The Carmichael / Honda deal?

mynewcr250 9/22/2013 1:43pm
9/22/2013 1:43pm
mynewcr250 wrote:
why not move your national schedule back a couple weeks as a courtesy to OUR guys whom YOU know will have to race the MXON in...
why not move your national schedule back a couple weeks as a courtesy to OUR guys whom YOU know will have to race the MXON in late September?

we can do this all day
GuyB wrote:
Why not stop being a fucktard?
is that all you really have, just insults? how is my point not valid?

this isnt a U.S. race, so why should they go out of their way to accommodate U.S. riders? serious question. id like a good reason.

the only thing im hearing is "villopoto is not gonna show up". he needed medical work, he would of been there had he not needed that work so how is that a viable reason for moving the mxon? dungey and tomac are there despite the horrible schedule.
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Xeno 9/22/2013 1:44pm
9/22/2013 1:44pm
Matthes wrote:
From what I remember, RC wanted more money, Honda balked and Suzuki paid him a crap ton (rumor was no title bonuses, his salary was assuming...
From what I remember, RC wanted more money, Honda balked and Suzuki paid him a crap ton (rumor was no title bonuses, his salary was assuming he would win the title). And then Suzuki found out what Honda already knew and that was they really didn't sell any more motorcycles by winning professional titles.

Like all free agents, it was about the money. Nothing wrong with that.
Yes, he emptied the red ATM and moved on to the yellow one.
mynewcr250 9/22/2013 1:47pm
9/22/2013 1:47pm Edited Date/Time 9/22/2013 1:47pm
DC wrote:
RMT, I think there's a difference between working at the motorcycle races, and being a professional motocross racer at the level of a Ryan Villopoto of...
RMT, I think there's a difference between working at the motorcycle races, and being a professional motocross racer at the level of a Ryan Villopoto of Chad Reed. You and I could travel every weekend for 12 months, but we're not trying to stay in tip-top shape, testing and training constantly between every race. The riders who do SX/MX need a chance to rest and reset, just like the NFL players, hockey players and every other sport with a season.

And mnewcr250, the schedule doesn't extend into September anymore because the riders and teams asked us to shorten the season, which includes 17 Supercross races and 12 Motocross races, and we felt it was the right thing to do. The U.S. schedule is a third longer than the 18-race GP schedule, and it starts three months earlier.

The MXoN race used to take place in mid-September, but they've pushed it back to the end of the month and extended the GP schedule to 18 races, which is fine, but that scheduling has an effect on the decisions of many riders, including RV and Chad Reed. Villopoto told me he would have raced if it were a week or two after the last national. That kind of puts it into perspective for me.

DC
MX Sports
Coyote wrote:
if they want the best riders in the world they're (FIM) going have to accomodate
they have and will continue to have the best riders from the US there despite the schedule. tomac and dungey are there are they not? 2/3 of the best guys already there. they only guy they're missing is the guy that had medical concerns and wanted to address them.
coolhand
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coolhand 9/22/2013 1:50pm
9/22/2013 1:50pm
DC, I have a lot of respect for what you have done for MX..but the comment about riders having to stay in shape for another
30-45 days is BS..mx's core comes from hard working people, top guys make millions..if you can't stay in shape for that then maybe your belong in tennis.


I knew RC what he was sitting in the back of my truck eating PB on white bread. Honda treated him like a has been pure and simple.. He got the last laugh...

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TeamGreen
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TeamGreen 9/22/2013 1:53pm
9/22/2013 1:53pm
Is it just me...or...did anyone-else see the comment about RV saying he would have gone if it was a few weeks earlier...?

And, the US isn't the only country w/ National Schedule conflicts.

Going to those 2 HUGE MOTO NATIONS, Thailand & Qatar, is what this Calendar debate is really about.
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DC 9/22/2013 1:53pm
9/22/2013 1:53pm
"why should they go out of their way to accommodate U.S. riders?"

Because U.S.-based riders are the ones that have to pack up and fly across the ocean to the other side of the world in the middle of the off-season. They are expected to win, and it's a large amount of work, staying in shape and keeping your outdoor skills sharp while everyone else is taking it easy or transitioning into supercross (surely Eli Tomac and Ken Roczen can't wait to park their 250s and focus on their new 450s).

It's viable because he needs a month off for surgery, and he decided to take it in September rather than October or November or December, which are all crucial testing and training months.

Look, it was just a suggestion to help ensure that the very best riders want to go over year, and a tweak in the schedule will maybe help that. If that's arrogant or selfish on behalf of the riders, I just don't see it.

DC
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BobbyM 9/22/2013 1:55pm
9/22/2013 1:55pm Edited Date/Time 9/22/2013 4:02pm
DC wrote:
Mynewcr250, why should U.S. based riders have to train and test for five extra weeks after their season ends so the FIM can add more races...
Mynewcr250, why should U.S. based riders have to train and test for five extra weeks after their season ends so the FIM can add more races and then get them to come race in Europe?

If they don't change the schedule, then they shouldn't blame U.S.-based riders who choose to take the month of September off to switch teams or heal their bodies. See: Ryan Villopoto, Chad Reed.

It's a modest suggestion and a courtesy to guys in the states who have a much bigger schedule, and two different disciplines to test and prepare for, and then maintain fitness for eight months as it is...

DC
MX Sports
RMT wrote:
I don't know you and you seem like a good guy, but I really don't feel bad for any pro motocross rider that might have to...
I don't know you and you seem like a good guy, but I really don't feel bad for any pro motocross rider that might have to stay disciplined for one more month. I have to work 12 months of the year and nobody is changing schedules for me. Before you start telling me I have no clue, your wrong as I have worked for one of the Japanese oem's for 10 years and know all to well what it's like to be at the airport every Thursday to head off to the races. I chose to have a family and spend time with them and chose a different path with another non Japanese oem. I enjoy watching the current crop of riders, but have no empathy for them to spend another month doing what they do. If he is injured, it's another story, but just to start you extended vacation a little early is not a reason for the FIM to change anything. And we wonder why the rest of the world thinks we are arrogant.
if you could ride a scooter worth a shit you might think differently.

And I too work 12 months a year walking around on a bloody stump but you don't see me whining about other peoples job situation.

DC just made a suggestion so lighten up

"bro"...
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jhansen510 9/22/2013 1:57pm
9/22/2013 1:57pm
mynewcr250 wrote:
why not move your national schedule back a couple weeks as a courtesy to OUR guys whom YOU know will have to race the MXON in...
why not move your national schedule back a couple weeks as a courtesy to OUR guys whom YOU know will have to race the MXON in late September?

we can do this all day
GuyB wrote:
Why not stop being a fucktard?
Pure awesomeness!
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DC 9/22/2013 1:58pm
9/22/2013 1:58pm
Coolhand, that means a year-round training schedule for guys like Dungey and Villopoto who will go every year (when they are healthy), year after year. That extra 45 days is HUGE when you and your team have titles to defend. Again, that's why RV didn't go, and Dungey and DeCoster also told me that they really hope the schedule changes.

I will be there either way, as I am in constant training to represent my country (in the beer tent).

Forget I mentioned it.

DC
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Trav138 9/22/2013 2:08pm
9/22/2013 2:08pm
coolhand wrote:
DC, I have a lot of respect for what you have done for MX..but the comment about riders having to stay in shape for another 30-45...
DC, I have a lot of respect for what you have done for MX..but the comment about riders having to stay in shape for another
30-45 days is BS..mx's core comes from hard working people, top guys make millions..if you can't stay in shape for that then maybe your belong in tennis.


I knew RC what he was sitting in the back of my truck eating PB on white bread. Honda treated him like a has been pure and simple.. He got the last laugh...
Easy on the Tennis players bro lol
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Coyote 9/22/2013 2:09pm
9/22/2013 2:09pm
DC wrote:
RMT, I think there's a difference between working at the motorcycle races, and being a professional motocross racer at the level of a Ryan Villopoto of...
RMT, I think there's a difference between working at the motorcycle races, and being a professional motocross racer at the level of a Ryan Villopoto of Chad Reed. You and I could travel every weekend for 12 months, but we're not trying to stay in tip-top shape, testing and training constantly between every race. The riders who do SX/MX need a chance to rest and reset, just like the NFL players, hockey players and every other sport with a season.

And mnewcr250, the schedule doesn't extend into September anymore because the riders and teams asked us to shorten the season, which includes 17 Supercross races and 12 Motocross races, and we felt it was the right thing to do. The U.S. schedule is a third longer than the 18-race GP schedule, and it starts three months earlier.

The MXoN race used to take place in mid-September, but they've pushed it back to the end of the month and extended the GP schedule to 18 races, which is fine, but that scheduling has an effect on the decisions of many riders, including RV and Chad Reed. Villopoto told me he would have raced if it were a week or two after the last national. That kind of puts it into perspective for me.

DC
MX Sports
Coyote wrote:
if they want the best riders in the world they're (FIM) going have to accomodate
mynewcr250 wrote:
they have and will continue to have the best riders from the US there despite the schedule. tomac and dungey are there are they not? 2/3...
they have and will continue to have the best riders from the US there despite the schedule. tomac and dungey are there are they not? 2/3 of the best guys already there. they only guy they're missing is the guy that had medical concerns and wanted to address them.
number one, IF and I say IF you have ever trained the way these riders do most of the year then you would understand where the majority of people here are coming from!! the other thing is the manufacturers who sponsor these riders to promote their product in the U.S. market don't get much from competing in Europe. As far as the "guy" with the medical issues competing, if the event was held earlier he would of been there
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jasen.bougher 9/22/2013 2:09pm
9/22/2013 2:09pm
Xeno wrote:
Like most breakups, it can be blamed on love or money. Add up Ricky's wins on the Honda, multiply that by his bonus incentive, then divide...
Like most breakups, it can be blamed on love or money.

Add up Ricky's wins on the Honda, multiply that by his bonus incentive, then divide by the number of factory Honda championships since then, and you'll have your answer.
DonM wrote:
Actually RC took a pay cut on the salary side and had a heavy bonus laden contract with Suzuki....Honda didn't want to sign him because they...
Actually RC took a pay cut on the salary side and had a heavy bonus laden contract with Suzuki....Honda didn't want to sign him because they thought his knee injury took away from his value...remember Suzuki signed him with his knee injury before he had even ridden an outdoor race. Honda was in a wait and see mode and RC didn't want to wait...the rest is history.
You have it backwards he took the guaranteed money over the chance at a bigger bonus with honda
early
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early 9/22/2013 2:14pm
9/22/2013 2:14pm
Seems to me like Villapoto was smart enough to not participate in a race "for the fans" so he could address medical problems and be ready for more important races not far down the road. Seems smart to me. Wait, where else have I seen this situation...? Whistling
mynewcr250 9/22/2013 2:14pm
9/22/2013 2:14pm Edited Date/Time 9/22/2013 2:16pm
Coyote wrote:
if they want the best riders in the world they're (FIM) going have to accomodate
mynewcr250 wrote:
they have and will continue to have the best riders from the US there despite the schedule. tomac and dungey are there are they not? 2/3...
they have and will continue to have the best riders from the US there despite the schedule. tomac and dungey are there are they not? 2/3 of the best guys already there. they only guy they're missing is the guy that had medical concerns and wanted to address them.
Coyote wrote:
number one, IF and I say IF you have ever trained the way these riders do most of the year then you would understand where the...
number one, IF and I say IF you have ever trained the way these riders do most of the year then you would understand where the majority of people here are coming from!! the other thing is the manufacturers who sponsor these riders to promote their product in the U.S. market don't get much from competing in Europe. As far as the "guy" with the medical issues competing, if the event was held earlier he would of been there
so what? what if he had gotten hurt like he did in supercross with a couple races to go and he goes immediately for medical work? should they now move the mxon back so we can ensure the best US guys will still be there?
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burn1986 9/22/2013 2:24pm
9/22/2013 2:24pm Edited Date/Time 9/22/2013 9:15pm
RMT wrote:
I don't know you and you seem like a good guy, but I really don't feel bad for any pro motocross rider that might have to...
I don't know you and you seem like a good guy, but I really don't feel bad for any pro motocross rider that might have to stay disciplined for one more month. I have to work 12 months of the year and nobody is changing schedules for me. Before you start telling me I have no clue, your wrong as I have worked for one of the Japanese oem's for 10 years and know all to well what it's like to be at the airport every Thursday to head off to the races. I chose to have a family and spend time with them and chose a different path with another non Japanese oem. I enjoy watching the current crop of riders, but have no empathy for them to spend another month doing what they do. If he is injured, it's another story, but just to start you extended vacation a little early is not a reason for the FIM to change anything. And we wonder why the rest of the world thinks we are arrogant.
Haha. Poor helpless millionaire riders who get chosen for the horrible drudgery of one more race vacation that pays their hotel, food, and travel. Even so, it is a little late in the year, and should be moved up to this weekend every year.

I also think they should cancel the MEC.
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GuyB 9/22/2013 2:27pm
9/22/2013 2:27pm
mynewcr250 wrote:
why not move your national schedule back a couple weeks as a courtesy to OUR guys whom YOU know will have to race the MXON in...
why not move your national schedule back a couple weeks as a courtesy to OUR guys whom YOU know will have to race the MXON in late September?

we can do this all day
GuyB wrote:
Why not stop being a fucktard?
mynewcr250 wrote:
is that all you really have, just insults? how is my point not valid? this isnt a U.S. race, so why should they go out of...
is that all you really have, just insults? how is my point not valid?

this isnt a U.S. race, so why should they go out of their way to accommodate U.S. riders? serious question. id like a good reason.

the only thing im hearing is "villopoto is not gonna show up". he needed medical work, he would of been there had he not needed that work so how is that a viable reason for moving the mxon? dungey and tomac are there despite the horrible schedule.
When part of your comeback is, "We can do this all day," you sound like someone who wants to argue just a little too much.

See, if you'd actually gone back and checked the dates of previous MXoNs, like this...

2006 Sept. 23-24
2007 Sept. 22-23
2008 Sept. 27-28
2009 Oct. 3-4
2010 Sept. 25-26
2011 Sept. 17-18
2012 Sept. 29-30

You'd see that Youthstream has been pretty consistent in when they run the race. That's a much better comeback than your previous response.
TripleFive 9/22/2013 2:28pm
9/22/2013 2:28pm
MX is one of the most physically demanding sports there is.

To expect these guys to go all out from January to the end of September is outrageous. Then consider that SX testing has basically already begun, at least for JS7 and CR22.

I can't blame the AMA riders for wanting to blow the MXdN off, and I'm not offended when they do.
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Coyote 9/22/2013 2:29pm
9/22/2013 2:29pm
mynewcr250 wrote:
they have and will continue to have the best riders from the US there despite the schedule. tomac and dungey are there are they not? 2/3...
they have and will continue to have the best riders from the US there despite the schedule. tomac and dungey are there are they not? 2/3 of the best guys already there. they only guy they're missing is the guy that had medical concerns and wanted to address them.
Coyote wrote:
number one, IF and I say IF you have ever trained the way these riders do most of the year then you would understand where the...
number one, IF and I say IF you have ever trained the way these riders do most of the year then you would understand where the majority of people here are coming from!! the other thing is the manufacturers who sponsor these riders to promote their product in the U.S. market don't get much from competing in Europe. As far as the "guy" with the medical issues competing, if the event was held earlier he would of been there
mynewcr250 wrote:
so what? what if he had gotten hurt like he did in supercross with a couple races to go and he goes immediately for medical work...
so what? what if he had gotten hurt like he did in supercross with a couple races to go and he goes immediately for medical work? should they now move the mxon back so we can ensure the best US guys will still be there?
back to my original post, IF they want the best riders in the world they're going to have to accomdate!!

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Deetsmx 9/22/2013 2:53pm
9/22/2013 2:53pm
If the US doesn't go it's just a gp and then the event loses it's luster.
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TeamGreen 9/22/2013 3:15pm
9/22/2013 3:15pm
Deetsmx wrote:
If the US doesn't go it's just a gp and then the event loses it's luster.
Bingo
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Aaryn234 9/22/2013 3:41pm
9/22/2013 3:41pm
Deetsmx wrote:
If the US doesn't go it's just a gp and then the event loses it's luster.
TeamGreen wrote:
Bingo
No it loses it's luster for the U.S fans, the rest of the world continues going and racing and a few other countries share the wins around.

Sure there will be a lot of people on here each year saying IF the U.S was there they would have won and the race is a joke without the U.S there, but they would be U.S fans!

The date is set and riders can choose if they are willing to represent their country on the date provided, if not so be it.

Reed, RV and Herlings are all out of this years event, I am still looking forward to watching it as much as any year.

What about the poor Kiwis, there MX Season finished way back at the start of March! Lucky they had an Aussie season to keep them occupied I guess.
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bobby397 9/22/2013 4:33pm
9/22/2013 4:33pm
Deetsmx wrote:
If the US doesn't go it's just a gp and then the event loses it's luster.
TeamGreen wrote:
Bingo
Yep, then riders like roczen, rattray, musquin will stop going to the event to rest or start preparing for sx. And yes, it wouldn't be anything other than another gp since Aussie sx has started and team Puerto Rico with mostly American riders wouldn't race the event.
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Roscoe33 9/22/2013 7:40pm
9/22/2013 7:40pm
The story I heard was that RC left over his image rights for video games and the push to 450, versus going to Suzuki and owning his image rights for the future and staying on a 2- stroke.
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BobbyM 9/22/2013 7:40pm
9/22/2013 7:40pm
gotta beat the best to be the best...simple as that.
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Gym Briggs 9/22/2013 8:48pm
9/22/2013 8:48pm
I would take what matthes said as trust worthy information. That's the closest you will get to the truth unless RC himself addresses it.

As far as the other debate.. Why does the GP need more rounds when they have trouble filling the gate on the ones they already have . If the schedule is keeping key riders from going then pull your shit together and adjust the GP schedule.

These riders already don't have shit of an off season. Give them a break so we can see 30 more weeks of great action.
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suzuki173 9/22/2013 8:48pm
9/22/2013 8:48pm
coolhand wrote:
DC, I have a lot of respect for what you have done for MX..but the comment about riders having to stay in shape for another 30-45...
DC, I have a lot of respect for what you have done for MX..but the comment about riders having to stay in shape for another
30-45 days is BS..mx's core comes from hard working people, top guys make millions..if you can't stay in shape for that then maybe your belong in tennis.


I knew RC what he was sitting in the back of my truck eating PB on white bread. Honda treated him like a has been pure and simple.. He got the last laugh...
Not sure you realize how hard tennis players have to train...
coolhand
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coolhand 9/23/2013 4:05am
9/23/2013 4:05am
Guys, I realize that tennis players train hard.
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Huckster 9/23/2013 4:43am
9/23/2013 4:43am
Deetsmx wrote:
If the US doesn't go it's just a gp and then the event loses it's luster.
we shouldn't go. This passion of ours has become a big business. It's no longer 1980. Timed qualifiers are gone, two day nationals are gone, privateers in their pickup's have gone the way of bigfoot, the lockness monster and two strokes and so should the MXoN. Why should RD, RV or any of our other top guys risk their health and career for a one off race that is a no win situation for them? If they win, its expected and even if they finish on the podium, its not good enough. Why take the risk?
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swtwtwtw 9/23/2013 5:13am
9/23/2013 5:13am
On the des Nations thing, isn't it a voluntary race? On SX and Nat's, perhaps cut out a couple of SX's and shorten the Nat's by a couple of rounds too. The nat's could be run two weeks on, two weeks off. On the RC deal, what a guy, he was good to Kawi, Honda, and Suz. I found a couple of pennies this morning :-)
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jamma10 9/23/2013 5:23am
9/23/2013 5:23am Edited Date/Time 9/23/2013 5:54am
DC wrote:
It wasn't that acrimonious. In fact, Ricky wore the #1 plate in that last race in 2004 in tribute to Honda and the whole team. He...
It wasn't that acrimonious. In fact, Ricky wore the #1 plate in that last race in 2004 in tribute to Honda and the whole team. He was in a hurry to get on the yellow bike, and Stewart was in a hurry to move up to the big boys' class, and there just wasn't a lot of interest on any sides...

I truly believe that the FIM needs to rethink the dates of the MXoN and get it back up into the middle of September, not at the end of the month, now that the U.S. season ends in August. It's probably been really hard for Ryan and Justin and Eli to take a break, and hard for Roczen to do his testing as he prepares to move up to the 450. Guys might take a pass this year because of the five-week delay -- most prominently Villopoto this time -- because the added month of focus and training.

DC
MX Sports
"now that the U.S. season ends in August..."

Seems as though the problem stems from this then. Though there was only a week gap between Pala and the MXdN in 2011 and I remember people complaining about lack of time then!

People are often criticising the short amount of time between the end of the SX season and the start of the MX season. It sounds as though a later start or a few more rest weekends would be welcomed. It would also allow riders to stay sharp right up until the MXdN.

Obviously this is much easier said than done, but the same can be said for organising the GP calendar and the other National Championships. As GuyB's post points out, you know roughly when the MXdN is going to be scheduled every year, so really it should be easier for you to accomodate it, rather than ask Youthstream to change the date which suits the majority.

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