Would like to see a rule change from the AMA

mxtech1
Posts
1968
Joined
7/21/2011
Location
Galesburg, IL US
Edited Date/Time 5/23/2019 11:52am
I have always struggled wrapping my head around why anyone who races (amateur or professionally) is willing to ditch their goggles mid Moto and keep racing. What's even more complexing is that the sanctioning bodies allow it.

The AMA rule book clearly states goggles must be worn to start the race, but can be discarded during competition without penalty or disqualification. WTF....

It just seems increasingly probable that sooner or later someone is going to have a massive eye injury, possibly loss of sight, and then everyone is going lose their minds because the AMA was allowing them to race while mud, rocks, etc, are being blasted into their faces from roost.

Why would the AMA not mandate that if a rider ditches their goggles, they must stop in the pits to get a new pair before proceeding? If they continue to circulate w/o goggles, black flag their asses.
5
33
|
Casting
Posts
519
Joined
2/8/2017
Location
PA US
5/20/2019 4:04pm Edited Date/Time 5/20/2019 4:04pm
No one forces a rider to ditch their goggles. If a guy does it, he knows the risk. If he wants he can pull in for a new set. A new rule is not needed.



26
1
TDeath21
Posts
6515
Joined
2/22/2011
Location
Somewhere, MO US
5/20/2019 4:11pm
What about privateers who only have one set? It would force them to keep them on with poor vision, an even larger hazard. The rider knows the risk when they take them off. The rule is fine.
1
15
Flip109
Posts
3460
Joined
6/15/2007
Location
TX US
5/20/2019 4:11pm
I see your point but people been tossing goggles since the beginning of goggles. Let em race it’s their eyes. It’s moto it’s supposed to be dangerous and you def can lose an eye if you toss your goggles. Could lose a lot of other shit too quick if you aren’t careful. I’m sure they know that Whistling Laughing Laughing
3
mxtech1
Posts
1968
Joined
7/21/2011
Location
Galesburg, IL US
5/20/2019 4:15pm
Casting wrote:
No one forces a rider to ditch their goggles. If a guy does it, he knows the risk. If he wants he can pull in for...
No one forces a rider to ditch their goggles. If a guy does it, he knows the risk. If he wants he can pull in for a new set. A new rule is not needed.



Do you think the muddy conditions like Hangtown 2nd motos exceed the capabilities of the goggle & tearoff/roll-off system?

How can you say it's not an issue when there is consistently a notable percentage of the field finishing mud races without goggles?
2
10

The Shop

BroFoSho
Posts
739
Joined
9/26/2013
Location
Tucson, AZ US
5/20/2019 4:24pm
Serious question.

If a rider goes down and gets a face full of mud in their helmet/goggle, could they remove their helmet (their choice) and continue to race?

I feel like the rules should be consistent for all protective gear Huh
5
10
deanwhite51
Posts
2683
Joined
10/5/2017
Location
Sydney AU
5/20/2019 4:29pm
It becomes dangerous to keep there goggles on and have no vision.

And name one privateer who races the AMA circuit who only has 1 pair of goggles... that's a piss poor excuse to bring a privateer into this.
21
jeffro503
Posts
27629
Joined
7/22/2007
Location
St Helens, OR US
5/20/2019 4:35pm
BroFoSho wrote:
Serious question. If a rider goes down and gets a face full of mud in their helmet/goggle, could they remove their helmet (their choice) and continue...
Serious question.

If a rider goes down and gets a face full of mud in their helmet/goggle, could they remove their helmet (their choice) and continue to race?

I feel like the rules should be consistent for all protective gear Huh
Who in their right mind would try and complete a moto , without a helmet? I've never seen anyone ditch a helmet before.....but goggle's? Yes of course people ditch them. When they quit functioning properly are are basically worthless , the rider then makes a choice to either toss them , or ride blind. Which would you do? I know I'd toss them if I couldn't see. People have been doing that since this sport started. I don't think I have ever heard of a dude tossing his helmet. You damaged your helmet......you got other problem's going on.
2
Csb146
Posts
140
Joined
6/20/2017
Location
San Diego, CA US
5/20/2019 4:37pm Edited Date/Time 5/20/2019 4:43pm
I'm pretty sure they started a rule this year in the GP's that a rider has to pit within 2 laps to get goggles if they toss theirs. I could be wrong, but I could've sworn I heard or read it somewhere. I could see a rule like that being past in AMA racing.
3
Johnny Ringo
Posts
8000
Joined
1/11/2016
Location
Tombstone, AZ US
5/20/2019 4:51pm Edited Date/Time 5/20/2019 4:52pm
TDeath21 wrote:
What about privateers who only have one set? It would force them to keep them on with poor vision, an even larger hazard. The rider knows...
What about privateers who only have one set? It would force them to keep them on with poor vision, an even larger hazard. The rider knows the risk when they take them off. The rule is fine.
Do we really think privateers only have one pair of goggles?

Eye injuries are no joke
7
-MAVERICK-
Posts
65560
Joined
3/26/2015
Location
Ontario CA
5/20/2019 5:10pm
Csb146 wrote:
I'm pretty sure they started a rule this year in the GP's that a rider has to pit within 2 laps to get goggles if they...
I'm pretty sure they started a rule this year in the GP's that a rider has to pit within 2 laps to get goggles if they toss theirs. I could be wrong, but I could've sworn I heard or read it somewhere. I could see a rule like that being past in AMA racing.
1
kb228
Posts
6154
Joined
1/31/2018
Location
Mansfield, OH US
5/20/2019 5:10pm
TDeath21 wrote:
What about privateers who only have one set? It would force them to keep them on with poor vision, an even larger hazard. The rider knows...
What about privateers who only have one set? It would force them to keep them on with poor vision, an even larger hazard. The rider knows the risk when they take them off. The rule is fine.
Cmon bro no privateers racing only has 1 set. Any given member here has at least 3 in a bag and another 3 lost in their truck under a seat
9
5/20/2019 5:14pm
TDeath21 wrote:
What about privateers who only have one set? It would force them to keep them on with poor vision, an even larger hazard. The rider knows...
What about privateers who only have one set? It would force them to keep them on with poor vision, an even larger hazard. The rider knows the risk when they take them off. The rule is fine.
Woohoo Woohoo Woohoo Woohoo Woohoo Woohoo
1
77Moto
Posts
512
Joined
1/31/2019
Location
CA
5/20/2019 5:27pm
They don't care and I agree.
The rule should be come in next available lap.

Whats funny is in other sports, the refs jobs, and race control(For like Indy car) is to ensure safety and fair play.

Last year at an Indy race a guys face shield came loose on one side when he flipped it up during a yellow flag. Race control saw it and radioed driver and pits to come in next lap. Race control steward was there to make sure he was fixed up properly before letting him out of the pits.
2
1
just James
Posts
1133
Joined
12/20/2012
Location
Wolf Creek, OR US
5/20/2019 5:36pm
mxtech1 wrote:
I have always struggled wrapping my head around why anyone who races (amateur or professionally) is willing to ditch their goggles mid Moto and keep racing...
I have always struggled wrapping my head around why anyone who races (amateur or professionally) is willing to ditch their goggles mid Moto and keep racing. What's even more complexing is that the sanctioning bodies allow it.

The AMA rule book clearly states goggles must be worn to start the race, but can be discarded during competition without penalty or disqualification. WTF....

It just seems increasingly probable that sooner or later someone is going to have a massive eye injury, possibly loss of sight, and then everyone is going lose their minds because the AMA was allowing them to race while mud, rocks, etc, are being blasted into their faces from roost.

Why would the AMA not mandate that if a rider ditches their goggles, they must stop in the pits to get a new pair before proceeding? If they continue to circulate w/o goggles, black flag their asses.
Everyone should also have to bring their mother with them to scold them if they go too fast.
Can't too safe, ya know.
5
greenmx5
Posts
1641
Joined
4/1/2014
Location
PA US
5/20/2019 5:45pm
The rider could potentially be at more risk if he has goggles on and can't see clearly because they're all muffed up
JWRM
Posts
117
Joined
7/9/2018
Location
Nuevo, CA US
5/20/2019 5:49pm Edited Date/Time 5/20/2019 5:49pm
I'm no pro, and I hardly race anymore, but I have at least 4 pairs of goggles ready at any moment. So yeah, nobody is racing pro with just 1 pair of goggles.

What are the rules on stopping for a new, fresh pair with tearoffs/rolloffs? I'd imagine that ~5 second pit stop wouldn't hurt if everyone's doing it and if lap times are already skewed by mud.
1
Johnny Ringo
Posts
8000
Joined
1/11/2016
Location
Tombstone, AZ US
5/20/2019 5:58pm
mxtech1 wrote:
I have always struggled wrapping my head around why anyone who races (amateur or professionally) is willing to ditch their goggles mid Moto and keep racing...
I have always struggled wrapping my head around why anyone who races (amateur or professionally) is willing to ditch their goggles mid Moto and keep racing. What's even more complexing is that the sanctioning bodies allow it.

The AMA rule book clearly states goggles must be worn to start the race, but can be discarded during competition without penalty or disqualification. WTF....

It just seems increasingly probable that sooner or later someone is going to have a massive eye injury, possibly loss of sight, and then everyone is going lose their minds because the AMA was allowing them to race while mud, rocks, etc, are being blasted into their faces from roost.

Why would the AMA not mandate that if a rider ditches their goggles, they must stop in the pits to get a new pair before proceeding? If they continue to circulate w/o goggles, black flag their asses.
just James wrote:
Everyone should also have to bring their mother with them to scold them if they go too fast.
Can't too safe, ya know.
Ah, I found one of the tough guys
3
JustMX
Posts
5241
Joined
4/1/2008
Location
TN US
5/20/2019 6:09pm
Yeah, pass a new rule.

Rules and laws fix any problem.

Common sense dictates that you not ride without goggles.

However there are circumstances, an example would be doing a faceplate that leaves your goggles completely useless. Now you have to ride around to get a new pair while you can't see anything and are a hazard to yourself and everybody else out there.

Sure you can give them a lap or two to get a pair, but for amateur racing who the hell is going to keep up with it. Promoters and staff usually have their hands full scoring and dealing with other issues that come up if conditions are bad enough that riders,are tossing goggles..

Let's just do like they have done in new jersey for years. They have a state law requiring goggles with state police trackside monitoring it and pulling riders off if they don't see goggles.

The riders solution was to drill holes in their goggle lens and loop a zip tie through. If it got to the point that they couldn't see anymore they would use the zip tie to jerk the lens out. The troopers wouldn't bother them as long as they saw a goggle strap.
1
Forty
Posts
3035
Joined
7/27/2009
Location
Saint Paul, MN US
5/20/2019 6:12pm Edited Date/Time 5/20/2019 6:16pm
On a mudder I try to prepare with tear offs and also have pit tootsie standing trackside with a back up set in case the shit gets hairy. Worst case scenario to ride without. only happened once in 48 years. Washougal of course.
Johnny Ringo
Posts
8000
Joined
1/11/2016
Location
Tombstone, AZ US
5/20/2019 6:12pm
JustMX wrote:
Yeah, pass a new rule. Rules and laws fix any problem. Common sense dictates that you not ride without goggles. However there are circumstances, an example...
Yeah, pass a new rule.

Rules and laws fix any problem.

Common sense dictates that you not ride without goggles.

However there are circumstances, an example would be doing a faceplate that leaves your goggles completely useless. Now you have to ride around to get a new pair while you can't see anything and are a hazard to yourself and everybody else out there.

Sure you can give them a lap or two to get a pair, but for amateur racing who the hell is going to keep up with it. Promoters and staff usually have their hands full scoring and dealing with other issues that come up if conditions are bad enough that riders,are tossing goggles..

Let's just do like they have done in new jersey for years. They have a state law requiring goggles with state police trackside monitoring it and pulling riders off if they don't see goggles.

The riders solution was to drill holes in their goggle lens and loop a zip tie through. If it got to the point that they couldn't see anymore they would use the zip tie to jerk the lens out. The troopers wouldn't bother them as long as they saw a goggle strap.
No one is talking about amateurs here, dude
2
spimx
Posts
1298
Joined
3/25/2019
Location
Port Isabel, TX US
5/20/2019 6:27pm
mxtech1 wrote:
I have always struggled wrapping my head around why anyone who races (amateur or professionally) is willing to ditch their goggles mid Moto and keep racing...
I have always struggled wrapping my head around why anyone who races (amateur or professionally) is willing to ditch their goggles mid Moto and keep racing. What's even more complexing is that the sanctioning bodies allow it.

The AMA rule book clearly states goggles must be worn to start the race, but can be discarded during competition without penalty or disqualification. WTF....

It just seems increasingly probable that sooner or later someone is going to have a massive eye injury, possibly loss of sight, and then everyone is going lose their minds because the AMA was allowing them to race while mud, rocks, etc, are being blasted into their faces from roost.

Why would the AMA not mandate that if a rider ditches their goggles, they must stop in the pits to get a new pair before proceeding? If they continue to circulate w/o goggles, black flag their asses.
Everyone will not lose their mind. You might lose your mind but most people will understand that the rider made that decision and will deal with the consequences.
2
mxtech1
Posts
1968
Joined
7/21/2011
Location
Galesburg, IL US
5/20/2019 6:27pm
I didn't see the thread about the goggle lane being implemented in MXGP before I posted.....but yeah, that's about what I had in mind.

My point was made - with it being implemented in MXGP, our National Series will have to follow suite.

Anything in the works Coombs?
2
mxtech1
Posts
1968
Joined
7/21/2011
Location
Galesburg, IL US
5/20/2019 6:33pm
spimx wrote:
Everyone will not lose their mind. You might lose your mind but most people will understand that the rider made that decision and will deal with...
Everyone will not lose their mind. You might lose your mind but most people will understand that the rider made that decision and will deal with the consequences.
Exactly. And we, collectively, understand that it's a big risk. Racers are conditioned to accept the fact that they will be expected to remove goggles (which is safety gear if you want to be blunt about it) to compete.

Why not try something new that helps increase their safety when needed?
2
1
bama205
Posts
1519
Joined
10/7/2010
Location
Williamson County, TN US
5/20/2019 6:50pm
They should make a new rule that it’s not legal to get hurt. That would solve the injury issue we have been having in SX.
9
snackfedbear
Posts
1060
Joined
10/18/2016
Location
Southern, CA US
5/20/2019 7:47pm
just invent helmets with windscreens and wipers built in bro
1
Johnny Ringo
Posts
8000
Joined
1/11/2016
Location
Tombstone, AZ US
5/20/2019 7:49pm
All you guys against it, should the riders be able to ditch their helmet when they break a visor and it’s hanging in their face?
2
12
VRR7
Posts
860
Joined
6/1/2011
Location
ZA
5/20/2019 8:21pm
Csb146 wrote:
I'm pretty sure they started a rule this year in the GP's that a rider has to pit within 2 laps to get goggles if they...
I'm pretty sure they started a rule this year in the GP's that a rider has to pit within 2 laps to get goggles if they toss theirs. I could be wrong, but I could've sworn I heard or read it somewhere. I could see a rule like that being past in AMA racing.
The GP's have a Goggle lane - A quick stop to get new goggles that is faster than going through the pits !
SPYGUY
Posts
2161
Joined
8/15/2006
Location
US
5/20/2019 9:09pm
BroFoSho wrote:
Serious question. If a rider goes down and gets a face full of mud in their helmet/goggle, could they remove their helmet (their choice) and continue...
Serious question.

If a rider goes down and gets a face full of mud in their helmet/goggle, could they remove their helmet (their choice) and continue to race?

I feel like the rules should be consistent for all protective gear Huh
jeffro503 wrote:
Who in their right mind would try and complete a moto , without a helmet? I've never seen anyone ditch a helmet before.....but goggle's? Yes of...
Who in their right mind would try and complete a moto , without a helmet? I've never seen anyone ditch a helmet before.....but goggle's? Yes of course people ditch them. When they quit functioning properly are are basically worthless , the rider then makes a choice to either toss them , or ride blind. Which would you do? I know I'd toss them if I couldn't see. People have been doing that since this sport started. I don't think I have ever heard of a dude tossing his helmet. You damaged your helmet......you got other problem's going on.
Tarz483
Posts
6344
Joined
2/25/2009
Location
Mankato, MN US
5/21/2019 8:05am
I dont Disagree if they make the choice to ditch them , that they grab a pair from their mechanic or crew the next time they get there, it became a rule and became the norm everyone would adapt and get used to it and avoid a bad Rock to the Eye like op is talking about , which i dont recall happening but definitely could, the bikes have more power than ever before,if the Rider makes the choice and loses a position or 2 in the process of getting a new pair so be it.
mac3-d
Posts
1321
Joined
4/16/2010
Location
IE
5/21/2019 8:22am
mxtech1 wrote:
I have always struggled wrapping my head around why anyone who races (amateur or professionally) is willing to ditch their goggles mid Moto and keep racing...
I have always struggled wrapping my head around why anyone who races (amateur or professionally) is willing to ditch their goggles mid Moto and keep racing. What's even more complexing is that the sanctioning bodies allow it.

The AMA rule book clearly states goggles must be worn to start the race, but can be discarded during competition without penalty or disqualification. WTF....

It just seems increasingly probable that sooner or later someone is going to have a massive eye injury, possibly loss of sight, and then everyone is going lose their minds because the AMA was allowing them to race while mud, rocks, etc, are being blasted into their faces from roost.

Why would the AMA not mandate that if a rider ditches their goggles, they must stop in the pits to get a new pair before proceeding? If they continue to circulate w/o goggles, black flag their asses.
just James wrote:
Everyone should also have to bring their mother with them to scold them if they go too fast.
Can't too safe, ya know.
Ha my dad would signal to slow me down with mum right beside him waving me on Laughing
3

Post a reply to: Would like to see a rule change from the AMA

The Latest