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And by this I don't mean to cross jump, get in the way on purpose etc.
It's funny when guys put 45-50 seconds on a lapper and then complain they can't get around them (or jump into the back of them like Hunter) like guys... the track has more than one line, you're good enough to move around a bit.
Have you ridden an indoor style track where you have to commit to things very quickly and 100%? And where if you need to back out of things it’s almost impossible?
Lol. In your scenario, the lappers should get to use the primo race lines and punish the leaders by having to use alternative lines? Shouldn't it be the other way around?
It’s funny when a top rider spends the whole race to build a 3 second gap on his main rival and loses 6 seconds passing a fucking nobody.
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If a “lapper” get the holeshot, how long does it take the top guys to get around him?
Why is it any different later?
Everyone is trying to fix the lapper problem. It’s not really a lapper problem, it’s a Vince problem
I personally think some of them ( not Vince )get in the way, by trying too hard to get out of the way.
Gworm it can fuck the race up early too… ever see a top guy get a lap or two of clean air while the next top guy has to fumble fuck his way through a couple “lappers” early on? And bam the guy out front has a 12 second lead in no time…
How is this so complicated?
Eli can have 15 riders in the main… but he’ll still have to deal with 13th place Vince 😂
I’ll take the opinion on lappers from those that are consistently affected by them over a guy that essentially made a career out of being one.
So should we just pick who we want to win, and not even hold a race? Or just run the top five?
Good lord, can we hurry up and get to this weekend so the AMA can screw something up different! This lapper talk is just lame. Sorry not sorry, its not going to change.
Does the straw man argument mean anything to you?
You lost me on this. I don’t see this as a straw man argument at all.
But you also mention complicated…
What is less complicated than just letting them race. If some goon does something egregious, penalize the crap out of them.
"Getting out of the way" shouldn't be what we're asking for. Not "Jumping from out of the way to into the way" is the problem.
Yea, I was on pins and needles watching MC get by Grayson Goodman, or Reed get around paul the roadblock carpenter.
Ok...here are the 2 new rules for lappers.
RULE #1...don't piss of Eli.
RULE #2...Seriously, stop pissing off Eli.
What would be the downside to at least pulling guys off the track once they go 2 laps down?
It’s too late by then and you’ve only punished the leaders by the time you yank them off.
To quote Bob Hannah, "the blue flag means there is a race going on......and you are not in it!"
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“Punished the leaders?” They’re still in the race. The lappers getting black-flagged are the ones getting punished. The upside is that positions 3 and later have less traffic to deal with and it could possibly make the racing more exciting.
They also may start to race the leader so they can stay in the race
That happened at Unadilla during Jett's rookie 450 year. Both he and Chase complained on the podium about lappers trying to race them.
MC used to say the same thing about guys trying to look cool racing him after a bad night.
I don't understand why they don't just tighten up the blue flags, so wave them when it is actually necessary AND make it no passing, unless you're the leaders.
That way, the 2+ backmarkers can pull over or slow down without having to also defend their hard-fought position as well.
Seems pretty bloody simple to me.
They put riders with hugely different skill sets on a track with 45 second lap times for 20 minutes and complain about lappers? Simple solution, no more 450s, everybody at the supercross is on a 250 - 2 or 4 stroke, no more 250/450 class bullshit. We don't need two different classes based on arbitrary engine size; this is pro motor sports. 40 riders go to the night show through timed qualifying, two heats of 20 - top 9 in each heat go to the main, 4 get in through the LCQ. Everybody else goes to the 15 minutes plus 2 B main after the A main runs 20 minutes plus 2. Less wear on the track, Friese, Harlan, Moranz, wouldn't make the A main probably and get in the way, and fans would get to see the 20 best compete. So what if we lose some 250 teams, or there are fewer jobs, sorry but nobody goes to a supercross to see how any of the teams that would leave would do. It makes no sense to have riders like Deegan, Kitchen, Shimoda, Davies, in the "lesser" class, and people like Trystan Lane on the track with Tomac. We have maybe 8(?) factory teams now, I think it could work hypothetically.
I don't envy the situation the lappers are in. Trying to race for position, blue flags all over the track not necessarily with a leader near the rider, bunch of 90degree turns forcing one line. I'd feel much better penalizing folks if the blue flags were really consistent and could be depended on for lapping.
But watching Bubba's podcast, man, Friese really was racing Tomac while being lapped before he cross-jumped (or got kicked due to ruts). That was pretty clear cut to me but I guess not to AMA. Really it was good that Tomac and Webb let loose on the situation to draw attention to a solution.
It does seem very simple but we're talking about the AMA here
The first lapped rider is in last place so why not just throw a black flag instead of blue? 20,19,18 on down the line would be their result for the race. I think it would add some extra excitement too. Some races go pretty deep into lappers and it would mean something special when the leader knocks out over half the field. I’m not entirely serious about this but I do think it would add an extra storyline. Everyone is watching the top 5 guys anyway. Plus the track would break down a little less too.
This isn't quite true. We have been lucky with some good races at the front lately, but often the leader is just off by himself. Then we are watching other battles in the field, sometimes the best battles are 10th and back.....
However, as part of the triple crown, losing the back markers as part of that "special" show might be fun. so long as its only rarely done.
Vince has been put on probation, fined and suspended multiple times in his career. Going all the way back to 2011, he was suspended from a race entirely for dirty riding. Now ask yourself, did you see any real change stem from that in 2011? Walk yourself through the subsequent years after 2011 with VF incidents. The suspension and fines changed the behavior as you suggest they would now?
My question would be WHO is waving the blue flags? Are they seasoned racers, hired professionals, volunteers? Do they have headsets telling them when to flag? Fans need to know.
Post a reply to: JT's opinion on Lappers