Why the Tomac smoke out the rear?

Austin_Rankin
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3/3/2024 7:02pm

It wasn’t the clutch…. 

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3/3/2024 7:34pm

IMG 0640.jpeg?VersionId=Bo Apologies for quality, but snapped a pic of a fan recorded video of the main. Tomac’s bike is literally smoking on the first lap, two turns into the race. Something was NOT right with that bike from jump street.

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Xracer
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3/3/2024 7:41pm
wheeels wrote:
Yeah i think he got frustrated and abused it for a few laps and also didn't adjust it by rolling in more free play. I doubt...

Yeah i think he got frustrated and abused it for a few laps and also didn't adjust it by rolling in more free play. I doubt he smoked a new clutch all by himself in those 5-10 laps. I think combination of his abuse and the tension on the plates from him forgetting /not realizing it needed adjustment

Hasletjoe wrote:
Keep in mind....As the clutch wears away, it causes the cable to slacker not tighter. In the days of cable clutches, the strategy was to keep...

Keep in mind....As the clutch wears away, it causes the cable to slacker not tighter. In the days of cable clutches, the strategy was to keep the tension right so the clutch was there when they fanned/slipped/etc. Hydraulic clutches are constantly adjusting themselves based off the valving/wear.

CPR wrote:

Ever fried a clutch? You end up with no free play.

Yep, he's got it backwards...cable gets tighter as clutch wears.  Rolling the adjuster forward (the most natural motion in the heat of battle) restores the slack.

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StillSmokin
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3/3/2024 7:52pm

Whats gonna be the excuse when Jett smokes Eli again next week?

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The Shop

Melicar
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3/3/2024 8:04pm

Whats gonna be the excuse when Jett smokes Eli again next week?

One week at a time, buddy! 

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LocalDrunk
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3/3/2024 9:06pm

Clutch blaster 😂

mtbkris2
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3/3/2024 9:23pm
   
 

 

I noticed this in the live feed but I thought it was sand blasting off his rear tire

Johnny Oz
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AU
3/3/2024 9:35pm

I've been a mechanic for 45 years, and a racer for 48 years, I don't think it was a clutch, to smoke like that for a number of laps, the clutch would have failed, after more than few laps of smoke, I ruled-out rear shock oil on the pipe, it did appear to me that there was a puff of smoke after some g-outs, my call is..... oil out of the engine breather onto the exhaust.

12
3/3/2024 9:39pm

Matthes said on the review pod that it wasn't the clutch, it was the valve cover gasket that went. Thats what caused the smoke. 

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Yz450fkid
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3/3/2024 9:56pm

Valve cover gasket. He would have lost a tiny bit of oil onto the header. 

He would not have noticed it at all like he said.

And everyone with theories are out the window.

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Austin_Rankin
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3/4/2024 6:01pm Edited Date/Time 3/4/2024 6:03pm
Yz450fkid wrote:
Valve cover gasket. He would have lost a tiny bit of oil onto the header.  He would not have noticed it at all like he said...

Valve cover gasket. He would have lost a tiny bit of oil onto the header. 

He would not have noticed it at all like he said.

And everyone with theories are out the window.

valve cover gasket blows when compression is escaping from cylinder area into upper head area, due to valve seats and valves crunching sand, then when compression lets through the valve seals open. when valve seals open due to compression, head builds pressure, then valve cover gasket goes....

you cant run a bike in wet sand all day and not change head, valve seals.... i called it before hand. i knew it during the race, you cant ride a yamaha directly behind someone in sand, or your done.

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3/4/2024 6:10pm
everyone reverts to clutch, but if you think about it i think it was the valve seals, i think the bike sucked sand, and ruined the...

everyone reverts to clutch, but if you think about it i think it was the valve seals, i think the bike sucked sand, and ruined the valve seals, bike sucks air from front and there were multiple moments he and his bike inhaled sand in the sand section, if clutch got smoked it think it was from the lack of oil due to it burning it cause valve seals experienced sand, glass media in valve stems, valve seats, that whole engine was smoked on lap 5 of running right behind some ones scoop tire....

 

Yamaha frontward air suction motors are notorious for intake valves, seats, guides, seals getting worn.

he said clutch felt fine.... smoke was oil burning due to valve seals, im telling you!

With valve seals you normally see the smoke out the exhaust. The smoke from Tomacs bike was not coming out of the end of the pipe. It was more like oil leaking on the pipe close to the engine. 

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OldTech
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3/4/2024 6:10pm
Yz450fkid wrote:
Valve cover gasket. He would have lost a tiny bit of oil onto the header.  He would not have noticed it at all like he said...

Valve cover gasket. He would have lost a tiny bit of oil onto the header. 

He would not have noticed it at all like he said.

And everyone with theories are out the window.

valve cover gasket blows when compression is escaping from cylinder area into upper head area, due to valve seats and valves crunching sand, then when compression...

valve cover gasket blows when compression is escaping from cylinder area into upper head area, due to valve seats and valves crunching sand, then when compression lets through the valve seals open. when valve seals open due to compression, head builds pressure, then valve cover gasket goes....

you cant run a bike in wet sand all day and not change head, valve seals.... i called it before hand. i knew it during the race, you cant ride a yamaha directly behind someone in sand, or your done.

If the factory guy's have to do a service like that, I think they fill the engine from the top anyway.

 

Forty
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3/4/2024 6:12pm
Johnny Oz wrote:
I've been a mechanic for 45 years, and a racer for 48 years, I don't think it was a clutch, to smoke like that for a...

I've been a mechanic for 45 years, and a racer for 48 years, I don't think it was a clutch, to smoke like that for a number of laps, the clutch would have failed, after more than few laps of smoke, I ruled-out rear shock oil on the pipe, it did appear to me that there was a puff of smoke after some g-outs, my call is..... oil out of the engine breather onto the exhaust.

agree.  

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Timo
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3/4/2024 6:13pm
valve cover gasket blows when compression is escaping from cylinder area into upper head area, due to valve seats and valves crunching sand, then when compression...

valve cover gasket blows when compression is escaping from cylinder area into upper head area, due to valve seats and valves crunching sand, then when compression lets through the valve seals open. when valve seals open due to compression, head builds pressure, then valve cover gasket goes....

you cant run a bike in wet sand all day and not change head, valve seals.... i called it before hand. i knew it during the race, you cant ride a yamaha directly behind someone in sand, or your done.

I don't think they have the front intake anymore, dropped it in 23. I think his mechanic probably didn't get the gasket seated properly, or forgot to tighten down the bolts. 

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dv12.com
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3/5/2024 1:14am Edited Date/Time 3/5/2024 1:16am
Hasletjoe wrote:
Keep in mind....As the clutch wears away, it causes the cable to slacker not tighter. In the days of cable clutches, the strategy was to keep...

Keep in mind....As the clutch wears away, it causes the cable to slacker not tighter. In the days of cable clutches, the strategy was to keep the tension right so the clutch was there when they fanned/slipped/etc. Hydraulic clutches are constantly adjusting themselves based off the valving/wear.

When the clutch wears out, meaning the fibers and the overall thickness of the plates get smaller, the lever gets tighter...

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Kawboy14!
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3/5/2024 8:32am

He had to know that smell was coming from him, and he would know how much he had left based on how much he had to adjust it!

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mx317
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3/5/2024 8:45am
valve cover gasket blows when compression is escaping from cylinder area into upper head area, due to valve seats and valves crunching sand, then when compression...

valve cover gasket blows when compression is escaping from cylinder area into upper head area, due to valve seats and valves crunching sand, then when compression lets through the valve seals open. when valve seals open due to compression, head builds pressure, then valve cover gasket goes....

you cant run a bike in wet sand all day and not change head, valve seals.... i called it before hand. i knew it during the race, you cant ride a yamaha directly behind someone in sand, or your done.

You should quit before you get further behind. 

4
Moto520
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3/5/2024 8:47am

Whatever it was....he finished the race and didn't lose a crap-ton of points.  The Yamaha held together

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mikelawlor
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Johnsonville, NY, USA
3/5/2024 8:48am

When your valve seals go the bike smokes from the exhaust when you let off because with the throttle closed it sucks the oil past the valve seals. If it were the clutch it would be blowing out the ccv once it got hot enough to make the oil smoke from that point on, not just momentarily. Like said above it was most likely from the valve cover gasket as it seemed to only smoke when he had a g out and the oil dripped on the exhaust. Also like said above that would have no adverse effect on the performance of the bike. Sucking sand in and causing wear on valve seals, or rings would constitute smoking from the muffler. This was not the case. 

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8tensolutions
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3/5/2024 8:51am
Moto520 wrote:

Whatever it was....he finished the race and didn't lose a crap-ton of points.  The Yamaha held together

Correct.  Eli also said the bike was fine and he didn't notice the smoke.  There was no excuses made by Tomac other than he got beat.  Class act and hope he comes out swinging in AL.

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ChiefLPD
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3/5/2024 9:49am
TbonesPop wrote:
And I don't buy for an instant that Tomac didn't notice it with the bike and it didn't impact his ability to ride it.  These guys...

And I don't buy for an instant that Tomac didn't notice it with the bike and it didn't impact his ability to ride it.  These guys can feel microscopic adjustments in anything from air pressure, frame stiffness, clutch feel, etc.  We know Eli likes a cable over hydraulic just based on feel - he had to feel there was an issue for over half the race.  He just wasn't going to make any excuses and props to him for that.  Rest assured he knew he was dealing with an issue - and it had to have had some level of impact on his riding.  He just wasn't making excuses.

Not sure if he really didn't know it or not...but 100% agree that the door to make a mechanical excuse was wide open when the question was asked. Prompts to Tomac for keepin it real.

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Hasletjoe
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3/5/2024 10:00am Edited Date/Time 3/5/2024 10:08am
Hasletjoe wrote:
Keep in mind....As the clutch wears away, it causes the cable to slacker not tighter. In the days of cable clutches, the strategy was to keep...

Keep in mind....As the clutch wears away, it causes the cable to slacker not tighter. In the days of cable clutches, the strategy was to keep the tension right so the clutch was there when they fanned/slipped/etc. Hydraulic clutches are constantly adjusting themselves based off the valving/wear.

dv12.com wrote:

When the clutch wears out, meaning the fibers and the overall thickness of the plates get smaller, the lever gets tighter...

Ah, my old school is showing. A lot of the older models push the clutch pressure plate away when the clutch lever is pulled. The newer design (1973/74) on some makes changed the effort to pull the pressure plate away.

My apologies for being stuck in the 70's

 

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3/5/2024 10:05am

You don't hit the quad with a smoked clutch, he hit it later in the race. And no way shock oil squirting onto the exhaust either that's ridiculous cuz you aint hitting the quad with a blown shock either! It wasn't steam I don't think because he would be losing power and you don't hit the quad with power loss! but an oil leak of some kind and prob from the vent hose.

3/5/2024 10:07am
valve cover gasket blows when compression is escaping from cylinder area into upper head area, due to valve seats and valves crunching sand, then when compression...

valve cover gasket blows when compression is escaping from cylinder area into upper head area, due to valve seats and valves crunching sand, then when compression lets through the valve seals open. when valve seals open due to compression, head builds pressure, then valve cover gasket goes....

you cant run a bike in wet sand all day and not change head, valve seals.... i called it before hand. i knew it during the race, you cant ride a yamaha directly behind someone in sand, or your done.

 

 

1
3/5/2024 10:16am
You don't hit the quad with a smoked clutch, he hit it later in the race. And no way shock oil squirting onto the exhaust either...

You don't hit the quad with a smoked clutch, he hit it later in the race. And no way shock oil squirting onto the exhaust either that's ridiculous cuz you aint hitting the quad with a blown shock either! It wasn't steam I don't think because he would be losing power and you don't hit the quad with power loss! but an oil leak of some kind and prob from the vent hose.

They said it was oil coming out of valve cover gasket, which makes perfect sense based on where the smoke seemed to come from and aligns with Eli's comments that he didn't feel anything.  Also aligns with the G outs coming with more smoke as the compression forces of the G-out would likely cause more oil to leak under the suspension compression stress and hit the exhaust, thus causing smoke.  

2
crmx105
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3/5/2024 10:21am
Yz450fkid wrote:
Valve cover gasket. He would have lost a tiny bit of oil onto the header.  He would not have noticed it at all like he said...

Valve cover gasket. He would have lost a tiny bit of oil onto the header. 

He would not have noticed it at all like he said.

And everyone with theories are out the window.

valve cover gasket blows when compression is escaping from cylinder area into upper head area, due to valve seats and valves crunching sand, then when compression...

valve cover gasket blows when compression is escaping from cylinder area into upper head area, due to valve seats and valves crunching sand, then when compression lets through the valve seals open. when valve seals open due to compression, head builds pressure, then valve cover gasket goes....

you cant run a bike in wet sand all day and not change head, valve seals.... i called it before hand. i knew it during the race, you cant ride a yamaha directly behind someone in sand, or your done.

The 23-24 doesn't suck air from the front unless they are running a vented air box cover. Wouldn't think Star would have problems sucking dirt and the 450s only got one practice session because it poured at the start of the 250s second practice so they canceled the second 450 practice and worked on the track. 

MxAddic
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3/5/2024 3:06pm
TbonesPop wrote:
They said it was oil coming out of valve cover gasket, which makes perfect sense based on where the smoke seemed to come from and aligns...

They said it was oil coming out of valve cover gasket, which makes perfect sense based on where the smoke seemed to come from and aligns with Eli's comments that he didn't feel anything.  Also aligns with the G outs coming with more smoke as the compression forces of the G-out would likely cause more oil to leak under the suspension compression stress and hit the exhaust, thus causing smoke.  

Like the shock would never piss out oil on the G-outs. You guys are a hoot.

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Meister
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3/5/2024 3:33pm

Anyone remember the exact same thing happening last year? 

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