Public riding areas, hmmmm.

miedosoracing1
Edited Date/Time 1/24/2012 4:47pm
Ok, I keep on hearing people bitch and moan about their public riding areas getting shut down by the greenies. etc. My question, is in what states do you have a government owned riding facility? I obviously know California does. But who else? Reason I ask? I was thinking. Maybe California really isn't that much greener in some ways. I mean, I don't know of anywhere in Texas that is not public owned, where I can just unload and go riding without getting a ticket. This is Republican country if I've ever seen it. Most places I've ever known in Iowa or Texas, you had to get permission from land owners if you just want to ride around the fields etc. Any other states actually have a government owned property that they can ride? Or are we hearing all kinds of bitching and moaning, on something that really doesn't affect any other state? Just wondering...
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RideMX
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RideMX 2/10/2010 4:52am
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You can't own land. You can only borrow it.
SteveS
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SteveS 2/10/2010 6:14am
2/10/2010 6:14am
Missouri has state parks with riding areas, and one even has an MX track which is commonly used for LL qualifiers and runs a regular season of racing. There is no land which is state owned which is just open to riding that isn't specifically designated as OHV area. I don't think we have any BLM land or Indian land in Missouri which is just open.
wakeriderof87 2/10/2010 6:42am
2/10/2010 6:42am
Florida has a couple of state owned riding areas. We also have a couple of National Forests.
miedosoracing1 2/10/2010 7:19am
2/10/2010 7:19am Edited Date/Time 2/10/2010 7:21am
So in my opinion, it seems that opinions of the greenies are scewed alittle towards the California area, rather than motorcycling offroad in general. Just something that I was wondering. The main complaint given when we talk about loud bikes, is that the greenies will find a reason still. But from this post I see that it is what I suspected. Homeowners are still the one's who mainly complain and get places shut down for noise. Here is an interesting fact. More Republicans own homes than Democrats. That may be because of racial reasons etc. But it is true. Thus, can we start blaming the Republicans for shutting down tracks??? Probably not, but saying lefty, greenies, tree huggers etc is quite bullcrap in the whole scheme of things.

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wardy
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wardy 2/10/2010 7:21am
2/10/2010 7:21am
Illinois has many state ohv grant recipients who have open to the public riding areas. These are places which the government taxes titles of ohv's and then gives it out in re-inburstment grants. These riding parks/tracks are up to like 10-12 in the state?
They are considered "owned" by private clubs or people who run them.

none are free to ride. and of course they compete head to head with whats left of the open private parks that were in business before this whole process begain in 1998. now we have more (ohv granted parks) then private. some have mx tracks and run races head to head with the non granted places.

nothing state run, or blm is allowed in IL. The biggest place that could be used has been illegal for as long as I know.......that would be shawnee national forest.
7I3N
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7I3N 2/10/2010 8:44am
2/10/2010 8:44am Edited Date/Time 2/10/2010 8:45am
miedosoracing1 wrote:
So in my opinion, it seems that opinions of the greenies are scewed alittle towards the California area, rather than motorcycling offroad in general. Just something...
So in my opinion, it seems that opinions of the greenies are scewed alittle towards the California area, rather than motorcycling offroad in general. Just something that I was wondering. The main complaint given when we talk about loud bikes, is that the greenies will find a reason still. But from this post I see that it is what I suspected. Homeowners are still the one's who mainly complain and get places shut down for noise. Here is an interesting fact. More Republicans own homes than Democrats. That may be because of racial reasons etc. But it is true. Thus, can we start blaming the Republicans for shutting down tracks??? Probably not, but saying lefty, greenies, tree huggers etc is quite bullcrap in the whole scheme of things.
Are you kidding me? The environmental movement is the single biggest threat to off road land use. And yes, it is purely a left wing led movement. In Utah we have been fighting a bill (The Red Rock Wilderness Act) sponsored by a Democrat Congressman from New York to close 9.4 million acres of public land to access by anything other than foot by designating it as “wilderness.” Most of the land we ride on in Utah is federal land managed by the BLM. There are several environment groups that work full time in an effort to get as much of it closed as possible. They play very dirty, using any and all techniques to get what they want. Last year a group based in Phoenix called the Center for Biological Diversity got several thousand acres of state land just south of town that we have been riding on legally for years completely closed (it is now posted no trespassing) by blackmailing the state by threatening to file a lawsuit that would have held up a highway construction project unless they closed the land. And the worst part is that these groups make money by getting reimbursed by the government for suing them.

http://www.savethetrails.us/EnviroLitigationGravy.html
Titan1
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Titan1 2/10/2010 8:55am
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Anyone that thinks the republicans are a larger threat to riding than the democrats is up in the night crazy.

Love 'em or hate 'em, the republicans are the most moto friendly of both parties.

And the last line in 713N's post is a very well kept secret among the greenies/libs...those environazi groups (SUWA, Sierra Club, etc) make money BECAUSE they sue the government, because the government has to reimburse them for court costs/time etc. That is why they are constantly suing the goverment to close riding areas, because that's one of the main ways they get paid.

The link in 713N's post is MUST READ for every American.
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kcadrenalin 2/10/2010 9:00am
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miedosoracing1 wrote:
So in my opinion, it seems that opinions of the greenies are scewed alittle towards the California area, rather than motorcycling offroad in general. Just something...
So in my opinion, it seems that opinions of the greenies are scewed alittle towards the California area, rather than motorcycling offroad in general. Just something that I was wondering. The main complaint given when we talk about loud bikes, is that the greenies will find a reason still. But from this post I see that it is what I suspected. Homeowners are still the one's who mainly complain and get places shut down for noise. Here is an interesting fact. More Republicans own homes than Democrats. That may be because of racial reasons etc. But it is true. Thus, can we start blaming the Republicans for shutting down tracks??? Probably not, but saying lefty, greenies, tree huggers etc is quite bullcrap in the whole scheme of things.
You are a dumbfuck.
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SPYGUY 2/10/2010 9:03am
2/10/2010 9:03am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 8:41pm
miedosoracing1 wrote:
Ok, I keep on hearing people bitch and moan about their public riding areas getting shut down by the greenies. etc. My question, is in what...
Ok, I keep on hearing people bitch and moan about their public riding areas getting shut down by the greenies. etc. My question, is in what states do you have a government owned riding facility? I obviously know California does. But who else? Reason I ask? I was thinking. Maybe California really isn't that much greener in some ways. I mean, I don't know of anywhere in Texas that is not public owned, where I can just unload and go riding without getting a ticket. This is Republican country if I've ever seen it. Most places I've ever known in Iowa or Texas, you had to get permission from land owners if you just want to ride around the fields etc. Any other states actually have a government owned property that they can ride? Or are we hearing all kinds of bitching and moaning, on something that really doesn't affect any other state? Just wondering...
Uh....

http://www.texasmotorizedtrails.com/mc/page.do?sitePageId=90171&orgId=t…
SteveS
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SteveS 2/10/2010 9:07am
2/10/2010 9:07am
There are two different issues being debated here. One is "public land" use. That is primarily a western states issue because they are pretty much the only places with giant swaths of public land. The threat on the use of public land by OHV's is purely a leftist/Democrat/Greenie issue. The other is closure of commercially run tracks because of noise issues, which isn't, strictly speaking, a "green" issue as much as a property value/nuisance issue. I would say that the homeowners who are moving in next door to tracks and then causing a fuss to get them closed aren't necessarily leftist or rightist as much as they are annoying city snobs. However tracks are excessively noisy nowadays, and the noise is much worse than it was prior to 10 years ago.
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Rooster 2/10/2010 9:18am
2/10/2010 9:18am
I've been to government run facilities in both Washington state and Oregon as well.
miedosoracing1 2/10/2010 9:28am
2/10/2010 9:28am Edited Date/Time 2/10/2010 9:29am
SteveS wrote:
There are two different issues being debated here. One is "public land" use. That is primarily a western states issue because they are pretty much the...
There are two different issues being debated here. One is "public land" use. That is primarily a western states issue because they are pretty much the only places with giant swaths of public land. The threat on the use of public land by OHV's is purely a leftist/Democrat/Greenie issue. The other is closure of commercially run tracks because of noise issues, which isn't, strictly speaking, a "green" issue as much as a property value/nuisance issue. I would say that the homeowners who are moving in next door to tracks and then causing a fuss to get them closed aren't necessarily leftist or rightist as much as they are annoying city snobs. However tracks are excessively noisy nowadays, and the noise is much worse than it was prior to 10 years ago.
Exactly, and I for one, don't care too much about the offroad part. I worry about motocross tracks. There has been hundreds of them shut down over the last couple of years due to noise etc. Does everyone here actually ride those offroad public lands? Yes, I know a few do, but how many of us here on a MX board?
Titan1
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Titan1 2/10/2010 9:31am
2/10/2010 9:31am
I almost exclusively ride offroad public lands....

Didn't know what i was missing until I tried it....I don't miss motocross anymore. (though i still hate to see tracks closed).

In utah I'm not aware of any tracks getting closed down...but I know of a few new tracks opening....
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Tiki 2/10/2010 9:37am
2/10/2010 9:37am
All California State run riding areas have sound requirements along with spark arrestor and registration requirements. If there are visible signs of oil coming off your tailpipe, they are also suspect to letting you ride. Most of these areas have been going for a long time, 30 years plus. Hang Town is on State land so is Hollister. Mammoth Motocross is on USDA Land and in is adjacent to Wilderness. Areas that have been shut down were not due to sound. Sound was an issue but there were more prevalent issues. Land development, need for homes, pressure from neighbors.

Here is something you may not want to hear. Snowmobile areas being changed or removed due to sound. Guess what powers a snowmobile? Two Strokes.

To be honest here Miedoso, I have heard you bitch way more then my Sierra Club neighbors. Even more than "Friends of the Inyo" who in this area have been known to take militant stands. Even a case locally where a Sierra Club member burned down a Forest Service building a few years back.


So exactly what are you saying? Are you a card carrying Sierra Club Member disguised as a board member?
miedosoracing1 2/10/2010 9:51am
2/10/2010 9:51am Edited Date/Time 2/10/2010 9:54am
Tiki wrote:
All California State run riding areas have sound requirements along with spark arrestor and registration requirements. If there are visible signs of oil coming off your...
All California State run riding areas have sound requirements along with spark arrestor and registration requirements. If there are visible signs of oil coming off your tailpipe, they are also suspect to letting you ride. Most of these areas have been going for a long time, 30 years plus. Hang Town is on State land so is Hollister. Mammoth Motocross is on USDA Land and in is adjacent to Wilderness. Areas that have been shut down were not due to sound. Sound was an issue but there were more prevalent issues. Land development, need for homes, pressure from neighbors.

Here is something you may not want to hear. Snowmobile areas being changed or removed due to sound. Guess what powers a snowmobile? Two Strokes.

To be honest here Miedoso, I have heard you bitch way more then my Sierra Club neighbors. Even more than "Friends of the Inyo" who in this area have been known to take militant stands. Even a case locally where a Sierra Club member burned down a Forest Service building a few years back.


So exactly what are you saying? Are you a card carrying Sierra Club Member disguised as a board member?
No, what I'm saying, and my whole point to this post, is the following. People here and all over are saying that noise while an issue, isn't important enough to make rules right this minute, because the greenies will still shut down areas etc anyways. But, as you said yourself, those areas require sound to be quiet anyways. So I'm trying to figure out, why this isn't a NOW issue. Over most MX tracks in the US, noise is the #1 issue. In Offroad, I agree the greenies. But that seems to be a western problem, not necessarily everywhere. Like the noise issue is. It is world wide. Why isn't it a more NOW issue. And why do people like you guys come and say greenies will do this or that, when in fact, they have nothing to do with what noise problems... Since you already have to have your bikes quiet.
miedosoracing1 2/10/2010 10:09am
2/10/2010 10:09am
I agree, I'm sure that in Cali, those are all issues. But we need to look past one state or a couple of them. We need to look at the big picture of the whole world. Sound is the number 1 issue in the world of motocross tracks being closed or police being called.
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Tiki 2/10/2010 10:15am
2/10/2010 10:15am
Good luck with that. You are missing the point. The police will be called if they are silent. Nosy Rosies will always be around to alert when someone is having fun.

But look past the facts in this thread where people posted public riding areas.

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7I3N
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7I3N 2/10/2010 10:22am
2/10/2010 10:22am
miedosoracing1 wrote:
I agree, I'm sure that in Cali, those are all issues. But we need to look past one state or a couple of them. We need...
I agree, I'm sure that in Cali, those are all issues. But we need to look past one state or a couple of them. We need to look at the big picture of the whole world. Sound is the number 1 issue in the world of motocross tracks being closed or police being called.
Last year a group here in Utah made a futile attempt to close an MX track run by the Utah State Parks by complaining that the dust from the track constituted a visibility hazard on the highway adjacent to the track. Environmental groups will use any excuse to try and stop the use of any and all off road vehicles.
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mxrose3 2/10/2010 10:25am
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Maryland and Delaware both have a couple small government owned riding areas, but you need to buy a special sticker license for you bike to ride there.
miedosoracing1 2/10/2010 11:16am
2/10/2010 11:16am
Tiki wrote:
Good luck with that. You are missing the point. The police will be called if they are silent. Nosy Rosies will always be around to alert...
Good luck with that. You are missing the point. The police will be called if they are silent. Nosy Rosies will always be around to alert when someone is having fun.

But look past the facts in this thread where people posted public riding areas.
Ah, but how many of them are saying they are in danger of getting closed by the greenies. So far, only Utah, which I'm not understanding, since the governor I thought rode MX? And Cali.
miedosoracing1 2/10/2010 11:18am
2/10/2010 11:18am
7I3N wrote:
Last year a group here in Utah made a futile attempt to close an MX track run by the Utah State Parks by complaining that the...
Last year a group here in Utah made a futile attempt to close an MX track run by the Utah State Parks by complaining that the dust from the track constituted a visibility hazard on the highway adjacent to the track. Environmental groups will use any excuse to try and stop the use of any and all off road vehicles.
And it didn't get closed, right? But, throw in Noise and I bet it would. So no matter if they have different excuses or not, it still remains, that most cases, it will come down to noise in most areas for reasons it got closed
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deathgrip 2/10/2010 11:28am
2/10/2010 11:28am
California has an abundance of state owned OHV parks which are near most major cities. California also has boundless acres of desert land to ride on. Gone are the days of riding in the urban surroundings but nobody can argue the riding areas are gone. Dirt bike riding is alive and well in California.

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Titan1 2/10/2010 11:37am
2/10/2010 11:37am
Tiki wrote:
Good luck with that. You are missing the point. The police will be called if they are silent. Nosy Rosies will always be around to alert...
Good luck with that. You are missing the point. The police will be called if they are silent. Nosy Rosies will always be around to alert when someone is having fun.

But look past the facts in this thread where people posted public riding areas.
miedosoracing1 wrote:
Ah, but how many of them are saying they are in danger of getting closed by the greenies. So far, only Utah, which I'm not understanding...
Ah, but how many of them are saying they are in danger of getting closed by the greenies. So far, only Utah, which I'm not understanding, since the governor I thought rode MX? And Cali.
And you aren't the only one that doesn't understand why non-Utah resident greenies are trying to close utah riding areas....very few in utah get it either.

Facts are: People that don't like/ride dirt bikes will find something ANYTHING to complain about, which will continue to get riding areas close.

They'll (the anti-riding crowd) complain about: Dust, noise, land damage, litter, endangered animals, to much traffic, rowdy kids, pollution...anything. And will continue to do so until dirt bikes/atv are no longer allowed to be ridden any place but private property with a 20 mile buffer to the property line.

Just wait....if i were honda, yamaha, kawasaki, suzuki, ktm, polaris, etc....I'd start dumping serious dollars into the lobby in support of keeping riding areas open....otherwise, the areas in this country that we can ride will be so few and far between that OHV's won't be worth owning.
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Titan1 2/10/2010 11:39am
2/10/2010 11:39am
deathgrip wrote:
California has an abundance of state owned OHV parks which are near most major cities. California also has boundless acres of desert land to ride on...
California has an abundance of state owned OHV parks which are near most major cities. California also has boundless acres of desert land to ride on. Gone are the days of riding in the urban surroundings but nobody can argue the riding areas are gone. Dirt bike riding is alive and well in California.

Dirt bike riding in this entire country is always under attack. There are groups (well funded, well organized groups) that will not stop fighting until OHV's are completely outlawed on public land.

Now isn't the time to be complacent...if we all don't volunteer, donate, and speak up, we'll be looking for new hobbies....
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motogrady 2/10/2010 11:41am
2/10/2010 11:41am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 8:42pm
mxrose3 wrote:
Maryland and Delaware both have a couple small government owned riding areas, but you need to buy a special sticker license for you bike to ride...
Maryland and Delaware both have a couple small government owned riding areas, but you need to buy a special sticker license for you bike to ride there.



Where?

I've heard of Hatfield-McCoy here in West Virginia.

And there's a place in Western Maryland, New Germany State Park I think, that has

some good woods.

HatfieldMcCoy-


http://www.trailsheaven.com/


They are about as bulletproof as one can get vs. the Greens.

From what I understand, this is how they did it.

A person or company buys the land, hopefully unzond land.

The land is leased to another person or company.

This divides the 2, decreasing liability of the property itself in case of lawsuits.

A third company is hired to design, obtain all permits and construct the site.

Lastly, another group actually runs the place.


Extreme, yes.

But if it's in before a place is zoned, with the proper permits, any zoning coming

in you're grandfathered. There's a lot of layers for a lawyer to get thru. And if

all the paperwork was done permit wise, Green's are out of luck.

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deathgrip 2/10/2010 11:49am
2/10/2010 11:49am
deathgrip wrote:
California has an abundance of state owned OHV parks which are near most major cities. California also has boundless acres of desert land to ride on...
California has an abundance of state owned OHV parks which are near most major cities. California also has boundless acres of desert land to ride on. Gone are the days of riding in the urban surroundings but nobody can argue the riding areas are gone. Dirt bike riding is alive and well in California.

Titan1 wrote:
Dirt bike riding in this entire country is always under attack. There are groups (well funded, well organized groups) that will not stop fighting until OHV's...
Dirt bike riding in this entire country is always under attack. There are groups (well funded, well organized groups) that will not stop fighting until OHV's are completely outlawed on public land.

Now isn't the time to be complacent...if we all don't volunteer, donate, and speak up, we'll be looking for new hobbies....
I disagree. I am for closing certain areas to riding especially if it harms the environment or accounts for noise pollution. Some forests are too beautiful to ride on. I feel as if dirt bikes always think of themselves but never anyone else and thats what gets us into trouble.
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Tiki 2/10/2010 12:08pm
2/10/2010 12:08pm
Tiki wrote:
Good luck with that. You are missing the point. The police will be called if they are silent. Nosy Rosies will always be around to alert...
Good luck with that. You are missing the point. The police will be called if they are silent. Nosy Rosies will always be around to alert when someone is having fun.

But look past the facts in this thread where people posted public riding areas.
miedosoracing1 wrote:
Ah, but how many of them are saying they are in danger of getting closed by the greenies. So far, only Utah, which I'm not understanding...
Ah, but how many of them are saying they are in danger of getting closed by the greenies. So far, only Utah, which I'm not understanding, since the governor I thought rode MX? And Cali.
Cali is in Columbia. Look it up. California is on the west coast of the United States. CA, CALIF. or California. What they do in Cali is up to anyone. I bet they ride whatever they want where ever. Cocaine is usually involved.

At this time almost every riding area in the west (CA, NV, OR, WA, AZ, NM) is under some sort of scrutiny. Mostly due to people just cant keep their nose out of others business. Kinda like a Democrat!
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7I3N 2/10/2010 12:09pm
2/10/2010 12:09pm
deathgrip wrote:
California has an abundance of state owned OHV parks which are near most major cities. California also has boundless acres of desert land to ride on...
California has an abundance of state owned OHV parks which are near most major cities. California also has boundless acres of desert land to ride on. Gone are the days of riding in the urban surroundings but nobody can argue the riding areas are gone. Dirt bike riding is alive and well in California.

Titan1 wrote:
Dirt bike riding in this entire country is always under attack. There are groups (well funded, well organized groups) that will not stop fighting until OHV's...
Dirt bike riding in this entire country is always under attack. There are groups (well funded, well organized groups) that will not stop fighting until OHV's are completely outlawed on public land.

Now isn't the time to be complacent...if we all don't volunteer, donate, and speak up, we'll be looking for new hobbies....
deathgrip wrote:
I disagree. I am for closing certain areas to riding especially if it harms the environment or accounts for noise pollution. Some forests are too beautiful...
I disagree. I am for closing certain areas to riding especially if it harms the environment or accounts for noise pollution. Some forests are too beautiful to ride on. I feel as if dirt bikes always think of themselves but never anyone else and thats what gets us into trouble.
Nobody is trying to run a Hare and Hound race in the Yosemite Valley. But the Mammoth Mountain MX is held in a National Forest. Has been for 40 years. Do you think it should be shut down?

There is plenty of land in this huge country for preservation and off road recreation to coexist, but in the environment movement we are dealing with a group of ideological zealots that will stop at nothing and use any and all means to achieve their ends.
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Tiki 2/10/2010 12:23pm
2/10/2010 12:23pm
deathgrip wrote:
California has an abundance of state owned OHV parks which are near most major cities. California also has boundless acres of desert land to ride on...
California has an abundance of state owned OHV parks which are near most major cities. California also has boundless acres of desert land to ride on. Gone are the days of riding in the urban surroundings but nobody can argue the riding areas are gone. Dirt bike riding is alive and well in California.

Titan1 wrote:
Dirt bike riding in this entire country is always under attack. There are groups (well funded, well organized groups) that will not stop fighting until OHV's...
Dirt bike riding in this entire country is always under attack. There are groups (well funded, well organized groups) that will not stop fighting until OHV's are completely outlawed on public land.

Now isn't the time to be complacent...if we all don't volunteer, donate, and speak up, we'll be looking for new hobbies....
deathgrip wrote:
I disagree. I am for closing certain areas to riding especially if it harms the environment or accounts for noise pollution. Some forests are too beautiful...
I disagree. I am for closing certain areas to riding especially if it harms the environment or accounts for noise pollution. Some forests are too beautiful to ride on. I feel as if dirt bikes always think of themselves but never anyone else and thats what gets us into trouble.
I have spoken directly with the Forest Service manager in Williams AZ. It was a few years ago, but I opened the discussion to hold a race there in the Forest. The manager at the time was all for it, he expressed there was a boundary that couldn't be passed under any condition. It was the home to an owl. Pretty clear understanding. Also I will add he was very open to the idea, much different than dealing with the Forest Service here. Personalities get involved and they shouldn't. The USDA is to MANAGE the land not imply their own agenda.

Post a reply to: Public riding areas, hmmmm.