Mountain Motorsports bait and switch scam!

hillbilly
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Afton, TN, USA
3/6/2015 7:15pm
jsmx198 wrote:
I work at a Honda dealership about an hour north of Atlanta. A smaller dealership with just one location. We sell all our units just above...
I work at a Honda dealership about an hour north of Atlanta. A smaller dealership with just one location. We sell all our units just above invoice with all the rebates that Honda offers. Our policy is to give you the best possible price with the hope of return business and the opportunity to service your new Honda. Our focus is on the service and repair side where many other dealerships focus on the front end retail sales aspect, they use the glitz and glam of a fancy show room floor to try and distract you and make you feel like you are apart of something important there.
Shops that blow bikes out for no profit are one big reason there is no money to be made selling dirt bikes, ESPECIALLY to racers.
If a shop is planning on making selling mx bikes they ain't going to make it.

Here they sell 10 or more quads to one dirtbike. Same with street bikes.

If they dont let that bike go at cost they will have it next year when the new improved model hits and then loose money.
Madc32
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Portland, OR, USA
Fantasy
3/6/2015 7:20pm
Drfletcher wrote:
I'm glad you posted this about Mountain Motorsports. I will be in the market for a new YZ450 this summer and I will stay away from...
I'm glad you posted this about Mountain Motorsports. I will be in the market for a new YZ450 this summer and I will stay away from them. Most of the time the smaller dealerships offer much better service and as always, cash is king.
I thought dealers would rather have you finance.
hillbilly
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Afton, TN, USA
3/6/2015 7:48pm
Motodork wrote:
Finally an American speaks
moscrop940 wrote:
what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I've ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response was there anything...
what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I've ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response was there anything that could even be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul
Motodork wrote:
Coming from someone that believes in santa claus, oh I mean god, you calling me an idiot is quite ironic. Should never bring religion or politics...
Coming from someone that believes in santa claus, oh I mean god, you calling me an idiot is quite ironic. Should never bring religion or politics in to any debate.
You have zero game,even the stupidest sums o bitches on the old ron ron board had more than the god post,damn.,what grade did you go to full time bong loader?
Brent
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Temecula, CA, USA
3/6/2015 8:18pm Edited Date/Time 3/6/2015 8:21pm
Motodork wrote:
Finally an American speaks
Motodork is a girl FYI.

Look, I get you worked at a dealership, but you have to understand that many people have been through shitty experiences when buying a dirt bike, Ive been through a couple myself ( thanks Roundy family, you fucks), and the inflated set up and bullshit fees are what drive most people crazy, at least in SoCal.

Go to Temecula Motorsports or Fun Bike Center or Chaparral and look at a tag on a bike and tell me 800 for set up is reasonable for a bike that needs the front wheel, fender, and bars put on.

Another poster was right, the back end rebates and hold backs from the manufacturer are paid to the dealer, so its not as if you are taking the bike from them for no profit.

Some dealers prefer to deal with their clients in a dishonest manner, but in my 34 years of buying bikes they are few and far between unfortunately. That is what gets most buyers pissed, lack of a honest or transparent transaction process.

Oddly enough I had to buy a bike from Altus in Oklahoma and get it shipped to SoCal to get a good price, still beat FBC by 1300 even with the shipping and tax.

The Shop

okieonayamaha
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Somewhere, OK, USA
3/6/2015 10:00pm
Altus and Chickasha in Oklahoma was always good on their over the phone prices. Both great groups of people to buy from each time I bought a bike from em
mxfiend
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Location
Riverside, CA, USA
3/6/2015 10:08pm
Shops that blow bikes out for no profit are one big reason there is no money to be made selling dirt bikes, ESPECIALLY to racers.
IWreckALot wrote:
I wonder why the manufacturers don't control the price. The bicycle industry has gone this direction and I like it. You get to buy the bike...
I wonder why the manufacturers don't control the price. The bicycle industry has gone this direction and I like it. You get to buy the bike from the shop you feel most comfortable with. And you know you didn't get ripped off any more than anyone else.
Berm wrote:
I believe it is illegal in every state for the manufacturer to force a dealer to sell at a certain price (resale price maintenance). It was...
I believe it is illegal in every state for the manufacturer to force a dealer to sell at a certain price (resale price maintenance). It was definitely illegal up until a court decision in 2007 but that decision changed so that each case will be handled separately (ie. if they do practice resale price maintenance, and are subsequently sued, they have to prove they had to do it to survive).

They can place rules on advertising prices but cannot force a dealer to sell at a specific price.

Many states also have very strict dealer laws (WI is one such state). The manufacturer can't force the price the dealer sells at, and more importantly, they can't drop a dealer for selling below MSRP.
No its not illegal pro taper just issued a map minimum advertized price so online only dealers who dont have overhead with employess and etc. Cant have a price .02 above cost
bigborefan
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Location
Urbana, IL, USA
3/6/2015 10:24pm
jsmx198 wrote:
I work at a Honda dealership about an hour north of Atlanta. A smaller dealership with just one location. We sell all our units just above...
I work at a Honda dealership about an hour north of Atlanta. A smaller dealership with just one location. We sell all our units just above invoice with all the rebates that Honda offers. Our policy is to give you the best possible price with the hope of return business and the opportunity to service your new Honda. Our focus is on the service and repair side where many other dealerships focus on the front end retail sales aspect, they use the glitz and glam of a fancy show room floor to try and distract you and make you feel like you are apart of something important there.
See, these guys get it. A dirt bike is a loss leader. Get em on the dirt bike, then sell em lots of dirt bike parts.

I rode KX-500s forever. And I seldom bought a new one. But I would do a major rebuild every summer. top end, clutch, bearings, cables, new plastic, the whole nine yards. I know AJAX Kawasaki probably made way more money of my rebuilds than they would of off selling me a new KX-500.

Plus, they always had a decent amount of accessories in stock. I was always buying goggles, air filters, grips, tires, etc.

These days, these multiline dealserhips, they have a million dollars worth or bikes on the floor, and no parts or accessories at all. It has the look and feel of a Chevy dealership. you just know your getting fucked before you even get in the door at these places.

I'd rather pay full retail than get "a deal" and then have $3000 worth of fees added on. I always buy my bikes from smaller shops, that have one or two franchises. Plus, I try and deal with the owner if possible.
Berm
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USA
Fantasy
3/6/2015 11:13pm
IWreckALot wrote:
I wonder why the manufacturers don't control the price. The bicycle industry has gone this direction and I like it. You get to buy the bike...
I wonder why the manufacturers don't control the price. The bicycle industry has gone this direction and I like it. You get to buy the bike from the shop you feel most comfortable with. And you know you didn't get ripped off any more than anyone else.
Berm wrote:
I believe it is illegal in every state for the manufacturer to force a dealer to sell at a certain price (resale price maintenance). It was...
I believe it is illegal in every state for the manufacturer to force a dealer to sell at a certain price (resale price maintenance). It was definitely illegal up until a court decision in 2007 but that decision changed so that each case will be handled separately (ie. if they do practice resale price maintenance, and are subsequently sued, they have to prove they had to do it to survive).

They can place rules on advertising prices but cannot force a dealer to sell at a specific price.

Many states also have very strict dealer laws (WI is one such state). The manufacturer can't force the price the dealer sells at, and more importantly, they can't drop a dealer for selling below MSRP.
mxfiend wrote:
No its not illegal pro taper just issued a map minimum advertized price so online only dealers who dont have overhead with employess and etc. Cant...
No its not illegal pro taper just issued a map minimum advertized price so online only dealers who dont have overhead with employess and etc. Cant have a price .02 above cost
That's exactly what I said was legal. They can set rules for advertised prices but can't force the dealer to actually sell at a specific price.
KennyT
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Vista, CA, USA
Fantasy
3/6/2015 11:27pm
I am shocked at what dealers/sales people make off bikes nowadays. It is no wonder they try and add on the bogus freight /setup fees.

I recently bought a 2014 model here in North San Diego county. My neighbor who works sales at the dealer helped get me what I felt was a great OTD price of 11,500. Over a beer the other day I asked him how he did on the commission on the sale. $100 was his answer.....that is a set commission he makes on any bike he sells because according to him the dealers margins are very low and they would not be in business if he was paid a decent commission on each sale.

The bait and switch is complete bullshit for sure and I would have been furious, but I also understand what Motodork is talking about.
Walter
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Location
Tucson, AZ, USA
3/7/2015 3:54am
The below the bike price line fees sometimes has an interesting effect on less than savvy customers.

Several years ago I was hanging out in my friend's very successful local dealership when a scene unfolded that had me laughing.

It was a busy Saturday and the owner was handling a sale at the front desk when a young man came in ranting in a loud voice about he had got a better deal for his dirt bike down the road at a different dealership. He was yelling "I told you I could get a better price!" My buddy asked to see his invoice. Here is where the fun started.

My buddy's store is old school: a price plus tax. His price was X. The other store's invoice had a lower price for the bike, but added over $1000 at the back end in various "fees" and "charges". The bottom line price was significantly more than my buddy's price. When this was pointed out to the charming fellow, he loudly proclaimed that "But I got a better price on the bike" and proudly stormed off after tossing a few profanity-laced phrases to the gathering crowd.

Gotta love it...they are out there.
Spartacus
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3/7/2015 4:37am Edited Date/Time 3/7/2015 4:42am
Spartacus wrote:
I thought maximizing profit [by any means] was capitalism at its best and to be encouraged?
You thought wrong.
Many people in business would disagree.

GrapeApe
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Mc Kinney, TX, USA
3/7/2015 6:02am
Spartacus wrote:
I thought maximizing profit [by any means] was capitalism at its best and to be encouraged?
You thought wrong.
Spartacus wrote:
Many people in business would disagree.

In business, as in society, it is illegal to do illegal things. White collar prison is still prison.
wfo250
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Location
Champaign, IL, USA
3/7/2015 6:21am Edited Date/Time 3/7/2015 6:22am
Brent wrote:
Never take any salesman's word for anything. Have the approved loan docs e mailed to you before you travel, so if they don't come through it...
Never take any salesman's word for anything. Have the approved loan docs e mailed to you before you travel, so if they don't come through it can be breach of contract on their part.
You always paint with such a broad brush?
Grieby54 wrote:
No kidding. There are certainly some liars out there, but that's a small minority of them.
All salesmen are liars or they would be broke. Its
part of the job. Stamp it.
albacore26
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Location
Portland, OR, USA
3/7/2015 11:04am Edited Date/Time 3/7/2015 11:32am
JoJmoto wrote:
First let me thank all of you who supported Lane and I in this aggravating time we had. Our community is a small one and we...
First let me thank all of you who supported Lane and I in this aggravating time we had. Our community is a small one and we are all the glue that hold it together.

OK so today a manager,Trey, from Mountain Motorsports called me while I was working. He asked to speak with about the issue we had last night at the store. I explained to him what happened and he asked if I would still be interested in a bike and I said no, I was not interested in buying anything from them ever again. I said Jason Upchurch from Talladega Cycle stepped up and was going to hook us up in the pinch we were now placed in. After some conversation they offered us a good deal on a 2015, plus throw in a few extras and would deliver the bike to our doorstep if we would allow them to complete the sale. I was told they DO NOT have any 14's there but he could make some things happen and get me one if I wanted it over a newer bike. I suppose he would jump on the Kawi dealer site and start asking for a dealer trade in order to make that happen. So, no, they do not have the 14's in stock they are advertising on Cycletrader.

So, I stopped and thought about it, and how much time and money it was fixing to cost me driving the 3 1/2 hours (7 hours round trip) out to Alabama to purchase a bike and how I am short on time as it is this week due to some things I have to get done. I did appreciate them calling and wanting to make the effort to make it right with us, they could have easily never called and tried.

So, I decided to swallow a little pride as in the end, it would save me some time and money that I really don't have right now and I took the deal they offered. I can only spend a certain amount for a bike and time is running out for me before next weekend, which is when we needed it before. The General Manager of the store, Josh, actually jumped in the truck and brought the bike up himself. I applaud their effort in wanting to try and keep a customer, or damage control from an angry one. We have the bike in the basement, now we are just waiting on the box of extras to make this transaction complete.

Now with that all said, I do still think they are in need of a business practice change and if they do not have the bikes advertised, they should not advertise them! I was told some closed door meetings went on today, who knows.... maybe things will change. Nonetheless, I am happy we were able to get a bike for Lane and Josh, the GM, knew it would be a long shot for us to ever come back as return customer... but he did offer to take care of us personally.
I somewhat understand your decision but I wouldn't have taken the deal, sometimes principals are worth a few dollars. I'd be willing to bet this dealership and employees are familiar with Vital and have seen this thread, hence the over the top reaction to your issue. I can't imagine a dealer that obviously does the old bait and switch bending over backwards for one of their run of the mill scam victims.

I have a feeling the same business practices are in effect as I type this, Cycle Trader Online is loaded with (686) 2014 bikes at blowout prices.
albacore26
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Portland, OR, USA
3/7/2015 11:19am Edited Date/Time 3/7/2015 11:49am
I just looked at the 142 Google reviews (which is a lot) and it seems like everyone loves this place! Funny how just about all of them have only one total review on Google and they went out of their way to give Mountain Motorsports 5 stars.

This place screams of dirty business and I for one would never buy a god damn thing from them.
I say fuck this shit hole and I'm sure it's being read by "magic maker" Trey, who gets glowing reviews on Google of course.

"Ryan Bishop
2 years ago
Trey Knight at mountain Motorsports was really helpful. I was looking for a super sport bike and found one that i liked and Trey worked magic and helped me purchase my first bike. Everyone that I interacted with was really friendly and helpful. Highly suggest to ask for him if looking to purchase a bike or anything. Thanks."
hvaughn88
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Conway, AR, USA
3/7/2015 11:23am
albacore26 wrote:
I just looked at the 142 Google reviews (which is a lot) and it seems like everyone loves this place! Funny how just about all of...
I just looked at the 142 Google reviews (which is a lot) and it seems like everyone loves this place! Funny how just about all of them have only one total review on Google and they went out of their way to give Mountain Motorsports 5 stars.

This place screams of dirty business and I for one would never buy a god damn thing from them.
I say fuck this shit hole and I'm sure it's being read by "magic maker" Trey, who gets glowing reviews on Google of course.

"Ryan Bishop
2 years ago
Trey Knight at mountain Motorsports was really helpful. I was looking for a super sport bike and found one that i liked and Trey worked magic and helped me purchase my first bike. Everyone that I interacted with was really friendly and helpful. Highly suggest to ask for him if looking to purchase a bike or anything. Thanks."
I agree with you, tuna
SPYGUY
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USA
3/7/2015 11:36am
KennyT wrote:
I am shocked at what dealers/sales people make off bikes nowadays. It is no wonder they try and add on the bogus freight /setup fees. I...
I am shocked at what dealers/sales people make off bikes nowadays. It is no wonder they try and add on the bogus freight /setup fees.

I recently bought a 2014 model here in North San Diego county. My neighbor who works sales at the dealer helped get me what I felt was a great OTD price of 11,500. Over a beer the other day I asked him how he did on the commission on the sale. $100 was his answer.....that is a set commission he makes on any bike he sells because according to him the dealers margins are very low and they would not be in business if he was paid a decent commission on each sale.

The bait and switch is complete bullshit for sure and I would have been furious, but I also understand what Motodork is talking about.
Salesmen have no idea what the dealers true margins are. Thanks to holdbacks & rebates, what the dealer shows on an invoice for any particular bike doesn't mean that's what he actually paid for the bike when all is said and done. It's all a game of smoke and mirrors. As long as a salesman thinks the dealership isn't actually making much money on a unit, he can't ask for a higher commission.
bturner26x
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Acworth, GA, USA
3/7/2015 11:41am
I go to Mountain Motorsports all the time as there are 2 within 5-10 mins of me both ways. Granted I have never bought a bike from them, I've always had good experiences there, especially w/ Josh. I go there for oil, plugs, oem parts, stuff like that. They have alot of stuff in stock. They are like the Walmart of motorcycle dealerships, they move in & shut all the small guys down because they just can't compete. The place is huge.
dcg141
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USA
3/7/2015 12:07pm Edited Date/Time 3/7/2015 12:33pm
NT
3/7/2015 12:17pm
You always paint with such a broad brush?
Grieby54 wrote:
No kidding. There are certainly some liars out there, but that's a small minority of them.
wfo250 wrote:
All salesmen are liars or they would be broke. Its
part of the job. Stamp it.
Wrong. Successful long-term salesmen cannot be liars, particularly in an industry that is fairly small. Short-term hustlers are full of crap, that's the basis of their game. The latter has always given the former a bad name.
BAMX
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Fallbrook, CA, USA
3/7/2015 12:33pm
hillbilly wrote:
IMO the otd price should been the 4811 ,no fee bullshit. Wth fee would be that amount but profit. It a shop is wanting shed of...
IMO the otd price should been the 4811 ,no fee bullshit. Wth fee would be that amount but profit.

It a shop is wanting shed of last year stock the price is the price.

Call sean tomorrow and cuss him with words you made up driving home, knowing myself it is what I'd do so i wouldn't be mad for days.
JoJmoto wrote:
Oh he even tried to say that the $5800 was the wrong price I was quoted anyway. He said there was another $279 "Bike set up...
Oh he even tried to say that the $5800 was the wrong price I was quoted anyway. He said there was another $279 "Bike set up fee" so the OTD price Sean should have told me was about $6100+ OTD...

The $890 was for them having the bike "Shipped" in from Kawasaki..
Typical bike assembly is to uncrate the bike and install the front tire and handlebars. $279 is a little ripe IMO. $900 to ship is also ridiculous. I don't know the freight class for bikes but I find it hard to believe that it is even half of that.
GIwasB4
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Beverly Hills, CA, USA
3/7/2015 12:52pm
BAMX wrote:
Typical bike assembly is to uncrate the bike and install the front tire and handlebars. $279 is a little ripe IMO. $900 to ship is also...
Typical bike assembly is to uncrate the bike and install the front tire and handlebars. $279 is a little ripe IMO. $900 to ship is also ridiculous. I don't know the freight class for bikes but I find it hard to believe that it is even half of that.
Yamaha and Suzuki east coast warehouses are in southern NJ. Trucking delivery to PA, WV, OH dealers from the warehouse was mandated by the OEM's and was $45 per crate paid to the trucking company. (some models have 2 units per crate). There's a bit of mark up on the shipping by dealers.
Old-Man
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Colorado springs, CO, USA
3/7/2015 12:55pm
moscrop940 wrote:
what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I've ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response was there anything...
what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I've ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response was there anything that could even be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul
Motodork wrote:
Coming from someone that believes in santa claus, oh I mean god, you calling me an idiot is quite ironic. Should never bring religion or politics...
Coming from someone that believes in santa claus, oh I mean god, you calling me an idiot is quite ironic. Should never bring religion or politics in to any debate.
hillbilly wrote:
You have zero game,even the stupidest sums o bitches on the old ron ron board had more than the god post,damn.,what grade did you go to...
You have zero game,even the stupidest sums o bitches on the old ron ron board had more than the god post,damn.,what grade did you go to full time bong loader?
Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Wink
djc
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USA
3/7/2015 1:37pm
So does anyone really know what shipping actually is? And does the buyer have to pay it? I am looking at a few bikes myself and www quoted like 300 for shipping and 200 or more for bs set up fee. How much work is actually involved in set up?
Brent
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Temecula, CA, USA
3/7/2015 1:45pm Edited Date/Time 3/7/2015 1:47pm
BAMX wrote:
Typical bike assembly is to uncrate the bike and install the front tire and handlebars. $279 is a little ripe IMO. $900 to ship is also...
Typical bike assembly is to uncrate the bike and install the front tire and handlebars. $279 is a little ripe IMO. $900 to ship is also ridiculous. I don't know the freight class for bikes but I find it hard to believe that it is even half of that.
Don't forget the front fender.

Used to be friends with a slave at FBC, they did bike assembly for other dealers and then would deliver the completed bikes.

For dirt bikes it took him between an hour to an hour and a half to put the bike together and break down the crate for recycle. he got paid 22 bucks an hour.

I was also told that Honda and Yamaha included the shipping price in the dealer costs, but I never saw invoices to confirm that.

However, I did order a bike from a dealer in Oklahoma for delivery to the terminal in San Diego, it cost 390.00.
seth505
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SD, CA, USA
3/7/2015 1:46pm
Motodork wrote:
It serves you right for trying to bike a bike for nothing, no dealer out there needs you and your type of business, like he said...
It serves you right for trying to bike a bike for nothing, no dealer out there needs you and your type of business, like he said, go buy it somewhere else, because they were making zero money. Fuckin dirt bike buyers crack me up, they want everyone to work for free for them and then don't wana pay for it. Classic line, I have bought 10 bikes from you and you should take care of me, oh wait I lost money 10 times on your sorry ass and now you want me to loss more, hit the road jack.
steveada wrote:
Huh? It is business. I want to buy something, you want to sell something. I want to buy low, you want to sell high. If we...
Huh? It is business. I want to buy something, you want to sell something. I want to buy low, you want to sell high. If we can agree on a price we can both live with, the deal is done and everyone walks away happy. The problem starts when one of the parties involved does not deal in good faith. In this case the dealer was dishonest, just trying to get the guy into the store and make him pay more than agreed upon. He wasn't looking for a freebie. The dealer advertised a price, he called and made a deal at that price, and the dealer didn't keep their side of the deal.
Motodork wrote:
You are right, it is about good faith, you call and ask a price, we give you a fair price and we agree over the phone...
You are right, it is about good faith, you call and ask a price, we give you a fair price and we agree over the phone before you drive 2 hours. An hour later you call back and tell me you shopped that fair price all over the country and beat my price by 100 dollars and want to see if I will match it, what happened to good faith? Oh ya you lied to me that you were headed down and took my number to shop me. Now we have to play games because buyers are liers. Do a little research on were the term "kicking tires" comes from before you think the dealership is the side that wanted to start playing games. Ask any retail employee and they will tell you the public is very disrespectful and have an entiled attitude, business was not like that 20 years ago because people were decent.
My favorite is when someone posts a new thread and then someone comes in from left field ranting about the general public and doesn't even pertain to the original poster. O wait, no I hate that...carry on
Brent
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3/7/2015 1:49pm
Altus and Chickasha in Oklahoma was always good on their over the phone prices. Both great groups of people to buy from each time I bought...
Altus and Chickasha in Oklahoma was always good on their over the phone prices. Both great groups of people to buy from each time I bought a bike from em
I second that, they were up front and honest with me from start to finish at Altus. i would buy from them again in a heartbeat.
GIwasB4
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Beverly Hills, CA, USA
3/7/2015 3:25pm
djc wrote:
So does anyone really know what shipping actually is? And does the buyer have to pay it? I am looking at a few bikes myself and...
So does anyone really know what shipping actually is? And does the buyer have to pay it? I am looking at a few bikes myself and www quoted like 300 for shipping and 200 or more for bs set up fee. How much work is actually involved in set up?
No you don't have to pay assembly and shipping fees. You may not get your deal though.
There are dealers that charge none of those fee's.

Dealer price includes shipping to the US warehouse, the dealer is responsible for the shipping charges from the US warehouse to they're location. Any dealer adding shipping and assembly fees of more than $200 are just padding the margin.
nc_mx_kid
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Team Charlotte Motorsports, NC, USA
3/7/2015 3:43pm
Thats a bummer you wanted a 2014 and they didn't deliver. Mountain Motorsports is owned by Ryan Hardwick and Dustin Farthing both of who are/were PWC racers now powersports owners.

For future I'd suggest making sure the particular vehicle/product you are calling is in stock at the specific store you are calling, schedule an appointment and go there in person to negotiate your deal. I'd wait to fill out finance papers AFTER having a deal agreed on said product.

IF your going to get preapproved for financing before going to store, put a deposit on the vehicle/product, get picture of vehicle, receipt, and copies of finance papers sent to your email for proof.

AND always call before you haul to confirm bike, deal, and appointment
McDuff
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USA
3/7/2015 4:13pm
I would go back and top shelf them.

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