROI in the form of a 450 SX...
Davolos to factory Kawasaki. They've invested a lot of money in him through the years. It's time the ROI in the form of a 450 SX championship.
Looby321 wrote:
Is this sarcasm? Please tell me it is.
Wink
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chase4372 3/21/2019 11:43am
3/21/2019 11:43am
agn5009 wrote:
I would keep Savatgy if I were Kawi. No way I let him go, he’s been great.
As well as Savatgy has been riding, AC92 is the kawi golden boy and I can't see Savatgy staying with kawi, the main reason being that he has done enough this season on the 450 to prove that he is elite, factory material. With openings at HRC, JGR, Yamaha and possibly Husky he will have at least one if not several full factory efforts courting him, not to mention the boys in green and Rocky Mountain. With that many options, he is bound to get not only offers, but the #1 seat. It is clear that kawi has an abundance of guys that could be the main guy under the tent besides savatgy. I see savatgy riding white or red next season and AC getting the nod at kawi. With the possibility of et3 leaving kawi it could change that scenario, and maybe eli does leave and savatgy gets the #1 ride there along with AC, but I can definitely see Savatgy getting a bigger payday elsewhere which is what it may come down to. The dude will have options that I am sure of.
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BobKerr
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BobKerr 3/21/2019 12:58pm
3/21/2019 12:58pm
delonick347 wrote:
Davolos to factory Kawasaki. They've invested a lot of money in him through the years. It's time the ROI in the form of a 450 SX...
Davolos to factory Kawasaki. They've invested a lot of money in him through the years. It's time the ROI in the form of a 450 SX championship.
Davalos is 32 yrs old. He is probably done after this year. He seems to have lost some speed this year.
77Moto
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77Moto 3/21/2019 1:04pm
3/21/2019 1:04pm
Forkner will probably be on 450s before AC.

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tek14
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tek14 3/21/2019 1:16pm
3/21/2019 1:16pm
Have AC been outside US ever? I heard there are bikes ready sittin at factory KTM MXGP team without riders now..
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Motodave15 3/21/2019 2:21pm
3/21/2019 2:21pm
450s and AC. I dont see it or even see a sniff at a title for him in that class.

He entered 250s with cooper webb, who dominated and is now showing up in the premier class... If im a team manager, I'd take a bye this off season on him and I'd put my money on going after forkner in 2021. But 450 2020, id say a ride at best with JGR and thats the most I think its worth
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Motofinne 3/21/2019 2:38pm
3/21/2019 2:38pm Edited Date/Time 3/21/2019 2:46pm
Motofinne wrote:
I think Kawasaki has a few problems on their hands. Too many riders and not enough factory 450 rides. Tomac is what he is, 2 time...
I think Kawasaki has a few problems on their hands. Too many riders and not enough factory 450 rides.

Tomac is what he is, 2 time outdoor champ and a guaranteed SX race winner. They would want to keep him.
Savatgy is impressing in his rookie 450 season and he is probably relatively cheap. A great second rider

Then there is the AC and Forkner problem. They could stay down one or two more years but these two (especially Forkner) are potential SX 450 title contenders. And both of these riders will be way more expensive compared to Savatgy.

The bold strategy is to let Tomac go to Honda and go with AC & Savatgy in 2020 and AC & Forkner in 2021. But that is very unlikely.

Kawasaki could really benifit of a satellite 450 team like RMATVMC KTM or MCR Honda.

Edit: One more thing. I think Matthes said in a podcast that a 3 rider team is not an option.
tcallahan707 wrote:
So dump Tomac to keep Savatgy for one season only?
No, not really. This is Tomacs last year on the contract and he will never sign a one year deal. So if they sign Tomac (that will be a multiyear deal) they will lose AC or Forkner because of only 2 factory 450 rides available. "Dropping" Tomac now would make it possible in theory to have AC and Forkner on the team in 2021 (i doubt both will move up for 2020). So it would be more of a move for the future.

But i don't think Savatgy will sign a 1 year deal for 2020. He has been good enough to land a 2 year deal, so i think he will go to JGR.

Btw, Forkner will turn 21 this year. He is the real deal in my opinion, he could easily move up next year and be a contender for wins in 2021.
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nickm
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nickm 3/21/2019 3:54pm
3/21/2019 3:54pm
Lets not forget Kawasaki didn't sign RJ because Lechein was the next big thing, they dumped Charmichael because Stewart was the next big thing, they dumped Stewart because RV was the next big thing, they shipped RV off to MXGP because Tomac was the next big thing....what do you really think Kawasaki will do next?
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dboivin 3/21/2019 4:04pm
3/21/2019 4:04pm
washeduprider367 wrote:
i really wouldn't be so sure Tomac will be on that bike for too much longer. Way too many super fast rookies to have him out...
i really wouldn't be so sure Tomac will be on that bike for too much longer. Way too many super fast rookies to have him out there not performing well. He really hasn't performed well enough to keep that ride in my opinion.
731chopper wrote:
He’s the defending 2 time champion outdoors...
lol these crack me up. winning supercross races and outdoor title.....but hes washed up?
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tcallahan707 3/21/2019 5:12pm
3/21/2019 5:12pm Edited Date/Time 3/21/2019 5:12pm
Motofinne wrote:
I think Kawasaki has a few problems on their hands. Too many riders and not enough factory 450 rides. Tomac is what he is, 2 time...
I think Kawasaki has a few problems on their hands. Too many riders and not enough factory 450 rides.

Tomac is what he is, 2 time outdoor champ and a guaranteed SX race winner. They would want to keep him.
Savatgy is impressing in his rookie 450 season and he is probably relatively cheap. A great second rider

Then there is the AC and Forkner problem. They could stay down one or two more years but these two (especially Forkner) are potential SX 450 title contenders. And both of these riders will be way more expensive compared to Savatgy.

The bold strategy is to let Tomac go to Honda and go with AC & Savatgy in 2020 and AC & Forkner in 2021. But that is very unlikely.

Kawasaki could really benifit of a satellite 450 team like RMATVMC KTM or MCR Honda.

Edit: One more thing. I think Matthes said in a podcast that a 3 rider team is not an option.
tcallahan707 wrote:
So dump Tomac to keep Savatgy for one season only?
Motofinne wrote:
No, not really. This is Tomacs last year on the contract and he will never sign a one year deal. So if they sign Tomac (that...
No, not really. This is Tomacs last year on the contract and he will never sign a one year deal. So if they sign Tomac (that will be a multiyear deal) they will lose AC or Forkner because of only 2 factory 450 rides available. "Dropping" Tomac now would make it possible in theory to have AC and Forkner on the team in 2021 (i doubt both will move up for 2020). So it would be more of a move for the future.

But i don't think Savatgy will sign a 1 year deal for 2020. He has been good enough to land a 2 year deal, so i think he will go to JGR.

Btw, Forkner will turn 21 this year. He is the real deal in my opinion, he could easily move up next year and be a contender for wins in 2021.
Ahh, I see. It is effectively letting Tomac go for one Savatgy year but I didn’t understand where the reasoning was. Thanks for explaining. Kawi sure has some decisions to make.
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Sully 3/21/2019 7:26pm
3/21/2019 7:26pm
washeduprider367 wrote:
i really wouldn't be so sure Tomac will be on that bike for too much longer. Way too many super fast rookies to have him out...
i really wouldn't be so sure Tomac will be on that bike for too much longer. Way too many super fast rookies to have him out there not performing well. He really hasn't performed well enough to keep that ride in my opinion.
731chopper wrote:
He’s the defending 2 time champion outdoors...
dboivin wrote:
lol these crack me up. winning supercross races and outdoor title.....but hes washed up?
Not to mention he's sitting 3rd in points, and only 21 back of Webb. Theoretically (but probably not likely), one bad race/mechanical for Webb with an Eli win, and he's right back in the hunt.
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Crush 3/21/2019 7:51pm
3/21/2019 7:51pm
Looby321 wrote:
I think it would be smart of Pro Circuit to have a couple 450’s in the stable for next year.
JBrockman856 wrote:
I agree with this, but seems to get written off fairly quickly. Does Mitch simply want to avoid a rider in the 450 class as seems...
I agree with this, but seems to get written off fairly quickly. Does Mitch simply want to avoid a rider in the 450 class as seems to be the case in the past?
decano51 wrote:
Mitch has spoken about this many times. The funding for a 450 is nearly double of a 250 team. He won’t go ahead unless Kawasaki put...
Mitch has spoken about this many times. The funding for a 450 is nearly double of a 250 team.
He won’t go ahead unless Kawasaki put in the funding for support of it.

Mitch Payton has always wanted to do the 450 team. He’s pretty outspoken about it actually haha
Salary is the issue though right? And double the SX races.
Squirrelings 3/21/2019 8:01pm
3/21/2019 8:01pm
nickm wrote:
Lets not forget Kawasaki didn't sign RJ because Lechein was the next big thing, they dumped Charmichael because Stewart was the next big thing, they dumped...
Lets not forget Kawasaki didn't sign RJ because Lechein was the next big thing, they dumped Charmichael because Stewart was the next big thing, they dumped Stewart because RV was the next big thing, they shipped RV off to MXGP because Tomac was the next big thing....what do you really think Kawasaki will do next?
RC went to Honda for the money. Stewart left Kawi because he's a Red Bull guy and Kawi did a team deal with Monster. RV went to GP's because he didn't want to race SX and had to fulfill the last year of his contract. What else you got?
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FerCzD
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FerCzD 3/21/2019 8:09pm
3/21/2019 8:09pm Edited Date/Time 3/21/2019 8:11pm
Although he is riding well right now, and might get a shot at a factory team he hasn't delivered a championship to PC either indoors or outdoors.

Does anyone know if there has been a 450 champion that never won a title in the 250?
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FerCzD
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FerCzD 3/21/2019 8:10pm
3/21/2019 8:10pm
Squirrelings 3/21/2019 8:23pm
3/21/2019 8:23pm
FerCzD wrote:
Although he is riding well right now, and might get a shot at a factory team he hasn't delivered a championship to PC either indoors or...
Although he is riding well right now, and might get a shot at a factory team he hasn't delivered a championship to PC either indoors or outdoors.

Does anyone know if there has been a 450 champion that never won a title in the 250?
Yeah, every supercross champion before MC since there was no 125 SX until 1985. Emig is the only guy since that didn't win a 125 SX title and won a 250 title. Chad Reed has a 450 MX title with no 250 MX. Lorocco won 250 and 500 MX titles, but never did on a 125. Same with Stanton. There's more, but things were different back then than now.
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-MAVERICK-
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-MAVERICK- 3/21/2019 8:36pm
3/21/2019 8:36pm
FerCzD wrote:
Although he is riding well right now, and might get a shot at a factory team he hasn't delivered a championship to PC either indoors or...
Although he is riding well right now, and might get a shot at a factory team he hasn't delivered a championship to PC either indoors or outdoors.

Does anyone know if there has been a 450 champion that never won a title in the 250?
Rick Johnson and Jeff Stanton. Both have championships in the 250/450 class but none in the 125/250 class. Might be more before that era. Every 450 champion after that has either won a 125/250 outdoor title and/or a regional SX title.

Rick Johnson: 250/450 Outdoor ('84, '86, & '87). 250/450 SX ('86). Also won titles in the 500 class. Outdoors ('87 & '88). SX ('88).

Jeff Stanton: 250/450 Outdoor ('89, '90, & '92). 250/450 SX ('89, '90, & '92).
uneasy_rider 3/21/2019 8:41pm
3/21/2019 8:41pm
agn5009 wrote:
I would keep Savatgy if I were Kawi. No way I let him go, he’s been great.
BobKerr wrote:
Agree. He is 8th in the points, and that is with having a mechanical DNF one race (Oakland?) that obviously wasn't his fault. Without that DNF...
Agree. He is 8th in the points, and that is with having a mechanical DNF one race (Oakland?) that obviously wasn't his fault. Without that DNF, he would be 7th in the points.


I mean no disrespect Bob, but it is ironic to me how people (not you) talk about Reed being a has been, lapper...etc and he is 7th in points, yet JS is riding great, an excellent prospect to win for Kawi, and he is behind Reed, and would only push Reed back one spot if it wasnt for his DNF.
uneasy_rider 3/21/2019 8:43pm
3/21/2019 8:43pm
nickm wrote:
Lets not forget Kawasaki didn't sign RJ because Lechein was the next big thing, they dumped Charmichael because Stewart was the next big thing, they dumped...
Lets not forget Kawasaki didn't sign RJ because Lechein was the next big thing, they dumped Charmichael because Stewart was the next big thing, they dumped Stewart because RV was the next big thing, they shipped RV off to MXGP because Tomac was the next big thing....what do you really think Kawasaki will do next?
In RV`s defense, he was extra crispy with the SX and MX scene so he shipped himself of to the GPs.
decano51
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decano51 3/21/2019 8:47pm
3/21/2019 8:47pm
With JGR struggling with sponsorships. I don’t see JGR being around to much longer.
Would be awesome to see Suzuki open up its factory doors again for a Team. Even better if CR22 and RC4 got highly involved as team managers or of some sort and take on the guys like AC92 and Wilson as riders.

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