Does it really take 17 rounds to decide this thing?

1/18/2016 10:36pm Edited Date/Time 1/18/2016 10:37pm
The series is in danger of being turned into a parody two races in by what suddenly looks to be a lack of parity.
I don't understand your point. You just seem to be parroting what everyone else already has been saying. Laughing
RG1
Posts
4661
Joined
7/12/2015
Location
GB
1/19/2016 3:27am
We're 2 rounds in for crying out loud, how can so many people have given up on the series already? There's nothing wrong with it
1/19/2016 4:11am
To me, resetting points or having a points chase lessens the value and prestige of a championship series. Let the guys earn it, let injuries and bad nights come into play, let the champion be a champion.....
Olson
Posts
4605
Joined
4/14/2012
Location
SE
1/19/2016 4:36am
Nothing wrong with the series. The "problem" is some riders take it to the next level, MC, Ricky, Villopoto and now Dungey. But it's just 2 races in. 17 rounds makes it possible for someone to step their game up or Dungey to make a misstake. "There's a reason they race all the rounds." (Feel like I should quote Gibby here?)

The Shop

1/19/2016 5:04am Edited Date/Time 1/19/2016 5:08am
No changes needed in my opinion.

If you really want a close batlle for the championship most every year in the end though, give every rider two or three "throwaway" rounds.


Woohoo Woohoo

Edit - And watch the team tactics come into play.
74
Posts
436
Joined
1/16/2013
Location
FI
1/19/2016 5:26am
Reset the points last three rounds. Invert the field. Random gate picks. Actual live gator pits. Mandatory backflip before the completion of the race. On lap...
Reset the points last three rounds. Invert the field. Random gate picks. Actual live gator pits. Mandatory backflip before the completion of the race. On lap seven take someone out then the winner of the best down continues to Lap 8. Change two tires and get some fuel on lap 19.
All this is great. Just add riding the track backwards every 4th lap. And refueling on lap 19 is of course done while riding, mechanic riding a tank-bike.
KMC440
Posts
7764
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
US
1/19/2016 5:29am
Beer a lap.

It's so obvious.
71Fish
Posts
1794
Joined
11/29/2011
Location
Ogden, UT US
1/19/2016 5:36am
Right, 17 is too many. Just one race is all they need, on showroom bikes.
jeffro503
Posts
27629
Joined
7/22/2007
Location
St Helens, OR US
1/19/2016 5:44am
I sure wouldn't mind a two moto format. Like two - 12 lap mains or something like that. It's really hard to make any " safe " suggestions. Sometimes the races get pretty boring , but for boring races , SX seems to take out more riders than the MX season.

I do think we need something to spice things up a bit.
ToolMaker
Posts
9334
Joined
11/19/2011
Location
Escondido, CA US
Fantasy
1/19/2016 7:01am
jeffro503 wrote:
I sure wouldn't mind a two moto format. Like two - 12 lap mains or something like that. It's really hard to make any " safe...
I sure wouldn't mind a two moto format. Like two - 12 lap mains or something like that. It's really hard to make any " safe " suggestions. Sometimes the races get pretty boring , but for boring races , SX seems to take out more riders than the MX season.

I do think we need something to spice things up a bit.
The thing I don't like about that, the race is then so dependent on the start. Bad start and not enough time to recover.
Also, as much as people like to complain about the lappers, it adds an element to the racing closing up the gap up front. Less laps and there's another element gone.
And for anyone that is going to complain about the lappers, If we really wanted to get rid of them, you could just implement a rule that anyone who falls 30 seconds back of leader gets a flag to get off the track.
hvaughn88
Posts
8361
Joined
6/19/2013
Location
Conway, AR US
1/19/2016 7:05am
Too many, shit, I wish moto and sx were 25 rounds each, haha.
mxb2
Posts
22437
Joined
6/15/2010
Location
Bowie, MD US
1/19/2016 7:06am
RG1 wrote:
We're 2 rounds in for crying out loud, how can so many people have given up on the series already? There's nothing wrong with it
X2,
motoman617
Posts
617
Joined
6/10/2012
Location
Camarillo, CA US
1/19/2016 7:44am
Last year everybody thought Roczen was going to run away with it after a few rounds. Look how that turned out. Two rounds in and any of the fast guys can figure something out and get in a groove any time going forward. Series is still new. Enjoy the show. Football starts winding down and Supercross takes over.
Grieby54
Posts
2826
Joined
7/1/2008
Location
Castle Rock, CO US
1/19/2016 7:48am
bob567 wrote:
I can't wait for Tomac, Roczen, Stewart, Reed, etc to start ripping off wins week after week but what if they don't? 17 rounds seems pretty...
I can't wait for Tomac, Roczen, Stewart, Reed, etc to start ripping off wins week after week but what if they don't? 17 rounds seems pretty excessive. If it was a shorter season the Dungey concept would apply less and maybe make for more aggressive racing. Maybe not. Just hoping for more parody at the front of the pack.
I'm confused as to why you left Dungey out of the list of riders that will start ripping off wins week after week, and further confused by you insinuating that the "Dungey concept" is not aggressive racing. Have you watched Dungey at all this year or last? The dude won 8 mains last year, I believe. In case you haven't noticed, Dungey has also had to make more than a handful of passes the past two weeks and he has done so without hesitation.
FreshTopEnd
Posts
12989
Joined
8/16/2006
Location
Sacramento, CA US
1/19/2016 8:26am Edited Date/Time 1/19/2016 8:27am
If it's "over" after two rounds, it's only because someone is a lot better and/or someone is hurt. I wish there was a way to eliminate injury, and folks always should think about how to minimize unnecessary risk in a sport that has some pretty harsh inherent risks, but I don't go for skewing the rules too much to penalize the guy who had it together.
Jordan421
Posts
1910
Joined
12/5/2007
Location
Lakeland, FL US
1/19/2016 8:47am
Watch the first 2 rounds, go off the grid for rounds 3-16, and then come back for the final round. Then complain the next week why the nationals are only 12 weeks and not longer...
Roostermx58
Posts
1539
Joined
9/18/2013
Location
Wilmington, NC US
1/19/2016 9:06am
jeffro503 wrote:
I sure wouldn't mind a two moto format. Like two - 12 lap mains or something like that. It's really hard to make any " safe...
I sure wouldn't mind a two moto format. Like two - 12 lap mains or something like that. It's really hard to make any " safe " suggestions. Sometimes the races get pretty boring , but for boring races , SX seems to take out more riders than the MX season.

I do think we need something to spice things up a bit.
Agreed. 20 Laps is rather long and when the leader is pulling each lap, it gets boring IMHO. 2 mains is a great idea, just like AX. The inverted start is an idea too.
stangkag
Posts
1407
Joined
9/28/2011
Location
Maybell, CO US
1/19/2016 9:22am
Id say 17 races is more important now than ever before with the stacked field the way it is. This year I bet we have alot more winners than last year..Top 10 could win on any given night, I cant remember a time this statement would have been true in the past.

Ill take as much racing as I can get if it involves a dirtbike, I dont care if its SX,MX, Straight Rhythm, MXDN...Its all great and Ill never hope for less of it... The offseason kills me as it is as a huge fan
Motodave15
Posts
4252
Joined
8/7/2010
Location
Temple City, CA US
1/19/2016 10:11am
You want parity.

Grid starts, on the start straight (main event only).. im up for that.

since they want to keep timed qualifying so damn much.... stop making the start such a gamble and let them all go in rows of 5

with a grid start, you can officially work a strategy into the race.. based on angles of the first turn and such. which could then alter first turn designs.

but the status quo bangers, want the gate drop just to be a timing wfo drag race. at somepoint something has to give
Zycki11
Posts
7683
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Edwardsville, IL US
1/19/2016 10:20am
Motodave15 wrote:
You want parity. Grid starts, on the start straight (main event only).. im up for that. since they want to keep timed qualifying so damn much...
You want parity.

Grid starts, on the start straight (main event only).. im up for that.

since they want to keep timed qualifying so damn much.... stop making the start such a gamble and let them all go in rows of 5

with a grid start, you can officially work a strategy into the race.. based on angles of the first turn and such. which could then alter first turn designs.

but the status quo bangers, want the gate drop just to be a timing wfo drag race. at somepoint something has to give
This would inherently change moto from the roots up, and not for the better. Part of the excitement is the start, no matter how fast you ride one lap if a guy rips a holeshot or is a great starter similar to Friese, it adds a element that is not predicted. I for one never want the start to change, it is exciting and nerve racking as hell. Besides, nothing feels better than getting a elbow under your bud off the start. Evil
RG1
Posts
4661
Joined
7/12/2015
Location
GB
1/19/2016 10:24am
Motodave15 wrote:
You want parity. Grid starts, on the start straight (main event only).. im up for that. since they want to keep timed qualifying so damn much...
You want parity.

Grid starts, on the start straight (main event only).. im up for that.

since they want to keep timed qualifying so damn much.... stop making the start such a gamble and let them all go in rows of 5

with a grid start, you can officially work a strategy into the race.. based on angles of the first turn and such. which could then alter first turn designs.

but the status quo bangers, want the gate drop just to be a timing wfo drag race. at somepoint something has to give
The start isn't a gamble. If you get a bad start it's not bad luck, you just didn't execute your start properly. Starting is a vital part of the race, and you can practice it and improve at it. I wish people would stop looking at the starts as an absolute lottery
1/19/2016 10:42am
bvm111 wrote:
For the life of me I don't understand the reset the points ideas.... So all the hard work for the past 3 months gets erased? Can...
For the life of me I don't understand the reset the points ideas.... So all the hard work for the past 3 months gets erased?

Can someone rationally explain this to me that would make sense?
The British Superbike Championship sort of resets the points. Basically at a certain point towards the end of the series the top 6 in points all get boosted to 500 points, essentially making it impossible for anyone outside the top 6 to win the championship. Throughout the first part of the season all riders earn 'podium credits' for finishing on the podium, obviously a 1st gets more credits than a 3rd. These credits then get added to their 500 points. Rather than settling for a 4th and getting no podium credits, this causes riders to really push and try and get on the podium to get the all important credits incase they make it through to the top 6. There are then 3 races left in the season after the 6 shootout riders have been confirmed.

Not everyone is a fan of the system because a rider could dominate the entire series up to the shootout, then get their points reset to 500+credits and then have 3 terrible performances/crashes/bad luck at the last 3 rounds and lose the championship that they dominated most of. What it does do, however, is add a lot more excitement, firstly you have the battle to be one of the all important top 6, and then you have a close battle for the championship during the last 3 rounds rather than a winner being crowned early, as often happens in other racing series.

It caused the 2011 championship to be decided on the last corner of the last lap of the last race of the season. Well worth a watch.

ChrisB10
Posts
2082
Joined
5/24/2014
Location
Plattsburgh, NY US
1/19/2016 10:51am
For such a dangerous sport 17 is too much. 16 is too much for NFL and imo sx us more dangerous. Then they have to go to 10 rounds outdoors. ...the season is way too long. I don't blame guys for skipping outdoors at all
1/19/2016 10:57am
two races into the series and this is what i learned on vital.

dungey is the champion
no one can hang with him
its over, bring on the outdoors
we need to rewrite the rule book because football has playoffs
dungey is burned out
dungey is on PEDs
dungey wants to start a family
suzukis are junk
suzukis are cursed
RCH sucks
roczen is just counting the days until he goes to hrc
aldon baker is awesome
aldon baker is evil and sacrifices orphans by tossing them into the sun
barcia is flaccid
if barcia does it, its dirty
if anyone else does it, its aggressive.

The Rock
Posts
8758
Joined
3/21/2007
Location
HAIKU, HI US
1/19/2016 10:59am
FWYT wrote:
Bring on the Outdoors!!! Smile
Usually by Daytona I am saying that.
The Rock
Posts
8758
Joined
3/21/2007
Location
HAIKU, HI US
1/19/2016 11:02am Edited Date/Time 1/19/2016 11:03am
ChrisB10 wrote:
For such a dangerous sport 17 is too much. 16 is too much for NFL and imo sx us more dangerous. Then they have to go...
For such a dangerous sport 17 is too much. 16 is too much for NFL and imo sx us more dangerous. Then they have to go to 10 rounds outdoors. ...the season is way too long. I don't blame guys for skipping outdoors at all
1) Total fail IMHO. If you have any big boy undies you should put them on before posting again. :-)

2) Skip outdoors? Yeah let's fall further behind the Euros at the MXoN who race 17 world championship MX rounds.
Sandberm
Posts
5845
Joined
3/27/2009
Location
Pasco, WA US
1/19/2016 11:21am
Top 7 was the same riders at each of the first two rounds. Theres 7 guys who can win, an win races in a row an make up points in chunks.

bh84
Posts
1750
Joined
8/20/2012
Location
Peterborough , ON CA
1/19/2016 11:30am
lol, 16 games a season is "too much" for the NFL, meanwhile the NHL runs an 82 game schedule plus the potential for 28 playoff games.
Mit12
Posts
2173
Joined
6/23/2014
Location
Lake Havasu City, AZ US
1/19/2016 11:31am
Olson wrote:
Nothing wrong with the series. The "problem" is some riders take it to the next level, MC, Ricky, Villopoto and now Dungey. But it's just 2...
Nothing wrong with the series. The "problem" is some riders take it to the next level, MC, Ricky, Villopoto and now Dungey. But it's just 2 races in. 17 rounds makes it possible for someone to step their game up or Dungey to make a misstake. "There's a reason they race all the rounds." (Feel like I should quote Gibby here?)
I agree, the question should be why should the points system penalize the great to help the others? Next time you are at a SX race take a look at the people that fill the stands and ask yourself how many of the people there actualley care about the points or championship? Most are there to see the big crash.
Rdubs19
Posts
767
Joined
4/16/2014
Location
Little Rock, AR US
1/19/2016 11:34am
jeffro503 wrote:
I sure wouldn't mind a two moto format. Like two - 12 lap mains or something like that. It's really hard to make any " safe...
I sure wouldn't mind a two moto format. Like two - 12 lap mains or something like that. It's really hard to make any " safe " suggestions. Sometimes the races get pretty boring , but for boring races , SX seems to take out more riders than the MX season.

I do think we need something to spice things up a bit.
Five mains during the night show -
Mains 1, 3, 5 : 12 lap 450
Mains 2, 4: 10 lap 250
Intermission: 8 lap 125 two stroke

Maybe there could be extra points for sweeping all your mains, or some other gimmicky thing to add an extra layer of interest, or something else during intermission. But this framework, or something similar, is going to come one day, and I really always thought that was a pipe dream but it's talked about so much now among the fans that it just might happen. This format would also get far more people in the stands for day qualifying, I believe.

Post a reply to: Does it really take 17 rounds to decide this thing?

The Latest