Hare scrambles

5/6/2018 4:49pm
I went through this a couple years ago. Moved to a new province and found some guys online locally that trail ride. Did a couple legit trail rides (not snowmobile and 4 wheeler trails) and realized the skill required to go quick isn't a joke, so I signed up for a race.
First race was C class. Bike didn't fire up on the first kick so I started dead last, and I stalled it twice, but I still ended up top 5. That race was only an hour and I wasn't tired. Part of the course was a MX track I was really familiar with so that was a blast, but is why I finished as well as I did.
So I moved up to B for the next race... Which felt like a big mistake because that course was all tight single track, the race was 90 minutes + a lap (20 minute lap times). Half way through I started to get heat stroke.
I love hare scrambles so much I bought myself a YZ250X for christmas and what a difference that bike has made. I'm climbing stuff I couldn't before, I can put the wheels where I want it and it doesn't beat me up over the rocks.

My MX bike is a 250f but it's sprung and valved somewhat aggressively, so in the rough stuff in the woods the bike more or less bounces and ricochets off of everything.
To take it racing I threw on some wrap around hand guards, a slightly better skid plate and strapped a wrist watch to the bar pad to watch for time... I could do about 1:15 before I needed gas. So I would usually stop at the hour mark and throw in some gas.

The new bike has a beefy plastic skid plate (TM designs), big tank, full wrap hand guards, comes stock with an 18" rear, and the softer suspension is a big plus.

It's a blast, less risky for the most part and if you're fit it really pays.

I suggest on the first start to take it easy and let most of the guys go and feel out the pace. I got a really good start on my second race and then I was really in the way for the first half lap.

I'm currently making a roughly 4km loop of single track with various sized of logs to cross (thigh high suspended logs are really a challenge).It should be good to go out once a week after work and do a 2 hour moto.

One of the perks of this style of racing is the bang for buck. I spend $40, show up at 10am, race for 2 hours and then pack up. I might get 40 minutes of riding for $100 and you're sitting there all day for moto... Also, practice is almost always free (just getting out on a fast paced trail ride)
navalseabee
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Virginia Beach, VA US
5/6/2018 5:27pm Edited Date/Time 5/6/2018 5:27pm
Typically,
Harescramble: a loop between 3 and 15 miles where you run for time usually 1-3 hours depending on your sanctioning body, heads up racing I.E. you start with the guys in your class.
Enduro: Think stage rally, multiple secions of timed point A to point B, typically 60 miles in total. Not heads up racing, people racing on your row can be any avaliable class, you are racing the clock. Fastest guy wins.

Mods are up to you but i'd say skid plate and your choice of hand guard are the necessities. Agree with the above comment about riding at race speed and see where your at for fuel, i will say that at my speed i can just barley get through a two hour harescramble with my stock KTM XC tank. Most folks around me with YZ's run the 3 gallon IMS tank and like them.
KennyT
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Vista, CA US
Fantasy
5/6/2018 5:34pm
My best advice is to not treat it like a MX race. Pre run the course if possible and make mental notes on possible
spots that will be trouble at race speed. Don’t be afraid to back it off a notch if you are unsure of the section ahead. Remember you are in a longer race and not a 10 minute Moto so pace yourself and don’t feel you need to go banzai through the pack. A steady clip will get you to the finish in one piece and a wide open balls out approach will most likley get you back to the pits with injuries.

I had a good time doing hare scrambles but you have to show discipline and not treat it like a 15 minute Moto
ama530
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216
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Location
Lehighton, PA US
5/6/2018 5:42pm
BobPA wrote:
My reason is because I do not like them. I ride tight single track all the time to this day with just regular hand guards. I...
My reason is because I do not like them. I ride tight single track all the time to this day with just regular hand guards. I chased D6, PA State, ECEA, and some NY races for a long time.
agn5009 wrote:
To each his own I suppose. I will never understand it. I certainly wouldn't recommend it.
It is personal preference. I run some of the D6 HS rounds and would never run without barkbuster style hand protection. I have 2 sets of bars. One for scrambles and one for MX. I run the standard plastic guards for MX.

At 50, I too switched from MX over to scrambles. It is something to get used to and a different mindset. Like someone had mentioned earlier in the post. You will see a guy sitting on an old XR or KDX in your class and think he is a chump. He will be the one waxing everyone. Don't be fooled. These guys can fly in the woods. It will be a learning curve. Give yourself a year or so to get your feet wet. Finishing one is the first step. It is tough. I have had more rough days than good ones. I have made allot of rookie mistakes. Be prepared, go in well hydrated, and with a positive outlook. Good luck!

The Shop

kevkx125
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Douglassville, PA US
5/6/2018 5:48pm
If you live in del. look up del. enduro riders they put on really good hare scrambles. Raced PA and DEL. and NJ. hare scrambles for long time a lot of fun.
5/6/2018 6:06pm
Typically, Harescramble: a loop between 3 and 15 miles where you run for time usually 1-3 hours depending on your sanctioning body, heads up racing I.E...
Typically,
Harescramble: a loop between 3 and 15 miles where you run for time usually 1-3 hours depending on your sanctioning body, heads up racing I.E. you start with the guys in your class.
Enduro: Think stage rally, multiple secions of timed point A to point B, typically 60 miles in total. Not heads up racing, people racing on your row can be any avaliable class, you are racing the clock. Fastest guy wins.

Mods are up to you but i'd say skid plate and your choice of hand guard are the necessities. Agree with the above comment about riding at race speed and see where your at for fuel, i will say that at my speed i can just barley get through a two hour harescramble with my stock KTM XC tank. Most folks around me with YZ's run the 3 gallon IMS tank and like them.
I got the GYTR IMS tank for my 250x and it fits great, no nut buster at the top, I can still sit at as forward as I normally would, and I can change a spark plug with the tank still on... Important thing to be able to do for when you swamp it in a river crossing.
VET176
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Location
Brisbane AU
5/6/2018 6:14pm
Pace yourself brother..pace yourself.

Things get pretty hairy after the 1 hour mark if you go out to fast.
wreckitrandy
Posts
4204
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Granite Falls, NC US
5/6/2018 6:46pm
I'd gear that puppy down... I guess it depends on how tight and technical the trail is though. If anyone tells you, 'You can drive a truck through there.' do the barkbusters. They're lying to you. Offroad guys like to see mx guys suffer for some reason. Good luck. Have fun.
5/6/2018 6:57pm
radiator braces. bark busters. wal mart sells cheap camel backs. softer suspension will help a ton. if its wet and roots mx settings will deflect and skip making for a long day lol. have funWink
Walter
Posts
375
Joined
8/21/2008
Location
Tucson, AZ US
5/6/2018 7:43pm
Don’t overthink trying it. You have some good advice here. If you are in a rocky area,get a skid plate and then just try one.

Go 75% of the pace you can ride at the first hour then dial it in.

You will learn a lot in your first race. Go from there.

My first one was in AZ in ‘76 on a 250 Pursang in full MX trim. Almost passed out in the heat but finished a 140 mile race. It was on from there.

Way more seat time and plain fun than a weekend MX race.
5/6/2018 8:46pm
Cory_Hill wrote:
I've been an MX racer for 16 years now and I'm looking into trying hare scrambles. Was wondering if anyone had any tips on how I...
I've been an MX racer for 16 years now and I'm looking into trying hare scrambles. Was wondering if anyone had any tips on how I should start off. (Ex bike mods, first race day, how to practice) I'm definitely going to get bark busters and a second set of handlebars that aren't as wide as the ones on my MX bike. I will be using my 2014 yz250f until I get a 250 2-stroke to use for hs.
I race a local series that is featured mainly the west side of Washington (woods).

1hr30m for C class + sportsman, 2h for B and up

Ive raced 2 250's and currently a 300 husky two stroke. the biggest mod would be first getting hand guards and i would recommend a skid + radiator and rotor/caliper guards. nothing sucks more then mechanical midway through a race. next is definitely setting your suspension for your weight and terrain. an oversize tank helps alot, but I use a quickfill and usually only takes half a minute or so into the pit and out (just a splash for the final few laps).


as others have said its mainly about getting used to the duration and learning when to go fast. i am a fan of saving for the last lap. I went from 5th to a 3rd in my class my last race due to conditioning! pre hydrate the week leading up to the race (if not... all the time? water intake is crucial for recovery and performance), get a good meal in the night before and morning of helps for me (slow carbs like sweet potato, and good portion of protein and fat) .

during race I stick to just water, but some people will make a pit stop for a fast carb boost like sports drink or a banana

as for training, I ride local trails as much as i can. I used to also MX but the track has not been kind with injuries. I spent a good 3-4 years as primarily a track kid, so those skills do help out on the moto portion of our races.

I just try and ride the sections of trail I know at decent speed, and usually will practice 'laps' as a 15-20 min quicker then average pace but spend an hour or so atleast total riding whatever and looking for technical lines. in woods racing you have to be very aware of the trail, good passing spots and of course how to choose a line that helps you maintain momentum but doesnt slow up the fast riders from classes behind you + the 'really' fast a and AA pros. learning to remember your strong sections and your "be carful and maybe take a breath" sections as a race progresses.

best of luck with your goals!



JB 19
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Marion, OH US
5/6/2018 10:46pm
agn5009 wrote:
You're crazy man. Obviously it depends what series you're doing. I could see doing a GNCC without back busters. A series such as AWRCS? Not a...
You're crazy man. Obviously it depends what series you're doing. I could see doing a GNCC without back busters. A series such as AWRCS? Not a chance.

I've clipped too many trees at pretty high speeds to not use them. We talk about safety here all the time. Bark busters are a huge safety feature. There's absolutely no reason not to use them in the woods. None.
One draw back is going over the bars and potentially getting your arm caught in the bark busters. I thought it was total bs until I somehow did it myself.
JAFO92
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BFE, TX US
5/7/2018 5:27am
Woods racers are looney AF.

RCF
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PA US
5/7/2018 5:47am
Like in the above picture when you come up on W's in the woods that means there's something that could be dangerous coming up, not sure why they have the W after the down limb in that picture should be before it.
Switch
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MP US
5/7/2018 6:05am Edited Date/Time 5/7/2018 6:07am
RCF wrote:
Like in the above picture when you come up on W's in the woods that means there's something that could be dangerous coming up, not sure...
Like in the above picture when you come up on W's in the woods that means there's something that could be dangerous coming up, not sure why they have the W after the down limb in that picture should be before it.
It's a 2 sided card.. the side facing them is an X, which means danger/caution. The W is put in areas where you could get away from the trail, telling you (W)rong way.. just as it says "Wrong" below the W in picture above. Normally, it will say "Danger" below the X on most traditional course markers.
RCF
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PA US
5/7/2018 6:18am
RCF wrote:
Like in the above picture when you come up on W's in the woods that means there's something that could be dangerous coming up, not sure...
Like in the above picture when you come up on W's in the woods that means there's something that could be dangerous coming up, not sure why they have the W after the down limb in that picture should be before it.
Switch wrote:
It's a 2 sided card.. the side facing them is an X, which means danger/caution. The W is put in areas where you could get away...
It's a 2 sided card.. the side facing them is an X, which means danger/caution. The W is put in areas where you could get away from the trail, telling you (W)rong way.. just as it says "Wrong" below the W in picture above. Normally, it will say "Danger" below the X on most traditional course markers.
My bad I don't know what the hell I was thinking
agn5009
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State College, PA US
5/7/2018 7:02am
agn5009 wrote:
You're crazy man. Obviously it depends what series you're doing. I could see doing a GNCC without back busters. A series such as AWRCS? Not a...
You're crazy man. Obviously it depends what series you're doing. I could see doing a GNCC without back busters. A series such as AWRCS? Not a chance.

I've clipped too many trees at pretty high speeds to not use them. We talk about safety here all the time. Bark busters are a huge safety feature. There's absolutely no reason not to use them in the woods. None.
JB 19 wrote:
One draw back is going over the bars and potentially getting your arm caught in the bark busters. I thought it was total bs until I...
One draw back is going over the bars and potentially getting your arm caught in the bark busters. I thought it was total bs until I somehow did it myself.
Something like that may happen once in a lifetime. You're gonna clip trees with your bars almost every race.
BLACKeR
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4
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US
5/7/2018 7:10am
i primarily race hare scrambles and where i live theres a mini hare scramble series that the local mx tracks with extra property put, on so it attracts a lot of mx riders. ive raced XC from C class up to AA and ive seen these mx rider mistakes in every class.


-walk the first mile, and go for it on the start, a lot of guys settle into the idea that its a 2hr race starts dont matter, believe me nailing your start and first 15 minutes of the race makes a difference, youll flow better and stay more relaxed if you dont think you have to chase the 20 people who beat you off the line.

-look ahead, look ahead, look ahead. you do not need to follow the main trail, its going to seem tight, but you dont have to follow the guy in front of you, plow through some bushes, duck some brances.

-be easy on the throttle, your throttle is a dimmer switch not a light switch! i dont care how hard you twist your wrist, you will not get traction on that rock or log. i cant tell you haw many times ive seem steaming bikes pinned on a pile of polished roots. just stop, this isnt a mulched, watered, and prepped track.

-let other riders by, there are likely a dozen different classes out there, if someone yells or is reving their bike behind you just move over, theyre not being dicks, its the accepted way of saying faster rider. you can do it too.

-watch for new lines especially in mud holes, do whatever you can to stay out of the mail line there.

-number one, just relax and have fun!
5/7/2018 8:22am
I went through this a couple years ago. Moved to a new province and found some guys online locally that trail ride. Did a couple legit...
I went through this a couple years ago. Moved to a new province and found some guys online locally that trail ride. Did a couple legit trail rides (not snowmobile and 4 wheeler trails) and realized the skill required to go quick isn't a joke, so I signed up for a race.
First race was C class. Bike didn't fire up on the first kick so I started dead last, and I stalled it twice, but I still ended up top 5. That race was only an hour and I wasn't tired. Part of the course was a MX track I was really familiar with so that was a blast, but is why I finished as well as I did.
So I moved up to B for the next race... Which felt like a big mistake because that course was all tight single track, the race was 90 minutes + a lap (20 minute lap times). Half way through I started to get heat stroke.
I love hare scrambles so much I bought myself a YZ250X for christmas and what a difference that bike has made. I'm climbing stuff I couldn't before, I can put the wheels where I want it and it doesn't beat me up over the rocks.

My MX bike is a 250f but it's sprung and valved somewhat aggressively, so in the rough stuff in the woods the bike more or less bounces and ricochets off of everything.
To take it racing I threw on some wrap around hand guards, a slightly better skid plate and strapped a wrist watch to the bar pad to watch for time... I could do about 1:15 before I needed gas. So I would usually stop at the hour mark and throw in some gas.

The new bike has a beefy plastic skid plate (TM designs), big tank, full wrap hand guards, comes stock with an 18" rear, and the softer suspension is a big plus.

It's a blast, less risky for the most part and if you're fit it really pays.

I suggest on the first start to take it easy and let most of the guys go and feel out the pace. I got a really good start on my second race and then I was really in the way for the first half lap.

I'm currently making a roughly 4km loop of single track with various sized of logs to cross (thigh high suspended logs are really a challenge).It should be good to go out once a week after work and do a 2 hour moto.

One of the perks of this style of racing is the bang for buck. I spend $40, show up at 10am, race for 2 hours and then pack up. I might get 40 minutes of riding for $100 and you're sitting there all day for moto... Also, practice is almost always free (just getting out on a fast paced trail ride)
hey! what province are you in and where do you race? I did the Manitoba Dirt rider opener yesterday!!
Kanewel433
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203
Joined
4/27/2017
Location
Summerville, SC US
5/9/2018 6:36am
I agree with Agn5009. I just started racing the GNCC's last year, after only 4 years of consistent riding, and so I joined the 250 C Junior (25+) class. In that class there are at least 5 guys who would be competitive B class riders, but they don't race enough of the events to point out of the C class. Discouraging? Yeah a little. Sandbagging? Maybe. I recognize that being so new to this sport, and working a 8-5 desk job, I'm an unlikely candidate to win such a competitve race, but I go out there and do the best I can.

As far as preparation goes, I tend to cramp up in my right hamstring while riding the 2 hour long races, but I've found that drinking pickle juice or eating some yellow mustard in the morning completely resolves that issue. I know it may sound goofy, but I swear it works.
If you're mid race and stop for a pit to refuel/ change goggles or gloves, I would recommend sucking down a packet of energy gel or something. Combined with a Camelbak, you should be ok for the whole 2 hours.

A few gear tips: Put a ladies maxi pad on the top layer of foam on your goggles. It'll soak up the brow sweat and prevent it from splashing onto the inside of your lenses in the event of a crash/ roost/ tree branch impact. I use full bark busters, regular width bars. Definitely clipped a tree or 2 in my races, and I'm thankful I had the full guards.

If you have any questions, please feel free to ask. I'm certainly no expert but being a fellow Hare Scramble rookie, I may have some more helpful insight.
mx shredder
Posts
28
Joined
3/3/2016
Location
Clifton Heights, PA US
5/9/2018 7:40am
I would normally do a handful of hare scrambles right after the mx season in october/november in pa from 2000-2005...it was always half track/half trail..i never changed a thing on my cr250 race bike and i always placed very well...no barkbusters,no changed gearing..10 mile loop..2hr race would get u 8-10 laps..biggest thing is energy/hydration before the race..eats lots of carbs before hand..relax for the first few laps..get to know the track and where the best lines are in the 1st three laps...pick a gd spot to re-fuel thats out of the way and not caught up in the chaos..id always eat a banana and pound a gatorade real quick while re-fueling for energy..in the beginning,guys will be crashing everywhere due to the amount of bikes on the track..pace yourself
Sit down as much as u can on the straight aways to ease armpump..extra padding on your ass from the amount of times you change positions on the bike..finally,have a cold beer wating in your cooler for after the race. .its a tough 2hrs and an accomplishment to finish and place well...gd luck and have fun

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