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course i woulda said 40 plus 2...
A little history... The two 250cc 4 stroke was made to compete directly with a 125cc 2 stroke, when they came on the market they did.. Does anyone remember bubba waxing the field a field of primarily 250cc 4 strokes on his 125cc 2 stroke???
When the factories started to focus on the advancement of the 4 stroke and stopped focusing on the 2 stroke the 4 stroke naturally became a better bike. That goes for both the 125cc 2 stroke vs 250 4 stroke and the 250cc 2 stroke vs 450cc 4 stroke.
The factories are not solely responsible for the slow death of the 2 stroke.. Racers all around the world started buying 4 strokes to get an advantage. If people were buying 2 strokes factories would be making them not the other way around.
If you walk around a national today I bet the majority of the fans who indeed race or just ride, own a 4 stroke and are quite happy with it. The argument that the fans are demanding a 2 stroke is limited in my opinion mainly to the message boards.
To argue that the 250cc 2 stroke should be allowed to compete against the 250cc 4 stroke IMO is abolishing the 125cc class altogether, something I think you Traditionalist (2 stroke lovers) should strongly be against.
Just my opinion the 2 stroke is not the answer, it is the past, let it go...
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You did bring up a valid point though, manufacturers stopped updating 2 strokes.
Why would anyone buy a 2 stroke when it is 5 year old technology with new plastics. On the other hand, how can a manufacturer justify making a new 2 stroke when the old ones arent selling.
How many things will this apply to in the next few years? I understand DC is working his ass off for the sport, I just worry as to what we are going to end up with.
I really, really hope we don't end up with outdoor supercross and TV coverage full of fluff... please god no.
The fluff is put in there to entertain and attract a wider audience. No fluff no live (same day)TV coverage. I don't know what side of the fence you fall on but I certainly can deal with 5 minutes of fluff for live TV.
And as far as how many things will apply with "In the past let it go"? I think DC probably knows and respects the heritage of motocross better than 99.9% of forum posters.
There are certain aspects of supercross that make it more marketable and TV friendly that motocross can adopt. That doesn't mean that motocross is going to become outdoor supercross. The essence of motocross is the balls to the wall fast paced, ruff track, tuff conditions racing. That essence can be kept and still made TV friendly.
As for the changes that have been made? A one day format is the only significant change I can think of that has been made. Every team rider, mechanic, bus driver seems to be in favor of it. As for the fans, I went last year IMO the one day format made race day more exciting with a lot more continual action. The racing was just as good as ever.
Change is inevitable.... What is possible is change for the better.
That is my hope "blahblah"!
Keep up the good work DC!
Btw, this is always the best part of the "anonymous industry" guy's post... don't forget to tell everyone they don't have a clue! LOL
Carry on
You pointed out that the 250F is superior to the 125 2 stroke, this has already abolished the 125cc class. So adding the 250cc 2 stroke isn't abolishing anything.
By adding the 250 2 stroke, then you are giving anyone that wants to ride a 2 stroke an equal or slight advantage to the 4stroke riders.(the same advantage the 250F guys have against the 125cc riders, right?)
Mainly privateers would have the choice,making it an affordable option for them.
I suppose my point and most of us 2 stroke lovers is, "what and or who does it hurt to allow them"??
Of course, I'm biased, I own a 250cc 2 stroke and am a die hard fan of them.
DC, you are so awesome for coming on here and listening to the bitch fest. Thank you for taking the time, because God knows you have a million other things to take care of. As with any open discussion, you take the good with the bad, but the important part is that you're here and giving direct answers, despite your obligation to not disclose proprietary info.
Regarding the core fan versus new eyeballs, TV argument... I think the non-race filler is important (aka rider profiles). Moreover, to not take advantage of the opportunity to attract a new audience through the NBC, Speed, and Alli relationships that you have worked so hard to secure would be foolish. Although, I would like to meet the creative team behind the rider profile pieces because they suck terribly IMO. I mean, is there really no better alternative for threading the entertainment needle between current and future fans of Supercross?
Pit Row
Where would you draw the line... What if you had a top racer on a works 250 2 stroke? how big of an advantage would that be?
Again, the simple question is, who is it hurting to allow cc vs. cc? Seems to work okay at the amateur level just fine.
Anyway..I know it's a dead horse and it's a pipe dream so.. on to other debates.
Down here in Oz they have a pretty cool system. I think the fans would like it a bit more as well. The first round of the season we did 3 20min +1 lap motos. I thought it was a really good idea and makes for tighter racing. Normally in the traditional 30s everyone is pretty spread out after 15-20minutes.
They also have 4 15minute motos back to back to back. I think there are 5 minute breaks between each moto. I don't think this would be a very good system to have to race in and not many team mangers in the US would go for this one.
I think the 3 20s could go over really well and make for some good racing. Maybe throw that out there for an idea to everyone and see how it goes? It will be a bit more work to the teams but I think the crowds are going to enjoy it a lot more having another gate drop per class and the possibilty of different leaders each moto. It also changes up the overalls a lot having that one extra moto for points.
Just an idea,
PJ
DC: "We have to hold races for the bikes that are being made by all of the OEMs, not a couple of them."
Chicken or egg?
Oh and BTW.. Great ride last weekend PJ. Way to make all the satellite teams that passed up on you here in the states wonder WTF were we thinking. I can list 20 guys that are on teams that if I was a team manager would not of been picked up over you.
Good luck the rest of the year PJ and hope to have you back in the states where you should be soon..But hey..Party lock a rock star while you're down there.. I'm sure an American winning national races down in OZ will be able to pull the ladies. Enjoy!!
As for the motos I think it would be a good thing to bring up in a meeting with all the team mangers and see what they think. I say don't rule it out until it has a trial run at one of the nationals though.
PJ
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