Why are gate picks a lottery for mxdn?

yz133rider
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yz133rider
Seems like a great way to wreck a race before it starts if a contender gets 3rd and another gets 37th
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mattyhamz2 10/3/2018 2:23pm
10/3/2018 2:23pm
Only reason I see for it is giving the little nations a fair chance at getting a good pick.

But it sucks for any of the big competitive countries when they get such a bad pick.
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Robgvx
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Robgvx 10/3/2018 2:25pm
10/3/2018 2:25pm Edited Date/Time 10/3/2018 2:26pm
It’s only for qualifying. Main race gate picks are taken from qualifying race results. Any contending team, even with last gate pick for the qualifying race, should be able to get 2 decent results out of 3 to earn a top-ten gate pick for Sunday.
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early
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early 10/3/2018 2:26pm
10/3/2018 2:26pm
Alot of guys from England are gonna be here to call you an idiot after they finish their tea.

It's a stupid system held over from before they had the ability to reliably time laps, why its still used when all the bikes, scoring and format is all different than it was back then, nobody knows.
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early
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early 10/3/2018 2:27pm
10/3/2018 2:27pm
Robgvx wrote:
It’s only for qualifying. Main race gate picks are taken from qualifying race results. Any contending team, even with last gate pick for the qualifying race...
It’s only for qualifying. Main race gate picks are taken from qualifying race results. Any contending team, even with last gate pick for the qualifying race, should be able to get 2 decent results out of 3 to earn a top-ten gate pick for Sunday.
How is the gate order determined for the qualifying race during the regular MXGP season.
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devindavisphoto 10/3/2018 2:34pm
10/3/2018 2:34pm
All it takes is to seed them into groups of 5 or 10 for the next event. I remember hearing this idea on one of the older podcasts on RacerX (I think?).

1st-5th gets seeded into Group A, 6th-10th gets seeded into Group B, etc. The following event randomly draws from those 5 (or 10) for gate pick at the following event.

Maybe you can do top 10 gets seeded into group A, then everyone else gets put into a huge group after that. It would eliminate chaos while still keeping an element of randomness and fairness to the event.
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Robgvx
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Robgvx 10/3/2018 2:38pm
10/3/2018 2:38pm
Robgvx wrote:
It’s only for qualifying. Main race gate picks are taken from qualifying race results. Any contending team, even with last gate pick for the qualifying race...
It’s only for qualifying. Main race gate picks are taken from qualifying race results. Any contending team, even with last gate pick for the qualifying race, should be able to get 2 decent results out of 3 to earn a top-ten gate pick for Sunday.
early wrote:
How is the gate order determined for the qualifying race during the regular MXGP season.
A timed practice session. Which makes the subsequent race just to determine a second set of gate picks a stupid thing.
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Andy_Greenney 10/3/2018 2:41pm
10/3/2018 2:41pm
Can understand both sides of the argument....like the idea of a bit of a mix up and a chance for the outsider teams personally, but each to their own.
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Andy_Greenney 10/3/2018 2:42pm
10/3/2018 2:42pm
devindavisphoto wrote:
All it takes is to seed them into groups of 5 or 10 for the next event. I remember hearing this idea on one of the...
All it takes is to seed them into groups of 5 or 10 for the next event. I remember hearing this idea on one of the older podcasts on RacerX (I think?).

1st-5th gets seeded into Group A, 6th-10th gets seeded into Group B, etc. The following event randomly draws from those 5 (or 10) for gate pick at the following event.

Maybe you can do top 10 gets seeded into group A, then everyone else gets put into a huge group after that. It would eliminate chaos while still keeping an element of randomness and fairness to the event.
Sounds like a good compromise to me
HusqFan3
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HusqFan3 10/3/2018 4:13pm
10/3/2018 4:13pm
yz133rider wrote:
Seems like a great way to wreck a race before it starts if a contender gets 3rd and another gets 37th
Because otherwise they’d have to have a qualifying race to decide gate picks for the qualifying race...
scott_nz 10/3/2018 4:19pm
10/3/2018 4:19pm Edited Date/Time 10/3/2018 4:19pm
its stupid that its a lottery,

if they want all the teams starting off the same grid, then go off last years results, or use the practice times for each grid from the practices,
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yz133rider
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yz133rider 10/3/2018 4:21pm
10/3/2018 4:21pm
yz133rider wrote:
Seems like a great way to wreck a race before it starts if a contender gets 3rd and another gets 37th
HusqFan3 wrote:
Because otherwise they’d have to have a qualifying race to decide gate picks for the qualifying race...
I mean wouldnt last years results be a better way than a friggin lottery?
philG
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philG 10/4/2018 1:59am
10/4/2018 1:59am
What about teams that miss a year.. it means guys can use the practice for bike set up instead of having to lay down a lap for gate pick. Each group gets one long session. Worked for years.
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philG 10/4/2018 2:02am
10/4/2018 2:02am
yz133rider wrote:
I mean wouldnt last years results be a better way than a friggin lottery?
Actually that would be fun.. just to watch Tomac having to line up behind Tanel Leok
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Paul_Jacky 10/4/2018 4:09am
10/4/2018 4:09am
Mx starts are 9 out of 10 a lottery, give cairoli or herlings a bad gate and they still win. Give a less rider the best gate maybe he'll win the holeshot award. Thats it. Whats the advantage for herlings to have first pick or last pick it does't matter.. I would like a motogp start less crashes at the first corner.. it sucks for the last one tough. But he would still not win the gp..
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yz133rider
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yz133rider 10/4/2018 4:15am
10/4/2018 4:15am
Paul_Jacky wrote:
Mx starts are 9 out of 10 a lottery, give cairoli or herlings a bad gate and they still win. Give a less rider the best...
Mx starts are 9 out of 10 a lottery, give cairoli or herlings a bad gate and they still win. Give a less rider the best gate maybe he'll win the holeshot award. Thats it. Whats the advantage for herlings to have first pick or last pick it does't matter.. I would like a motogp start less crashes at the first corner.. it sucks for the last one tough. But he would still not win the gp..
I agree i have suggested this before to a fury of hatred and attacks lol
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c0ncEpT
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c0ncEpT 10/4/2018 5:23am
10/4/2018 5:23am
Every race I've been apart of (amateur of course) has had a lottery for the 1st moto gate pick.

No matter the gate pick the fast guys still end up in the front by the end of the moto.
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early
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early 10/4/2018 5:46am
10/4/2018 5:46am
Robgvx wrote:
It’s only for qualifying. Main race gate picks are taken from qualifying race results. Any contending team, even with last gate pick for the qualifying race...
It’s only for qualifying. Main race gate picks are taken from qualifying race results. Any contending team, even with last gate pick for the qualifying race, should be able to get 2 decent results out of 3 to earn a top-ten gate pick for Sunday.
early wrote:
How is the gate order determined for the qualifying race during the regular MXGP season.
Robgvx wrote:
A timed practice session. Which makes the subsequent race just to determine a second set of gate picks a stupid thing.
Why not take one best time from each team from the practice sessions and gate all classes for the team according to that order. This elevates the role of the "team captain" and allows the other 2 guys to work on their setup for the races. The qualifying races at the MXdN are not only for gate pick but also who is racing the main races on Sunday.

The idea of introducing randomness into the start order would not be such a big deal if every start was not explicitly designed to favor the top qualifying position, yet there is no order to the qualifying race.
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make1go
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make1go 10/4/2018 3:14pm
10/4/2018 3:14pm
early wrote:
Alot of guys from England are gonna be here to call you an idiot after they finish their tea. It's a stupid system held over from...
Alot of guys from England are gonna be here to call you an idiot after they finish their tea.

It's a stupid system held over from before they had the ability to reliably time laps, why its still used when all the bikes, scoring and format is all different than it was back then, nobody knows.
yeah dump history and traditional rules that ive, we've? never heard a complaint about from riders, teams, official bodies, cause some guys on vitail think its stupid..

strong argument ?
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early
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early 10/4/2018 4:08pm
10/4/2018 4:08pm
early wrote:
Alot of guys from England are gonna be here to call you an idiot after they finish their tea. It's a stupid system held over from...
Alot of guys from England are gonna be here to call you an idiot after they finish their tea.

It's a stupid system held over from before they had the ability to reliably time laps, why its still used when all the bikes, scoring and format is all different than it was back then, nobody knows.
make1go wrote:
yeah dump history and traditional rules that ive, we've? never heard a complaint about from riders, teams, official bodies, cause some guys on vitail think its...
yeah dump history and traditional rules that ive, we've? never heard a complaint about from riders, teams, official bodies, cause some guys on vitail think its stupid..

strong argument ?
So nobody has EVER complained about the system?

Why not keep the history of the 125 class, and separate class scoring?
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scott_nz 10/4/2018 4:30pm
10/4/2018 4:30pm Edited Date/Time 10/4/2018 4:31pm
philG wrote:
What about teams that miss a year.. it means guys can use the practice for bike set up instead of having to lay down a lap...
What about teams that miss a year.. it means guys can use the practice for bike set up instead of having to lay down a lap for gate pick. Each group gets one long session. Worked for years.
if they miss a year, they go to the back of the line
FillmoreSouth 10/4/2018 6:24pm
10/4/2018 6:24pm
Robgvx wrote:
It’s only for qualifying. Main race gate picks are taken from qualifying race results. Any contending team, even with last gate pick for the qualifying race...
It’s only for qualifying. Main race gate picks are taken from qualifying race results. Any contending team, even with last gate pick for the qualifying race, should be able to get 2 decent results out of 3 to earn a top-ten gate pick for Sunday.
early wrote:
How is the gate order determined for the qualifying race during the regular MXGP season.
Robgvx wrote:
A timed practice session. Which makes the subsequent race just to determine a second set of gate picks a stupid thing.
MXGP is a two-day production with support races split across Saturday and Sunday. The Saturday MX2/MXGP qualifying races are there to give Saturday marquee events that, ironically, help generate interest in the undercard.
Edge-Of-Adhesion 10/4/2018 7:54pm
10/4/2018 7:54pm
mattyhamz2 wrote:
Only reason I see for it is giving the little nations a fair chance at getting a good pick. But it sucks for any of the...
Only reason I see for it is giving the little nations a fair chance at getting a good pick.

But it sucks for any of the big competitive countries when they get such a bad pick.
I think the main reason is that adding timed practice sessions to determine qualifying race gate picks to an already busy schedule is not practical. It's ok for the GPs as there are just 2 classes but MXoNs have 3, so there's 50% more to schedule in.
Squirrelings 10/4/2018 9:18pm
10/4/2018 9:18pm
c0ncEpT wrote:
Every race I've been apart of (amateur of course) has had a lottery for the 1st moto gate pick. No matter the gate pick the fast...
Every race I've been apart of (amateur of course) has had a lottery for the 1st moto gate pick.

No matter the gate pick the fast guys still end up in the front by the end of the moto.
Gate pick is pretty important when there is 40 guys on the line.

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