Tomac and the 2015 Honda

tcallahan707
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tcallahan707 4/28/2017 8:53pm
4/28/2017 8:53pm Edited Date/Time 4/28/2017 9:00pm
Dtat720 wrote:
Because its never the bikes fault for the rear end swapping and not staying stable? Tomac isnt one to talk much so if he opens up...
Because its never the bikes fault for the rear end swapping and not staying stable? Tomac isnt one to talk much so if he opens up and says he didnt like the bike, i take that as he did not like the bike.
tcallahan707 wrote:
It didn't swap. It skated out on him. He was cutting across braking bumps and ruts while pinned down an offcamber hill. It's not the bike's...
It didn't swap. It skated out on him. He was cutting across braking bumps and ruts while pinned down an offcamber hill. It's not the bike's fault physics exists.

It's very possible he has talent that exceeds the capabilities of a bike, and therefore felt like the bike was to blame, but what he was trying to do there was something that any bike would have reacted similarly. Like I said, if the front was tucking, then I'd believe the bike characteristics were involved.
dboivin wrote:
i'll take eli's word for it. specially when hes not known for making wild claims or burning bridges. if he didn't like it...he didn't like it...
i'll take eli's word for it. specially when hes not known for making wild claims or burning bridges. if he didn't like it...he didn't like it. no reason to say anything otherwise. hes a pretty straight shooter.
I agree. He's a stand up guy and is typically reserved. Did you take in the whole interview? He was basically stuffed into a corner and the only way out was to give the guy a one liner about how the Honda sucked while his boss looked over his shoulder.
tcallahan707
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tcallahan707 4/28/2017 9:00pm
4/28/2017 9:00pm Edited Date/Time 4/28/2017 9:01pm
Mx286 wrote:
I've heard that Honda gives them settings to run, not so much letting the rider set the bike up. I mean I'm sure they let them...
I've heard that Honda gives them settings to run, not so much letting the rider set the bike up. I mean I'm sure they let them get it to their liking, but more so here's the settings you can win with this here you go.
Haha that's been the MO of Kawi since RV. Weimer has said it and Tomac (not on record) has been asking for stuff while Williamson gave him the "RV did it this way". Took a meeting with the Japanese crew (aka Mike W's bosses) to get what Eli wanted. Coincidence that meeting was a few rounds into the 2017 SX season?
tcallahan707
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tcallahan707 4/28/2017 9:01pm
4/28/2017 9:01pm
Mx286 wrote:
I've heard that Honda gives them settings to run, not so much letting the rider set the bike up. I mean I'm sure they let them...
I've heard that Honda gives them settings to run, not so much letting the rider set the bike up. I mean I'm sure they let them get it to their liking, but more so here's the settings you can win with this here you go.
ed921reyes wrote:
Where would you hear somethin like this? Figure it would be something more geared towards Kawi? With them winning so much I remember hearing on pulp...
Where would you hear somethin like this? Figure it would be something more geared towards Kawi? With them winning so much I remember hearing on pulp and reading that tomac was given rv setting and that to not go to far from his setup? Didn't tomac take a suspension guy with him and him leave because of that?
Ding ding ding.
oldblood
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oldblood 4/28/2017 9:01pm
4/28/2017 9:01pm


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avidchimp 4/28/2017 9:01pm
4/28/2017 9:01pm
Mx286 wrote:
I've heard that Honda gives them settings to run, not so much letting the rider set the bike up. I mean I'm sure they let them...
I've heard that Honda gives them settings to run, not so much letting the rider set the bike up. I mean I'm sure they let them get it to their liking, but more so here's the settings you can win with this here you go.
Funny, some people would say this about Kawasaki as well. That is until your bread and butter tells you to shovel snow, I'm leaving.
ed921reyes
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ed921reyes 4/28/2017 9:01pm
4/28/2017 9:01pm
tcallahan707 wrote:
I agree. He's a stand up guy and is typically reserved. Did you take in the whole interview? He was basically stuffed into a corner and...
I agree. He's a stand up guy and is typically reserved. Did you take in the whole interview? He was basically stuffed into a corner and the only way out was to give the guy a one liner about how the Honda sucked while his boss looked over his shoulder.
Finally someone with the blinders off!!!
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ed921reyes 4/28/2017 9:04pm
4/28/2017 9:04pm
oldblood wrote:
[img]https://p.vitalmx.com/photos/forums/2017/04/28/191218/s1200_s1200_ET3Fly150.jpg[/img]


Look he's on the ground... oh wait....
MX Guy
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MX Guy 4/28/2017 9:05pm
4/28/2017 9:05pm
That remark was low key @ Ken Roczen
colintrax
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colintrax 4/28/2017 9:06pm
4/28/2017 9:06pm
Lets not forget that Kenny got a 2017, not even close to the 2015 bike Eli was on.

Eli felt the Honda is unstable, and that's fine. Still a good bike. But it's not a secret the big green bike feels stable, and likely played a role in Eli switching to green.
tcallahan707
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tcallahan707 4/28/2017 9:16pm
4/28/2017 9:16pm
"There we go. That’s the part of the thought process we all wanted to know. Excellent I got my answer"

Ask as many questions as it takes to get the answer you're looking for that will create clickbait. Great journalism Weege. (Normally, i would just chalk this up to Weege being Weege and saying sarcastic things, but he's gotta know that a comment like that will stir the pot when posted as a Racer X interview. If it was on Pulp, we'd all know he was jokingly setting him up and no one would take it so serious)
MX Guy
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MX Guy 4/28/2017 9:22pm
4/28/2017 9:22pm
colintrax wrote:
Lets not forget that Kenny got a 2017, not even close to the 2015 bike Eli was on. Eli felt the Honda is unstable, and that's...
Lets not forget that Kenny got a 2017, not even close to the 2015 bike Eli was on.

Eli felt the Honda is unstable, and that's fine. Still a good bike. But it's not a secret the big green bike feels stable, and likely played a role in Eli switching to green.
If you read the interview you'd know there's no distinction between anything other than the color of the bike being mentioned. That being said, we can assume it was a dig at Honda in general, not at the 2015 CRF450R specifically.
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dboivin 4/28/2017 10:18pm
4/28/2017 10:18pm
ed921reyes wrote:
Tomac fanboy noted. Just dont think its a thing to be taking jabs at something just cause your on a different color. Growth of the sport...
Tomac fanboy noted. Just dont think its a thing to be taking jabs at something just cause your on a different color. Growth of the sport is what everyone should have at. When tomacs opinion should be taken seriously is when he starts taking blame for mistakes(which he has) and blaming the bike when it's the bikes fault(when he hasnt and if he has please disclose what magic they found to make his arms not pump up? Mathes even said they told him but he wasn't aloud to say). But I bet we will never see that. He still is paid by Kwai so a jab at Honda shouldn't be taken to seriously. until he retires and can come forth with the truth
lol no. i like kroc too. no favoritism at all. honda has been augering my favorite riders into the ground for years now.
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Mit12 4/28/2017 10:32pm
4/28/2017 10:32pm
Now that Tomac is winning all you guys that said he needs to switch brands are back peddling. He was not very good last year. Ecause of his shoulders not the bike.
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cali11 4/28/2017 10:33pm
4/28/2017 10:33pm
FI2T wrote:
I haven't been a fan of any of the 3 Honda 450's I've had. My 450's were to nervous for me and i could never get...
I haven't been a fan of any of the 3 Honda 450's I've had. My 450's were to nervous for me and i could never get comfortable cornering with them. I'm not paid to say that either.... I did love my 06 cr250 though. Miss that bike.
I feel being a taller rider that both the YZ and KX are light yrs better for me. Maybe Eli likes a more stable bike. I think the KX has a way better feel at higher speeds.
ed921reyes wrote:
Opinion noted but this discussion is about a professional that has a big influence on opinions stating somethin to be incorrect becasue unless he goes out...
Opinion noted but this discussion is about a professional that has a big influence on opinions stating somethin to be incorrect becasue unless he goes out in hangtown and beats the stage by 3 plus minutes that comment he made about the honda is invalid

what would have made this all better is the fact that if kenny was here tomac wouldn't be of any discussion. Roczen would been all the discussion. And tomac woulda been about arm pump. And his keys to sx about arm pump.
Sorry to burst your bubble. But Kenny or anyone else in the world, is in Tomacs league right now. Yeah he won 2 races on that Honda, but he did not kick ass like this. He barley beat Dungey at round 2 & Dungey was kicking his ass at A2.
cali11
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cali11 4/28/2017 10:37pm
4/28/2017 10:37pm
Mx286 wrote:
I've heard that Honda gives them settings to run, not so much letting the rider set the bike up. I mean I'm sure they let them...
I've heard that Honda gives them settings to run, not so much letting the rider set the bike up. I mean I'm sure they let them get it to their liking, but more so here's the settings you can win with this here you go.
I'm calling BS on that!
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kong0036 4/28/2017 10:57pm
4/28/2017 10:57pm Edited Date/Time 4/28/2017 11:00pm
FI2T wrote:
I haven't been a fan of any of the 3 Honda 450's I've had. My 450's were to nervous for me and i could never get...
I haven't been a fan of any of the 3 Honda 450's I've had. My 450's were to nervous for me and i could never get comfortable cornering with them. I'm not paid to say that either.... I did love my 06 cr250 though. Miss that bike.
I feel being a taller rider that both the YZ and KX are light yrs better for me. Maybe Eli likes a more stable bike. I think the KX has a way better feel at higher speeds.
ed921reyes wrote:
Opinion noted but this discussion is about a professional that has a big influence on opinions stating somethin to be incorrect becasue unless he goes out...
Opinion noted but this discussion is about a professional that has a big influence on opinions stating somethin to be incorrect becasue unless he goes out in hangtown and beats the stage by 3 plus minutes that comment he made about the honda is invalid

what would have made this all better is the fact that if kenny was here tomac wouldn't be of any discussion. Roczen would been all the discussion. And tomac woulda been about arm pump. And his keys to sx about arm pump.
cali11 wrote:
Sorry to burst your bubble. But Kenny or anyone else in the world, is in Tomacs league right now. Yeah he won 2 races on that...
Sorry to burst your bubble. But Kenny or anyone else in the world, is in Tomacs league right now. Yeah he won 2 races on that Honda, but he did not kick ass like this. He barley beat Dungey at round 2 & Dungey was kicking his ass at A2.
You don't think Kenny would also get faster on that bike as the season went on. All i know is could we all imagine if this went down to a 3 way title fight in the same position we are in now. That is what dreams are made of.
blackdiamond
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blackdiamond 4/28/2017 11:15pm
4/28/2017 11:15pm
I don't remember Eli crashing that much on the Honda? Obviously the one in Lakewood was a game changer but that doesn't define that season IMO.

Let's wait and see if he can win Hangtown by a minute and a half on the Kawi and then ask the same question?
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KC435 4/28/2017 11:47pm
4/28/2017 11:47pm Edited Date/Time 4/29/2017 12:00am
Eh..I don't think Mike Williamson can fire Eli Tomac. The boss for Eli is Dan Fahey, if not mistaken, who answers to Bruce Stjernstrom. Just sayin'......

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FI2T
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FI2T 4/28/2017 11:56pm
4/28/2017 11:56pm
FI2T wrote:
I haven't been a fan of any of the 3 Honda 450's I've had. My 450's were to nervous for me and i could never get...
I haven't been a fan of any of the 3 Honda 450's I've had. My 450's were to nervous for me and i could never get comfortable cornering with them. I'm not paid to say that either.... I did love my 06 cr250 though. Miss that bike.
I feel being a taller rider that both the YZ and KX are light yrs better for me. Maybe Eli likes a more stable bike. I think the KX has a way better feel at higher speeds.
ed921reyes wrote:
Opinion noted but this discussion is about a professional that has a big influence on opinions stating somethin to be incorrect becasue unless he goes out...
Opinion noted but this discussion is about a professional that has a big influence on opinions stating somethin to be incorrect becasue unless he goes out in hangtown and beats the stage by 3 plus minutes that comment he made about the honda is invalid

what would have made this all better is the fact that if kenny was here tomac wouldn't be of any discussion. Roczen would been all the discussion. And tomac woulda been about arm pump. And his keys to sx about arm pump.
Roczen looked unbeatable on the Suzuki in MX. After watching MEC, I thought SX wasn't going to be a Roczen runaway. He looked beatable. Dungey was running with Ken. We all sadly know how close Dungey is to Tomac at this point. Tomac is on a completely different level right now compared to the start of the season. He is riding his Kawie like it's BMX bike. Unfortunately none of us will ever know for sure but I think Ken would have had to found a lot more to compete with Eli' s current speed.
Tomac like everyone else is entitled to an opinion. I don't think it's irrelevant or incorrect unless he's lying.
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kiwifan 4/29/2017 12:08am
4/29/2017 12:08am
blackdiamond wrote:
I don't remember Eli crashing that much on the Honda? Obviously the one in Lakewood was a game changer but that doesn't define that season IMO...
I don't remember Eli crashing that much on the Honda? Obviously the one in Lakewood was a game changer but that doesn't define that season IMO.

Let's wait and see if he can win Hangtown by a minute and a half on the Kawi and then ask the same question?
yup, I agree BD

Look the fact is that some factory riders WERE struggling with the Honda from 12/13 to 15 (yet still getting good results..not great but good)....HRC then got involved much more seriously in 16....so I bet IF Honda settings/management/whatever was the issue then, it sure as heck wouldn't be an issue now.
blackdiamond
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blackdiamond 4/29/2017 1:21am
4/29/2017 1:21am
kiwifan wrote:
yup, I agree BD Look the fact is that some factory riders WERE struggling with the Honda from 12/13 to 15 (yet still getting good results..not...
yup, I agree BD

Look the fact is that some factory riders WERE struggling with the Honda from 12/13 to 15 (yet still getting good results..not great but good)....HRC then got involved much more seriously in 16....so I bet IF Honda settings/management/whatever was the issue then, it sure as heck wouldn't be an issue now.
I think you nailed it, 100%
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Crush 4/29/2017 3:21am
4/29/2017 3:21am Edited Date/Time 4/29/2017 3:24am
Well, what would you say?

And as much as he was going mach 9 on it, there were a good amount of of "Eli doesn't like his bike rumours", suspension swaps, balance issues etc, before the end of SX in 15 when he seemed to be getting it together... but he was washing the front, there were a few races where he literally had wash outs battling with Dungey.

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TMessi111 4/29/2017 5:01am
4/29/2017 5:01am
Even if some of us have liked the Honda we haven't pushed it anywhere near Tomac's level. This also has nothing to do with Ken or the 17 Honda. This is all about Eli and the 15. I'm sick of hearing about how Roczen would be winning because it's taking away from what Eli has been doing. All last summer and the summer before anyone could have said the same thing about Dungey winning and Ken winning outdoors. If Eli wouldn't have gotten hurt he would have ran away with the outdoors. Well he did get hurt. So did Ken and there's no way to say if either could've continued on the pace they were on early in the respective championships.
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philG 4/29/2017 5:35am
4/29/2017 5:35am
There are riders who dont need to crash to find the limit, and those that do..Tomac yarding the field and then crashing while doing it was down to him IMO... if he is going the same , or similar speed as everyone else, and it happens, fair enough, if you are hitting stuff with no room for error , and it gets away from you , you cant call the bike.
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tcallahan707 4/29/2017 5:43am
4/29/2017 5:43am
philG wrote:
There are riders who dont need to crash to find the limit, and those that do..Tomac yarding the field and then crashing while doing it was...
There are riders who dont need to crash to find the limit, and those that do..Tomac yarding the field and then crashing while doing it was down to him IMO... if he is going the same , or similar speed as everyone else, and it happens, fair enough, if you are hitting stuff with no room for error , and it gets away from you , you cant call the bike.
Exactly.
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resetjet 4/29/2017 5:52am
4/29/2017 5:52am
If you ask me, a factory team can do just about anything to a bike. So to blame the bike is lame. When you are riding good the bike u are on is great. When riding bad its the bikes fault.
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kkawboy14 4/29/2017 6:00am
4/29/2017 6:00am
Seeley seems to be struggling more this year......
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Mx286 4/29/2017 6:48am
4/29/2017 6:48am
Mx286 wrote:
I've heard that Honda gives them settings to run, not so much letting the rider set the bike up. I mean I'm sure they let them...
I've heard that Honda gives them settings to run, not so much letting the rider set the bike up. I mean I'm sure they let them get it to their liking, but more so here's the settings you can win with this here you go.
ed921reyes wrote:
Where would you hear somethin like this? Figure it would be something more geared towards Kawi? With them winning so much I remember hearing on pulp...
Where would you hear somethin like this? Figure it would be something more geared towards Kawi? With them winning so much I remember hearing on pulp and reading that tomac was given rv setting and that to not go to far from his setup? Didn't tomac take a suspension guy with him and him leave because of that?
tcallahan707 wrote:
Ding ding ding.
Hate to be the one to say "I know a guy," but I do know a guy "in the know" and he told me this. And yea Kawasaki is bad about that, hence the Weimer comments.
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Louie112 4/29/2017 8:00am
4/29/2017 8:00am
ed921reyes wrote:
Where would you hear somethin like this? Figure it would be something more geared towards Kawi? With them winning so much I remember hearing on pulp...
Where would you hear somethin like this? Figure it would be something more geared towards Kawi? With them winning so much I remember hearing on pulp and reading that tomac was given rv setting and that to not go to far from his setup? Didn't tomac take a suspension guy with him and him leave because of that?
tcallahan707 wrote:
Ding ding ding.
Mx286 wrote:
Hate to be the one to say "I know a guy," but I do know a guy "in the know" and he told me this. And...
Hate to be the one to say "I know a guy," but I do know a guy "in the know" and he told me this. And yea Kawasaki is bad about that, hence the Weimer comments.
I've read this a couple times and it kind of confuses me. It is in the manufacturer's best interest to have a comfortable rider that can put in better results, no?
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tcallahan707 4/29/2017 8:23am
4/29/2017 8:23am
tcallahan707 wrote:
Ding ding ding.
Mx286 wrote:
Hate to be the one to say "I know a guy," but I do know a guy "in the know" and he told me this. And...
Hate to be the one to say "I know a guy," but I do know a guy "in the know" and he told me this. And yea Kawasaki is bad about that, hence the Weimer comments.
Louie112 wrote:
I've read this a couple times and it kind of confuses me. It is in the manufacturer's best interest to have a comfortable rider that can...
I've read this a couple times and it kind of confuses me. It is in the manufacturer's best interest to have a comfortable rider that can put in better results, no?
You'd think, but it doesn't make it true.

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