KTM/Shorty question

hartebreak
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hartebreak
Edited Date/Time 10/19/2012 6:04pm
When Shorty was with KTM he signed a 1 year deal with a mutual option for a 2nd year. He obviously didnt like the 350 and he got hurt testing what would be Dungeys future bike. I remember watching an interview after he signed with Larry and he talked about his deal with KTM and said something along the lines of " I got hurt testing the new bike, I was excited to have a chance to ride it next year, but some things went down and it didnt work out." Anyone know what "things" went down? Was it that KTM didnt have any $$$ left after signing Dungey or maybe Shorty kind of felt like a 2nd or 3rd fiddle once Ryan came on. I just kinda wonder what happened because i really think he could have done well on the new bike. Anyone know the facts?
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D702
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D702 10/18/2012 7:18pm
10/18/2012 7:18pm
I am betting that KTM told him he had to ride the 350 and couldn't ride the new 450 that just broke both his arms and he didn't dig that too much.
Wolfman
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Wolfman 10/18/2012 7:32pm
10/18/2012 7:32pm
Keep Two Mechanics, lol.
stantdm
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stantdm 10/18/2012 7:56pm
10/18/2012 7:56pm
That is what I thought D702, that 350 was not his favorite bike. He stated somewhere that he was really glad to be back on the Honda 450. It was noted that KTM would have kept him but Andrew was really wanting to get back on the 450. It was a smart move since he won Seattle.

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jamma10
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jamma10 10/19/2012 1:27am
10/19/2012 1:27am
stantdm wrote:
That is what I thought D702, that 350 was not his favorite bike. He stated somewhere that he was really glad to be back on the...
That is what I thought D702, that 350 was not his favorite bike. He stated somewhere that he was really glad to be back on the Honda 450. It was noted that KTM would have kept him but Andrew was really wanting to get back on the 450. It was a smart move since he won Seattle.
And ironically Roczen finished in 2nd on the 350. Better than any of Shorts finishes on it the previous year.
Motocross83 10/19/2012 5:22am
10/19/2012 5:22am
I think the big problem with the 350 (or at least has been so far) in America is the tracks. The tracks are much more about sheer hp in the Nationals than they are the GPs. Cairoli himself has said on a couple of occasions that he could not make the 350 work in the Nationals and that he'd have to switch to a 450.
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Shawn142 10/19/2012 5:44am
10/19/2012 5:44am
stantdm wrote:
That is what I thought D702, that 350 was not his favorite bike. He stated somewhere that he was really glad to be back on the...
That is what I thought D702, that 350 was not his favorite bike. He stated somewhere that he was really glad to be back on the Honda 450. It was noted that KTM would have kept him but Andrew was really wanting to get back on the 450. It was a smart move since he won Seattle.
jamma10 wrote:
And ironically Roczen finished in 2nd on the 350. Better than any of Shorts finishes on it the previous year.
And who beat Roczen to win that SX?
dl117
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dl117 10/19/2012 6:16am
10/19/2012 6:16am
jamma10 wrote:
And ironically Roczen finished in 2nd on the 350. Better than any of Shorts finishes on it the previous year.
One thing I think is a differance is going from a 250 UP to 350. Shorty rode a 450 real well and I think it is a step backwards going to the 350 for him.
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jamma10 10/19/2012 6:41am
10/19/2012 6:41am Edited Date/Time 10/19/2012 6:42am
stantdm wrote:
That is what I thought D702, that 350 was not his favorite bike. He stated somewhere that he was really glad to be back on the...
That is what I thought D702, that 350 was not his favorite bike. He stated somewhere that he was really glad to be back on the Honda 450. It was noted that KTM would have kept him but Andrew was really wanting to get back on the 450. It was a smart move since he won Seattle.
jamma10 wrote:
And ironically Roczen finished in 2nd on the 350. Better than any of Shorts finishes on it the previous year.
Shawn142 wrote:
And who beat Roczen to win that SX?
Rocen was a 17 year old Supercross rookie. Short is a seasoned Supercross veteran. I think Roczen even led him for most of the race didn't he?
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jamma10 10/19/2012 6:41am
10/19/2012 6:41am
jamma10 wrote:
And ironically Roczen finished in 2nd on the 350. Better than any of Shorts finishes on it the previous year.
dl117 wrote:
One thing I think is a differance is going from a 250 UP to 350. Shorty rode a 450 real well and I think it is...
One thing I think is a differance is going from a 250 UP to 350. Shorty rode a 450 real well and I think it is a step backwards going to the 350 for him.
Absolutely agree.
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Dezerted 10/19/2012 7:51am
10/19/2012 7:51am
AC222's 350 in the GPs is nothing like the 350 ridden here state side. Wink
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newmann 10/19/2012 8:09am
10/19/2012 8:09am
Dezerted wrote:
AC222's 350 in the GPs is nothing like the 350 ridden here state side. Wink
Everybody says that yet nobody ever has a single detail as to what they are claiming. Winky eye.

Obviously it must be a 4 cam 16 valve head and 622 cc's since he rides it "over there".
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Deetsmx 10/19/2012 8:47am
10/19/2012 8:47am
newmann wrote:
Everybody says that yet nobody ever has a single detail as to what they are claiming. Winky eye. Obviously it must be a 4 cam 16...
Everybody says that yet nobody ever has a single detail as to what they are claiming. Winky eye.

Obviously it must be a 4 cam 16 valve head and 622 cc's since he rides it "over there".
I have details but I'm not about to splatter the who are what on here but it's closer to 400.
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davistld01 10/19/2012 9:14am
10/19/2012 9:14am
I just think Shorty flat could see the writing on the wall, and saw that Dungey would be the only one to ride the 450 because Roger hired him on that premise. He obviously didn't like the 350, but could see that he would probably have been made to race it again in 2012 had he stayed. I really don't think him crashing on the 450 and breaking his elbows was the deciding factor. Nobody likes to be in a shadow, especially when they can be the team leader elsewhere.

He's a Honda guy anyway...
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hartebreak 10/19/2012 11:38am
10/19/2012 11:38am
davistld01 wrote:
I just think Shorty flat could see the writing on the wall, and saw that Dungey would be the only one to ride the 450 because...
I just think Shorty flat could see the writing on the wall, and saw that Dungey would be the only one to ride the 450 because Roger hired him on that premise. He obviously didn't like the 350, but could see that he would probably have been made to race it again in 2012 had he stayed. I really don't think him crashing on the 450 and breaking his elbows was the deciding factor. Nobody likes to be in a shadow, especially when they can be the team leader elsewhere.

He's a Honda guy anyway...
That's kind of what I'm thinking. Roger probably told Short that he (Roger) was going to really focus on Dungey and Short probably felt a little pissed. Short said that he was going to ride the 450 so I don't thnk the. 350 was the issue.
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Presley155 10/19/2012 11:42am
10/19/2012 11:42am
What is the biggest advantage of a 450 over a 350? The start. Cairoli is not at such a disadvantage in the GP's because their starts are built to favor the most inside gate. AC can turn fast laps on the 350 or 400 or whatever the heck it actually is, so he gets pole position pretty much every race. With the starts in the US not favoring the inside most gate (at least at most of the nationals), AC would have a hard time yanking holies' against all the bigger 450's on his 350/400.
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Deetsmx 10/19/2012 12:10pm
10/19/2012 12:10pm
Presley155 wrote:
What is the biggest advantage of a 450 over a 350? The start. Cairoli is not at such a disadvantage in the GP's because their starts...
What is the biggest advantage of a 450 over a 350? The start. Cairoli is not at such a disadvantage in the GP's because their starts are built to favor the most inside gate. AC can turn fast laps on the 350 or 400 or whatever the heck it actually is, so he gets pole position pretty much every race. With the starts in the US not favoring the inside most gate (at least at most of the nationals), AC would have a hard time yanking holies' against all the bigger 450's on his 350/400.
His bike flat hauls, look at some of the start pictures and he's often a few lengths ahead. I think on an AMA 350 with the deep ripped starts and the starts that aren't always best from the inside he would have a tougher time. It looks like they've made a lot of progress on that bike stock so it would be interesting to see another top rider on one here now that they've had a few years of development. I still think that's the bike Stewart should be riding in SX.
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Dezerted 10/19/2012 1:22pm
10/19/2012 1:22pm
Dezerted wrote:
AC222's 350 in the GPs is nothing like the 350 ridden here state side. Wink
newmann wrote:
Everybody says that yet nobody ever has a single detail as to what they are claiming. Winky eye. Obviously it must be a 4 cam 16...
Everybody says that yet nobody ever has a single detail as to what they are claiming. Winky eye.

Obviously it must be a 4 cam 16 valve head and 622 cc's since he rides it "over there".
you could choose to believe its a 350 if u like but mr winky eye and apparently many others KNOW its not.

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Faceaz
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Faceaz 10/19/2012 1:24pm
10/19/2012 1:24pm Edited Date/Time 10/19/2012 1:25pm
Dezerted wrote:
AC222's 350 in the GPs is nothing like the 350 ridden here state side. Wink
But the stock 13 350 seems to be beating the majority of 450's in the shootouts this year. IMO will take awhile, but 450's are destined to go the way of 500cc 2 strokes.
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Ing 10/19/2012 2:14pm
10/19/2012 2:14pm
Even if it's a hot rodded 400 Caroli rides it's still 50cc less than the average 450
TripleFive 10/19/2012 2:29pm
10/19/2012 2:29pm
Rumor has it that a KTM cough in a rhythm section was the cause of his broken elbows. Something tells me that that incident was the beginning of the end for his orange days.
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stantdm 10/19/2012 2:40pm
10/19/2012 2:40pm Edited Date/Time 10/19/2012 2:40pm
jamma10 wrote:
Rocen was a 17 year old Supercross rookie. Short is a seasoned Supercross veteran. I think Roczen even led him for most of the race didn't...
Rocen was a 17 year old Supercross rookie. Short is a seasoned Supercross veteran. I think Roczen even led him for most of the race didn't he?
No, Short led that one from start to finish unless you count two corners where Roczen went around him but then Short cut back underneath and back into the lead.
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davistld01 10/19/2012 3:26pm
10/19/2012 3:26pm
I think, with the right rider (ie: lighter, younger...a la Roczen & TC) in the saddle, the 350...at least the 2013 factory 350 might be a podium threat indoors here, and maybe a fluke outdoor moto or two. But, IMO...against a line of factory 450's on an American-style outdoor track it just doesn't have the beans.
St Ann More 10/19/2012 4:02pm
10/19/2012 4:02pm
newmann wrote:
Everybody says that yet nobody ever has a single detail as to what they are claiming. Winky eye. Obviously it must be a 4 cam 16...
Everybody says that yet nobody ever has a single detail as to what they are claiming. Winky eye.

Obviously it must be a 4 cam 16 valve head and 622 cc's since he rides it "over there".
Deetsmx wrote:
I have details but I'm not about to splatter the who are what on here but it's closer to 400.
'I have details but'... Whistling ... that old chestnut! Wink
TripleDigit 10/19/2012 6:04pm
10/19/2012 6:04pm
Roczen did well on the 350,he actually did pretty good the previous year at Daytona,Musquin as well when he rode it,I don't think there's much doubt that the right guy could win on one in SX,Roczen nearly had Short but admitted he was getting pretty sketchy and backed off

When Cairoli moved up to MX1 his De Carli YZ450 was sleeved down to around 400cc,and indeed he has said he might well go with the 450 if he ever did some AMA races,he was a touch down on power at Colorado,although the altitude may have hindered him there too

I think the 350 is here to stay and will only get better,as for Shorty's whole deal who knows what went on,I agrree he surei would've preferred the 450 KTM,

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