Thoughts on earning extra points...

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8/15/2019 7:06 PM

Follow me here...and let's try to keep it civil.

GIVEN:

-The rules are such that during each moto a rider can earn a maximum of 25 points. (50 pts for the race)

-We also know a 2nd in the first moto is as good as a first if you win the second moto (because the 2nd moto is "weighted" heavier and a 2-1 beats a 1-2)

THE IDEA:

To offer more point opportunities, why not award an extra point (or more) for the guy who wins the race. This provides incentive and reward for riders to want to win the race not just manage the points lead by going 1-2 or 2-1. It also might keep the points closer and provide for better racing near the end of the season.

While we're at it, maybe award a point for being the top qualifier and for running the fastest lap in the second moto (similar justification for the second moto score having more weight. Track is typically tougher.)

Curious to hear everyone's thoughts...

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8/15/2019 7:09 PM

I'm all for an extra point being awarded for the overall winner.

I could go along with an extra point for fastest qualifier too.

Not sure about the rest...

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8/15/2019 7:12 PM

The problem with adding bonus points for winning qualifying, motos, or heat races makes a dominant rider pull away quicker. There were years where Stewart won every heat race, he would have won the championship a week earlier.

When there is parody already in the field is when the points stay close. You can’t manufacture a tight points race without it becoming a gimmick like Nascar.

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8/15/2019 7:47 PM

If the second moto is a tie breaker, break the tie damn it! Points for the overall. Don’t just say there’s a winner. Let the points show it.

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8/16/2019 3:56 AM

Im ok with an extra 1 or 2 points for an overall.

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8/16/2019 4:21 AM

How about points only for overall? Would make the win more meaningful, and keep guys from pulling off if there's no chance of top 20.

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8/16/2019 4:40 AM

Extra 100 points if you’re winning the points and,you are on a green bike - Photoand you agree to go to the MXDN and serve your country. Dammit.

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8/16/2019 4:51 AM

I get the idea on this to keep the points closer, but in this years scenario it would just make the gap bigger co side ring AC has 6 OAs compared to Dylan’s 2, so I don’t know if it would really matter in the long run besides seeing on paper that someone clearly had the win with an extra point.

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8/16/2019 4:59 AM

Not a fan of top qualifier points. We've all seen what a shit show qualifying is. You have guys on heaters, trying to play frogger around guys cadillacing around. Race points should be just that, during the race, in my opinion.

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8/16/2019 5:09 AM

The thing is, they call the 2nd moto winner the overall winner because they need to make a distinction that someone is the event winner. In essence, a 2-1 and a 1-2 really tied for the day, hence they come away with the came points.

How about this....if you have 2-1 and 1-2 moto finishes (for example), you have a final 1 lap shoot out between the two immediately after the track is cleared from the second moto? You can award, say, 5 points for the shootout winner and then there truly is an overall event winner based off of a better performance on the day. That one lap battle would be epic for spectators. Also, there would situations where someone would race harder the second moto because they wanted to "stay out" of a shootout situation. Conversely, there could be situations where someone in the second moto may want to "lose" a position to therefore force a post race shootout to try and gain more points vs just winning on the day. It could lead to teams and riders having to come up with all kinds of "on the fly" race strategies for points, and it would be really exciting for the spectators.

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8/16/2019 5:12 AM

Formula 1 has went to awarding and extra point for fastest lap of the race, and it seems to be working well.

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8/16/2019 6:10 AM

rhargrave431 wrote:

Formula 1 has went to awarding and extra point for fastest lap of the race, and it seems to be working well.

Ye, but its really not that easy in mx. Fastest lap always happens in the first 2-3 rounds, after that the track is usually pretty much destroyed.

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8/16/2019 6:29 AM

Motocross/Supercross are sports where there tends to be a dominate rider and that causes poor points chases.

You have two choices:

1 Deal with it and enjoy the dominance.
2. Create some ridiculous system like NASCAR where you really have a end of season champion, not a full years champion.

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8/16/2019 9:02 AM

dirtworldmx wrote:

How about points only for overall? Would make the win more meaningful, and keep guys from pulling off if there's no chance of ...more

I like this idea, but it would also create lots of situations when riders don't need to pass the guy in front to secure the overall or next position overall. Each moto might suffer in excitement as a result.

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Braaapin' aint easy.

8/16/2019 10:33 AM

KirkChandler wrote:

The problem with adding bonus points for winning qualifying, motos, or heat races makes a dominant rider pull away quicker. ...more

I see what you're saying but the days of RC, Stewart, RV, RD, etc are behind us. I think we're seeing riders more closely matched up and we're not seeing the same guy having the fastest lap time, fasted lap, and winning the race week in and week out.

Even Tomac has shown to have more than a couple bad days even though on any given weekend he might be the FMOTP. This might give guys like Marvin, Kenny, Zach, and Jason an opportunity to capitalize when the "dominate rider" has one or two bad motos or even races.

Something to think about for sure.

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8/16/2019 10:40 AM

I think it is fine the way it is. Honestly, I thought SX was fine with 1 main event also. Sure the 3 mains are interesting, mostly because the races are shorter so the riders tend to be closer together, but overall I think 1 main is fine and 2 motos is fine. No extra points for qualifying, nor heat races. And tell Monster to pound sand, 26 points for a win is GAY.

25, 22, 20, 18..

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8/16/2019 10:41 AM

dickjackson170 wrote:

Not a fan of top qualifier points. We've all seen what a shit show qualifying is. You have guys on heaters, trying to play ...more

Qualifying is part of racing. It dictates your gate pick and dictates who gets to race in the main.

The benefit would be to not only get the best gate pick but a bonus point for being top qualifier.

Justin Cooper would be killing it with extra points. haha

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8/16/2019 10:45 AM

KHI Guy wrote:

The thing is, they call the 2nd moto winner the overall winner because they need to make a distinction that someone is the ...more

How many other sports do this? None. MotoGP, Formula 1, MXGP... Mostly because of time and tv.

I agree it would be epic to see a one on one battle but this idea couldn't be realistically implemented.



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8/16/2019 10:47 AM

rhargrave431 wrote:

Formula 1 has went to awarding and extra point for fastest lap of the race, and it seems to be working well.

That's where the idea came from. It's amazing that the drivers care about that one point but they do and sometimes it comes at the end of the race...because of tires, fuel, and the need to keep the other guy from getting that extra point.

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8/16/2019 10:47 AM

dickjackson170 wrote:

Not a fan of top qualifier points. We've all seen what a shit show qualifying is. You have guys on heaters, trying to play ...more

Zaugg wrote:

Qualifying is part of racing. It dictates your gate pick and dictates who gets to race in the main.

The benefit would be to ...more

I get the thought process, I just don't agree with it. We don't pass out points for winning practice.

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8/16/2019 10:51 AM

Zaugg wrote:

Qualifying is part of racing. It dictates your gate pick and dictates who gets to race in the main.

The benefit would be to ...more

Justin Cooper would also be killing it if he didn't have a "2nd half of the season" fade happening.

I'm not a fan of points for timed qualifying because I do not think it is relevant. Some riders don't stress about getting the hottest lap in, and instead work on the bike settings or a particular section of the track. Look at MXGP, they have timed Q and a 20 minute qualifying race and there are no points awarded there.

Outdoor points are just fine the way it is IMO. SX needs to award a point or 2 for a heat race win, especially since they have gone back to 1-9 transfers. There is not much racing between 3-6 in the average heat race these days. And for the Triple Crown races, I believe there needs to be a points structure for each gangbang, not just the overall.

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Old MXer turned Superfan.

8/16/2019 10:54 AM

mx 219 wrote:

I think it is fine the way it is. Honestly, I thought SX was fine with 1 main event also. Sure the 3 mains are interesting, ...more

Not suggesting 26 points per moto...nor am I suggesting MX move to a 1-moto format.

You're injecting SX points issues into an MX discussion which doesn't translate because MX determines the winner with 2 motos not a single main event.

For what it's worth, I agree that 26 points in SX doesn't make sense...

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8/16/2019 11:00 AM

hamncheeze wrote:

Justin Cooper would also be killing it if he didn't have a "2nd half of the season" fade happening.

I'm not a fan of points ...more

Not talking about SX. MX and SX are two totally different racing structures. (We can fix SX in another thread. haha)

Again these are just ideas. The main idea being to award an extra point for the guy who wins the race.

The other point opportunities were just ideas to kick around.

It's pretty cool to hear what people think.

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8/16/2019 11:04 AM

I think an extra point should be given only if first and second overall went 2-1. 1-2. Receiving the same points for second place doesn’t seem right.

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8/16/2019 11:16 AM

mx 219 wrote:

I think it is fine the way it is. Honestly, I thought SX was fine with 1 main event also. Sure the 3 mains are interesting, ...more

Zaugg wrote:

Not suggesting 26 points per moto...nor am I suggesting MX move to a 1-moto format.

You're injecting SX points issues into an ...more

My point was, why does it need to change?

My suggestion, no points changes, no format changes. Not broke, don't fix it.

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8/16/2019 11:26 AM

Not saying it's broke.

I'm suggesting we discuss ways to improve the points system.

Your position is the sport doesn't need improvement. That's your opinion.

Again, interesting to hear everyone's perspective.


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8/16/2019 11:30 AM

camstop22 wrote:

I think an extra point should be given only if first and second overall went 2-1. 1-2. Receiving the same points for second ...more

Not really sure what you're saying...my apologies.

Second place overall wouldn't get a point just the racer who won the overall.

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8/16/2019 6:47 PM

KHI Guy wrote:

The thing is, they call the 2nd moto winner the overall winner because they need to make a distinction that someone is the ...more

Zaugg wrote:

How many other sports do this? None. MotoGP, Formula 1, MXGP... Mostly because of time and tv.

I agree it would be epic to ...more

It wouldn't take much time at all. Go right back to the starting line when the moto was over. Couple of minutes to clear the track, 2+ minutes to run one lap....You're right though, it would never happen.

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