Sexton’s Secret Suspension Switch to KYB?

ILoveMoto
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3/11/2024 11:06am Edited Date/Time 3/11/2024 11:13am
LungButter wrote:

Did Barcia or any of the other Team Austria guys have them this weekend?

ML and the guy with the funny accent go into detail about it on their race review. I don't remember the particulars except it was a mixed bag.

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aeffertz
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3/11/2024 11:25am
LungButter wrote:

Did Barcia or any of the other Team Austria guys have them this weekend?

Barcia emphasized he was on "stock WP components and that's all I got to say about that" this weekend when Lewis interviewed him after the race. Seemed kind of odd he kept specifically saying "stock WP components" but there's that I guess. Grinning

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ML512
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3/11/2024 2:51pm

The best I can guess, based on what I saw, is Barcia was on WP kit suspension...possibly tuned by someone outside of the team or internal WP sources.

My three guesses would be Factory Connection, TCD, or REP. One has responded with no, waiting on the other, don't have a contact for one of the three.

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Money
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3/11/2024 4:24pm
ML512 wrote:
The best I can guess, based on what I saw, is Barcia was on WP kit suspension...possibly tuned by someone outside of the team or internal...

The best I can guess, based on what I saw, is Barcia was on WP kit suspension...possibly tuned by someone outside of the team or internal WP sources.

My three guesses would be Factory Connection, TCD, or REP. One has responded with no, waiting on the other, don't have a contact for one of the three.

With REP in freestone dont see how it was them. I would bet its FC 

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The Shop

ML512
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3/11/2024 4:50pm
ML512 wrote:
The best I can guess, based on what I saw, is Barcia was on WP kit suspension...possibly tuned by someone outside of the team or internal...

The best I can guess, based on what I saw, is Barcia was on WP kit suspension...possibly tuned by someone outside of the team or internal WP sources.

My three guesses would be Factory Connection, TCD, or REP. One has responded with no, waiting on the other, don't have a contact for one of the three.

Money wrote:

With REP in freestone dont see how it was them. I would bet its FC 

All of the brands mentioned have plentiful staff to pull it off if necessary.

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3/11/2024 5:10pm

Did Webb use FC for a round or 2 of outdoors last year? Then that got shut down?

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ML512
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3/11/2024 5:18pm

Did Webb use FC for a round or 2 of outdoors last year? Then that got shut down?

Webb was using FC last year for some races.

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3/11/2024 5:42pm
LungButter wrote:

Did Barcia or any of the other Team Austria guys have them this weekend?

aeffertz wrote:
Barcia emphasized he was on "stock WP components and that's all I got to say about that" this weekend when Lewis interviewed him after the race...

Barcia emphasized he was on "stock WP components and that's all I got to say about that" this weekend when Lewis interviewed him after the race. Seemed kind of odd he kept specifically saying "stock WP components" but there's that I guess. Grinning

Probably because he wants to be on the 52mm’s 

PTshox
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3/11/2024 10:09pm
LungButter wrote:

Did Barcia or any of the other Team Austria guys have them this weekend?

aeffertz wrote:
Barcia emphasized he was on "stock WP components and that's all I got to say about that" this weekend when Lewis interviewed him after the race...

Barcia emphasized he was on "stock WP components and that's all I got to say about that" this weekend when Lewis interviewed him after the race. Seemed kind of odd he kept specifically saying "stock WP components" but there's that I guess. Grinning

Probably because he wants to be on the 52mm’s 

So..are you Adam from Kreft or ... a former employee of Kreft?

 

Also, no need for a rocket scientist to do the tuning... any local suspension guy who knows has played the shim stack game for several years can "tune" the forks or shock if the rider can give good feedback. I ve said it before.. it's not rocket science. It's pretty basic stuff. 

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3/12/2024 2:21am
aeffertz wrote:
Barcia emphasized he was on "stock WP components and that's all I got to say about that" this weekend when Lewis interviewed him after the race...

Barcia emphasized he was on "stock WP components and that's all I got to say about that" this weekend when Lewis interviewed him after the race. Seemed kind of odd he kept specifically saying "stock WP components" but there's that I guess. Grinning

Probably because he wants to be on the 52mm’s 

PTshox wrote:
So..are you Adam from Kreft or ... a former employee of Kreft?   Also, no need for a rocket scientist to do the tuning... any local...

So..are you Adam from Kreft or ... a former employee of Kreft?

 

Also, no need for a rocket scientist to do the tuning... any local suspension guy who knows has played the shim stack game for several years can "tune" the forks or shock if the rider can give good feedback. I ve said it before.. it's not rocket science. It's pretty basic stuff. 

This may be the issue, is Chase providing good feedback?

What is Chase chasing with fork setup, is he chasing a feel he only experienced when he first started riding a PW50?

He's had issues for years losing the front wheel, how much is it suspension setup, how much of it is bike setup, how much is it rider technique?

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8tensolutions
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3/12/2024 5:31am
aeffertz wrote:
Barcia emphasized he was on "stock WP components and that's all I got to say about that" this weekend when Lewis interviewed him after the race...

Barcia emphasized he was on "stock WP components and that's all I got to say about that" this weekend when Lewis interviewed him after the race. Seemed kind of odd he kept specifically saying "stock WP components" but there's that I guess. Grinning

Probably because he wants to be on the 52mm’s 

PTshox wrote:
So..are you Adam from Kreft or ... a former employee of Kreft?   Also, no need for a rocket scientist to do the tuning... any local...

So..are you Adam from Kreft or ... a former employee of Kreft?

 

Also, no need for a rocket scientist to do the tuning... any local suspension guy who knows has played the shim stack game for several years can "tune" the forks or shock if the rider can give good feedback. I ve said it before.. it's not rocket science. It's pretty basic stuff. 

Yeah, basic stuff but factory guys have full time suspension techs that essentially travel with the Teams.  Not rocket science, but having a guy that can watch the bike, communicate with the rider, and then know which direction to go is not an easy combination.  It's about feeling comfortable and confident and with the speeds these guys are going a small difference can be massive.  

I do think it's mental for some, including me. I'm just an old guy, but am incredibly sensitive to my MTB being just right and if its not I won't ride well, where others can have a bike creaking and popping with worn out parts and suspension that has never been serviced and have no problem.  

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ILoveMoto
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3/12/2024 5:55am
This may be the issue, is Chase providing good feedback? What is Chase chasing with fork setup, is he chasing a feel he only experienced when...

This may be the issue, is Chase providing good feedback?

What is Chase chasing with fork setup, is he chasing a feel he only experienced when he first started riding a PW50?

He's had issues for years losing the front wheel, how much is it suspension setup, how much of it is bike setup, how much is it rider technique?

Championships:

2019 AMA Supercross 250cc East

•2020 AMA Supercross 250cc East

•2023 AMA Supercross 450cc

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DudeImSoRad
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3/12/2024 6:10am

Probably because he wants to be on the 52mm’s 

PTshox wrote:
So..are you Adam from Kreft or ... a former employee of Kreft?   Also, no need for a rocket scientist to do the tuning... any local...

So..are you Adam from Kreft or ... a former employee of Kreft?

 

Also, no need for a rocket scientist to do the tuning... any local suspension guy who knows has played the shim stack game for several years can "tune" the forks or shock if the rider can give good feedback. I ve said it before.. it's not rocket science. It's pretty basic stuff. 

Yeah, basic stuff but factory guys have full time suspension techs that essentially travel with the Teams.  Not rocket science, but having a guy that can...

Yeah, basic stuff but factory guys have full time suspension techs that essentially travel with the Teams.  Not rocket science, but having a guy that can watch the bike, communicate with the rider, and then know which direction to go is not an easy combination.  It's about feeling comfortable and confident and with the speeds these guys are going a small difference can be massive.  

I do think it's mental for some, including me. I'm just an old guy, but am incredibly sensitive to my MTB being just right and if its not I won't ride well, where others can have a bike creaking and popping with worn out parts and suspension that has never been serviced and have no problem.  

Feedback from the rider is one of the hardest parts of being a shim shuffler.  What you see them and the bike doing may be the complete opposite of what they're feeling. Learning how to decipher what they mean, even if it's completely irrational is a gift.  That's why people like Bones, Ziggy, and Ross are so damn good at what they do. 

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soggy
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3/12/2024 7:52am

Probably because he wants to be on the 52mm’s 

PTshox wrote:
So..are you Adam from Kreft or ... a former employee of Kreft?   Also, no need for a rocket scientist to do the tuning... any local...

So..are you Adam from Kreft or ... a former employee of Kreft?

 

Also, no need for a rocket scientist to do the tuning... any local suspension guy who knows has played the shim stack game for several years can "tune" the forks or shock if the rider can give good feedback. I ve said it before.. it's not rocket science. It's pretty basic stuff. 

This may be the issue, is Chase providing good feedback? What is Chase chasing with fork setup, is he chasing a feel he only experienced when...

This may be the issue, is Chase providing good feedback?

What is Chase chasing with fork setup, is he chasing a feel he only experienced when he first started riding a PW50?

He's had issues for years losing the front wheel, how much is it suspension setup, how much of it is bike setup, how much is it rider technique?

It is interesting that Dazzy said when Jett got on the 450 the setup was shit. Implying sexton and canard did a horrible job setting up the bike. 
 

the bike does look calmer compared to when sexton was on it. 

5
3/12/2024 8:52am

Why is anyone surprised to see prototype parts on factory racing bikes...? 
Great spy work, idiots. 

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ILoveMoto
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3/12/2024 9:01am

Why is anyone surprised to see prototype parts on factory racing bikes...? 
Great spy work, idiots. 

Imagine what's been done to the engine and transmission...😏

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LungButter
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3/12/2024 9:05am

Why is anyone surprised to see prototype parts on factory racing bikes...? 
Great spy work, idiots. 

Uhhhh yeah....those aren't prototype parts bud....any schmuck on the street can buy them. 

But hey, hopefully you feel better calling everyone idiots even though you were the one that wasn't smart enough to know they sell thousands of those kits a year.   Tongue

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1
3/12/2024 9:35am Edited Date/Time 3/12/2024 9:35am

Why is anyone surprised to see prototype parts on factory racing bikes...? 
Great spy work, idiots. 

LungButter wrote:
Uhhhh yeah....those aren't prototype parts bud....any schmuck on the street can buy them.  But hey, hopefully you feel better calling everyone idiots even though you were...

Uhhhh yeah....those aren't prototype parts bud....any schmuck on the street can buy them. 

But hey, hopefully you feel better calling everyone idiots even though you were the one that wasn't smart enough to know they sell thousands of those kits a year.   Tongue

So cute watching guys like you get fired up over nothing.... haha 

Thank you for the entertainment. 

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3/12/2024 9:36am

Why is anyone surprised to see prototype parts on factory racing bikes...? 
Great spy work, idiots. 

ILoveMoto wrote:

Imagine what's been done to the engine and transmission...😏

A BETA transmission for sure... 

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TeamGreen
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3/12/2024 10:10am

Why is anyone surprised to see prototype parts on factory racing bikes...? 
Great spy work, idiots. 

LungButter wrote:
Uhhhh yeah....those aren't prototype parts bud....any schmuck on the street can buy them.  But hey, hopefully you feel better calling everyone idiots even though you were...

Uhhhh yeah....those aren't prototype parts bud....any schmuck on the street can buy them. 

But hey, hopefully you feel better calling everyone idiots even though you were the one that wasn't smart enough to know they sell thousands of those kits a year.   Tongue

Yes, there’s always that. Laughing

Why do I get the feeling that it’s quite possible that WP (in-house WP suspension services as made available to the KTM Group Teams) has limitations on what they’re “allowed” to do and what is actually available -officially- from parts to even time available…? (Time: time available or hours available to service suspension as needed, test as needed and MAKE CHANGES as needed). 

Yes, from parts availability to budgeted time available to spend working on ALL the suspension per team…and…ultimately…per rider. 

While I’m sure there are those that are gonna tell me I’m being ridiculous…I know about these budgets.

Do I believe certain riders get certain “special consideration”? I sure do. But, I’ll let you in on a little secret: It’s ALWAYS been that way in one form or another. You don’t have to like it, but, Chase’s bike DOES have “1” on the plate and he might even have a contract that has language about “special considerations”. One could say,”He’s earned it”. 

Personally, I’m impressed by the lengths to which Team KTM has gone to make Cahse’s bike work…for Chase. This “Any Means Necessary” has a familiar tone to it and I know a guy over at KTM that’s legendary when it comes to finding “whatever” it takes to make the bike work.

Now, wether or not “other” KTM Group Teams are given the same opportunities or “parts availability”…? Well, that sounds like an internal conversation that’s got to be difficult to have & justify when you actually work for the guy(s) that are on the Orange bike AND you’re not as competitive as you’re supposed to be…even though an argument can reasonably be had that suspension is an important part of that conversation for some of these riders…my point: justifying budget is REALLY a bitch these days. 

So, are outside sources being used and is it for budgetary reasons? “Available Settings” reasons? (That sound like a tricky one; but, it’s not. Some of the aftermarket co’s may actually have MORE experience with a wider variation of riders and settings with the “commercially available” products). As we’ve seen with the KYB kit: some co’s may have different hardware that allows for different settings. How about a combination of parts that…maybe…just maybe…the in house WP guys don’t have available and/or aren’t allowed to use.

Then there’s Barcia’s beloved 52s…

Well, it seems to me that we were hearing from the top guy at KTM N.A. that they’re moving towards using what they sell and…therefore…away from the “Factory ONLY” type stuff…? Hence, as of late…we keep getting told that JB51 is on “WP Kit Suspension” or WP “Pro Components”. All of that is 48mm, isn’t it? Does this mean the 52s are “dead”? 

Well, this is all the stuff that I’ve thought of.

So, does Michael have some answers by now…?🤔

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LungButter
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3/12/2024 10:13am

So cute watching guys like you get fired up over nothing.... haha 

Thank you for the entertainment. 

Almost as entertaining as watching someone like you thinking you're the smartest guy in the room when you don't even know you can buy those KYB parts any time you want.

Thanks for stopping by Marty, it's been fun.

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Coach529
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3/12/2024 11:01am

Like Mathes said.....this is a Big Spicy Meatball.

Crazy that KTM lost Webb because they would not think outside the box. 

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3
3/12/2024 3:17pm
This may be the issue, is Chase providing good feedback? What is Chase chasing with fork setup, is he chasing a feel he only experienced when...

This may be the issue, is Chase providing good feedback?

What is Chase chasing with fork setup, is he chasing a feel he only experienced when he first started riding a PW50?

He's had issues for years losing the front wheel, how much is it suspension setup, how much of it is bike setup, how much is it rider technique?

ILoveMoto wrote:

Championships:

2019 AMA Supercross 250cc East

•2020 AMA Supercross 250cc East

•2023 AMA Supercross 450cc

image-20240313091411-1

image-20240313091509-2

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ILoveMoto
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3/12/2024 3:26pm
This may be the issue, is Chase providing good feedback? What is Chase chasing with fork setup, is he chasing a feel he only experienced when...

This may be the issue, is Chase providing good feedback?

What is Chase chasing with fork setup, is he chasing a feel he only experienced when he first started riding a PW50?

He's had issues for years losing the front wheel, how much is it suspension setup, how much of it is bike setup, how much is it rider technique?

ILoveMoto wrote:

Championships:

2019 AMA Supercross 250cc East

•2020 AMA Supercross 250cc East

•2023 AMA Supercross 450cc

image-20240313091411-1

image-20240313091509-2

"Cooper Webb wins in Arlington after Jett Lawrence crashes"

"BIG Crash for Jett Lawrence at San Diego Press Day"

"Jett Lawrence had a weird crash in the opening practice today at Anaheim"

It's a brutal sport my man...

 

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Flatliner
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3/12/2024 4:06pm
This may be the issue, is Chase providing good feedback? What is Chase chasing with fork setup, is he chasing a feel he only experienced when...

This may be the issue, is Chase providing good feedback?

What is Chase chasing with fork setup, is he chasing a feel he only experienced when he first started riding a PW50?

He's had issues for years losing the front wheel, how much is it suspension setup, how much of it is bike setup, how much is it rider technique?

ILoveMoto wrote:

Championships:

2019 AMA Supercross 250cc East

•2020 AMA Supercross 250cc East

•2023 AMA Supercross 450cc

How many titles did rc have before the 03 sx season?  Yes, he won but chad beat him 6 in a row towards the end.

He's admitted that the setup was screwed up by him.

 

Point is, mistakes happen.

Moto Braap
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3/12/2024 4:21pm
ML512 wrote:

Anyone want to go to the races in my place next week?

Money wrote:
This is what makes me so mad about our sport. You do an awesome job reporting and finding out these pit bits as new stuff riders...

This is what makes me so mad about our sport. You do an awesome job reporting and finding out these pit bits as new stuff riders are running then I’m sure are treated like trash once it gets reported. F1 teams are always taking photos of other teams stuff and the media is doing the same. Every week in f1 there is something new and it gets reported about. But someone doing a great job in Moto reports this a there treated like a black sheep. Not cool teams….

avidchimp wrote:
This whole sport is absolutely bush league when it comes to information. Sometimes I think they think they are actually curing cancer or something with how...

This whole sport is absolutely bush league when it comes to information. Sometimes I think they think they are actually curing cancer or something with how they guard information.

The only one that truly understands the game is Lars, that guy is awesome.

I wouldn’t be surprised if this hand injury that i never got to see was Chase adjusting to the new setup.

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DudeImSoRad
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3/13/2024 2:21am
Flatliner wrote:
How many titles did rc have before the 03 sx season?  Yes, he won but chad beat him 6 in a row towards the end. He's...

How many titles did rc have before the 03 sx season?  Yes, he won but chad beat him 6 in a row towards the end.

He's admitted that the setup was screwed up by him.

 

Point is, mistakes happen.

True. My parents used to tell me the same thing. 

Spoonguy
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3/13/2024 4:08am

It seems that Chase despite the titles has become one of those riders constantly chasing set up.

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ILoveMoto
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3/13/2024 4:14am
Spoonguy wrote:

It seems that Chase despite the titles has become one of those riders constantly chasing set up.

Like Champion Chad Reed, like Champion Ken Roczen, like Champion Cooper Webb, like Champion....

1
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Chris_Buehler
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3/13/2024 4:31am

Why is anyone surprised to see prototype parts on factory racing bikes...? 
Great spy work, idiots. 

LungButter wrote:
Uhhhh yeah....those aren't prototype parts bud....any schmuck on the street can buy them.  But hey, hopefully you feel better calling everyone idiots even though you were...

Uhhhh yeah....those aren't prototype parts bud....any schmuck on the street can buy them. 

But hey, hopefully you feel better calling everyone idiots even though you were the one that wasn't smart enough to know they sell thousands of those kits a year.   Tongue

Who knew I was running prototype A-kit on my KTM? 

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