Engine Rebuild Advice?

AP_151
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AP_151
Edited Date/Time 3/11/2014 6:38pm
Will I be able to do a full engine from home? I've got a 2012 KX250F and don't have the cash yet (and won't for awhile) to have the Kawi shop do a full engine for me. Never done any engine work myself

Is it so crazy difficult to do as people make it out to be? I feel like with a little help and some good instructions and advice I could do it. I don't see how I could screw up if I'm following the steps. Maybe I'm naive but...

Anyone think I can give it a shot? If so, any good tips?
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hillbilly
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hillbilly 3/10/2014 5:10pm
3/10/2014 5:10pm
Call it a engine instead of a motor and i may help.

If you have never done any I'd say your fucking up bad
ML512
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ML512 3/10/2014 5:17pm
3/10/2014 5:17pm Edited Date/Time 3/10/2014 5:53pm
AP_151 wrote:
Will I be able to do a full engine from home? I've got a 2012 KX250F and don't have the cash yet (and won't for awhile)...
Will I be able to do a full engine from home? I've got a 2012 KX250F and don't have the cash yet (and won't for awhile) to have the Kawi shop do a full engine for me. Never done any engine work myself

Is it so crazy difficult to do as people make it out to be? I feel like with a little help and some good instructions and advice I could do it. I don't see how I could screw up if I'm following the steps. Maybe I'm naive but...

Anyone think I can give it a shot? If so, any good tips?
I'm glad to see you have gotten away from asking what do I do when it blows up in mid-air. Are you planning on doing bottom and the top end? If so I'd find someone that has a bit of experience to help you. If it's just the top end grab a service manual (service is not the owners manual) and follow the instructions to a T (someone with experience would still be helpful to at least over-view your work). Just take your time and re-check everything till there are no doubts, it's really a valuable skill to be able to properly maintain your own bikes.

If you go this route be fully-aware that you are risking it not working properly, if you do decide to take the project on then good luck.

(Note: Check out some top end rebuild videos on the internet, but stay away from any that involve the bike sitting on a hay-bale and a guy spitting chew saying "Today I'll show Ya'll how to fix your dirtcycle")
Brad460
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Brad460 3/10/2014 5:18pm
3/10/2014 5:18pm
What does " do a full motor mean"? You converting it to electric? Dry
Sandberm
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Sandberm 3/10/2014 5:21pm
3/10/2014 5:21pm
Go for it.

The Shop

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gt80rider
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gt80rider 3/10/2014 5:29pm
3/10/2014 5:29pm
Drives me insane these engine vs motor people.... Somebody just help the dude out with his enginecycle.... I gotta hop in my ford engine company truck and go run some errands...
AP_151
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AP_151 3/10/2014 5:29pm
3/10/2014 5:29pm
AP_151 wrote:
Will I be able to do a full engine from home? I've got a 2012 KX250F and don't have the cash yet (and won't for awhile)...
Will I be able to do a full engine from home? I've got a 2012 KX250F and don't have the cash yet (and won't for awhile) to have the Kawi shop do a full engine for me. Never done any engine work myself

Is it so crazy difficult to do as people make it out to be? I feel like with a little help and some good instructions and advice I could do it. I don't see how I could screw up if I'm following the steps. Maybe I'm naive but...

Anyone think I can give it a shot? If so, any good tips?
Edited it for you two dildos... Engine* rebuild. My bad.
AP_151
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AP_151 3/10/2014 5:32pm
3/10/2014 5:32pm
ML512 wrote:
I'm glad to see you have gotten away from asking what do I do when it blows up in mid-air. Are you planning on doing bottom...
I'm glad to see you have gotten away from asking what do I do when it blows up in mid-air. Are you planning on doing bottom and the top end? If so I'd find someone that has a bit of experience to help you. If it's just the top end grab a service manual (service is not the owners manual) and follow the instructions to a T (someone with experience would still be helpful to at least over-view your work). Just take your time and re-check everything till there are no doubts, it's really a valuable skill to be able to properly maintain your own bikes.

If you go this route be fully-aware that you are risking it not working properly, if you do decide to take the project on then good luck.

(Note: Check out some top end rebuild videos on the internet, but stay away from any that involve the bike sitting on a hay-bale and a guy spitting chew saying "Today I'll show Ya'll how to fix your dirtcycle")
I wised up just a little bit. Apparently not enough because I have people correcting me for saying motor instead of engine (they're correct though). Thanks for the 1 serious answer I've gotten so far. Appreciate the advice.
stangkag
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stangkag 3/10/2014 5:34pm
3/10/2014 5:34pm
Need more details as mentioned before. Ive rebuilt countless engines 2 stroke and 4. When I first started out I'd take a lot of pictures to help me remember how things went back together until my confidence came along. Lay things on a bench in order that they come off the bike... Again take your time, take pics when in doubt and make sure you mark the timing chain before you lossen the tensioner... Timing is everything on that 250f ( sorry for listing the obvious but you didnt give us much to go off of)
MXD
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MXD 3/10/2014 5:37pm
3/10/2014 5:37pm
To do it right you'll need to (or probably want to depending on the condition and hours on the bike) cut new valve seats, install new valves, split the cases and do a crank and a ton of other small stuff in between. First off, it will cost you the same money to buy all the tools you'll need as it will to get the job done by someone else. Second, if you're going to tackle it yourself, having someone help you out is a potential disaster. What you'd really need is someone to do it for you and teach you along the way. There is a big difference between the two. If you've never done it before I would say you're probably in over your head. There is more to it than replacing parts. You need to be able to spot things that aren't right as well. Good luck.
MX690
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MX690 3/10/2014 5:40pm
3/10/2014 5:40pm
If you have a service manual and the correct tools its not as hard as you think. Believe it or not YouTube can be a great help. If you're unsure about something before you pull it apart, whip out your phone and take photos so you have something to refer back to if you're not sure. And it really does pay to have someone you can turn to for some advice if you get stuck. The more you do it the easier it becomes and you will save yourself a fortune.
BobPA
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BobPA 3/10/2014 5:45pm
3/10/2014 5:45pm
MXD wrote:
To do it right you'll need to (or probably want to depending on the condition and hours on the bike) cut new valve seats, install new...
To do it right you'll need to (or probably want to depending on the condition and hours on the bike) cut new valve seats, install new valves, split the cases and do a crank and a ton of other small stuff in between. First off, it will cost you the same money to buy all the tools you'll need as it will to get the job done by someone else. Second, if you're going to tackle it yourself, having someone help you out is a potential disaster. What you'd really need is someone to do it for you and teach you along the way. There is a big difference between the two. If you've never done it before I would say you're probably in over your head. There is more to it than replacing parts. You need to be able to spot things that aren't right as well. Good luck.
This

I'm sure with a service manual you could just replace parts and put it back together. But it is nice to have someone with some experience who knows what to look for.

Good luck rebuilding your MOTORcycle...help the dude out instead of belly aching over minor technicalities.
AP_151
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AP_151 3/10/2014 5:47pm
3/10/2014 5:47pm
stangkag wrote:
Need more details as mentioned before. Ive rebuilt countless engines 2 stroke and 4. When I first started out I'd take a lot of pictures to...
Need more details as mentioned before. Ive rebuilt countless engines 2 stroke and 4. When I first started out I'd take a lot of pictures to help me remember how things went back together until my confidence came along. Lay things on a bench in order that they come off the bike... Again take your time, take pics when in doubt and make sure you mark the timing chain before you lossen the tensioner... Timing is everything on that 250f ( sorry for listing the obvious but you didnt give us much to go off of)
Thank you very much!
djc
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djc 3/10/2014 6:54pm
3/10/2014 6:54pm
What is the shop charging? I would get a hold of the local guy who work from his garage. They should charge much less. I paid 300 or :350 for full motor too/bottom. No valves though. Then I paid I believe another 300 for parts. If your not very mechanical I would not touch it. If you were just gonna do a too end then I would say go for it but top and bottom I would rather pay then take it to someone in pieces. If you are mechanically inclined then that is a different story I guess. I am not but I know people who are that can and have done it for first time
kevkx125
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kevkx125 3/10/2014 7:50pm
3/10/2014 7:50pm
For sure get yourself a service manual. Take your time. Read the service manual several times if you have to. Test and check yourself as your go along. Take pride in yourself knowing that you did it yourself, and remember practice makes perfect.
blusmbl
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blusmbl 3/10/2014 7:55pm
3/10/2014 7:55pm
hillbilly wrote:
Call it a engine instead of a motor and i may help.

If you have never done any I'd say your fucking up bad
Engine is a subset of motor. Quit your whining.
lostboy819
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lostboy819 3/10/2014 7:57pm
3/10/2014 7:57pm
MXD wrote:
To do it right you'll need to (or probably want to depending on the condition and hours on the bike) cut new valve seats, install new...
To do it right you'll need to (or probably want to depending on the condition and hours on the bike) cut new valve seats, install new valves, split the cases and do a crank and a ton of other small stuff in between. First off, it will cost you the same money to buy all the tools you'll need as it will to get the job done by someone else. Second, if you're going to tackle it yourself, having someone help you out is a potential disaster. What you'd really need is someone to do it for you and teach you along the way. There is a big difference between the two. If you've never done it before I would say you're probably in over your head. There is more to it than replacing parts. You need to be able to spot things that aren't right as well. Good luck.
X2
BobPA
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BobPA 3/10/2014 8:01pm
3/10/2014 8:01pm
blusmbl wrote:
Engine is a subset of motor. Quit your whining.
Learn the definition of an engine....you may take that whole statement back.
danman
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danman 3/10/2014 8:43pm
3/10/2014 8:43pm
In my opinion, the motor/engine itself is rather easy to completely tear apart and get back together OK. Yes, you need some special tools, but they aren't very expensive.
The part that REQUIRES someone that knows what they are doing is the head. You definitely want the head serviced properly, because if that fails, that is where the largest cost of the motor comes in.

Buy all the parts( top end, lower end, bearings, and gaskets), drive your butt to Wisconsin. You and I can do the motor in probably 2 nights. I don't mess with the head though. That requires more expensive tools and more knowledge than I have.

Pit Row

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AP_151
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AP_151 3/10/2014 8:52pm
3/10/2014 8:52pm
danman wrote:
In my opinion, the motor/engine itself is rather easy to completely tear apart and get back together OK. Yes, you need some special tools, but they...
In my opinion, the motor/engine itself is rather easy to completely tear apart and get back together OK. Yes, you need some special tools, but they aren't very expensive.
The part that REQUIRES someone that knows what they are doing is the head. You definitely want the head serviced properly, because if that fails, that is where the largest cost of the motor comes in.

Buy all the parts( top end, lower end, bearings, and gaskets), drive your butt to Wisconsin. You and I can do the motor in probably 2 nights. I don't mess with the head though. That requires more expensive tools and more knowledge than I have.
Seeing as I'm living out of Houston the Wisconsin drive would be an issue haha, generous offer.
500guy
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500guy 3/10/2014 9:00pm
3/10/2014 9:00pm
Seems like money is an issue ? The biggest problem you are going to have is costing yourself 2-3 times the money learning.

Unless you can get some experienced help, You might be money ahead to pull the engine and have someone local do it.
captmoto
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captmoto 3/10/2014 9:26pm
3/10/2014 9:26pm
500guy wrote:
Seems like money is an issue ? The biggest problem you are going to have is costing yourself 2-3 times the money learning. Unless you can...
Seems like money is an issue ? The biggest problem you are going to have is costing yourself 2-3 times the money learning.

Unless you can get some experienced help, You might be money ahead to pull the engine and have someone local do it.
Damn it 500 guy, you are not paying attention.! It's the MOTOR he needs help rebuilding!
Graybeard 3/10/2014 9:38pm
3/10/2014 9:38pm
Learning to wrench on your own bike is a great skill, and will give you a lot of satisfaction when you do it. A lot of guys rebuild their own engines, so don't be afraid to learn that skill set. You have some good bike shops in the Houston area if you get into trouble, and a lot of guys from the track will also give you some great advice. Take a look at the video below--great overview from Bike Bandit, and then see how you feel about giving it a go!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dYLROWIjHo4
BobbyM
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BobbyM 3/10/2014 10:05pm
3/10/2014 10:05pm
hillbilly wrote:
Call it a engine instead of a motor and i may help.

If you have never done any I'd say your fucking up bad
Wrong Billy hill. Better not work on any outboard motors ...work for Honda motor company or a hundred other entities.
BobbyM
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BobbyM 3/10/2014 10:14pm
3/10/2014 10:14pm
AP_151 wrote:
Will I be able to do a full engine from home? I've got a 2012 KX250F and don't have the cash yet (and won't for awhile)...
Will I be able to do a full engine from home? I've got a 2012 KX250F and don't have the cash yet (and won't for awhile) to have the Kawi shop do a full engine for me. Never done any engine work myself

Is it so crazy difficult to do as people make it out to be? I feel like with a little help and some good instructions and advice I could do it. I don't see how I could screw up if I'm following the steps. Maybe I'm naive but...

Anyone think I can give it a shot? If so, any good tips?
Have you ever rebuilt or fixed anything before?
Radical
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Radical 3/10/2014 10:27pm
3/10/2014 10:27pm Edited Date/Time 3/10/2014 10:31pm
Motor/engine, whatever.

There's a lot of good advice on here.
If you're going to tackle it, leave the bottom end alone unless you suspect there are problems. Splitting the cases and dealing with every single part is too ambitious for your first rebuild. Besides, the bike's not very old, so unless you suspect damage, let it be.

Once the top end is disassembled check for vertical play in the connecting rod. If you can move it side to side a small amount, fine. Without the crank turning, if you can lift it up and down, or it doesn't turn completely smoothly, then you need bottom end work. Decide at that time whether you're up to doing it yourself.

As you reassemble, pay attention to aligning the timing chain correctly. Being one tooth off and your bike will barely run. Just follow the directions to a tee, and you'll be OK.

After you remove the valve cover, and before you remove the camshafts, measure the valve clearance of each valve. If you need shims, this will save you from having to remove the camshafts twice. Just order the correct shims before you reassemble the engine.

There isn't much to the head, but I agree. It must be done right. You won't have the tools to rebuild the head, so if it needs it, take it to a reputable shop.

You'll need a metric socket set with the smaller sizes taking a 1/4" ratchet.

You'll need 2 torque wrenches, one in in-lbs, and another in ft-lbs or the metric equivalent. There are also some nuts that you won't be able to get to without a torque wrench converter or a Crowfoot wrench set.

The following are decent tools, not top of the line, but good quality at a decent price.

To check the valve clearance, you'll need feeler gauges in .001" increments.

1/4" Torque wrench 20-200 Inch/Pounds for the light stuff.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00C5ZL2EG/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i01?…

Crowfoot Wrench Set
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000NPR2BC/ref=oh_details_o00_s00_i00?…

Those were some tips for doing the work itself.

My best advice though is to study how engines work in as much detail as you can, down to the purpose of each and every part. Then read the entire service manual from cover to cover and try to understand as much as you possibly can about the entire bike. It seems unrelated, but it's not. The more you learn about how mechanical things work and of course especially the engine, the easier and smoother the job will go.

That's it for now.

Good Luck!
Parris
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Parris 3/10/2014 10:49pm
3/10/2014 10:49pm
You will want to motor that engine over a few seconds before you hit the ignition
CASH476
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CASH476 3/11/2014 2:07am
3/11/2014 2:07am
blusmbl wrote:
Engine is a subset of motor. Quit your whining.
BobPA wrote:
Learn the definition of an engine....you may take that whole statement back.
WTF has this got to do with Locomotives?
mrquick
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mrquick 3/11/2014 2:13am
3/11/2014 2:13am
I love my enginecycle...I ride it every weekend at enginesports park.
StartedTooLate 3/11/2014 2:39am
3/11/2014 2:39am Edited Date/Time 3/11/2014 2:41am
You need to have the right tools. That includes precision measuring tools to measure things to see if they are in spec. The basics...

Complete set of normal tools (metric)
0-6" Dial Caliper
0-1" / 1-2" / 2-3" / 3-4" .0001" Micrometers
Bore Gauge
Granite Surface Plate and Surface Gauge
V-Blocks
.0001" dial indicator
Heat Gun
Hyd Press
Blind Bearing Puller
Crank removal tool
Flywheel puller
Clutch wrench
Torque wrenches
Feeler gauges

Even then, you will have to send out parts...namely cranks and heads.
rossi46
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rossi46 3/11/2014 4:37am
3/11/2014 4:37am
YOUTUBE…
has heaps of 'how to vids'

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