What does a factory bike cost?

steveada
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steveada 4/11/2018 10:47am
4/11/2018 10:47am
Go to RMMC, pull up the stock parts list for your particular bike and individually order all the parts to create your stock bike. It will give you a number but it is not a realistic representation of what your bike cost. People who think the bikes cost 300k to build must be using this method.
DL
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DL 4/11/2018 11:03am
4/11/2018 11:03am
$40,000 plus for a good privateer effort just for the bike build. Add the cost of building a practice bike, full time mechanic and aggressive maintenance schedule and you can see how fast the cost escalates.


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BobPA
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BobPA 4/11/2018 1:01pm
4/11/2018 1:01pm
ML512 wrote:
Honda's US race team doesn't make their clamps, linkages, footpegs brackets, and many of those CNC style parts in house.... As someone else mentioned here, Honda's...
Honda's US race team doesn't make their clamps, linkages, footpegs brackets, and many of those CNC style parts in house....

As someone else mentioned here, Honda's US team is a separate entity, just like KMC is seperate fro KHI (Kawasaki) they pay for their parts.

For the ones that keep asking what would the hard cost be of the bike? Here's my rough estimate if you had access to each supplier and paid the cost of each part that's custom made and the retail cost of all publicly available items.

I'm using a HRC bike as a placeholder and I'm bringing up over $55,000 (no labor or development costs) with rough costs of the initial bike, titanium bolts, brake calipers, wheelsets (including works hubs), works suspension, carbon fiber bits, exhausts, throttle body mods, crank and rod costs, valve train, cams, clutches, custom spec pistons, electronics (ECUs, wiring harnesses, and data acquisition components) footpeg and brackets, controls such as shift and brake levers, handle bar controls, plastics, seat cover, lightweight seat foam, CNC costs for clamps, cylinder heads, fork lugs, linkages, bell cranks, brackets, etc...

Just suspension and works parts such as calipers, hubs, clamps, linkages, and electronics has a rough cost of around $25,000 or more.

I asked J-Bone one time what it costs them to run a 450 for the whole season, not including the rider's salary, he said it was something north of $350,000 just to add a third 450 in rotation with race and practice bike...prior to rider's costs.
TXDirt wrote:
I was pretty much spot on then back on page 1.

250's are about $150k-$250k and the 450's are about $250k-$400k.
Claiming you were “spot on” whilst giving yourself a range of $150k in error is a bit contradictory...Don’t ya think?
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TXDirt
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TXDirt 4/11/2018 1:53pm
4/11/2018 1:53pm
BobPA wrote:
Claiming you were “spot on” whilst giving yourself a range of $150k in error is a bit contradictory...Don’t ya think?
Different teams, different bikes, different parts, different costs. So yeah it's a range and I was correctly within that. I could have narrowed my 450 costs a bit more for sure. 300-400. I wanted to be a little conservative. On the high-end I would not be surprised to hear a bike is $500k for Honda or Kawi.

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drt410
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drt410 4/11/2018 3:00pm
4/11/2018 3:00pm
Theres also hours and hours of testing between riders that make million dollar salaries, mechanics, the head honchos in japan...etc's time that goes into all of this. Theres no way to know, but Id say a few hundred thousand by the time it lines up to the gate.
drt410
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drt410 4/11/2018 3:31pm
4/11/2018 3:31pm Edited Date/Time 4/11/2018 3:35pm
steveada wrote:
Go to RMMC, pull up the stock parts list for your particular bike and individually order all the parts to create your stock bike. It will...
Go to RMMC, pull up the stock parts list for your particular bike and individually order all the parts to create your stock bike. It will give you a number but it is not a realistic representation of what your bike cost. People who think the bikes cost 300k to build must be using this method.
Lol I did this just for fun selected my bike, went through all the parts and selected everything I would need and it came out to $5430 and thats with minimal engine work and no suspension or the cost of the bike. So thats basically the privateerest of privateer bikes. So thats $8599 for the bike, $5430 in RMMC parts, probably $15,000 for suspension, and $10,000 for engine work besides what I was able to do with the head, ti valves, high comp piston, clutch etc... So for a VERY privateer bike were talking $39,029. Thats not cheap, and thats just a rocky mountain bike lol. Damn.

Although Reed said his stock Husky was lighter and faster than his factory Yz450f so you could probably get by on a fairly stock Husky, especially if were talking the 450 class because you don't really need to do much power wise besides move it around. At the same time Reed is known to rip on any brand he rides for or any bike that he doesn't win on so I guess take it with a grain of salt, but we do know the Husky is making a ton of HP and its very light so it would cost a lot of money just to get some other stock bikes down to stock KTM/Husky weight or power. That Rocky Mountain Husky would be a RIPPER though for an off the shelf bike.
mxb2
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mxb2 4/11/2018 4:53pm
4/11/2018 4:53pm
Good privateer bike is 30-40k. I have25k in my crf. Et3 replica . $$ adds up quick.
TeamGreen
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TeamGreen 4/11/2018 5:55pm
4/11/2018 5:55pm
You're not aware of the Made in Japan HRC pegs? (From BILLET)
Or proprietary parts made IN-HOUSE by the OEMs?
Better yet, your ranting on some of the people that make &/or source these parts.
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RichieW13
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RichieW13 8/15/2018 10:27am
8/15/2018 10:27am Edited Date/Time 8/15/2018 10:27am
On a related topic. During Supercross, Ralph mentioned a few times that the thing that Justin Brayton was most excited to get from Honda was a factory front brake caliper.

What could the factory do to a brake caliper to make it so much better than a typical aftermarket brake caliper?
Flip109
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Flip109 8/15/2018 10:32am
8/15/2018 10:32am
Couldn’t even begin to imagine what these new 450’s cost. 20 years ago in a magazine they stated Ezra Lusks factory Honda 250 cost about 90k.
Jeremy Macbeth 8/15/2018 10:47am
8/15/2018 10:47am Edited Date/Time 8/15/2018 10:49am
RichieW13 wrote:
On a related topic. During Supercross, Ralph mentioned a few times that the thing that Justin Brayton was most excited to get from Honda was a...
On a related topic. During Supercross, Ralph mentioned a few times that the thing that Justin Brayton was most excited to get from Honda was a factory front brake caliper.

What could the factory do to a brake caliper to make it so much better than a typical aftermarket brake caliper?
Machined from billet aluminum or magnesium and finished to extremely close tolerances and the pistons are typically specially coated with something like the DLC or Titanium nitride process. As a testament to their close tolerances, they typically don't require piston seals like a standard caliper uses.
RichieW13
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RichieW13 8/15/2018 10:54am
8/15/2018 10:54am
RichieW13 wrote:
On a related topic. During Supercross, Ralph mentioned a few times that the thing that Justin Brayton was most excited to get from Honda was a...
On a related topic. During Supercross, Ralph mentioned a few times that the thing that Justin Brayton was most excited to get from Honda was a factory front brake caliper.

What could the factory do to a brake caliper to make it so much better than a typical aftermarket brake caliper?
Jeremy Macbeth wrote:
Machined from billet aluminum or magnesium and finished to extremely close tolerances and the pistons are typically specially coated with something like the DLC or Titanium...
Machined from billet aluminum or magnesium and finished to extremely close tolerances and the pistons are typically specially coated with something like the DLC or Titanium nitride process. As a testament to their close tolerances, they typically don't require piston seals like a standard caliper uses.
What is the effect of this? Faster brake response? More stopping pressure? Both?
mx317
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mx317 8/15/2018 11:11am
8/15/2018 11:11am
RichieW13 wrote:
On a related topic. During Supercross, Ralph mentioned a few times that the thing that Justin Brayton was most excited to get from Honda was a...
On a related topic. During Supercross, Ralph mentioned a few times that the thing that Justin Brayton was most excited to get from Honda was a factory front brake caliper.

What could the factory do to a brake caliper to make it so much better than a typical aftermarket brake caliper?
Jeremy Macbeth wrote:
Machined from billet aluminum or magnesium and finished to extremely close tolerances and the pistons are typically specially coated with something like the DLC or Titanium...
Machined from billet aluminum or magnesium and finished to extremely close tolerances and the pistons are typically specially coated with something like the DLC or Titanium nitride process. As a testament to their close tolerances, they typically don't require piston seals like a standard caliper uses.
I agree with most of this, but I don't see how they would work with no seal. The pistons have to have enough clearance to move and brake fluid under pressure when you apply the brakes would seep past.
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RandyS
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RandyS 8/15/2018 11:44am
8/15/2018 11:44am
It's the post with answers that are mostly exactly what I didn't ask, that keeps on giving. Reading back over it I realize 20-25 not including the bike was probably low. Still can't see it going over 50 including labor. No R&D, break time caviar, or lunch hookers included.
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Blade Flanagan jr. 8/15/2018 12:59pm
8/15/2018 12:59pm
RichieW13 wrote:
On a related topic. During Supercross, Ralph mentioned a few times that the thing that Justin Brayton was most excited to get from Honda was a...
On a related topic. During Supercross, Ralph mentioned a few times that the thing that Justin Brayton was most excited to get from Honda was a factory front brake caliper.

What could the factory do to a brake caliper to make it so much better than a typical aftermarket brake caliper?
Jeremy Macbeth wrote:
Machined from billet aluminum or magnesium and finished to extremely close tolerances and the pistons are typically specially coated with something like the DLC or Titanium...
Machined from billet aluminum or magnesium and finished to extremely close tolerances and the pistons are typically specially coated with something like the DLC or Titanium nitride process. As a testament to their close tolerances, they typically don't require piston seals like a standard caliper uses.
RichieW13 wrote:
What is the effect of this? Faster brake response? More stopping pressure? Both?
Lighter weight, better feel, more power along with better modulation, more reliable etc.
Blade Flanagan jr. 8/15/2018 1:06pm
8/15/2018 1:06pm
TeamGreen wrote:
You're not aware of the Made in Japan HRC pegs? (From BILLET) Or proprietary parts made IN-HOUSE by the OEMs? Better yet, your ranting on some...
You're not aware of the Made in Japan HRC pegs? (From BILLET)
Or proprietary parts made IN-HOUSE by the OEMs?
Better yet, your ranting on some of the people that make &/or source these parts.
You really think the teams are getting works parts for free? The American factory teams get bills from the factories in Japan for most if not all of the trick factory parts on those bikes. The only parts they get for free are aftermarket parts and maybe some stuff for R&D purposes.
GeorgiePorgie 8/15/2018 1:06pm
8/15/2018 1:06pm
I wonder if the factories don’t even keep a tally. Just bolt it on and run it. Who cares about cost at that level.
Blade Flanagan jr. 8/15/2018 1:09pm
8/15/2018 1:09pm
GeorgiePorgie wrote:
I wonder if the factories don’t even keep a tally. Just bolt it on and run it. Who cares about cost at that level.
They absolutely keep track. They know the cost of every part used and in stock.

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Old2stroker08 8/15/2018 9:39pm
8/15/2018 9:39pm
100k and im struggling to put out a grand to totally rebuild my bike. HAHAH. hey these guys are at the highest level. its like all sports and competitive sports. at the highest level every advantage is taken regardless of the cost.

brands have a lot on the line with factory bikes. people see podiums for kawi, honda and whoever and im sure uneducated people think those bikes are somehow better (although we know they are vastly different).

On a side note. Imagine putting all the big boys together on BONE STOCK bikes. wouldn't be as fun to watch but interesting. Im sure the results wouldn't change much. TALENT IS TALENT
Jrewing
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Jrewing 8/16/2018 12:42am
8/16/2018 12:42am
DL wrote:
$40,000 plus for a good privateer effort just for the bike build. Add the cost of building a practice bike, full time mechanic and aggressive maintenance...
$40,000 plus for a good privateer effort just for the bike build. Add the cost of building a practice bike, full time mechanic and aggressive maintenance schedule and you can see how fast the cost escalates.


Who pays full retail? I get 10% off through my sponsor
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Jrewing
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Jrewing 8/16/2018 12:45am
8/16/2018 12:45am
mxb2 wrote:
Good privateer bike is 30-40k. I have25k in my crf. Et3 replica . $$ adds up quick.
Wtf! I charge myself 200/hr for labor on my builds. Tire changes cost 400...
DoubleA
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DoubleA 8/16/2018 1:44am
8/16/2018 1:44am
I heard one year might of been 2015 but for MEC Dungey's wheels cost 75k because they were stronger/one of wheels. True or not I don't know.


Everyone arguing about teams getting sponsorship's and the parts not costing but if you were to build a full blown factory bike I bet you would have to pay for them. Also whether or not they got the parts for free it will still bump up the cost of the bike its self.
matt.3150
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matt.3150 9/16/2018 6:54pm
9/16/2018 6:54pm
Well you guys are missing a lot when you talk about what it cost to make these factory bikes. All I here is that you program the part and run them on a CNC machine. That’s only a small portion of the costs. There are literally hundreds of poeple involved in the process that your missing. Your missing all the management involved right down to poeple that clean the bathrooms. What about design costs? Engineering is a big cost, the machine tool CNC that make these HRC titanium pegs cost around a million dollars. Then the programmer that program them, the set up guy/ operator. What about shipping and receiving costs, inventory. You guys need to open your eyes nothing is cheap I know My company makes some parts for these teams. The HRC titanium pegs are done in two 5 axis CNC operation that take about a day to get each operation set up and then take about 20 hours to run each operation. The guys setting these machines up are not cheap, the guys running these million dollar pieces of equipment are the best in there field. The titanium for each piece cost almost $100. So we are talking about 2weeks just to get the first part done. But know you have to make the other side and the mounts. When your done 1 set of pegs and mounts took you over a month and a half of just set up time and run time, then somewhere in the ball park of $350 dollar in titanium, some a lot of very expensive endmills. This cost is even before the engineering which is even more expensive! Bottom line it ain’t cheep!
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Racer111 9/16/2018 6:59pm
9/16/2018 6:59pm
RandyS wrote:
I was looking at the mud pictures and wondering what it would cost if the factories just threw those bikes away and built an exact replica...
I was looking at the mud pictures and wondering what it would cost if the factories just threw those bikes away and built an exact replica. Not how much do they spend developing the bikes but lets say Monday morning after Seattle they said "let's build a brand new bike for Vegas". This would be assuming they made every custom part including suspension. $15,000, $20,000, $25,000??? I would guess $20,000 range, maybe I'm way off but once the CNC programming is done it's pretty cheap considering to reproduce.
You’re WAY off. There was an article in 2001 of Racer X on riding RC’s 100,000.00 KX250! That was 17 years ago.

20,000.00 my ass!
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decano51
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decano51 9/16/2018 7:45pm
9/16/2018 7:45pm
RichieW13 wrote:
On a related topic. During Supercross, Ralph mentioned a few times that the thing that Justin Brayton was most excited to get from Honda was a...
On a related topic. During Supercross, Ralph mentioned a few times that the thing that Justin Brayton was most excited to get from Honda was a factory front brake caliper.

What could the factory do to a brake caliper to make it so much better than a typical aftermarket brake caliper?
Coatings, Bigger internals and sleeves.

Here in aus. I spoke to Metcalfs mechanic and they said the same thing about the factory caliper.
from what he said, the piston was bigger, lighter and was coated so it was a smoother surface with more feel.
certain materials in o-rings and all surfaces are ti nitrate coated.
more fluid going through on a bigger surface,means more power and feel.


Langhammx 9/16/2018 7:59pm
9/16/2018 7:59pm
RandyS wrote:
I was looking at the mud pictures and wondering what it would cost if the factories just threw those bikes away and built an exact replica...
I was looking at the mud pictures and wondering what it would cost if the factories just threw those bikes away and built an exact replica. Not how much do they spend developing the bikes but lets say Monday morning after Seattle they said "let's build a brand new bike for Vegas". This would be assuming they made every custom part including suspension. $15,000, $20,000, $25,000??? I would guess $20,000 range, maybe I'm way off but once the CNC programming is done it's pretty cheap considering to reproduce.
Racer111 wrote:
You’re WAY off. There was an article in 2001 of Racer X on riding RC’s 100,000.00 KX250! That was 17 years ago.

20,000.00 my ass!

No doubt !!

I have 4 bikes in my garage that all have more than $20K in them.

Randy is HIGH !! Lol
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RandyS
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RandyS 9/17/2018 8:00am
9/17/2018 8:00am
Does anyone even read original posts anymore, or just pull things out of their asses. I agreed with a couple of posts long ago that placed it in the 50k-60k range. A crank does not cost 20k to make, the question was "What would it cost for a manufacturer to reproduce a bike during the season if every part was made in house." No profit, no R&D, no lunchtime hookers. Production parts, materials, hourly overhead, hourly employee labor.
Rs444
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Rs444 9/17/2018 2:31pm
9/17/2018 2:31pm Edited Date/Time 9/17/2018 2:37pm
Man i dont know what the f is wrong with some ppl in here ?. "5k for titanium pegs" man its not fucking gold or platinum, its a fucking industrial metal.. you can buy the exact same titanium footpegs like the 24mx honda team use for 150 dollars from 24mx.se (for a ktm 150) scar titanium footpegs for most other brands off motoaction.se for like 350 bucks , a complete titanium bolt kit for 3-400 bucks through a bolt manufacturer. Ppl talking about thousands of dollars for ti parts are waaay off...

In reality the big cost of the factory bikes is designing and developing them and most parts that the bike manufacturer does not supply the teams with are completly free for the factory teams through sponsorship like suspension, sprockets, pistons, tires etc. But lets play with the tought that me or you would like to build lets say a ktm 450 factory bike and lets calculate the cost. The short answer is it wouldnt cost a dime because there is so many things none of us would be able to buy like 52mm wp forks or factory tires but lets say we wanted to build something similar on the same level then!?. With a bike, head porting, new ecu + mapping on a dyno, ti bolts/pegs, lets say complete öhlins factory level fork n suspension, factory like clamps and some carbonfiber details it would set you back around 20-25k and that is a bit high calculated depending on what the cost of the öhlins suspension would be but im guessing around 6-8k for their best stuff that easily could compete with any factory suspension out there.

If we were talking about a competetive gp bike and there was changing of frame and swing dimensions involved and alternating bore and stroke and so on it would cost way more tho.

Ofc dudes like payton talks about 60-100k per bike but that is with having 5 mechanincs working full time building it, developing pipes etc etc, spare parts etc but the raw cost for the bike without any spare parts or mechanics or development involved wouldnt cost you even close to that.
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matt.3150
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matt.3150 9/17/2018 3:10pm
9/17/2018 3:10pm
First of all I own a machine shop that makes some parts for the factory teams, secondly, the HRC pegs are 100% machined out of a solid block of titanium 6-4. These other company are making them out of sheetmetal.It totally not the same thing. Its fine you don't have to believe me, I really could care less, It sound to me that you have exactly 0 knowledge of manufacturing and your just taking a guessing at it based on some company selling something that might look similar. I on the other hand, own a machine shop that employee about 20 people and have owned it for 25 years. I have been racing since I was 6 years old and I am now 46 years old. On top of that I have done work for the factory teams for about 10 years. But don't take my word. Lastly you can't buy the 52mm factory fork or other factory parts from the factory teams. Either someone stole the part or a set was given to a factory rider and he sold them or gave them away....
RandyS
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RandyS 9/17/2018 3:30pm
9/17/2018 3:30pm
matt.3150 wrote:
First of all I own a machine shop that makes some parts for the factory teams, secondly, the HRC pegs are 100% machined out of a...
First of all I own a machine shop that makes some parts for the factory teams, secondly, the HRC pegs are 100% machined out of a solid block of titanium 6-4. These other company are making them out of sheetmetal.It totally not the same thing. Its fine you don't have to believe me, I really could care less, It sound to me that you have exactly 0 knowledge of manufacturing and your just taking a guessing at it based on some company selling something that might look similar. I on the other hand, own a machine shop that employee about 20 people and have owned it for 25 years. I have been racing since I was 6 years old and I am now 46 years old. On top of that I have done work for the factory teams for about 10 years. But don't take my word. Lastly you can't buy the 52mm factory fork or other factory parts from the factory teams. Either someone stole the part or a set was given to a factory rider and he sold them or gave them away....
I never said anything about footpegs so I assume you're answering one of the other posters. But since you brought it up, ballpark what does the material in a billet set of ti footpegs cost, what is the scrap value of the shavings, how many hours of CNC time, what does an operator cost per hour, and what is the overhead of that portion of the shop for those hours. Just pure cost without any issues, which is what my original question was. And like I said ballpark.

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