Who Thinks Supercross Needs Some Changes & If So What?

mx836
Posts
5577
Joined
4/2/2008
Location
;, BF
1/28/2017 7:52am Edited Date/Time 1/28/2017 8:11am
kaptkaos wrote:
Yeah, SX needs more than 2 elite riders. BOOM! Ship them in from Europe or Mars, just find them. Historically its always been like this. MC...
Yeah, SX needs more than 2 elite riders. BOOM!

Ship them in from Europe or Mars, just find them.

Historically its always been like this. MC was a one man show, RC vs JS, JS vs CR, RV another one man show, RD vs KR is our current situation.

I guess the sport can only afford two elite riders at one time?
With a sport as difficult and dangerous as MX, guys seem to find their place and stay there consistently. It is quite strange the way it works out, but that's just the way it is. One or two guys are always clearly better than the rest. It's mental at the speeds they are going and with the injuries that they are susceptible to.
Phantom 661
Posts
717
Joined
2/7/2013
Location
Torrance, CA, USA
1/28/2017 8:08am
mx836 wrote:
[img]https://thumbs.dreamstime.com/z/piles-dirt-700358.jpg[/img]
I see lots of potential here.
kkawboy14
Posts
11486
Joined
6/5/2015
Location
USA
1/28/2017 8:26am
Move it outside on natural terrain tracks with 2 strokes only......
akillerwombat
Posts
3211
Joined
10/16/2013
Location
Los Angeles, CA, USA
1/28/2017 8:27am Edited Date/Time 1/28/2017 8:28am
Gotta love it; a board filled with people that lose their shit when Friese is ahead of the points leaders and rides a wide bike thinks the best idea we have is to force the top guys to start behind the same people we have problems with them passing.

I truly believe nothing is going to fix the weekly racing and after the first few weeks (A1 aside) do we really need to? Watching Dungey and Roczen battle to the last lap was awesome and had Roczen not crashed I'm sure last week would have been a fun race as well. The problem with Supercross is that our sport has always been about one or two people and we have convinced ourselves that by changing the track, or changing it from one main to two, or reversing the gate that it will somehow level the playing field that allows those two people to shine. It won't.

The biggest problem with Supercross is how rapidly the points system declares the top 3 guy(s) who are going to walk away with the championship, quickly followed up by the top 2, then declaring the champion before we even get to our final race(s). This dramatically lowers the excitement towards the end of the season when we as fans should be at our most hyped. Honestly, how many years in a row do we see people opting to sit out, start prepping for outdoors, and cruising come the last 2 - 3 races of the year because they have zero shot at a title? As a fan it sucks. I watch all of my friends go nuts over the Superbowl (I'm a Chargers fan – I get little excitement in that world), the World Series (Padres fan – again, little excitement), the Stanley Cup, etc. and here I am come Vegas telling them how our sport likes to blow it's excitement load the first race(s) of the season then we all start counting down the days till the first day of outdoors.

This is why I am up for trying a playoff "chase" system in which riders have their points reset with respect for their current position in the "regular season" with 5-6 races left. IE, first in the regular season gives you 10 points in the reset, second 9, third 8, etc. which is essentially what we do every weekend (but stretched out into a season long night show). I know everyone is going to say, "it's not fair", "it punishes the fast guys", "what happens with Noren gets on a heater and beats Dungey", "you gotta be there every weekend to win", etc. but I think it would be an interesting thing to try out. Weekly purse money, pride, and (still) points would push the riders to win during the regular season but play it a little safe to not blow themselves out in the early weeks. Then come the "play offs" we would potentially see a war between a group of 4-5 riders instead of 1-2, warmed up from several weeks of racing, going at it for the championship.

Is a play off system as pure as it is now, no, but it's far more exciting and in my mind an equally fair way to prove who is the best while rewarding the fans for the entire season. Everyone will know the system going into the season, it won't punish people who have a bad race early nearly as bad as it does now (like everyone suggesting a throw away race or two), you won't have any crazy Championship winner surprises at the end because they would have to beat Roczen, Dungey, etc. for 5-6 races, etc.

The Shop

kkawboy14
Posts
11486
Joined
6/5/2015
Location
USA
1/28/2017 8:32am
Gotta love it; a board filled with people that lose their shit when Friese is ahead of the points leaders and rides a wide bike thinks...
Gotta love it; a board filled with people that lose their shit when Friese is ahead of the points leaders and rides a wide bike thinks the best idea we have is to force the top guys to start behind the same people we have problems with them passing.

I truly believe nothing is going to fix the weekly racing and after the first few weeks (A1 aside) do we really need to? Watching Dungey and Roczen battle to the last lap was awesome and had Roczen not crashed I'm sure last week would have been a fun race as well. The problem with Supercross is that our sport has always been about one or two people and we have convinced ourselves that by changing the track, or changing it from one main to two, or reversing the gate that it will somehow level the playing field that allows those two people to shine. It won't.

The biggest problem with Supercross is how rapidly the points system declares the top 3 guy(s) who are going to walk away with the championship, quickly followed up by the top 2, then declaring the champion before we even get to our final race(s). This dramatically lowers the excitement towards the end of the season when we as fans should be at our most hyped. Honestly, how many years in a row do we see people opting to sit out, start prepping for outdoors, and cruising come the last 2 - 3 races of the year because they have zero shot at a title? As a fan it sucks. I watch all of my friends go nuts over the Superbowl (I'm a Chargers fan – I get little excitement in that world), the World Series (Padres fan – again, little excitement), the Stanley Cup, etc. and here I am come Vegas telling them how our sport likes to blow it's excitement load the first race(s) of the season then we all start counting down the days till the first day of outdoors.

This is why I am up for trying a playoff "chase" system in which riders have their points reset with respect for their current position in the "regular season" with 5-6 races left. IE, first in the regular season gives you 10 points in the reset, second 9, third 8, etc. which is essentially what we do every weekend (but stretched out into a season long night show). I know everyone is going to say, "it's not fair", "it punishes the fast guys", "what happens with Noren gets on a heater and beats Dungey", "you gotta be there every weekend to win", etc. but I think it would be an interesting thing to try out. Weekly purse money, pride, and (still) points would push the riders to win during the regular season but play it a little safe to not blow themselves out in the early weeks. Then come the "play offs" we would potentially see a war between a group of 4-5 riders instead of 1-2, warmed up from several weeks of racing, going at it for the championship.

Is a play off system as pure as it is now, no, but it's far more exciting and in my mind an equally fair way to prove who is the best while rewarding the fans for the entire season. Everyone will know the system going into the season, it won't punish people who have a bad race early nearly as bad as it does now (like everyone suggesting a throw away race or two), you won't have any crazy Championship winner surprises at the end because they would have to beat Roczen, Dungey, etc. for 5-6 races, etc.

Not a board filled with.......that's like 5 guys that ride quads and race Barbie cars downhill running their mouths!
wfo4ever
Posts
789
Joined
8/3/2014
Location
USA
1/28/2017 8:33am
Electro21 wrote:
Use paragraphs.
Sorry about that. I am on pain pills after a surgery, and wrote this post late last night. I apologize to all forum members. Surgery was not dirt bike related. Carry on...
Jamal#440
Posts
273
Joined
12/23/2016
Location
USA
1/28/2017 9:06am
Nothing has to be changed anymore than was changed 10 years back
Just simply go back to the challenging tracks from before that time.
Jamal#440
Posts
273
Joined
12/23/2016
Location
USA
1/28/2017 9:18am
Quit this Rythm-cross BS and simply go back to SUPERCROSS
The race action was better and attendance numbers were great.
mx836
Posts
5577
Joined
4/2/2008
Location
;, BF
1/28/2017 9:22am
Gotta love it; a board filled with people that lose their shit when Friese is ahead of the points leaders and rides a wide bike thinks...
Gotta love it; a board filled with people that lose their shit when Friese is ahead of the points leaders and rides a wide bike thinks the best idea we have is to force the top guys to start behind the same people we have problems with them passing.

I truly believe nothing is going to fix the weekly racing and after the first few weeks (A1 aside) do we really need to? Watching Dungey and Roczen battle to the last lap was awesome and had Roczen not crashed I'm sure last week would have been a fun race as well. The problem with Supercross is that our sport has always been about one or two people and we have convinced ourselves that by changing the track, or changing it from one main to two, or reversing the gate that it will somehow level the playing field that allows those two people to shine. It won't.

The biggest problem with Supercross is how rapidly the points system declares the top 3 guy(s) who are going to walk away with the championship, quickly followed up by the top 2, then declaring the champion before we even get to our final race(s). This dramatically lowers the excitement towards the end of the season when we as fans should be at our most hyped. Honestly, how many years in a row do we see people opting to sit out, start prepping for outdoors, and cruising come the last 2 - 3 races of the year because they have zero shot at a title? As a fan it sucks. I watch all of my friends go nuts over the Superbowl (I'm a Chargers fan – I get little excitement in that world), the World Series (Padres fan – again, little excitement), the Stanley Cup, etc. and here I am come Vegas telling them how our sport likes to blow it's excitement load the first race(s) of the season then we all start counting down the days till the first day of outdoors.

This is why I am up for trying a playoff "chase" system in which riders have their points reset with respect for their current position in the "regular season" with 5-6 races left. IE, first in the regular season gives you 10 points in the reset, second 9, third 8, etc. which is essentially what we do every weekend (but stretched out into a season long night show). I know everyone is going to say, "it's not fair", "it punishes the fast guys", "what happens with Noren gets on a heater and beats Dungey", "you gotta be there every weekend to win", etc. but I think it would be an interesting thing to try out. Weekly purse money, pride, and (still) points would push the riders to win during the regular season but play it a little safe to not blow themselves out in the early weeks. Then come the "play offs" we would potentially see a war between a group of 4-5 riders instead of 1-2, warmed up from several weeks of racing, going at it for the championship.

Is a play off system as pure as it is now, no, but it's far more exciting and in my mind an equally fair way to prove who is the best while rewarding the fans for the entire season. Everyone will know the system going into the season, it won't punish people who have a bad race early nearly as bad as it does now (like everyone suggesting a throw away race or two), you won't have any crazy Championship winner surprises at the end because they would have to beat Roczen, Dungey, etc. for 5-6 races, etc.

Totally agree about the points issue. No need for a gap at the top of the finishing positions. Make mistakes more critical and you will have a closer championship. Guys are way more consistent since the point structure was set way back when and the machinery is way more reliable as well. They should have done away with that decades ago.
1/28/2017 9:32am Edited Date/Time 1/28/2017 9:33am
kkawboy14 wrote:
Move it outside on natural terrain tracks with 2 strokes only......
That's it. Kill it. Because it sucks and always has sucked. I don't give a rat's ass if it makes money for Feld.

What's more, it's done long-term damage to the perception of the sport. I can't even tell my friends that I watch motocross (meaning MXGP and real AMA Motocross), because they immediately think Supercross, which they equate with X-Games, Monster Trucks and NASCAR. It's just humiliating to be associated with any of that. (And some people want a "chase"; shocker.) Supercross is just an embarrassment, and its primary purpose seems to be to cause injuries that interfere with the outdoor season.

Kill Supercross and expand the outdoor season to 18 or so rounds (some of which would cross over with MXGP). Problem fucking solved.
mx617
Posts
1622
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Trail, CA
1/28/2017 9:36am
I like the idea of inverted picks for the mains. Also need to slow things down, be that bikes or track design (or more likely a combo of.both).

Here's something else that everyone goes on about is the pay of the lower placed riders. I think the TV broadcast needs to do a better job of naming sponsors. Of all riders, but in particular those 10-20 placed riders. Even having a scrolling bar across the bottom of the screen would be great.

At this level they're rolling billboards, and a little better job on sponsor mentions will help that. Also why we can't get rid of the semis, heats, and lcqs. Would eliminate any benefit to sponsors of anyone outside the top 20.

The Canadian Nationals do a pretty good job of it, and there's some great battles back there to be shown.

Now just to be clear I'm not suggesting cut away from a battle for the lead to show the 18/19 place race. But if Dungey has a 30 second lead let's show something interesting. And just talk about the guys who are paying the bills, in addition to the ones who build the bikes.
1/28/2017 2:54pm
As mentioned, the RACING needs punching up, and that means an evolution (or de-evolution) in the tracks. Each track should only have one rhythm lane, and the rest of its length is berms and ruts, turns with multiple lines, hip jumps, style jumps, multiple over-unders (store them with the dirt), etc. Like the Charlotte track. With only one rhythm lane you can move the dirt around for other cool things.

I'm kind of tired of bowl turns and the "racing" they inspire. So you just take the shorter line right to the exit of the turn and cut in front of your opponent? Brilliant.

Also, everyone should be required to double everything until a flag comes out, which would be some time after the first rhythm section & triple. Less carnage, and the leader(s) won't break away as much.

level
Posts
6184
Joined
8/27/2006
Location
Acworth, GA, USA
1/28/2017 4:32pm
450 is too much bike. You see so many 250f riders fall on there face on that big machine almost to never be heard from again in 3 years.

The 250f though they up the horsepower tremendously but the bike is more manageable.

I really don't know what the answer is for injuries. There is not much room for error on those huge steep jumps. Only thing I can think of is totally rethink track design and get rid of the 450 class.
kkawboy14
Posts
11486
Joined
6/5/2015
Location
USA
1/28/2017 4:36pm
If your gonna leave it indoors, make the finish line jump 10' bigger and the triples 10' bigger with 2 single to flat landers
kyoshi
Posts
5
Joined
3/9/2012
Location
Palmdale, CA, USA
1/28/2017 4:57pm
"Invert the gate pick order for the mains"- Remember the Rodil cup

1/28/2017 5:02pm
I think the tracks need to be tamed down a little. Hopefully reduce some injuries.
SlowMoFo
Posts
1539
Joined
4/17/2008
Location
USA
1/28/2017 5:02pm
Add a 125 class!
oshow
Posts
4083
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
USA
1/28/2017 5:08pm
3 day event again
Fri practice/ press day
Sat- Race
Sunday- Amature Day

norcal racer
Posts
289
Joined
1/31/2016
Location
Stockton, CA, USA
1/28/2017 5:34pm
250's. Or have Charlotte GP style racing instead. That was good racing
MotoX85
Posts
2198
Joined
10/9/2011
Location
Centralia, IL, USA
1/28/2017 5:35pm
Go back to indoor motocross and get rid of do or die cross.
hillbilly
Posts
9079
Joined
8/16/2006
Location
Afton, TN, USA
1/28/2017 5:41pm
I think these guys like it,

I mean,nobody forces them to do this stuff. They could just say to dangerous and go home.

Why dont they?
jj welks
Posts
712
Joined
5/14/2015
Location
USA
1/28/2017 5:42pm Edited Date/Time 1/28/2017 5:43pm
Changes? Needs to go away...MOAR OUTDOORS!!!
Brosho
Posts
481
Joined
1/31/2011
Location
Los Angeles, CA, USA
1/28/2017 6:58pm Edited Date/Time 1/28/2017 7:05pm
I agree make the premier class 250 4 strokes and bring back the 125 2 strokes.

If there series is 17 races, Score only 14 of the races. Let them drop their 3 worse races, or if they get hurt by dropping 3 races points, they can have up to 4 weeks to heal and maybe more if there is a bye week race one of those weeks. This way when they come back from injury they will still be in the points hunt for the championship, and will battle to win instead of just satisfying their sponsors by racing.

If a rider do not miss any of the 17 races, let him earn 3 points which he can carry over to the beginning of the next season. This way riders will less likely avoid tracks they do not like (for example Daytona) and it helps to sell tickets knowing that top rider will not sit out that race just for the heck of it.

Also give the riders more weekends off, if they have to hold more supercross races at outdoor race tracks like Daytona to make it happen then so be it. This way more cities that do not get races can get a race, even though their football or baseball stadium is not available.

Also the promotors need to promote more of the Riders instead of just the top 5 riders. All the riders who are making the nights mains should get equal exposure on tv as the top 5 guys do.

1/29/2017 10:27am
Next year have MX vs Atv install a track simulator and have the fans design the tracks based off their ideas. Feld picks the best track and showcases the designer on the Kawasaki track map each week riding their track, plus an additional 2 tickets for the live viewing of your submission.
mx617
Posts
1622
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Trail, CA
7/17/2017 11:39pm
I know there's about a dozen of these SX format change threads going so I just picked one to dig up.

Comments from the FXR interview on Racer X:

"The riders in supercross who are making the mains through the LCQs, we get a lot of great TV time out of that."

I don't think you can just focus on the top 3 or top 5 and expect to maintain a healthy sport. Gotta have coverage for those that fill the gate.

Also I can't find the post, but there was a rider who posted on Twitter about making more in a local fair race than making the main at a supercross. Yes Feld is a business and cares about making money, but they have to look at making money for the next 20-30 years, not just the next 2-3.
7/17/2017 11:55pm Edited Date/Time 7/17/2017 11:56pm
mx617 wrote:
I know there's about a dozen of these SX format change threads going so I just picked one to dig up. Comments from the FXR interview...
I know there's about a dozen of these SX format change threads going so I just picked one to dig up.

Comments from the FXR interview on Racer X:

"The riders in supercross who are making the mains through the LCQs, we get a lot of great TV time out of that."

I don't think you can just focus on the top 3 or top 5 and expect to maintain a healthy sport. Gotta have coverage for those that fill the gate.

Also I can't find the post, but there was a rider who posted on Twitter about making more in a local fair race than making the main at a supercross. Yes Feld is a business and cares about making money, but they have to look at making money for the next 20-30 years, not just the next 2-3.
The rider who makes more money racing local fair races, wins the local fair races,but when he goes to a National SX he might make the night program but will be so far off the pace that he is a non factor. Its a viscous cycle. Some times its better to big the big fish in a small pond.
don'tknowwhy
Posts
529
Joined
7/15/2015
Location
North Las Vegas, NV, USA
7/18/2017 12:49am
1983? Anaheim SX commercial

More awesome water holes!!! See the link.

The Coca-Cola Catapult

The Wrangler Grand National Championship



Seriously, maybe a mandatory pit stop where thier mechanic has to change out the back wheel without any custom made quick release hubs or anything like that unless its OEM supplied. Might sound cheesy or too much like the Jokers lane but something that brings out more of the team and not just the rider...... If carefully done so as not to appear as a idea from the tv production crew might be interesting while demonstrating more of the team aspect and might result in some neat tricks added to production bikes to boot.
Acidreamer
Posts
1793
Joined
8/25/2015
Location
Mansfield, OH, USA
7/18/2017 2:48am
It isnt broken dont fix it. The only thing id change is miss supercross. Shes still kinda cringey. But that whole deal is so minor really. *handflip
kkawboy14
Posts
11486
Joined
6/5/2015
Location
USA
7/18/2017 2:50am
Acidreamer wrote:
It isnt broken dont fix it. The only thing id change is miss supercross. Shes still kinda cringey. But that whole deal is so minor really...
It isnt broken dont fix it. The only thing id change is miss supercross. Shes still kinda cringey. But that whole deal is so minor really. *handflip
Diana Dahlgren was doing the XGames Smile

Post a reply to: Who Thinks Supercross Needs Some Changes & If So What?

The Latest