protests

bogdan912
Profile picture for user bogdan912
Posts
2722
Joined
8/15/2006
Location
Estell Manor, NJ, USA
bogdan912 6/1/2009 10:19am
6/1/2009 10:19am
Vurbmoto is reporting it was a 255 now.
Dutchmenmxpark 6/1/2009 10:27am
6/1/2009 10:27am
skynard wrote:
The bike in question was no where near a 302cc. Std bore ( 78mm ) , stroke was a little over the 52.2 mm std. size.
OH,that makes it ok then.
skynard
Profile picture for user skynard
Posts
13
Joined
8/17/2006
Location
Douglasville, GA, USA
skynard 6/1/2009 11:04am
6/1/2009 11:04am
Dutchmenmxpark,

I don't believe I said it was ok....I was only stating facts.

Anything over 250cc'c IS illegal in that class.
bogdan912
Profile picture for user bogdan912
Posts
2722
Joined
8/15/2006
Location
Estell Manor, NJ, USA
bogdan912 6/1/2009 11:05am
6/1/2009 11:05am
Hope no body tears me down I am running a 432!

The Shop

See All »
lumpy790
Profile picture for user lumpy790
Posts
11839
Joined
9/18/2007
Location
York, SC, USA
lumpy790 6/1/2009 11:23am
6/1/2009 11:23am
The way I understand it there was no one doing the protesting. It was either the promoter or MX Sports decision to mandate the top 5 tear downs.

I think this would be a good idea if they did several class random tear downs at each regional.

At one time the PW class at Lorettas was a zoo with protests. They finally started do mandatory top 10 tear down for the class.

oldx
Profile picture for user oldx
Posts
3046
Joined
8/16/2006
Location
Camano Island, WA, USA
oldx 6/1/2009 11:36am
6/1/2009 11:36am
900cc wouldn't help me
oldx
Profile picture for user oldx
Posts
3046
Joined
8/16/2006
Location
Camano Island, WA, USA
oldx 6/1/2009 11:38am
6/1/2009 11:38am
Yes, back in the day a factory bike was claimed, jobs lost and careers ruined. My memory has slipped on the details, but I'm sure someone will come along with the details.
lumpy790
Profile picture for user lumpy790
Posts
11839
Joined
9/18/2007
Location
York, SC, USA
lumpy790 6/1/2009 12:13pm
6/1/2009 12:13pm
A Factory Honda was claimed by a privateer back in 78 or 79. I cant remember his name but he protested the bike at several races till he won. Roudier or something like that and he had the worst looking numbers sewn on the back of his jersey.

I think it was Cycle World who ended up tearing the bike down and doing a huge article showing all the parts in detail.
project racer
Profile picture for user project racer
Posts
4371
Joined
8/26/2006
Location
USA
project racer 6/1/2009 1:35pm
6/1/2009 1:35pm
It was John Roeder that claimed Marty Tripes factory RC250 in '79. He was a privateer Maico rider. He never intended to race the bike, he was just exercising his right to claim a bike. He was going to do it again, but the AMA took the rule off the book.

I think he paid about $3500 for it.
khough22
Profile picture for user khough22
Posts
60
Joined
7/7/2008
Location
Fountaintown, IN, USA
khough22 6/1/2009 3:09pm
6/1/2009 3:09pm
Why is there still a claim rule? That didnt work back in the day and still doesnt. Why not limit the compression That is an easy check. Take the plug out and hook up the tester. They do this every weekend at the local car tracks. Someone has to get control over these four stroke engines. The bad thing about it from what I took from DCs comments is that nobody knows who is in control of this.
flarider
Profile picture for user flarider
Posts
25496
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
Daytona Beach, FL, USA
flarider 6/1/2009 3:21pm
6/1/2009 3:21pm
khough22 wrote:
Why is there still a claim rule? That didnt work back in the day and still doesnt. Why not limit the compression That is an easy...
Why is there still a claim rule? That didnt work back in the day and still doesnt. Why not limit the compression That is an easy check. Take the plug out and hook up the tester. They do this every weekend at the local car tracks. Someone has to get control over these four stroke engines. The bad thing about it from what I took from DCs comments is that nobody knows who is in control of this.
There is no claim rule in pro racing
Only amateur
khough22
Profile picture for user khough22
Posts
60
Joined
7/7/2008
Location
Fountaintown, IN, USA
khough22 6/1/2009 3:28pm
6/1/2009 3:28pm
So back to my original question. Do they tear down any of the pro's? It schould be automatic that the top ten get checked.
bd
Profile picture for user bd
Posts
6056
Joined
4/6/2007
Location
Las Vegas, NV, USA
bd 6/1/2009 3:38pm
6/1/2009 3:38pm
khough22 wrote:
Anybody have names and the year?
Yamaha protested Team Honda in 1992.

AMA took the bikes and Honda was cleared
slumpstone
Profile picture for user slumpstone
Posts
399
Joined
9/22/2006
Location
Thomasville, GA, USA
slumpstone 6/1/2009 3:56pm
6/1/2009 3:56pm
AMA tore about 8 bikes down (my son included) at Lazy River 2 weekends ago. Nobody was out of spec. so allot of people didnt hear about it. I think its a step in the right direction and hope they continue to do it all year. The only odd thing was that they didnt tear any "stock" class 85cc bikes down instead opting for the Supermini class, I think people are more apt to cheat in a stock class than a Supermini class.
bogdan912
Profile picture for user bogdan912
Posts
2722
Joined
8/15/2006
Location
Estell Manor, NJ, USA
bogdan912 6/1/2009 4:39pm
6/1/2009 4:39pm
Who tears the bikes down? Does the AMA supply the gaskets and stuff needed to put it all back together?
SlowOldGuy 6/1/2009 5:22pm
6/1/2009 5:22pm
slumpstone wrote:
AMA tore about 8 bikes down (my son included) at Lazy River 2 weekends ago. Nobody was out of spec. so allot of people didnt hear...
AMA tore about 8 bikes down (my son included) at Lazy River 2 weekends ago. Nobody was out of spec. so allot of people didnt hear about it. I think its a step in the right direction and hope they continue to do it all year. The only odd thing was that they didnt tear any "stock" class 85cc bikes down instead opting for the Supermini class, I think people are more apt to cheat in a stock class than a Supermini class.
I was glad to see Joey and Tyler as well as the Supermini guys torn down and found to be legal. There was a ton of talk about certain kids and I think this validated their talent. On your other point, I think they are more concerned with displacement violations. It is pretty cut and dried, it is either within the displacement limit or it is not. It is a whole lot more subjective to find violations in the stock class and a whole lot more work to tear the engine completely down. Unless it is obvious like porting etc., you could be there all day looking at stock motors trying to find violations. I applaud the AMA and MX Sports for doing what they are doing to enforce these rules.
khough22
Profile picture for user khough22
Posts
60
Joined
7/7/2008
Location
Fountaintown, IN, USA
khough22 6/1/2009 6:22pm
6/1/2009 6:22pm
slumpstone wrote:
AMA tore about 8 bikes down (my son included) at Lazy River 2 weekends ago. Nobody was out of spec. so allot of people didnt hear...
AMA tore about 8 bikes down (my son included) at Lazy River 2 weekends ago. Nobody was out of spec. so allot of people didnt hear about it. I think its a step in the right direction and hope they continue to do it all year. The only odd thing was that they didnt tear any "stock" class 85cc bikes down instead opting for the Supermini class, I think people are more apt to cheat in a stock class than a Supermini class.
SlowOldGuy wrote:
I was glad to see Joey and Tyler as well as the Supermini guys torn down and found to be legal. There was a ton of...
I was glad to see Joey and Tyler as well as the Supermini guys torn down and found to be legal. There was a ton of talk about certain kids and I think this validated their talent. On your other point, I think they are more concerned with displacement violations. It is pretty cut and dried, it is either within the displacement limit or it is not. It is a whole lot more subjective to find violations in the stock class and a whole lot more work to tear the engine completely down. Unless it is obvious like porting etc., you could be there all day looking at stock motors trying to find violations. I applaud the AMA and MX Sports for doing what they are doing to enforce these rules.
I do not get the point that it is easier to tech a mod bike than it is to tech a stock bike. I have never heard of tearing down bikes at an area, but that is great.
rocrac
Profile picture for user rocrac
Posts
2454
Joined
8/15/2006
Location
Indianapolis, IN, USA
rocrac 6/1/2009 8:44pm
6/1/2009 8:44pm Edited Date/Time 6/1/2009 8:52pm
My kid got "inspected" a few years ago at Lazy RIver along with all the top five guys did. They looked to see who was running their filter screens and checking frame numbers. Never happened at any other track we've been to though.

Random teardowns should happen at all major amateur nationals as well as the pro's.

Pit Row

See All »
BobbyM
Profile picture for user BobbyM
Posts
21435
Joined
8/15/2006
Location
USA
BobbyM 6/1/2009 8:54pm
6/1/2009 8:54pm
i have a great story from hangtown about this very same issue. you wouldn't believe it if i told you...well maybe you would and this is from a top pro wrench. crazy...
ACMYERS
Profile picture for user ACMYERS
Posts
865
Joined
3/21/2008
Location
Zeeland, MI, USA
ACMYERS 6/1/2009 9:46pm
6/1/2009 9:46pm
Out with it Bobby.
moto111 6/2/2009 3:50am
6/2/2009 3:50am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 12:12am
The wierdest thing is this.......

My son races the B classes.

I know his bike is stock. He only has one. I don't have the money to do the motor.


He has better results in the Mod classes on his stock bike than in the stock classes on his stock bike ?

SlowOldGuy 6/2/2009 5:17am
6/2/2009 5:17am
slumpstone wrote:
AMA tore about 8 bikes down (my son included) at Lazy River 2 weekends ago. Nobody was out of spec. so allot of people didnt hear...
AMA tore about 8 bikes down (my son included) at Lazy River 2 weekends ago. Nobody was out of spec. so allot of people didnt hear about it. I think its a step in the right direction and hope they continue to do it all year. The only odd thing was that they didnt tear any "stock" class 85cc bikes down instead opting for the Supermini class, I think people are more apt to cheat in a stock class than a Supermini class.
SlowOldGuy wrote:
I was glad to see Joey and Tyler as well as the Supermini guys torn down and found to be legal. There was a ton of...
I was glad to see Joey and Tyler as well as the Supermini guys torn down and found to be legal. There was a ton of talk about certain kids and I think this validated their talent. On your other point, I think they are more concerned with displacement violations. It is pretty cut and dried, it is either within the displacement limit or it is not. It is a whole lot more subjective to find violations in the stock class and a whole lot more work to tear the engine completely down. Unless it is obvious like porting etc., you could be there all day looking at stock motors trying to find violations. I applaud the AMA and MX Sports for doing what they are doing to enforce these rules.
khough22 wrote:
I do not get the point that it is easier to tech a mod bike than it is to tech a stock bike. I have never...
I do not get the point that it is easier to tech a mod bike than it is to tech a stock bike. I have never heard of tearing down bikes at an area, but that is great.
The point is that when teching a mod bike the only item that is up for debate is displacement. Anything else can be modified. Check the bore and stroke and you know if it is legal or not. In the stock class you have to check every part on the inside of the engine to make sure it has not been modified.
khough22
Profile picture for user khough22
Posts
60
Joined
7/7/2008
Location
Fountaintown, IN, USA
khough22 6/2/2009 6:07am
6/2/2009 6:07am
Didnt someone say that the bike at millcreek was ran in both classes. He only got a DQ in one class and not the other. How the hell does that work?
rallendude
Profile picture for user rallendude
Posts
2203
Joined
8/17/2006
Location
Adger, AL, USA
rallendude 6/2/2009 7:01am
6/2/2009 7:01am Edited Date/Time 4/17/2016 12:13am
There are many reasons that might work. First, the promoters and officials have a full day of running races and checking bikes. How are they supposed to know the same bikes is being run in more than one class?

Add to that the fact that they only tore down a few classes and most likely this bike only ended up in one of those classes.

The only way it WOULD have been checked in any other class is if someone racing with them knew it was doing double duty and protested it. In addition, for the protest, you have to protest a specific item for the protest to stand and be upheld. If you were to protest engine displacement for example and they checked and it was okay but they found no air filter screen present when it should be, they get a bye because the air filter screen was not part of the protest. Get my point?

The AMA/MXsports/Promoters are not looking for a way to keep people from racing and enforce the rules per se. But, if a protest is properly filed they will follow up on it. Chances are there were a lot more illegal bikes there that never got checked or looked twice at.
rocrac
Profile picture for user rocrac
Posts
2454
Joined
8/15/2006
Location
Indianapolis, IN, USA
rocrac 6/2/2009 7:57am
6/2/2009 7:57am
Cheaters will be cheaters but rule twisting may be curbed at the threat of random tear downs is all I'm saying.

Am I the only one that thinks the 250 pro class should be a production class? I know the after market companies wouldn't stand for that but man the cost of keeping a competitive 250f together is a financial nightmare.
Matt Fisher 6/2/2009 8:22am
6/2/2009 8:22am
rocrac wrote:
Cheaters will be cheaters but rule twisting may be curbed at the threat of random tear downs is all I'm saying. Am I the only one...
Cheaters will be cheaters but rule twisting may be curbed at the threat of random tear downs is all I'm saying.

Am I the only one that thinks the 250 pro class should be a production class? I know the after market companies wouldn't stand for that but man the cost of keeping a competitive 250f together is a financial nightmare.
If you'd like to keep costs down in the 250cc class, just let the 250cc pingers in there.
Big Lenny
Profile picture for user Big Lenny
Posts
14378
Joined
8/15/2006
Location
Compton, CA, USA
Big Lenny 6/2/2009 8:35am
6/2/2009 8:35am Edited Date/Time 6/2/2009 8:43am
project racer wrote:
It was John Roeder that claimed Marty Tripes factory RC250 in '79. He was a privateer Maico rider. He never intended to race the bike, he...
It was John Roeder that claimed Marty Tripes factory RC250 in '79. He was a privateer Maico rider. He never intended to race the bike, he was just exercising his right to claim a bike. He was going to do it again, but the AMA took the rule off the book.

I think he paid about $3500 for it.
Here is said offender and bike. Tripes RC250. After that bikes was claimed and torn apart by Cycle magazine, I think the big 4 said it would never happen again and would out bid any claimer no matter whose bike it was...



TeamGrnRacer99 6/2/2009 8:50am
6/2/2009 8:50am
35smom wrote:
Rob...theres no link to Millcreeks results. Where did you see it?
Dutchmenmxpark wrote:
Amy, I didn't see results. They aren't out ,yet. I just heard about the tear downs. What do I know anyway, I just know about strippers...
Amy,

I didn't see results. They aren't out ,yet. I just heard about the tear downs. What do I know anyway, I just know about strippers. LOL.
[b]STRIPPERS!!!! [/b] i still have those pics, i'll have to e-mail them to you.
ACMYERS
Profile picture for user ACMYERS
Posts
865
Joined
3/21/2008
Location
Zeeland, MI, USA
ACMYERS 6/2/2009 8:53am
6/2/2009 8:53am
35smom wrote:
Rob...theres no link to Millcreeks results. Where did you see it?
Dutchmenmxpark wrote:
Amy, I didn't see results. They aren't out ,yet. I just heard about the tear downs. What do I know anyway, I just know about strippers...
Amy,

I didn't see results. They aren't out ,yet. I just heard about the tear downs. What do I know anyway, I just know about strippers. LOL.
TeamGrnRacer99 wrote:
[b]STRIPPERS!!!! [/b] i still have those pics, i'll have to e-mail them to you.
Don't bother e-mailing them...Just post them here.

Post a reply to: protests